Anyone gotten a bigger than usual esb bill?

Davy

Fnergg wrote: »

The meter cabinet is not ESB property. It is supplied by the builder of the house who is supposed to provide the owner with a key. That almost never happens.

Yes all true, buy usually networks will look after someone with one if needed even though they dont have to. A lot of people who haven't got a key, may not know that its still in the meter cabinet stuck to it with tape. The door is closed so they need to get a longnose to get at the key

Fnergg

foggy_lad wrote: »

more like the readers are not being taken on by esb networks to cut down on costs, my meter was only read 3times in the last 2 years and has never been blocked by anything or protected by any dog or other animal, maybe the reader was afraid the sky dish above the meter box would fall on their head? but back to the estimates which were based on usage history........which was non-existant as it is a new house, so what part of the sky were the esb pulling my estimated readings from?

there is no excuse for not doing the job properly especially in the current climate and i have already made a written complaint to esb networks which resulted in the meter reader calling to my door to inform me that he had just read the meter as there was a complaint made, which i am not happy about as he had no esb identification at all and could have been anyone!

The cost of meter reading is not huge and ESB Networks are definitely not refusing to take on readers in the interests of reducing costs. They are policed by the Regulator in relation to the commitment to call to premises 4 times a year to read meters so there is no question of cutting down on readers. There can be problems with getting people to read however.

Every meter reader is obliged to carry an ID card so you should have asked him for his. I would also have said to him that no complaint would have been made had he read your meter regularly in the first place. It looks to me as if there was a reader allocated to your area but for whatever reason best known to himself he was not doing his job.

Some of these contract readers do not work out and end up having their contracts terminated.

As regards the estimates when there is no usage history, all ESB can do is come up with a generic figure for the type of premises but they are operating in a vacuum and the result is invariably wide of the mark. Rather than curse ESB and the meter reader it surely would have been better to submit your own readings to rectify the situation while at the same time complaining about the non-reading.

Reading a meter is simple to do: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cmPTlXqhzYc

Regards,

Fnergg

foggy_lad

Fnergg wrote: »

The cost of meter reading is not huge and ESB Networks are definitely not refusing to take on readers in the interests of reducing costs. They are policed by the Regulator in relation to the commitment to call to premises 4 times a year to read meters so there is no question of cutting down on readers. There can be problems with getting people to read however.

Every meter reader is obliged to carry an ID card so you should have asked him for his. I would also have said to him that no complaint would have been made had he read your meter regularly in the first place. It looks to me as if there was a reader allocated to your area but for whatever reason best known to himself he was not doing his job.

Some of these contract readers do not work out and end up having their contracts terminated.

As regards the estimates when there is no usage history, all ESB can do is come up with a generic figure for the type of premises but they are operating in a vacuum and the result is invariably wide of the mark. Rather than curse ESB and the meter reader it surely would have been better to submit your own readings to rectify the situation while at the same time complaining about the non-reading.

Reading a meter is simple to do: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cmPTlXqhzYc

Regards,

Fnergg

from what i could see the meter reader came directly from the local ESB offices on that day just to read my meter and did not carry id, he also had no business whatsoever calling at my door unannounced to discuss a complaint which i had made about him not doing his job.

the ESB are falling behind in what they are supposed to be doing and the only thing that will force they to do their jobs properly is proper complaints to ESB networks and also the regulator.

on the subject of estimates where there is no history the esb should endeavour to read those meters every time for at least two years but they will not do this as it will cost too much.

and why have a dog and bark myself? why should anyone read their own meter when the esb are supposed to be doing such a great job?

Fnergg

foggy_lad wrote: »

... and why have a dog and bark myself? why should anyone read their own meter when the esb are supposed to be doing such a great job?

For the obvious reason that it is the customer who will have the foot the bill at the end of the day. It's a simple job to read a meter and by doing so you make sure you are being billed properly. I simply cannot understand people who receive estimated bill after estimated bill - each one clearly marked as such and containing details of how to submit your own reading - and then complain loudly when eventually an actual reading is obtained and they get a huge bill based on accumulated usage.

Of course ESB Networks may be at fault and of course people should complain. But customers have responsibilities too and checking their bills and taking steps to correct estimated readings are part of them.

Regards,

Fnergg

foggy_lad

Fnergg wrote: »

For the obvious reason that it is the customer who will have the foot the bill at the end of the day. It's a simple job to read a meter and by doing so you make sure you are being billed properly. I simply cannot understand people who receive estimated bill after estimated bill - each one clearly marked as such and containing details of how to submit your own reading - and then complain loudly when eventually an actual reading is obtained and they get a huge bill based on accumulated usage.

Of course ESB Networks may be at fault and of course people should complain. But customers have responsibilities too and checking their bills and taking steps to correct estimated readings are part of them.

Regards,

Fnergg

there is no may be here! ESB networks are most definitely at fault for not employing enough meter readers and for not ensuring they are keeping to the guideline 4 readings per year!

ESB networks are being paid to provide a service which they are failing to provide!

Davy

jor el wrote: »

According to the Energy Regulator, they read the meter 4 times a year, and estimate twice. It doesn't say if that's an absolute requirement, or just a target.

Its not a requirement. Esb networks state they will read a meter up to four times a year.

Fnergg

Davy wrote: »

Its not a requirement. Esb networks state they will read a meter up to four times a year.

ESB Networks state they will call to premises to read meters 4 times a year. That's not the same as saying they will read the meter 4 times a year for the simple reason that readers can fail to gain access to premises when they call.

foggy_lad states that ESB Networks are not employing enough readers but there is no evidence for this. I obviously don't know the circumstances of his individual case but one shouldn't extrapolate from the particular to the general. If ESB had a problem in sourcing a reader in his locality it doesn't follow that this is a countrywide issue causing huge problems because it's not.

The biggest problems with elecricity bills are related to estimated readings and it is in everyone's interest to ensure that regular actual readings are obtained. Of course ESB Networks has the primary responsibility for this but we all of us as customers have a part to play as well by checking our bills and making sure we get them corrected when the estimates are out of line.

Regards,

Fnergg

ejmaztec

On the rare occasion that our meter reader shows up, I have to tell her what the reading is while she stands on the drive thinking that some invisible dog is going to bite her.:eek: I must have a very honest face, or she could be a bit dim.

foggy_lad

Fnergg wrote: »

foggy_lad states that ESB Networks are not employing enough readers but there is no evidence for this. I obviously don't know the circumstances of his individual case but one shouldn't extrapolate from the particular to the general. If ESB had a problem in sourcing a reader in his locality it doesn't follow that this is a countrywide issue causing huge problems because it's not.

The biggest problems with elecricity bills are related to estimated readings and it is in everyone's interest to ensure that regular actual readings are obtained. Of course ESB Networks has the primary responsibility for this but we all of us as customers have a part to play as well by checking our bills and making sure we get them corrected when the estimates are out of line.

Regards,

Fnergg

the biggest problem is estimated readings due to the failure of ESB networks to read our meters as they are contracted to do, up to 4 times a year would be fine if they stuck to that but in carlow town the readers are just overworked or too lazy to walk around reading meters so do they put in that the meter boxes were inaccessible in half the town and head to the pub?

where i live is next to hundreds if not thousands of houses so i am just assuming the reader ran out of steam when they got this far or were all of the houses out this half of carlow ignored by the meter readers?

surely if there are issues ongoing for two years with one or more meter readers they should be replaced with someone who is capable of doing the job?

making this the customers problem by saying it is somehow the customers responsibility to read their own meter is not good enough really when the ESB are contracted and paid well for providing this service!

dotsman

But, again, why can't you just read your own meter? It's a lot easier and ultimately reduces costs (seeing as you seem to think they are so high). After all, reducing ESB's costs are in everyone's interest.

The Meter-Reader is used to verify the accuracy of your readings (to prevent a fraudulent person from constantly submitting under-weighted readings).

Davy

Roll on smart meters and hopefully end these threads

foggy_lad

dotsman wrote: »

But, again, why can't you just read your own meter? It's a lot easier and ultimately reduces costs (seeing as you seem to think they are so high). After all, reducing ESB's costs are in everyone's interest.

The Meter-Reader is used to verify the accuracy of your readings (to prevent a fraudulent person from constantly submitting under-weighted readings).

why should i go out and read my own meter when i am paying a company to do that job for me? will ESB networks repay my standing charges for the last 18 months because they were somehow unable to get to my meterbox? if ESB networks reduced the standing charges i would read my own meter but they are not going to do that when they can keep getting paid for work they are not doing!

ejmaztec

dotsman wrote: »

But, again, why can't you just read your own meter? It's a lot easier and ultimately reduces costs (seeing as you seem to think they are so high). After all, reducing ESB's costs are in everyone's interest.

The Meter-Reader is used to verify the accuracy of your readings (to prevent a fraudulent person from constantly submitting under-weighted readings).

The meter reader mentioned in my previous post has been doing the "job" for a number of years and has never once actually read my meter. I wonder how many others on her round are in the same boat as myself, and how much she gets paid for her outstanding work.

Fnergg

ejmaztec wrote: »

The meter reader mentioned in my previous post has been doing the "job" for a number of years and has never once actually read my meter. I wonder how many others on her round are in the same boat as myself, and how much she gets paid for her outstanding work.

Have you complained to ESB Networks about her?

If so, what was their response?

If not, you definitely should. You are paying for a service and you deserve to have that service delivered.

Regards,

Fnergg

Fnergg

Davy wrote: »

Roll on smart meters and hopefully end these threads

Ah yes, smart meters. No more estimates as they will automatically ping back to a central hub details of your usage every 15 minutes.

The ESB and The Government are committed to delivering them.

Hmmmm.

There's just one teeny little fly in the ointment: they're going to cost us BILLIONS!

You think electricity costs are high now? Wait until smart meters are rolled out.

Not merely will you and I have to pay for them but they will be used to charge us higher rates for electricity used at certain times of day such as 5pm to 7pm. Unless you are prepared to make drastic changes to your usage pattern you will be paying more.

But the Green Minister for Energy thinks they will help save the planet so that's alright then.

Regards,

Fnergg

darc

Fnergg wrote: »

Ah yes, smart meters. No more estimates as they will automatically ping back to a central hub details of your usage every 15 minutes.
The ESB and The Government are committed to delivering them.
There's just one teeny little fly in the ointment: they're going to cost us BILLIONS!
You think electricity costs are high now? Wait until smart meters are rolled out.
Not merely will you and I have to pay for them but they will be used to charge us higher rates for electricity used at certain times of day such as 5pm to 7pm. Unless you are prepared to make drastic changes to your usage pattern you will be paying more.

The savings in personell costs & 100% accuracy will more than offset the cost of installation. As to the thinking behind increased charges between certain hours - not a chance, if anything it will allow for off peak reductions without second meteres.

Fnergg

darc wrote: »

.... As to the thinking behind increased charges between certain hours - not a chance, if anything it will allow for off peak reductions without second meteres.

One of the advantages of smart meters from a utility perspective is the ability to apply time of day tariffs and in particular to charge higher prices for the period of peak demand - 5pm to 7pm - in order to encourage customers to reduce usage and thus reduce the demand on electricity generation during those hours. That will DEFINITELY be a feature.

You will only get customers to reduce their usage during those hours by hitting them in the pocket.

I can see the advantages of smart meters: as you say, reduced personnel costs (e.g. ESB Networks will no longer have to send a technician out to disconnect your supply when you don't pay your bill - the supplier will be able to switch you off remotely) and definitely the absence of estimated readings will be a huge advantage (if the technology works).

They will give greater detail on your usage pattern throughout the day and in theory this will allow you to economise.

I just worry about the overall cost (we are talking billions here) and if it's going to be worth it.

Regards,

Fnergg

ejmaztec

Fnergg wrote: »

Have you complained to ESB Networks about her?

If so, what was their response?

If not, you definitely should. You are paying for a service and you deserve to have that service delivered.

Regards,

Fnergg

I actually did mention it to them a few months ago, and they still sent her out so that I could read the meter:rolleyes:. She must be a protected species. Her predecessor was a retired guard and read the meter everytime.

dotsman

foggy_lad wrote: »

why should i go out and read my own meter when i am paying a company to do that job for me?

Are you paying ESB for this? If so, how much? It will cost you nothing to do this, so why complain.

Do you complain because you have to fill your car with petrol yourself? That used to require a pump attendant, and people used to complain if the attendant was slow to come out to them, or the attendant filled the incorrect amount etc. Then people starting setting up off their ass and filling their own cars. They began to realise how simple and normal it was to do it themselves. Now, we don't have pump attendants, and pay less for our petrol because of it.

You won't get refunded by ESB if you, individually, read your own meter. That wouldn't make sense, and anybody with any concept of accounting/finance would tell you that. But, in time, if everybody started doing it then yes, there would be a monetary benefit to the customer.

Davy

Fnergg wrote: »

Ah yes, smart meters. No more estimates as they will automatically ping back to a central hub details of your usage every 15 minutes.

The ESB and The Government are committed to delivering them.

Hmmmm.

There's just one teeny little fly in the ointment: they're going to cost us BILLIONS!

You think electricity costs are high now? Wait until smart meters are rolled out.

Not merely will you and I have to pay for them but they will be used to charge us higher rates for electricity used at certain times of day such as 5pm to 7pm. Unless you are prepared to make drastic changes to your usage pattern you will be paying more.

But the Green Minister for Energy thinks they will help save the planet so that's alright then.

Regards,

Fnergg

I never said anything about the cost, just about ending these threads

But if Italy can do it, why cant we, They have a plan to have every meter changed by 2011. I think its gonna cost them about 2 billion, they think its worth it, with having a better network regards knowing whats going on, and saving on meter readings etc.

Fnergg

Davy wrote: »

.. But if Italy can do it, why cant we, They have a plan to have every meter changed by 2011. I think its gonna cost them about 2 billion, they think its worth it, with having a better network regards knowing whats going on, and saving on meter readings etc.

The driving force behind the Italian smart meter roll-out was the need to stop electricity theft which was endemic in Italy and was costing them billions. There was a good cost benefit case to be made there. Electricity theft is nowhere as big a problem in Ireland - it exists but it's small scale - so the case doesn't stack up on that front.

Regards,

Fnergg

foggy_lad

dotsman wrote: »

Are you paying ESB for this? If so, how much? It will cost you nothing to do this, so why complain.

they are getting paid for reading meters which are not being read!

Do you complain because you have to fill your car with petrol yourself?

if i had to read a petrol meter each month and then pay for my petrol when the garage are paid to do this i would be expecting a refund of their meter reading charges!

You won't get refunded by ESB if you, individually, read your own meter. That wouldn't make sense, and anybody with any concept of accounting/finance would tell you that. But, in time, if everybody started doing it then yes, there would be a monetary benefit to the customer.

ESB networks take the standing charge from everyone's bills and are supposed to spend a portion of this on meter reading services so that everyone's meter gets read 4 times a year but they are obviously not doing this, what are thay doing with the money we are paying them? thay are contracted to supply a service and they are not supplying it!

please read the thread as all your comments were answered previously.

parsi

Fnergg wrote: »

Every meter reader is obliged to carry an ID card so you should have asked him for his.

This comment always bugs me.

I've never seen a meter reader's ID card so I've no idea what it looks like. Why do companies insist in telling us that their staff carry ID without showing us what it looks like ?

(Not a dig at Fnergg btw).

Fnergg

parsi wrote: »

This comment always bugs me.

I've never seen a meter reader's ID card so I've no idea what it looks like. Why do companies insist in telling us that their staff carry ID without showing us what it looks like ?

(Not a dig at Fnergg btw).

I'd imagine that in rural areas in particular meter readers are often well known and so the need to produce the ID card is minimal.

They definitely are given the cards though. There is no way ESB Networks would countenance agents working on their behalf (contract readers are not ESB staff) going to houses without them. Whether the readers bother to bring them with them, or if they produce them at all when calling to houses, is something totally outside of the control of the ESB.

Common sense would dictate that when calling to a house where you do not know the occupant you should have your ID card to hand, especially if it's an inside meter requiring access to the home.

Regards,

Fnergg

ejmaztec

parsi wrote: »

This comment always bugs me.

I've never seen a meter reader's ID card so I've no idea what it looks like. Why do companies insist in telling us that their staff carry ID without showing us what it looks like ?

(Not a dig at Fnergg btw).

You must be psychic because that is exactly what a genuine ESB ID card looks like.:eek:

parsi

ejmaztec wrote: »

You must be psychic because that is exactly what a genuine ESB ID card looks like.:eek:

Well Holy God...

foggy_lad

considering my meter reader arrived first without a meter key i would have been very surprised if he offered to show any id when he called to the door but he did not as most likely had no id with him

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

foggy_lad wrote: »

considering my meter reader arrived first without a meter key i would have been very surprised if he offered to show any id when he called to the door but he did not as most likely had no id with him

Instead of assuming everybody is inept why not just ask him for his ID and find out for yourself. You are entitled (indeed encouraged) to look for ID and the meter reader (and even contractors working on lines) all have ID issued to them. If they have no ID don't let them in and phone ESB Networks to report it. They take it very seriously as I found out when a guy claiming to be working on the ESB lines at the back of the house had a damaged ID and made my mother suspicious last year. She rang ESB and they said not to let the guy in. Theye then sent a van out to check on the situation. Everything was fine but at least they checked.

foggy_lad

Selah Howling Eraser wrote: »

Instead of assuming everybody is inept why not just ask him for his ID and find out for yourself. You are entitled (indeed encouraged) to look for ID and the meter reader (and even contractors working on lines) all have ID issued to them. If they have no ID don't let them in and phone ESB Networks to report it. They take it very seriously as I found out when a guy claiming to be working on the ESB lines at the back of the house had a damaged ID and made my mother suspicious last year. She rang ESB and they said not to let the guy in. Theye then sent a van out to check on the situation. Everything was fine but at least they checked.

the meter readers id is not the issue i was highlighting but the fact that ESB networks are taking our money every two months and doing very little to earn it!

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

foggy_lad wrote: »

the meter readers id is not the issue i was highlighting but the fact that ESB networks are taking our money every two months and doing very little to earn it!

Something like 8cent every 2 months goes towards Meter Reading. Your Standing Charge covers much more besides. Sad world if you complain about anybody taking 48 cent a year and doing, in your opinion, very little for it.