Roast Chicken Help

neuro-praxis

To all you roast chicken experts:

I am having friends over tonight for a roast chicken dinner with all the trimmings. However I forgot to take this chicken out of the freezer last night. So anyway, I took it out at 10am this morning. It's about 2kg and I suspect it won't be fully defrosted by the time I go to put it in the oven at approx 6pm.

Is there anything I can do to defrost it faster? I am worried the microwave would cook it rather than defrost it. Is it safe to put a partially thawed chicken in the oven and if yes, at what temperature should it go in and for how long?

Thanks folks.

foodaholic

I really think your supposed to have it fully defrosted before cooking it. Could your cut it into portions so it would defrost quicker.

If all else fails u could do what they did in the royal family and have a bath with it:D

the beer revolu

I wouldn't roast a partially frozen chicken.
Try putting it in a sink of warm water and keep changing the water to keep it warm. I reckon that should defrost it in an hour or so.

Mena

Does your microwave not have a defrost setting?

Magic Monkey

The usual roasting guidelines for chicken are 20mins/lb + 20mins; for partially defrosted increase to 30mins/lb + 30mins. Start the first 20-25mins @ 220°c, the remainder of the cooking time at 190°c. If you have a thermometer, it's done when the breast reaches 71°c, the thigh 76°c.

the beer revolu

Mena wrote: »

Does your microwave not have a defrost setting?

That's not always satisfactory as, particularly with larger pieces, the meat starts to cook before it's fully defrosted.

iMax

the beer revolu wrote: »

Try putting it in a sink of warm water and keep changing the water to keep warm it warm. I reckon that should defrost it in an hour or so.

Cold Water ... COLD !!!

You'll give everyone food poisening otherwise.

OP, just get a fresh thawed chicken. it's the safest. Put the other one in the fridge to thaw overnight & then make chicken pie or something with it, cooked off & frozen for later in the week.

the beer revolu

iMax wrote: »

Cold Water ... COLD !!!

You'll give everyone food poisening otherwise.

Explain please.

iMax wrote: »

OP, just get a fresh thawed chicken. it's the safest. Put the other one in the fridge to thaw overnight & then make chicken pie or something with it, cooked off & frozen for later in the week.

Probably the best idea!

tSubh Dearg

I have cooked a not totally defrosted chicken, but it was only still a bit crunchy sounding around the thigh, and maybe a little on the front of the breast.

I put it in the oven at my usual starting temp (180) but gave it 40 mins instead of 30, then when I flipped it over instead of turning down the temp as I normally would I left it at 180 and I also gave it another 40 mins. For the final 30 mins I turned it over again, cut the legs away from the breast, turned down the temp to 160 and let it brown for about 20 mins but for the last 10/15 I had it covered in tin foil to prevent burning.

It turned out fine. However, I would not recommend this unless it really is a very small part of the chicken left frozen. If it had been more frozen than it was I would've left it and gone and gotten something else for our dinner.

GHOST MGG2

here is what happened when my half defrosted chicken got roasted:-)

neuro-praxis

I put it in warm water as per the advice here, and went for a wonderful afternoon nap. When I came back, it was defrosted perfectly.

Then I read the replies that followed.

The chicken is in the bin and I am off to the shops for a fresh one. RIP chicken.

iMax

the beer revolu wrote: »

Explain please.

Warm wateer will assist the growth of bacteria faster than cold water will.

Cold water will gradually defrost the frozen parts, while warm water does it at about 2.5 times the speed giving bacteria 2.5 times longer to multiply.

Dizzyblonde

neuro-praxis wrote: »

The chicken is in the bin and I am off to the shops for a fresh one. RIP chicken.

Better safe than sorry - I'd have binned it too.

the beer revolu

iMax wrote: »

Cold Water ... COLD !!!

You'll give everyone food poisening otherwise.

OP, just get a fresh thawed chicken. it's the safest. Put the other one in the fridge to thaw overnight & then make chicken pie or something with it, cooked off & frozen for later in the week.

iMax wrote: »

Warm wateer will assist the growth of bacteria faster than cold water will.

Cold water will gradually defrost the frozen parts, while warm water does it at about 2.5 times the speed giving bacteria 2.5 times longer to multiply.

If it defrosts it faster, then how does that give the bacteria longer to multiply? Bit of a contradiction there.

I accept that warmer conditions promote bacterial growth but this chicken is frozen - that means cold.

Bringing a chicken from frozen in the space of an hour or so is perfectly safe. As I remember the chicken was going to be cooked then.
Yes, safety first but .........binning that chicken was wrong!
There's alot of paranoia regarding chicken and pork.
A little common sense and good practice goes a long way.
That's not the same as neurosis!

the beer revolu

neuro-praxis wrote: »

I put it in warm water as per the advice here, and went for a wonderful afternoon nap. When I came back, it was defrosted perfectly.

and no doubt at a fridge cool temperature - not dodgey warm for hours.

rubadub

the beer revolu wrote: »

Bringing a chicken from frozen in the space of an hour or so is perfectly safe. As I remember the chicken was going to be cooked then.
Yes, safety first but .........binning that chicken was wrong!

+1

I often defrost fillets in luke warm water.

olaola

Bacteria need warmth and moisture to multiply. I would not serve chicken that was defrosted in warm water. Let alone people that I had invited to my house!!!

If the chicken has defrosted faster in prime conditions for the bacteria to multiply, why wouldn't you have more bacteria? If it's defrosted in the fridge, the bacteria growth is inhibited by the temp, but the meat still thaws. Temp here is more important than time.

Mr Magnolia

Yeah, >5 degreesC is breeding ground for bacteria so defrost it in the fridge or cold water, certainly not warm or hot water.

Also, cooking a partially defrosted chicken is dangerous. The defosted parts of the chicken will cook quicker then others so you'll either get a fully cooked chicken with the defrosted parts of it over-cooked or a partially cooked chicken with parts that were frozen under-cooked. You can't stike the balance, though I'd rather the over cooked version.

Magic Monkey

For those defrosting poultry in warm water, it's better to use cold. The meat's surface is the first part to thaw - in warm water this can bring it to >5°c quicker than the inside can defrost, promoting bacterial growth. For small pieces like breasts, they won't take as long to defrost, plus boiling/frying/roasting will kill off most surface bacteria, so it's probably not as dangerous to use warm water. But at least by using cold water you can slow this process down a bit. Just change the water every 30 minutes.

The most important thing is to ensure the chicken is cooked through to the centre. From a partially-frozen state it is possible to do this, by increasing the cooking time by 50%. You can prevent excessive surface browning by covering with tinfoil.

the beer revolu

OP, if I were you, I wouldn't be so quick to blindly take advice from punters on the internet - at least not without some sort on consensus.

You were very happy to take my advise on thawing the chicken but were just as quick to take someone else's contradictory advise and bin your chicken.

I still stand by my advise, provided the chicken was to be cooked straight away as I'm sure the other posters still hold their position that this was dangerous.

the beer revolu

As it happens, I'm roasting a chicken today.
It's not frozen but I am going to take out of the fridge to allow it to warm up for a couple of hours before I cook it.

Do all you <5 degrees people think my wife, guests and myself will survive the experience?

Mr Magnolia

the beer revolu wrote: »

As it happens, I'm roasting a chicken today.
It's not frozen but I am going to take out of the fridge to allow it to warm up for a couple of hours before I cook it.

Do all you <5 degrees people think my wife, guests and myself will survive the experience?

It's the internet, opinions and teachings will vary, discussion is good though, it lets people make informed decisions.

Take the opinions or leave them.

the beer revolu

Mr Magnolia wrote: »

It's the internet, opinions and teachings will vary, discussion is good though, it lets people make informed decisions.

Take the opinions or leave them.

or sometimes ill-informed decisions!

as I said, we can't all be right if we're contradicting each other!

Magic Monkey

While we're on the subject, defrosting in cold water as opposed to the kitchen counter is about twenty times faster, due to water's better heat transfer than air, plus it has the advantage of keeping the surface safely cold.

Faith

the beer revolu wrote: »

or sometimes ill-informed decisions!

as I said, we can't all be right if we're contradicting each other!

Yes, that's true. And in this case, it's those who are promoting defrosting chicken in warm water that are wrong. Don't believe me? Then click here.

It is very important to be aware of how to handle and prepare products such as poultry. Neuro-praxis was right to bin the chicken. Where she was wrong was following the first piece of advice she saw, as it was very wrong. If she cooked that chicken, she risked giving herself and her guests serious food poisoning.

Minder

The advice from the USDA link in Faiths post above is slightly contradictory.

As on any perishable meat, fish or poultry, bacteria can be found on raw or undercooked chicken. They multiply rapidly at temperatures between 40 °F and 140 °F (out of refrigeration and before thorough cooking occurs). Freezing doesn't kill bacteria but they are destroyed by thorough cooking.

It is not necessary to wash raw chicken. Any bacteria which might be present are destroyed by cooking.

Seems more like a science experiment, take a source of bacteria and warm it thoroughly for the bacteria to multiply, then blast it with sufficient heat so that the bacteria is killed. Why would you bother?

While it may be safe if cremated afterwards, to my mind, defrosting anything in warm water just feels wrong.

the beer revolu

Faith wrote: »

Yes, that's true. And in this case, it's those who are promoting defrosting chicken in warm water that are wrong. Don't believe me? Then click here.

It is very important to be aware of how to handle and prepare products such as poultry. Neuro-praxis was right to bin the chicken. Where she was wrong was following the first piece of advice she saw, as it was very wrong. If she cooked that chicken, she risked giving herself and her guests serious food poisoning.

I'm really not going to get into an argument where "because askaboutcooking.com said so" is considered proof!

The Sweeper

I will happily defrost chicken in cold water to speed up the process if I've forgotten to take it out of the freezer.

In terms of chicken fillets, I won't bother defrosting them utterly. I'll chop them while semi-frozen, because they cut quite easily in that condition. Heap the cut pieces onto a clean plate, where they will continue to defrost as you finish cutting the rest of the meat. The process of then frying to seal and simmering to cook is more than enough to cook the chicken pieces properly - and I'm talking about strips here, about 1 cm thick.

I wouldn't be happy roasting a still-partially-frozen chicken whole, simply because the cooking would be uneven. However I would section out a still-partially-frozen chicken for roasting in pieces.

I'm more concerned that the food I'm eating has been cooked to piping hot all the way through, than I am about whether or not it started off partially frozen. Any hesitation I have about cooking from frozen is based only on the notion that the frozen parts may not get to piping hot as quickly as the rest.

Then again I use my nose and my eyes when I cook as much as I use guidelines and use-by dates. Does it smell right? Does it look right? How is the colour and texture? How is the smell when it's cold, when it's warm and as it is cooking? Is it hot enough? Has it cooked evenly? Thankfully that hasn't let me down yet - whereas if I'd followed the use-by instructions faithfully at all times, and ignored my noise, there's a couple of occasions where I would have been poisoned.

the beer revolu

Minesajackdaniels wrote: »

I'm more concerned that the food I'm eating has been cooked to piping hot all the way through, than I am about whether or not it started off partially frozen. Any hesitation I have about cooking from frozen is based only on the notion that the frozen parts may not get to piping hot as quickly as the rest.

Then again I use my nose and my eyes when I cook as much as I use guidelines and use-by dates. Does it smell right? Does it look right? How is the colour and texture? How is the smell when it's cold, when it's warm and as it is cooking? Is it hot enough? Has it cooked evenly? Thankfully that hasn't let me down yet - whereas if I'd followed the use-by instructions faithfully at all times, and ignored my noise, there's a couple of occasions where I would have been poisoned.

That is all very sensible.
It's what I'm getting at really.
Common sense is what is needed, not hard and fast rules.
Although, if one don't have common sense regarding food then maybe idiot proof rules are necessary.
Just don't try to apply them to me!

rubadub

olaola wrote: »

Bacteria need warmth and moisture to multiply.

Yes, so if you know what you are doing you can use luke warm water, which will be cooled in a few minutes. I would never freeze a whole chicken in the first place.

Faith wrote: »

Yes, that's true. And in this case, it's those who are promoting defrosting chicken in warm water that are wrong.

It is easier to just say do not do it, because most people cannot follow or understand simple instructions, so it is best to make them idiot proof. If you know what you are at it is not "wrong". If you know the basics of heat transfer & microbiology it is easily done, you should mix the water well. I have studied baterical growth and sterilization and have made my own sterile chicken dishes which will last in jars in a press at room temp for several years. But I know how to do it and do not take shortcuts, many do so. Government and general sites like this just presume people will not follow them correctly.

I have altered my pressure cooker so I can sterilize stuff very quickly, but I actually design pressure vessels and would never give instructions on how to do it online as I know people take shortcuts or susbstitute things.

Common sense is needed, but a lot of people lack it.

neuro-praxis

Good discussion.

However there was no way I was going to take a risk when feeding others.

I also appreciate heartily everyone discussing where I was wrong, in apparently everything I did. As far as I am concerned I did what I thought was right at the time, in both instances. You just can't win on boards. I'll remember never to ask for advice again!