Primetime on FAS in Castlebar

Faster Doudle

knex wrote: »

helping to provoide meals how many does it take to provide 15 meals that were provided at that time? I know that the whole building was done up by the Fas scheme drylined, painted,new bars placed on the windows to prevent break ins of which there were many:)

Meals on wheels doesn't mean meals on wheels then? It means laundry and roofing? I'd say you sound like big Eddie himself only I doubt very much he has the cop on to surf the net. That is unless he got Fas money to train himself to do so.

Kristopherus

I have to say that Knex is correct in what he says. The two main characters have history between them, mostly emanating from the topic we're on. I think what the programme was about the lack of accountability by Fas in the way they administered grants to local community groups. On the local issues, there is a lot more yet to come out from these issues already in the public domain. IMHO there is a truckload of similar cases around the country, and of course now that money is scarce, there will be peoply who will question where the lolly went. Just as we all are on a National Level.

nesf

knex wrote: »

I do not care if you beleive me or not proof is there if you bother to look for it

And the rules of the forum are that the people putting forward claims are the ones who have to link to proof. Telling people it's there and to google it doesn't count.

Substantiate them please.

netman

knex wrote: »

Ex-guard removed fas staff members from Social Services in 2004 one of whom had lost her partner and child less than one week previous in a tragic accident.

And then he was abducted by aliens and sent back in time to fight Kublai Khain, damn that ex-guard!!!

Tuars

Prime time made a balls of this. They sent a crew down for a few days and got nothing of substance so they threw out a few insinuations and half-truths to justify their jaunt.

Some people were mentioned in that report who have nothing to do with any of this and prime time were told this (by the few that they bothered to contact) prior to broadcasting the programme. Yet still they were mentioned in the programme. Irresponsible reporting that has real consequences for real people.

I have a reasonable knowledge of the background to this and whatever about the rights and wrongs of it, what prime time presented was shoddy and misleading.

Faster Doudle

Tuars wrote: »

Prime time made a balls of this. They sent a crew down for a few days and got nothing of substance so they threw out a few insinuations and half-truths to justify their jaunt.

Some people were mentioned in that report who have nothing to do with any of this and prime time were told this (by the few that they bothered to contact) prior to broadcasting the programme. Yet still they were mentioned in the programme. Irresponsible reporting that has real consequences for real people.

I have a reasonable knowledge of the background to this and whatever about the rights and wrongs of it, what prime time presented was shoddy and misleading.

Could you elaborate on this? They named the 3 guys and the priest involved in the 4 fas schemes & the chairman and the nun involved in social services. Who did they misrepresent?

The programme can be seen here btw.

Tuars

Faster Doudle wrote: »

Could you elaborate on this? They named the 3 guys and the priest involved in the 4 fas schemes & the chairman and the nun involved in social services. Who did they misrepresent?

People were mentioned in the report who now have the hassle of hiring solicitors to correct the record after Prime Time's sloppiness. I won't elaborate further because it's a legal matter now.

serfboard

After seeing this thread I watched the programme online and have to conclude with others that the case is not proven.

Seems Michael Melotte set out to do a hatchet job on yer man and succeeded. He was armed with all the facts, documents etc. and yer man is just relying on his memory (or was trying to remember the context of the documents when presented with them).

Yes, it's true that they did claim that they were providing meals-on-wheels and were not (or were only on a limited basis by seconding people into Social Services). So they have questions to answer for that. However, yer man did say that people did things like painting and decorating and that's fair enough - they were on a CE scheme for which they got paid and they did something for it.

The programme was very un-balanced. Michael Melotte should have tried to get access to the audited accounts of the various companies involved - talked to the workers who were paid salaries and asked them what they did and then confirmed with other people that those things were done. Having done that, he could then come back and ask some more questions.

Unfortunately it will be a long time before the truth emerges and we'll all have forgotten it by then.

netman

Maybe FAS should send a couple more million their way, for job creation in companies such as "Trying to get the facts straight LTD" and "Hope I get this one right PLC" or "I better stay quiet now LLC".

Dannyboy83

knex wrote: »

I do not care if you beleive me or not proof is there if you bother to look for it

Its not a question of belief, its a question of proof.
If you cannot prove it, it has to be erased from the forum.

Otherwise there would be blatant lies on the forum that no fool would believe such as "Willie O'Dea does a great job".

I don't know about you, but if some chap who looked after my community was getting a raw deal, I would go do the 10minutes research to take the black mark off his name, its the least he deserves if he really helped folks.

Faster Doudle

serfboard wrote: »

Yes, it's true that they did claim that they were providing meals-on-wheels and were not (or were only on a limited basis by seconding people into Social Services). So they have questions to answer for that. However, yer man did say that people did things like painting and decorating and that's fair enough - they were on a CE scheme for which they got paid and they did something for it.

The programme was very un-balanced. Michael Melotte should have tried to get access to the audited accounts of the various companies involved - talked to the workers who were paid salaries and asked them what they did and then confirmed with other people that those things were done. Having done that, he could then come back and ask some more questions.

Unfortunately it will be a long time before the truth emerges and we'll all have forgotten it by then.

I simply don't accpet your logic here. The crux of the issue is one that you've already identified. They claimed to provide meals on wheels and by Fas' own admission they were not. To me, this calls every other claim that they make into question. Just how are we to believe them about the other services and works provided if they misled Fas for year upon year about meals on wheels?

You obviously think it's ok to draw down funding for one purpose and spend it on something else. I don't. Why bother with an application process so? Do you not think it's important that we know what our tax money is spent on before it's assigned and whether it was put to good use when it was spent?

The burden of proof lies with them - not with the reporter. Melotte was asking some very straight forward questions to which they gave no satisfactory reply. He asked how many people were working on meals and wheels and what they were doing and was told to go ask a nun. It's not unreasonable to think that people in charge of multi million euro schemes should know who they hired and for what. They kept talking in generalisations. He asked if one of them was a director of one of the companies and Eddie hold his henchman not to reply.

The programme really angered me because it showed the total lack of accountability within Fas. I shudder to think how much money was wasted over the past few years due to a lack of administrative oversight. It highlighted what I think the main problem with this country is right now - accountability. People are not held to account for their actions and that goes right from the top to the bottom of society.

knex

remember mike moilette came to castlebar claiming none of the companies involved had insurance,had not paid suppliers,also contacted ex member of staff in a dublin hospital after a serious operation not much social service there.But forgot to contact 2 ex members of staff who had taken sucessful unfair dissmissal cases against social services in 2006 and 2007 both will speak on local radio tomorrow,one will tell he was bullied by the ex gaurd and how the judge saw through the ex gaurd and repremanded the ex gaurd for his behaviour leading to undisclosed sum paid to ex employee plus all costs I was witness to this case.Local papers refused to print outcome of case at the time I wonder why?:D

Faster Doudle

knex wrote: »

remember mike moilette came to castlebar claiming none of the companies involved had insurance,had not paid suppliers,also contacted ex member of staff in a dublin hospital after a serious operation not much social service there.But forgot to contact 2 ex members of staff who had taken sucessful unfair dissmissal cases against social services in 2006 and 2007 both will speak on local radio tomorrow,one will tell he was bullied by the ex gaurd and how the judge saw through the ex gaurd and repremanded the ex gaurd for his behaviour leading to undisclosed sum paid to ex employee plus all costs I was witness to this case.Local papers refused to print outcome of case at the time I wonder why?:D

I fail to see what any of this has to do with Fas accountability.

I also dont remember any claims made about insurance or avoidance of payments in the programme. You have utterly failed to address the real issues here by trying to mudsling as a diversionary tactic. That more than anything else shows you up as one of Eddies cronies.

nesf

knex, if you do not provide proof of your claims I'm going to remove all your posts from this forum.

knex

Not one of Eddies cronies just someone who can see the whole set up this was. No moilette was afraid to show insurance claims on tv in case he was sued but I saw the allegations in a letter and email from Moilette these are with a media lawyer now and case may be pending. There were no accountability issues here applications for funding did not reflect actual funding ahich was always less and was accounted for with certified accounts meals on wheeles/social services was a very small part of each application but gained more than most remember there was only 3 working in the kitchen altogether 1 supplied by fas not bad for fas to fund 33%of cost associated with actual food preperation when they funded all other costs associated with the building maintenence, caretaking, secruity.
This is only starting and alot of stuff to come out.Only wish ex gaurd would not keep rufusing comment to local papers and radio. Whats he afraid of I wonder? intresting times ahead. Good on Moilette someone will be well off when all is over.

netman

knex wrote: »

Local papers refused to print outcome of case at the time I wonder why?:D

It was because they were anal probed by the superrace of alien spacebreed otherwise known as the Skweeeg who have taken their brains and replaced them with a household alternative known as Vileda Professional.

Their brains were later used to scrub alien spaceships from deep space debris, such as for example the human waste from spacestation MIR, for which they were much more suitable for.

skelliser

from my knowledge and stories iv heard knex and similar posters are heading in the right direction with this.

a local spat between two old lads that hate eachother is the crux of this story, nothing more.

Kristopherus

nesf wrote: »

knex, if you do not provide proof of your claims I'm going to remove all your posts from this forum.

I've said in a previous post that what he is saying is correct. Basically this is a case of one man making allegations about the other. These two men live no more than 200yds apart in the same area of the town. There is a myriad of side issues, that are largely local, thrown into the mix. Bottom line is it was poor housekeeping by Fas.

P. Breathnach

skelliser wrote: »

a local spat between two old lads that hate eachother is the crux of this story, nothing more.

That may be what brought something out into the public gaze. But the public is now gazing, many of us see possible cause for concern, and we will not want the story dropped without further investigation.

Ben Dunne's making a fool of himself in Florida with white powder and a hooker led to consequences unimagined at the time.

nesf

Kristopherus wrote: »

I've said in a previous post that what he is saying is correct. Basically this is a case of one man making allegations about the other. These two men live no more than 200yds apart in the same area of the town. There is a myriad of side issues, that are largely local, thrown into the mix. Bottom line is it was poor housekeeping by Fas.

I'm referring to allegations of unfair dismissal cases. This has nothing to do with the present issue other than character assassination to undermine the ex-garda on Prime Time. This is fair enough if there were unfair dismissal cases against the orginisation he was running. But these should be a matter of public record and evidence should be provided to substantiate them.

This request is purely to stop people libelling/slandering others in the legal sense by making false claims about them.

Tuars

nesf wrote: »

I'm referring to allegations of unfair dismissal cases. This has nothing to do with the present issue other than character assassination to undermine the ex-garda on Prime Time. This is fair enough if there were unfair dismissal cases against the orginisation he was running. But these should be a matter of public record and evidence should be provided to substantiate them.

This request is purely to stop people libelling/slandering others in the legal sense by making false claims about them.

The unfair dismissals cases are fact and are part of the public record. Perhaps they are not available on the internet. There is no libel issue here.

However I agree that they are not relevant to this case. For me the issue is whether Prime Time represented the issue accurately and fairly. I believe they did not and therefore I don't believe the report has any credibility. This is a pity because there are real issues to be investigated and we shouldn't have to doubt the credibility and bona-fides of the investigators.

P. Breathnach

Tuars wrote: »

The unfair dismissals cases are fact and are part of the public record. Perhaps they are not available on the internet.

It would be highly unusual for things like that to happen and leave no trace on the internet.

Tuars

P. Breathnach wrote: »

It would be highly unusual for things like that to happen and leave no trace on the internet.

I don't know which state department is responsible for publishing this information but the cases are real and they did happen.

Not everything in the world is on the internet you know. God forbid that you'd actually have to step outside your door and see what's going on in the real world.

Anyway, those cases are not relevant to this issue.

P. Breathnach

Tuars wrote: »

I don't know which state department is responsible for publishing this information but the cases are real and they did happen.

I'm not referring to official publication. Normally if you google to get the story on any matter of general interest, even if it is of interest only in one locality like an Irish town, you get lots of hits: local newspapers, blogs, forum discussions, all sorts of thing.

Not everything in the world is on the internet you know. God forbid that you'd actually have to step outside your door and see what's going on in the real world.

No good purpose is served by cheap shots.

Anyway, those cases are not relevant to this issue.

They were introduced here with the clear implication that it discredited one of the main sources of the accusations against FAS and the operation of CE schemes in Castlebar.

Faster Doudle

There definitely seems to be more to this story than was presented on Prime Time given the amount of people here who've got local knowledge about the situation. That said, I really couldn't care less about a local grudge match, but I do care about the issue that was raised - where exactly did the Fas money go and why isn't it accounted for? Why aren't Fas concerned that the schemes weren't providing the services they claimed initially and why does Fas as an organisation get away with such bad management? I really don't know what the ex-guards dismissals case has to do with this. Perhaps he has an alterior motive to expose wrong doing in the Fas schemes, but ultimately his allegations raise serious questions about Fas and how it's run. Such questions need to be answered imo.

dreenman

Faster Doudle wrote: »

There definitely seems to be more to this story than was presented on Prime Time given the amount of people here who've got local knowledge about the situation. That said, I really couldn't care less about a local grudge match, but I do care about the issue that was raised - where exactly did the Fas money go and why isn't it accounted for? Why aren't Fas concerned that the schemes weren't providing the services they claimed initially and why does Fas as an organisation get away with such bad management? I really don't know what the ex-guards dismissals case has to do with this. Perhaps he has an alterior motive to expose wrong doing in the Fas schemes, but ultimately his allegations raise serious questions about Fas and how it's run. Such questions need to be answered imo.

I'm afraid his motive is based on the 'Mud Sticks' theory of allegations. He has made them before and they have been investigated - the accounts do show where all the money went ... but now he is taking advantage of the current mood to make them again and this time RTE took the bait. He has actually set out to do what he wanted all along to which is to vilify his perceived nemisis.

This feud which upto now was small town, petty and vindictive is now national with one guy's reputation in tatters.

And of course now its all going to be fought out in the public spotlight for example ...

http://www.advertiser.ie/mayo/article/8741

http://www.advertiser.ie/mayo/article/8740

Its a pity RTE dont get so tough with the scum leading this country - the one thing we want made public is the names of the Golden Circle but RTE havent got the guts to do that.

Sand

Just glanced through the first link:

A lot of it is waffle - just providing detail without addressing the concerns raised by the Prime Time piece...

For example:

The supervisor on this scheme is TJ Kirrane and this scheme, which is a social economy scheme funded by Pobal and not FÁS, was set up in 2001. It was initially funded by FÁS but in 2006 Pobal took over the funding of SE schemes.

Whats the relevance here? Prime Time focused on the FAS payments from 2001 to 2004. Like the majority of the article, this is fairly irrelevant.

To date eight investigations have been carried out into the workings of FÁS in Castlebar. Two were conducted by FÁS, one by the Archbishop of Tuam, one by Pobal, one by the Department of Family and Community Affairs, one by the Public Accounts Committee, one by the Comptroller and Auditor General, and the final one by Prime Time. None of the investigations could find any wrongdoing.

This is incorrect - Prime Time did find evidence of wrong doing - payments claimed when they should not have been, funds drawn down for services that were not provided by the FAS scheme, supervisors who couldnt account for the money they received. And if the extent of the Archbishops investigation [ "Hey, Father - Ive been told you're potentially running a corrupt scheme down there in Castlebar? Oh you're not? Grand so."] is any guide then those investigations would be pitiful.

As Prime Time highlighted, at least one of those investigations didnt even investigate if the scheme was actually carrying out the task it drew down funds for.

Mr Hoban explained that meals on wheels is not just peeling potatoes and extends to maintenance of the social services building which meals on wheels operates from.

This is pure brass neck, which seems to play well to a certain constituency. The funds were drawn down on the basis of providing meals on wheels, not doing up buildings. The funds were drawn down on a fundamentally false basis.

I can understand Hoban is desperately attempting to run damage control before the Gardai start to investigate, but this article isnt good enough.

Mr.Micro

Its a pity RTE dont get so tough with the scum leading this country - the one thing we want made public is the names of the Golden Circle but RTE havent got the guts to do that.

Unless its somebody ordinary arrested for an alleged crime and then RTE give name, address etc despite the fact that the said person has not even had a trial or been found guilty of anything. Never understood the giving out of the address of a suspect myself. Innocent until proven guilty.

P. Breathnach

Mr.Micro wrote: »

Unless its somebody ordinary arrested for an alleged crime and then RTE give name, address etc despite the fact that the said person has not even had a trial or been found guilty of anything. Never understood the giving out of the address of a suspect myself. Innocent until proven guilty.

I think RTE do not publish names and addresses of suspects. They, and other media, publish the names of people actually charged with a criminal offence. Laying a charge brings the matter into the public domain.

Mr.Micro

P. Breathnach wrote: »

I think RTE do not publish names and addresses of suspects. They, and other media, publish the names of people actually charged with a criminal offence. Laying a charge brings the matter into the public domain.

Sorry, I have to disgree with you. Many a time I have heard the name of a suspect and an address often with a video clip so the id of the person can be in no doubt and often before any charges are laid, I guess it depends on who the person is. Innocent until proven guilty and charging sombody does not mean they are guilty.