living on site in caravan - electricity

Smashee

Hiya,

We were thinking of buying a caravan and living in it for the term of the build (about 6-8 months). We'll be doing some work to the cottage that's on site so it won't be viable for us to live in it too and we're trying to keep costs to a minimum.

What I'm wondering is if we can tap into the electricity from the cottage and bring it to the caravan (a few metres away)? Our architect was telling us that it costs a fortune for the ESB to disconnect from the house to connect to the caravan and then to disconnect from the caravan again and reconnect to the new build ... and if our bills are still coming to the same address and being paid in the same way then I'm wondering if it's possible to kinda just do it ourselves?!

Thanks

Poor Uncle Tom

Short answer - NO.

Talk to your electrician, get advice from them.

You will probably be using most utensils & gadgets as normal, electric kettle, cooker, lights, etc., so the draw is big, an extension lead type set up will not do.

BTW do you have planning permission for the mobile home?

charlieIRL

Poor Uncle Tom wrote: »

BTW do you have planning permission for the mobile home?

you don't need it - temporary structure therefore exempt as far as i know.

You can't get a temporary supply to a site anymore either.

smashey

Planning permission will be required for the mobile home.

muffler

charlieIRL wrote: »

you don't need it - temporary structure therefore exempt as far as i know.

You can't get a temporary supply to a site anymore either.

You do need planning permission for a mobile home that is being lived in. And I wouldnt be surprised if the ESB requested this also if they were asked to provide a connection to it.

Smashee

What? Are you serious? I need planning persmisson to put a caravan on the site? That's mental!!! So not alone did I have to go through the planning process to get permission to build the extension now you're telling me that I have to go back and apply to put a caravan there?

Ah seriously

smashey

Smashee wrote: »

What? Are you serious? I need planning persmisson to put a caravan on the site? That's mental!!! So not alone did I have to go through the planning process to get permission to build the extension now you're telling me that I have to go back and apply to put a caravan there?

Ah seriously

Correct.

charlieIRL

muffler wrote: »

You do need planning permission for a mobile home that is being lived in. And I wouldnt be surprised if the ESB requested this also if they were asked to provide a connection to it.

apologies, you are correct.........

15. Can I store caravans and boats?
One caravan, one campervan or one boat may be stored
in your garden for up to 9 months of the year as long as it
is not lived in or used for business purposes.

davgtrek

as far as i know the ESB will not connect up anything that doesn't have planning. its not a very accommodating setup by the esb. it pretty much screws the idea of living on your site in a mobile home to minimise rent whilst build is on etc.

in fact you need planning for a caravan if its parked up for 9 or more months in the year. of course they prob cant enforce this.

muffler

davgtrek wrote: »

in fact you need planning for a caravan if its parked up for 9 or more months in the year. of course they prob cant enforce this.

Wrong and wrong. (in this instance anyhow.)

Have you read the previous posts at all?

davgtrek

Muffler. thats what i mean. if its in the one spot for more than 9 months it needs planning. i skimmed charlies post. I wasn't aware of this minute law but a solicitor friend was entertained when he discovered it. i have a caravan ( its hardly roadworthy, i inherited from a relly who was camping mad thinking it would be a great idea, getting away at weekends etc.) parked up beside my house permanently for past 2 years. he was slagging me informing me that legally i need planning for it.

muffler

Parking it up the side of the house is one thing but in this instance the OP intends to live in it so there is no time lag.

pieface_ie

Regarding getting power to your caravan it's not a big deal and can be easily done by tapping off your exisiting connection in the house using armoured cable(s.w.a),as long as you get the right size cable for the job(depends on distance) so I woudnt be worried about that aspect,it's quiet easy to do.

Poor Uncle Tom

Yes....but is it legal????:eek:

CamperMan

15. Can I store caravans and boats?
One caravan, one campervan or one boat may be stored
in your garden for up to 9 months of the year as long as it
is not lived in or used for business purposes.

is this throughout the country?, one caravan, one campervan or one boat in your garden for up to 9 months, where are you supposed to put them the other 3 months of the year??, what happens if you liked collecting caravans and had 3 in your garden or maybe 4 boats?

Capt'n Midnight

use bottled gas for cooking , including kettle and heating to reduce your electricity load t the point where you could use an "extension lead" though of course you would need conduit / armoured cable


you can also get gas powered fridges but don't know too much about them

and you still have the legal problem

muffler

CamperMan wrote: »

15. Can I store caravans and boats?
One caravan, one campervan or one boat may be stored
in your garden for up to 9 months of the year as long as it
is not lived in or used for business purposes.

is this throughout the country?, one caravan, one campervan or one boat in your garden for up to 9 months, where are you supposed to put them the other 3 months of the year??, what happens if you liked collecting caravans and had 3 in your garden or maybe 4 boats?

Yes, this is part of the Planning & Development Acts which is supposed to be enforced throughout the country but rarely is from what I can see.

Poor Uncle Tom

I'm not getting at anyone in particular with this comment, and I'm sure we all know this, but I think it is worth remembering:

Having a prosecution upheld for an unauthorised development, even if the council are only chasing costs, means the named 'developer' gets a criminal record.

bye. bye, entry to USA..!, etc., etc.

charlieIRL

muffler wrote: »

Yes, this is part of the Planning & Development Acts which is supposed to be enforced throughout the country but rarely is from what I can see.

yupp, the paragraph i posted is an exerpt from "Do i need planning permission?" A leaflet you can pick up from any planning office. It can be downloaded as well.

cossworxenergy

To power your caravan I would suggest running an appropiate size SWA cable from cottage fuse board to your caravan. Make sure it is connected to an RCBO which protects against overload and short circuit. Very safe and easy to do. This is not illegal also. Its just a sub board!

RKQ

Good advice above, especially electrical from cossworxenergy.

In reality the refurbishment of the cottage, will require the owners to live in a caravan for a few months - technically it does require planning permission. However, Enforcement may not be very interested unless they receive a written complaint.

The ethos of the Act is to prevent people living in mobile homes / caravan beside dwellings, on a permanent basis. IMO it is not there to prevent people living Temporarily while refurbishing their home.

Either way it makes sense to live on site during the refurbishment - save rent and added security for build / materials.

Poor Uncle Tom

RKQ, I agree, but what is wrong with getting planning permission for the use of the mobile home on site temporarily. I've done it for a lot of my clients exactly in this position. It just makes everything legit, even from a site insurance point of view for living on site, very important, imo.

muffler

RKQ wrote: »

In reality the refurbishment of the cottage, will require the owners to live in a caravan for a few months - technically it does require planning permission. However, Enforcement may not be very interested unless they receive a written complaint.

The ethos of the Act is to prevent people living in mobile homes / caravan beside dwellings, on a permanent basis. IMO it is not there to prevent people living Temporarily while refurbishing their home.

The owners do not have to live in a caravan - there would be alternative accommodation available Im sure. Encouraging people to flout the planning laws is in breach of the charter and you should take a minute and read it.

Infraction given.

RKQ

Poor Uncle Tom wrote: »

RKQ, I agree, but what is wrong with getting planning permission for the use of the mobile home on site temporarily. I've done it for a lot of my clients exactly in this position. It just makes everything legit, even from a site insurance point of view for living on site, very important, imo.

Nothing wrong with that Uncle Tom. One MUST comply with the Law. I have clearly stated Permission is required.

I would never encourage anyone to flout the Law. It goes without saying that Permission must be applied for. Please quote the "encouragement" part of my post.

Muffler you misread my post, if you read the post you with see I was discussing the "Ethos" of the Act. Lets keep our disagreement on the Help Desk and stop the petty point scoring:D

Poor Uncle Tom

muffler, with the greatest of respect RKQ would never advocate law breaking. I think you know that.

Me on the other hand, I've seen it all, lived it all, and am most likely to tell people to flout the law, give me the time off instead please, leave the good man alone please.:)

muffler

Poor Uncle Tom wrote: »

muffler, with the greatest of respect RKQ would never advocate law breaking. I think you know that.

Me on the other hand, I've seen it all, lived it all, and am most likely to tell people to flout the law, give me the time off instead please, leave the good man alone please.:)

Anything posted that breaches the charter will be moderated so if you wish to stray from your normal well behaved pattern then Id be surprised indeed. Please post any other comments by PM only as I dont want this thread derailed.

Poor Uncle Tom

Noted and documented. thanks, muffler.

Smashee

But I'll only be living in it for 6 months ... ah c'mon, this country is flippin hilarious, you're taxed for breathing, you have to get planning permission if you stand still long enough, you have to pay for a tv license so that RTE can overpay some really crap presenters to host terrible shows and still pay a sky bill so that you can retain some sort of sanity after working round the clock to get no overtime, or pay-rise because now we're in a freakin recession after Bertie and his gang looked after their mates in the banks and building trade while they did dodgy dealings all over the gaff.

And I have to pay to get planning, then to get planning while I'm waiting for the house to be built for a freaking caravan on my freakin own freakin land, then pay a big disconnection/connection/reconnection again fee to the freakin ESB who have been freakin overcharging me for the freaking substandard service that they provide in any case.

*Deep Breaths*

muffler

Maybe its the legislators you need to be addressing your comments too.

TV licence fees, tax, paying for sky TV etc have nothing to do with this forum.

pathway33

You said you have land. How big is it? If you can't get planning for your caravan then you need to look at development that is exempt from planning. If you have a piece of land 10 metres from a public road and 100 metres from the nearest house (if nearer the houseowner can give written permission for you to place this structure on your land), school, church, public building, then you can place a structure there which is for agricultural purposes only. Now don't laugh. All you need to do to make it for agricultural purposes is a few calves or sheep, some hay and water. This is known as a type 1 structure and is exempt from planning if its under a certain square metreage (200 square metres I think). Also if you don't fancy sleeping with the pigs there is a type 4 structure, also exempt, which must be a store for machinery or agricultural products or a barn.


Now the planning officer may say 'wait a minute you have a bed here. This is not for agricultural purposes.' You say 'the bed is there to watch sheep lambing / cows calving at night.'


He'll say wait a minute 'you have a fridge in this barn, This is not for agricultural use'
You say 'I need the fridge to keep colostrum frozen for the newborn lambs'


All you have to do is come up with an agricultural use for everything you have there and you are not breaking any law.




This is a prime example of how to get yourself banned from this forum....

Read the charter!!

Syd

Poor Uncle Tom

Please be careful here. I have dealt with a couple of cases like this where Enforcement were of the opinion that it takes C.16 acres (C.6.5 hectares) to constitute a farm and thus the exemptions which apply to a farm. This could backfire badly and prove costly.

Question: The land is it zoned agricultural or is it unzoned, it does make a difference.

muffler

You beat me to it syd