The Golden Circle Strikes again!

Spore

Just tuned into Newstalk, some serious allegations made over Cowen's decision to reverse the tax liability on CFD purchases which helped our friend Seany Quinn buy up Anglo, the silly bint.

Anyway, Cowen as minister for finance back then reversed the decision by the Revenue Commissioners to pursue the Tax implications of acquiring shares through CFD's.

Accussations in the Dail that Cowen was direcly lobbied by a 'Golden Circle' of investors / stockbrokers

Times have some coverage on it:

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/frontpage/2009/0218/1224241332510.html?via=mr

THE IDENTITY of the 10 investors who were given €300 million in loans by Anglo Irish Bank to support its share price last year has emerged as a key political issue with the Opposition intensifying pressure on the Government to justify the decision to nationalise the bank.
In the Dáil yesterday Taoiseach Brian Cowen denied that he or any of his Ministers knew the identity of the wealthy individuals whose debts of €300 million will have to be picked up by the taxpayer as a result of the Government’s decision to nationalise the bank.
Mr Cowen was asked by Fine Gael leader Enda Kenny for the dates on which he became aware of developments at Anglo Irish.
“Can he confirm that no member of his Cabinet was in any way involved in the decisions of a new golden circle? The Galway tent may be gone but its spirit seems to be alive and well,” said Mr Kenny.

gerry28

Cowan looked quite worried about it yesterday in the dail. No doubt there will be a few dodgy names in the Anglo 10 when it all comes out.

mike65

So then 10 wealthy business men (read devlopers) received 300 million euro from Anglo-Irish to buy up shares of Anglo-Irish last Autumn. The Gubberment is refusing to name names (playing dumb methinks) the forthcoming regulators report won't name then either, should they be named by whoever might know under Dail privilege?

After all its all our banks now.

gandalf

Oh the time has come to name names now. It will happen its only a matter of time. I think we probably all have an idea of who they are and what race meetings they attended

mike65

10 fellas standing around looking for a tent?

ntlbell

what's the point in knowing who they were if they're not going to be punished?

Darragh29

A mate of mine told me last night that his parents were at this community discussion last week and Alan Dukes was speaking at the event. He was asked a question about the current situation and his reply was something along the lines of: "As I am on the board of Anglo Irish Bank, I cannot divulge specific information, but I can say this to you... What is going to come out in the next week or two about what has been going on within Anglo, is going to shock the Irish people to their very core, they will barely be able to get their heads around the seriousness of what they are going to hear, they will actually not believe what they are hearing"...

I'm not making this up, now whether this has something to do with the Golden Circle that is emerging, I have no idea, but I do know that Alan Dukes made the above statement or something along the lines of the above, as recently as last week. I'll give my mate a call and see if I can find out exactly what event or where this statement was made...

kenco

I heard rumours last night that some 'interesting names' were going to be falling out of this golden circle.

As of the last few mins RTE Lunchtime news is insinuating that Policitians possibly ministers might be involved. That could be speculation but just imagine the conflict of interests (and im being polite about that)

Zynks

Villain

I think Kenny knows something and is trying to set FF up for a big fall

thebigcheese22

One of the Golden Circle may be a Minister? Thats incredible! I know its all speculation but these are indeed interesting times.

Hopefully this will be enough for the Greens to pull out finally and end this trainwreck of a Government.

Also, can any person with legal knowledge explain the difficulties of divulging the names of these people? I understand it was confidential, but that was before the bank was nationalised so surely we the owners of it have a right to know who they are?
I'm not a lawyer but surely that is common sense.

nesf

Threads merged.

SkepticOne

thebigcheese22 wrote: »

I understand it was confidential, but that was before the bank was nationalised so surely we the owners of it have a right to know who they are?

I think legislation was enacted prior to the nationalising of the bank preventing this information from being released.

Sierra Oscar

Something fishy going on.

SEPT 23 1989

i think the corrupt Fianna Fail will gone after the weekend

gandalf

SkepticOne wrote: »

I think legislation was enacted prior to the nationalising of the bank preventing this information from being released.

Could they be named under Dail privilege?

Zynks

SkepticOne wrote: »

I think legislation was enacted prior to the nationalising of the bank preventing this information from being released.

:eek:
Do you have more information on that? Did the opposition let it go through silently?

SkepticOne

Zynks wrote: »

:eek:
Do you have more information on that? Did the opposition let it go through silently?

It seems to have been opposed by Joan Burton of Labour.

http://www.examiner.ie/story/Ireland/idcwcwsnoj/rss2/

Labour’s finance spokesperson Joan Burton said: "A huge amount of that bill basically deals with secrecy, preserving the secrecy of what goes on in that bank. If we need to restore Ireland’s reputation, the first thing we need to do is restore accountability."

Darragh29

gandalf wrote: »

Could they be named under Dail privilege?

Yeah, constitutionally, Dail privilege is absolute. There is nothing that could not be said in the Dail by a TD for fear of legal retribution. Obviously there is a political sensitive reason as opposed to a commercially sensitive reason why the names have not been forthcoming. Note members of both houses enjoy Dail privilege, which includes Senators as well as TD's...

All official reports and publications of the Oireachtas or of either House thereof and utterances made in either House wherever published shall be privileged. 13. The members of each House of the Oireachtas shall, except in case of treason as defined in this Constitution,
felony or breach of the peace, be privileged from arrest in going to and returning from, and while within the precincts of, either House, and shall not, in respect of any utterance in either House, be amenable to any court or any authority other than the House itself.

Zynks

SkepticOne wrote: »

It seems to have been opposed by Joan Burton of Labour.

http://www.examiner.ie/story/Ireland/idcwcwsnoj/rss2/

Thanks, but I am now about to enter a state of severe depression. This is worse than I thought. If there is somebody from the cabinet involved in the golden circle, he/she may be protected by this legislation.

What next, are they going to setup a new multi-million yo-yo tribunal that basically allows everyone to walk away free?

We are gone beyond banana republic. This is sounding like mafia stuff. It is low, abhorrent, abusive day-light robbery.

Darragh29

Zynks wrote: »

Thanks, but I am now about to enter a state of severe depression. This is worse than I thought. If there is somebody from the cabinet involved in the golden circle, he/she may be protected by this legislation.

What next, are they going to setup a new multi-million yo-yo tribunal that basically allows everyone to walk away free?

We are gone beyond banana republic. This is sounding like mafia stuff. It is low, abhorrent, abusive day-light robbery.

The truth will always emerge in a situation like this.

Pal

mike65 wrote: »

After all its all our banks now.

Its the Minister's bank.
He is the sole shareholder.

Sorry to disappoint but you and I are still plebs.

We own SFA

nuttz

Darragh29 wrote: »

A mate of mine told me last night that his parents were at this community discussion last week and Alan Dukes was speaking at the event.

What?

I wouldn't be surprised is more does come out about Anglo and all the rest of them, but come on now Darragh, the parents of a mate heard that the friend of sister...

Darragh29

nuttz wrote: »

What?

I wouldn't be surprised is more does come out about Anglo and all the rest of them, but come on now Darragh, the parents of a mate heard that the friend of sister...

No, no sisters or friends of sisters! Just my mates parents who told him what they heard Alan Dukes saying at this meeting and they told him and he told me, simple enough tbh...

spadder

Would it be prudent for us to speculate which minister(s) are in the golden circle?

nesf

spadder wrote: »

Would it be prudent for us to speculate which minister(s) are in the golden circle?

So long as anyone isn't making any accusations or tries to state as fact that a certain person was a member of this circle it's fine to speculate. If anyone starts accusing specific people of crime I'll remove their access from this forum since it could be construed as libel.


There is a very fine line here and I would ask people to think carefully before posting anything on this subject.

lostexpectation

Darragh29 wrote: »

A mate of mine told me last night that his parents were at this community discussion last week and Alan Dukes was speaking at the event. He was asked a question about the current situation and his reply was something along the lines of: "As I am on the board of Anglo Irish Bank, I cannot divulge specific information, but I can say this to you... What is going to come out in the next week or two about what has been going on within Anglo, is going to shock the Irish people to their very core, they will barely be able to get their heads around the seriousness of what they are going to hear, they will actually not believe what they are hearing"...

so why hasn't he being shouting about this from the rooftops?

its been called economic treason, is keeping schtum about it treason too.

strombone

Here's a list of current Ministers and Ministers of State:

http://www.taoiseach.gov.ie/index.asp?locID=237&docID=-1

For various reasons, I don't currently believe that any of these can be one of the Anglo Ten.

In any event, are we really to believe that in July of last year, Anglo and Quinn, needing a "dig-out" on the Quinn CFDs, and in the context of the potential for a run on Anglo, directly invited a member of the government to take a loan of €30m to buy shares?

I think Kenny is spoofing with this line of questioning, and, if that's is the case, then it's less than helpful in the circumstances.

K4t

Darragh29 wrote: »

I'll give my mate a call and see if I can find out exactly what event or where this statement was made...

Do be careful 007

P. Breathnach

spadder wrote: »

Would it be prudent for us to speculate which minister(s) are in the golden circle?

We're still at the stage of speculating if any politician was involved. This looks like racing too far ahead.

old boy

how come some people are suprised by this, where is charlie bird when we need him most, how come trickey questions are not being asked by the media.