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The Golden Circle Strikes again!

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24

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    #32
    J.
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9 ✭J.


    TV3 Political editor Ursula Halligan is reporting from a government source saying that 'a senior female FF government minister told FF backbenchers that if they taught it was bad now they were wrong, to brace themselves for a rocky weekend' and the source noted concern the the greens have not been in the dail the last two days during leaders questions and cowens statements


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    #33
    habraws
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1 ✭habraws


    Given that the 'awareness' of the deal goes back to March, can I detect the the cold hand of Bertie pulling the strings:confused:


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    #34
    P. Breathnach
    Registered Users Posts: 12,089 ✭✭✭✭P. Breathnach


    old boy wrote: »
    ...where is charlie bird when we need him most ...

    In Washington. We need him there, or anywhere but here. He would be seriously out of his depth with this stuff.

    A bit like us.


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    #35
    ejmaztec
    Registered Users Posts: 24,077 ✭✭✭✭ejmaztec


    No problems now as Biffo is apparently only protecting the Irish taxpayer. I wonder which Irish taxpayer he's talking about.

    http://www.independent.ie/breaking-news/national-news/politics/cowen-says-he-is-not-protecting-anyone-but-taxpayers-1643796.html

    The Taoiseach has insisted in the Dail that he is not protecting anybody other than the Irish taxpayer in his dealings with the Irish banks.
    Brian Cowen was speaking after coming under attack for a second day over the secrecy surrounding the 10 investors who were given €300m in loans by Anglo Irish Bank in order to buy shares in the bank.
    The individual purchases, which were small enough to avoid disclosure to the Stock Exchange, helped to prevent potential damage to Anglo's share price after Sean Quinn decided to offload a 10% stake in the firm.
    Fine Gael leader Enda Kenny repeatedly questioned Mr Cowen this morning about the extent of his knowledge of the shares deal when the Government drew up its bank guarantee scheme last year.
    The Taoiseach responded by saying he resented Fine Gael suggestions that he was protecting somebody involved in the deal.


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    #36
    J.
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9 ✭J.


    habraws wrote: »
    Given that the 'awareness' of the deal goes back to March, can I detect the the cold hand of Bertie pulling the strings:confused:

    This makes more sense than a current cabinet minister or jr minister being involved, surely if it was a current minister they would be presured to offer they're resignation by now


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    #37
    Mr.Micro
    Registered Users Posts: 5,336 ✭✭✭Mr.Micro


    The Taoiseach has insisted in the Dail that he is not protecting anybody other than the Irish taxpayer in his dealings with the Irish banks.

    If that is the case why is any information coming out on a drip drip basis? If Biff really meant what he said he would let it all out now and make a clean breast of it. The longer the scandal is prolonged the more suspicious it looks, and the more likely long term damage.


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    #38
    OhNoYouDidn't
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,934 ✭✭✭OhNoYouDidn't


    spadder wrote: »
    Would it be prudent for us to speculate which minister(s) are in the golden circle?

    I hate to be the boring one, but the jungle drums I'm hearing are that its not a minister, but a serving FF TD. Not as sexy a story, but will be gas nonetheless.


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    #39
    mike65
    Closed Accounts Posts: 88,978 ✭✭✭✭mike65


    Why is boards.ie full of P.ie refugees? ;) :pac:


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    #40
    thomasj
    Registered Users Posts: 4,809 ✭✭✭thomasj


    OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »
    I hate to be the boring one, but the jungle drums I'm hearing are that its not a minister, but a serving FF TD. Not as sexy a story, but will be gas nonetheless.

    are the jungle drums saying if the td was ever a minister ?


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    #41
    J.
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9 ✭J.


    OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »
    I hate to be the boring one, but the jungle drums I'm hearing are that its not a minister, but a serving FF TD. Not as sexy a story, but will be gas nonetheless.

    well it has to be a multi-millionaire, how many multi-millionaire FF TDS that aren't government ministers are in the dail


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    #42
    Godge
    Closed Accounts Posts: 21,727 ✭✭✭✭Godge


    Fyffes, nothing illegal in the eyes of the Board but to most peoples' eyes it was wrong.
    Quinn selling off 10% of Anglo to a golden circle who were lent the money to buy it by Anglo, nothing illegal but wrong.
    Anglo dropping the security requirement in the deal, not illegal but wrong.
    Anglo depositing money in Irish Nationwide and back again, nothing illegal but wrong.

    A taoiseach who takes gifts in Manchester and loans in a pub in Drumcondra, doesn't have a bank account, nothing illegal but wrong.

    The common thread is the cute hoorism loved by FF. Bertie was the personification of that. When our previous Taoiseach is defending himself by saying he did nothing illegal, why wouldn't others follow and ignore what is wrong and concentrate on what is legal.

    The Irish people have got what they voted for.


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    #43
    OhNoYouDidn't
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,934 ✭✭✭OhNoYouDidn't


    thomasj wrote: »
    are the jungle drums saying if the td was ever a minister ?

    Why the fcuk did I not think to ask that. :mad:


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    #44
    J.
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9 ✭J.


    is this going to be like naming charlie in the early 90's, no paper or news agency prepared to take on 'the man'. what ever happened to investigative journalism. a sense of once bitten twice shy over the lawlor mishap on the female interpreter


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    #45
    stepbar
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,123 ✭✭✭stepbar


    J. wrote: »
    is this going to be like naming charlie in the early 90's, no paper or news agency prepared to take on 'the man'. what ever happened to investigative journalism. a sense of once bitten twice shy over the lawlor mishap on the female interpreter

    There's a difference between investigative journalism and pure lies.


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    #46
    P. Breathnach
    Registered Users Posts: 12,089 ✭✭✭✭P. Breathnach


    stepbar wrote: »
    There's a difference between investigative journalism and pure lies.

    In the Lawlor case, it was more like impure lies.

    I think J. describing it as a "mishap" is something of an understatement.


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    #47
    J.
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9 ✭J.


    stepbar wrote: »
    There's a difference between investigative journalism and pure lies.

    i know theres a hugh differnce in both stories and in truth n lies but this could be just overkill in the legal departments of the newspapers, etc. we need investigative journalism now more than ever, our counrty is on the line,


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    #48
    nesf
    Registered Users Posts: 27,645 ✭✭✭✭nesf


    J. wrote: »
    i know theres a hugh differnce in both stories and in truth n lies but this could be just overkill in the legal departments of the newspapers, etc. we need investigative journalism now more than ever, our counrty is on the line,

    With the mob in the mood it's in the papers better not start naming people unless they're damn sure of what they're saying because it'll blacken people's names regardless of whether it's true or not.


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    #49
    J.
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9 ✭J.


    nesf wrote: »
    With the mob in the mood it's in the papers better not start naming people unless they're damn sure of what they're saying because it'll blacken people's names regardless of whether it's true or not.

    im not asking the papers to take a stab at naming the 10 members of the golden circle, i dont want to know who may or may not be a member, i want to know who the members actually are, at the end of the day im one of the four million and odd owners of that bank now, i want to know who the hell is screwing me and my fello four million citzens out of 225-300 million euro, free press including investigative journalism is the birth-stone of democracy. 225 million of wat they owe us has been declared bad debt by anglo's board and i want it back


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    #50
    Darragh29
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,097 ✭✭✭Darragh29


    Cowen tonight has "confirmed" for us that no person in the cabinet is a member of the "Golden Circle", despite confirming for us today and yesterday that he doesn't know the names of any of the members in the "Golden Circle", so make of that what you will...

    I think it is extremely important to note that Cowen, while confirming for us all that he knows that none of his cabinet/ministers are linked to this, despite not knowing the names of the people who are within this "Golden Circle", has not ruled out the possibility that any FF TD's are members of this elite group...

    So how many FF TD's outside of the cabinet are in a financial position to be involved here....???


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    #51
    nesf
    Registered Users Posts: 27,645 ✭✭✭✭nesf


    J. wrote: »
    im not asking the papers to take a stab at naming the 10 members of the golden circle, i dont want to know who may or may not be a member, i want to know who the members actually are, at the end of the day im one of the four million and odd owners of that bank now, i want to know who the hell is screwing me and my fello four million citzens out of 225-300 million euro, free press including investigative journalism is the birth-stone of democracy. 225 million of wat they owe us has been declared bad debt by anglo's board and i want it back

    What do those 10 people have to do with Anglo's bad debt?


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    #52
    J.
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9 ✭J.


    nesf wrote: »
    What do those 10 people have to do with Anglo's bad debt?

    the anglo board wrote off 75% of their 300 million euro loan as a non recoverable debt (given to the golden circle) as will be stated in the PWC report to be published on friday, cowen is saying the government is doing wat it can with out knowin names 2 secure the remainin 25%(75m) of the loan


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    #53
    nesf
    Registered Users Posts: 27,645 ✭✭✭✭nesf


    J. wrote: »
    the anglo board wrote off 75% of their 300 million euro loan as a non recoverable debt (given to the golden circle) as will be stated in the PWC report to be published on friday, cowen is saying the government is doing wat it can with out knowin names 2 secure the remainin 25%(75m) of the loan

    Blame the Anglo Board and Fitzpatrick in particular for that, rather than the 10 investors. They were the ones who signed off on the loan which was extremely reckless.


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    #54
    Darragh29
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,097 ✭✭✭Darragh29


    J. wrote: »
    the anglo board wrote off 75% of their 300 million euro loan as a non recoverable debt (given to the golden circle) as will be stated in the PWC report to be published on friday, cowen is saying the government is doing wat it can with out knowin names 2 secure the remainin 25%(75m) of the loan

    I've a mortgage for 250K. I'm going down to AIB tomorrow morning to see if they'll accept the 50K I have in me Credit Union account to see if we can settle up...


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    #55
    skelliser
    Registered Users Posts: 2,985 ✭✭✭skelliser


    This is very interesting

    "It emerged last night that Anglo Irish has decided not to pursue the 10 investors for the €75 million in security they offered for the €300 million in loans from the bank, because of legal problems with the loan agreement. The bank will confirm it has written off the loans in its annual report, to be published on Friday."

    Especially this!!

    "In the Dáil last night Mr Lenihan confirmed that Bank of Ireland chief executive Brian Goggin will step down within the next three weeks, earlier than his planned departure this summer."

    http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/frontpage/2009/0218/1224241332510.html


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    #56
    lostexpectation
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,082 ✭✭✭lostexpectation


    http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601102&sid=awf7bVUsWKmY

    The Irish Times today reported that Anglo Irish wouldn’t pursue 10 investors for 75 million euros ($94.5 million) they put up to secure a 300 million euro-loan that funded the purchase.

    Anglo Irish will chase prepayment to “the greatest extent that they can do so under the terms and conditions of the loans,” Cowen said today in parliament


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    #57
    DublinWriter
    Registered Users Posts: 9,557 ✭✭✭DublinWriter


    I have a gut feeling that this might be the straw that breaks the Greens' back.


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    #58
    Darragh29
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,097 ✭✭✭Darragh29


    lostexpectation wrote: »
    http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601102&sid=awf7bVUsWKmY

    The Irish Times today reported that Anglo Irish wouldn’t pursue 10 investors for 75 million euros ($94.5 million) they put up to secure a 300 million euro-loan that funded the purchase.

    Anglo Irish will chase prepayment to “the greatest extent that they can do so under the terms and conditions of the loans,” Cowen said today in parliament

    More of the same auld codding. If you owe them 20 Euro, they will come after you for it. If the people of this country tolerate this, then I think the only answer is that something has been put into the water in this country.
    DublinWriter wrote: »
    I have a gut feeling that this might be the straw that breaks the Greens' back.

    I think it will pretty soon be the cause of more than the camels back being broken...


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    #59
    J.
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9 ✭J.


    DublinWriter wrote: »
    I have a gut feeling that this might be the straw that breaks the Greens' back.

    ya im getin that feelin also, its a bit of a gamble, putting 15 people in power now at a time of crisis, with only 2 of the potintial 15 with cabinet experince, will it be worth it? can it be much worse than wats there now?


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    #60
    Darragh29
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,097 ✭✭✭Darragh29


    J. wrote: »
    ya im getin that feelin also, its a bit of a gamble, putting 15 people in power now at a time of crisis, with only 2 of the potintial 15 with cabinet experince, will it be worth it? can it be much worse than wats there now?

    There is only one thing worse than no experience and that is bad experience. When you are dealing with the corrupt, there is no hope. You can only have hope where there is potential. We are on the road to hell with this government.


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    #61
    K-9
    Registered Users Posts: 43,311 ✭✭✭✭K-9


    Darragh29 wrote: »
    Cowen tonight has "confirmed" for us that no person in the cabinet is a member of the "Golden Circle", despite confirming for us today and yesterday that he doesn't know the names of any of the members in the "Golden Circle", so make of that what you will...

    I think it is extremely important to note that Cowen, while confirming for us all that he knows that none of his cabinet/ministers are linked to this, despite not knowing the names of the people who are within this "Golden Circle", has not ruled out the possibility that any FF TD's are members of this elite group...

    So how many FF TD's outside of the cabinet are in a financial position to be involved here....???

    Maybe he asked a simple question at the cabinet table? Are any of you involved?

    Doesn't mean he can rule it out completely?

    Mad Men's Don Draper : What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.



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