WIT University Status - "Its a big 'no'"

dayshah

Odats wrote: »

Waterford Glass factory is the solution but could prove to be a pig in a poke with cleaning up the site to be fit for development which would could run into a significant cost.

I don't know anything about construction, but would it really be so expensive?

I mean, they weren't exactly making anything poisonous and there was a canteen there and people working, so it couldn't be that bad.

I heard a reliable figure of €5million is expected for the site.

deisedeise

I mean, they weren't exactly making anything poisonous and there was a canteen there and people working, so it couldn't be that bad.


apart from the lead in the crystal maybe, apparently the land is wrecked cos of lead poisoning over the years

dayshah

deisedeise wrote: »

apart from the lead in the crystal maybe, apparently the land is wrecked cos of lead poisoning over the years

Maybe if they build on it and disturb the land it would get into the ground water or something.

THall04

deisedeise wrote: »

I mean, they weren't exactly making anything poisonous and there was a canteen there and people working, so it couldn't be that bad.


apart from the lead in the crystal maybe, apparently the land is wrecked cos of lead poisoning over the years

They also used Arsenic.

ec18

the whole site is probably contaminated. Like the car park by the maxol station. Aldi couldn't build there years ago because of the cost of getting the car park decontaminated

dayshah

THall04 wrote: »

They also used Arsenic.

Really :eek:

for what? None left in the wine glasses I hope

THall04

dayshah wrote: »

Really :eek:

for what? None left in the wine glasses I hope

Think arsenic was used to prevent bubbles forming as the glass cooled.

The arsenic store was located in the building closest to the houses at the end of Manor Lawn (across from the junction of Ashe Road/Matties Hill).

dayshah

No real surprise, unfortunately.

http://www.munster-express.ie/local-news/hunt-report-%E2%80%98buries%E2%80%99-wit%E2%80%99s-university-bid/

We have to go back to the drawing board.

I never liked the University of the South East idea, I don't think its good to spread a campus over a city, never mind a region.

I think we should just concentrate on getting a designation that sets us apart from the other ITs.

Nolanger

Ireland's first 'technical university' is going to be in Dublin soon.

Groinshot

Surely the lecturers actually have to start doing something before its considered a university..

Sully

Hardly a set in stone no. Fine Gael have said for a long time they want to sort this mess out, and I think other opposition parties have said (somewhat) the same.

A Fianna Fail government were never going to give us university status. So tbh, I take no heed of reports and blabber in papers until we get a new government in.

dayshah

Sully wrote: »

Hardly a set in stone no. Fine Gael have said for a long time they want to sort this mess out, and I think other opposition parties have said (somewhat) the same.

A Fianna Fail government were never going to give us university status. So tbh, I take no heed of reports and blabber in papers until we get a new government in.

I think you are being over optimistic. What's good for Waterford or the South East isn't necessarily good for the country. This is a point that has been missed out on those promoting university status. The argument has been focused on 'fairness' for the south east and our unemployment and so on. That'll never get support from FF, FG or Labour TDs up in Mayo or Dublin.

We need to make a better argument for increased funding for WIT. I think the fact that the report was put together by a Waterford man says alot. We can in no way accuse him of being anti-Waterford. The case for a 10th university in Ireland (8th in Republic) is weak. Also universities don't do the good work WIT does on cert and diploma courses (whatever they are called now).

I think we should just focus on getting a designation above the other ITs to show WIT is better than the rest of them (except DIT), and increased funding. I'd be happy with the designation Waterford Polytechnic. I'd also have been happy with the designation IT had all the other Regional Technical Colleges not been upgraded by Micheal Martin to keep Cork RTC happy. We shouldn't weaken WIT by spreading it over several counties, loosing critical mass.

Also the term Technical University is a contradiction in terms and should be abandoned.

jmcc

It is obvious that Fianna Fail in Dublin are trying to shore up their vote in Dublin (where they face obliteration) by trying to pull the woll over peoples eyes again. This decision to give Dublin yet another bloody "university" is purely a Fianna Fail decision and, as with most Fianna Fail decisions, against the national interest.

Regards...jmcc

dayshah

This might interest people. pg 43 of the programme for government.
http://www.irishtimes.com/focus/2011/coalition-pact/agreement.pdf



"We will explore the establishment of a multi campus Technical University in the South East."

Not very committal, (but I think a multi-campus university is a bad idea anyway).

O Riain

dayshah wrote: »

This might interest people. pg 43 of the programme for government.
http://www.irishtimes.com/focus/2011/coalition-pact/agreement.pdf



"We will explore the establishment of a multi campus Technical University in the South East."

Not very committal, (but I think a multi-campus university is a bad idea anyway).

At least it removes cork from the equation and hints towards it being unique to the South East, this technical university carry on will only benefit us if we are the only one's who have it.

dlofnep

What's the difference between a Technical Uni and a standard Uni?

dayshah

dlofnep wrote: »

What's the difference between a Technical Uni and a standard Uni?

A technical university is just a new name tag.

A university should be universal in the subjects it covers, eg arts, business, etc. A technical university is a contradiction in terms. I'd rather WIT were just called a polytechnic than some sort of mickey mouse university.

dlofnep

That's what I assumed. A name change to appease people

Sully

I'm not overly happy with this, as a FG voter and member. I was always told, in writing, we would be given a University. Now it seems that yes we will, but a different type. Ill wait until I hear exactly what this will mean. The WIT Branch queried our newely elected TD by email and got this detailed response.

A bit of context is required here. I stood for election first in 2007 and at that time I am ashamed to say there was no mention of University for SE anywhere in the FG election manifesto.
Subsequently I was elected to the Seanad and I lobbied hard within the FG Parliamentary Party to have this issue properly addressed - the matter was then taken up by the Frontbench and Brian Hayes TD then FG Education spokesperson published a policy on 3rd level education that committed FG to pursuing the establishment of a University in the South East.

This also formed part of our 2011 election manifesto.

The Programme for Government is a broad brush document that is an agreed programme for the new coalition but the finer detail of the document obviously has to be worked out as priorities and resources allow.
This document just sets out broadly what the new Coalition intends to do in the various policy areas - it is not an attempt to spell out exactly what each Dept will do over the next term - that will be the job of the various line Ministers that will be appointed on Wednesday and the government TDs.

It surely has to be welcomed that University for the SE is mentioned although briefly in the PFG Document - I would be a lot more worried if there was no mention at all.
Therefore it is on the radar of the new government and it still is a matter that all stakeholders have to pursue and push for. I am committed to continue lobbying and pursuing this objective as I always have.

In fact I believe that the wording should have read "Technological University" but I can understand the document was drafted and with intense pressure on to produce an agreed document in a very short timeframe so some allowances have to be made. This can be clarified when the new Ministers are appointed.

I agree with the view that we, here in the South East , should not be trying to replicate other Universities that currently exist in the State but rather we should be trying to establish a University with its own unique courses and capacities that are not available in other unis here in Ireland.
This approach gives us a niche market and will attract students from all over the Country and beyond whilst also justifying the demand on public expenditure for the creation of such a university - therefore no duplication and lessens the charge that could be laid at us of why set up a University there when we have such courses in Cork, Limerick etc etc.?

It is very obvious to me that such a University of the South East would have to have its HQ in the existing WIT Campus which is by far the most developed and largest Campus in the SE - the multi campus concept I suspect is that outreach facilities that would benefit regional development would be located in the smallers ITs that exist ie Carlow and Tipperary etc.
This is not the first time Ive heard of such proposals and personally I would much prefer it to what seems to be the present rumoured direction of WIT ie merge with CIT.
Much more common sense from an economic regional argument to have the campuses based in SE.
Again this is my understanding and the real detail of the proposal still will have to be outlined by the new Minister for Education and his/her Department.

There is no-one more interested in the development of Waterford and the SE than myself and again I would point out that the PFG is a broad brush document that could not possibly detail all the plans of the next Government in minute detail - that work still remains but we are in there!
I dont see such a mention in PFG for Letterkenny or Athlone ITs even though there was a serious lobby for their upgrade also which probably historically hampered WITs case too.

FGs proposals for funding 3rd level education have been diluted somewhat by the removal of the graduate tax - to set up universities and run colleges the money has to come from somewhere so this is an area I suspect may have to be revisited in a revised PFG at some stage.

So in short I would say that the fight must continue - we have been given something to hang on and pursue, I would be a lot more worried and concerned as I stated earlier if there was no mention at all.

That is my initial assessment of the issue you raised without having discussed the matter in detail with anybody - however its obviously an issue I will be pursuing closely and intensely with the new government and new Minister for Education..

Its very early days and I would say that FG as a party are going to face many difficult decisions in government so I would urge all in YFG to hang on tight and be prepared because it will be scary at times and will not be for the faint hearted but at the end of the day my hope is that we will come out the other side with more hope and propsects of a sustainable economy and country again.

Phil Hogan had this on Facebook today;

The new Programme for Government has good news for Kilkenny and the South East.

The Programme, which was agreed by Fine Gael and Labour over the weekend, has given third level education in the South East a major boost.

The programme contains a commitment to explore the establishment of a multi campus Technical University in the South East.

“We will explore the establishment of a multi campus Technical University in the South East”, states the Programme.
Deputy PhilHogan, who was one of the chief negotiators in drafting the programme, has now called on the existing third level colleges in the South East to advance the proposal.

“This proposal will enable students in the region to have a broad range of third level education in their own area”, he said.

“This means that the four counties in the South East will have a contribution to make towards a critical and viable mass of students in the region to sustain a university.

“Hopefully, this decision of the Fine Gael/Labour negotiating teamas set out in the objectives of the Programme for Government will lead to better cooperation between Waterford and Carlow Its.

“It would also be a major attraction for potential foreign investment in industry and job creation”.

CantGetNoSleep

A Technical University is still not a university though

If they wanted to create a technological university why can't they just create a University of Waterford and specialise in technology related disciplines

I have to admit though it was a simple thing to promise before an election, so I am not one bit surprised

AdMMM

Sounds like we'll be in no-mans-land!

dlofnep

Do I understand that they wish to create a multi-campus, cross-county Technical University? This is clearly not the way forward in my view. I think we can specialise in particular areas in WIT - Focus on cutting-edge areas of IT, like IPv6 and really get ahead of the pack - But this plan isn't the way forward. Infact, it will just dilute it.

Sully

dlofnep wrote: »

Do I understand that they wish to create a multi-campus, cross-county Technical University? This is clearly not the way forward in my view. I think we can specialise in particular areas in WIT - Focus on cutting-edge areas of IT, like IPv6 and really get ahead of the pack - But this plan isn't the way forward. Infact, it will just dilute it.

The campus idea, I think, will be like the original proposals by the campaigners and not the ones currently being discussed (WIT and Cork for example).

jmcc

Sully wrote: »

The campus idea, I think, will be like the original proposals by the campaigners and not the ones currently being discussed (WIT and Cork for example).

And it may well end with Carlow as the HQ. Same sh!t - different government.

Regards...jmcc

dayshah

So basically we will be a polytechnic/IT.

I've no real problem with that so long as we get increased funding. I'd like the new name to differentiate us from other ITs that aren't as good, so I'd be happy with Waterford Polytechnic.

But I'm against the idea of multi-campus. It looses all the economies of scale and scope. I could handle a separate campus for agricultural science, we can't be keeping cows on the cork road, but how would we divide the library?

Multi-campus institutes are only ever political fudges. I see no advantage to Waterford (or the south-east) in a mediocre dispersed institution.

dlofnep

Sully wrote: »

The campus idea, I think, will be like the original proposals by the campaigners and not the ones currently being discussed (WIT and Cork for example).

But the statement above by you looked to share the campus across multiple counties?

Joey leBlanc

CantGetNoSleep wrote: »

I have to admit though it was a simple thing to promise before an election, so I am not one bit surprised

Different government - same old story (or should that be lies!). Why do we continually elect people to represent us who blatantly lie & confuse the electorate for the next 4yrs. Its for this very reason I declined to vote in the recent general election, did'nt answer my door to canvasers or listen to the blanket election coverage. Do people not remember who got the country into the mess its in at the moment? Politicians! Irregardless of party they "all" play the same game when they attain the reigns of power.

Back on point I still have a badge given to me at a St Patrick's Day Parade calling for "University for Waterford!" - the year anyone????
Ans: 17th March 1987!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
(I reckon I will be celebrating my badges golden jubilee next year)

Nolanger

dlofnep wrote: »

What's the difference between a Technical Uni and a standard Uni?

The technical uni is full of lads wearing aroraks and football bags over their shoulders who are there to get a job. The standard uni is full of people who want to broaden their minds while getting a job is something that can wait.

dayshah

Nolanger wrote: »

The technical uni is full of lads wearing aroraks and football bags over their shoulders who are there to get a job. The standard uni is full of people who want to broaden their minds while getting a job is something that can wait.

I think you are overrating the vast majority of university students. Most people go to 3rd level to get a job or because its what's expected of them.

Bards

SO they're going to grab courses out of WIT and spread them out to Wexford & Kilkenny uner the auspicies of a Technological Multi-Campus University

I for one would rather WIT stay as an IT fully located in Waterford than see Crash & Grab approach.

Remember it was a Lab/FG Govt that took the ambulance sercvice from WRH and moved it to Wexford.

A Lab/FG Govt that moved the director of the IDA S.E to Cork

this will be another Grab from Waterford to make it less of a City so the other towns can claim to be the capital of the S.E