Latest Spoke

Lord TSC

Am I right in saying that the editor of the Spoke is someone elected during the student elections?

My main problem with it has always been that it seems entirely focused on the SU and nothing else. All the stories, all the pictures, etc, are all focused around the bar and every now and again, clubs which do something in the bar. There's very little effort made to tackle issues from Maynooth at large. That was why I was delighted to see The Advocate come into existance and why I started contributing to it. Unfortunatly, it too seemed to get more and more SU focused as it went on.

Could just be me being a tad bitter though. As a non-drinking commutter, I often find that things like the Spoke have zero appeal to me

PrivateEye

Am I right in saying that the editor of the Spoke is someone elected during the student elections?

Yep.


http://www.rebeccacollins.net/images/MaynoothInterview1.jpg
(Article found on Google from The Advocate, 2007)

Solid, nice layout, looks like the kind of publication you'd pay money for, something of interest outside the bar, and a generally stellar publication from the copy or two I've found around the place.

I think the hunger's there for another paper like it to be honest.


http://maynoothadvocatenews.blogspot.com/

From just casting my eye over that I see bits on the BICS, Shell in Mayo, students and elections and local news (Tescos planning permission at the time) Much more interesting than the sh/te they're filling pages with now.

banquo

Mother of GO-

WE DON'T NEED THE ADVOCATE

We already have a funded publication. We pay for it. It already exists. It's just unfortunate that it's generally run by a gang of talentless fools who just want to write about themselves - see this issue's front cover.

Next year we've a new editor. I got to know him in the course of the SU campaigns and he's actually pretty sound - to talk to at least, I don't know what he'll be like as an editor. But, he's not Duffy, so that's a start.

We've seen the results of apathy towards the publication. Duffy was terrible all year and everybody just complained. New year, new Spoke. We have a number of options:

1) Get very involved in content. I've a good deal of the right kind of experience at this. Privateeye can do some pretty decent captions as seen in this thread , there's loads of talent to go around.

2) Do nothing and complain.

3) If it's bad next year (and it may well not be), and students get no creative control over it, then we can.. I dunno, kidnap his dog or something.

PrivateEye

COUP D'ETAT!

Lord TSC

Thought so.

To an extent, I agree with Banquo. We shouldn't need the Advocate, but rather we should be demanding that how the editor of the Spoke is chosen changes.

My problem is that no matter how sound someone may be, when they get picked for the role, chances are they've never run a paper/mag before and thus really don't know anything about it. They get a year learning the ropes and then they leave and someone else comes in who has no clue what they are doing. Even if next years editor does a brilliant job, it doesn't mean the following years will be any good.

What they need to do, in my opinion anyway, is to move the job away from the student elections and into some form of a club/society where the members choose an editor based on his creds (and not on his popularity in the bar). This way, you could also theoretically have someone getting to do it for a few years because they know what they are doing. Furthermore, I'd say there should be some form of an apprentice editor who would constantly be in training and working with the editor with the idea being that when one editor stepped down for whatever reason, someone would already be trained and know the ropes.

Thats why I loved the idea of the Advocate. It wasn't tied down to the bar. It wasn't held back by people voting in strangers into a job they had no clue if he was qualified for or not. IIRC though, it was difficult to get any ads for various reasons and thus there wasn't enough money for it to be run effiently. I'd have loved to have seen John get the money the Spoke gets. It could have been awesome.

banquo

I agree with TSC to an extent

I'm sorta on the fence with the club/soc idea. On one hand, it means that you get a broader circle of views. On the other hand - and this is from my own experience - you end up with a ''magazine camp'' system, where it's important that everyone gets to play, no matter how bad their ideas.

If I were editor (/curses) I'd like to be able to reject an article without having to go ten rounds on the whys and buts.

I agree that it sucks that editor is editor for 1 year. Though they can stand for re-election if they do a good job. They should hire a full-time designer who knows what they're doing to make sure that it's consistently good.

I agree with TSC on how the club could elect its editor. You could join the club at the start of the year, and a member of that club is elected - by club members - as next year's VP COMMS. Oneka had that (or something like it) in her manifesto, and I'm sorry I didn't think of it myself.

@Private Eye: COUP d'ETAT indeed! Also, I think the newspaper is the way to go, if for no other reason than people are more likely to notice a newspaper lying on a tabletop than they are a magazine. Also, it contains news. Also, cheaper. Also, you can get away with a smaller typeface in a newspaper.

I really, really like the look of Der Allemeigne (spelling?) It's a conservative German paper and therefore impossible for me to understand, but it's just beautiful to look at. Like, really gorgeous.

And while I remember: Yes, pixellated pictures ftl.

Whatever happens, we need as many students as possible involved in the direction and content of the publication. I don't plan on leaving Eoin Byrne's office for the first month. Any bit of useful information I can pass on that he happens not to know already he shalt receive, by force if necessary.

conf101

In each of my 4 years here the Spoke has gotten progressively worse. Some of the issues this year aren't even good enough to light a fire with. Using huge typeface to cover up the fact that you have small articles with nothing in them is patronising to the reader. I can honestly say that I didn't read anything worthwhile in ANY of the issues of the spoke this year, and I read them all.

And for God sake what were they playing at with the cover design this month, absolute tripe!

Beau

banquo wrote: »

I don't plan on leaving Eoin Byrne's office for the first month. Any bit of useful information I can pass on that he happens not to know already he shalt receive, by force if necessary.

Are you not finishing up in Maynooth?

This year it really sucked. The article about the clubs and socs awards was pathetic, it would've been cool to see my clubs (Rugby) achievements and why we won club of the year rather than it just mentioned in passing, same goes for Dance or any of the other award like the presidents award which wasn't mentioned at all.

banquo

Beau wrote: »

Are you not finishing up in Maynooth?

This year it really sucked. The article about the clubs and socs awards was pathetic, it would've been cool to see my clubs (Rugby) achievements and why we won club of the year rather than it just mentioned in passing, same goes for Dance or any of the other award like the presidents award which wasn't mentioned at all.

I'll still be living here (hopefully)

Club of the year = 5 words.
Friends of the editor = front page.

Nice.

allandanyways

on a rant-related note about the SU, why does the website (web****e more like) take so long to load?

banquo

allandanyways wrote: »

on a rant-related note about the SU, why does the website (web****e more like) take so long to load?

All the crap.

Anyone up for chipping in for a ''Worst-editor-ever-we're-thrilled-you're-leaving'' trophy?

PrivateEye

Anyone up for chipping in for a ''Worst-editor-ever-we're-thrilled-you're-leaving'' trophy?

We should've got the National Union of Journos out to blockade against the printers van whenever a new one was on the way.

cython

banquo wrote: »

Mother of GO-

WE DON'T NEED THE ADVOCATE

We already have a funded publication. We pay for it. It already exists. It's just unfortunate that it's generally run by a gang of talentless fools who just want to write about themselves - see this issue's front cover.

There actually is a very arguable need for the Advocate, or the Tonic, as the Publications Society used to print before that (now that's going back a while!). One of the biggest issues with the Spoke is that it is run directly by the SU, so of course they are going to deal with a good bit of their own stuff in it. I agree that they should look further afield as well, but a large proportion of SU-related content is to be expected.

However, a better reason for the Advocate/Tonic/Other non-SU-published student newspaper is transparency - the SU are not going to publish anything in their paper that casts the SU themselves (or even the University, seeing as they are the source of the SU funding) in any bad light. An independent paper, on the other hand, is in a position to do this, because they should be mostly, if not entirely, funded from their advertising, and so they don't have to tread as softly. Additionally, when such a paper has to seek almost all their funding from scratch, it is in their best interests to get their circulation as high as possible, in order to demand more money for advertising. This in itself is an incentive for better publication values, and better content that will attract students to the paper.

In fact, if there was an independent publication of good quality competing with the Spoke for the limited enough amount of advertisers around Maynooth, that might actually be the kick up the arse that was needed if they realised they were losing out to it

redenemyjoe

Is there a publication in existence for Dublin/Ireland that focuses on the 18 - 30 age group college students tend to fall into?

I mean a paper that isn't overly left and actually has something constructive to say? That would be interesting.

PrivateEye

However, a better reason for the Advocate/Tonic/Other non-SU-published student newspaper is transparency

Exactly.

They've two papers out in UCD and while obviously they're far far larger than us, the issue of transparency would justify it on a campus as small as our own too. It doesn't take a genius to work out which of their two publications is the one asking questions, and which gives you pictures of the exec and their mates.

I imagine the problem is finding advertising at the minute!

Lord TSC

I'm sorta on the fence with the club/soc idea. On one hand, it means that you get a broader circle of views. On the other hand - and this is from my own experience - you end up with a ''magazine camp'' system, where it's important that everyone gets to play, no matter how bad their ideas.

If I were editor (/curses) I'd like to be able to reject an article without having to go ten rounds on the whys and buts.

Agreed 100%. Whoever runs it should have the guts to say if they dont want the story put in, and I think that is a very important characteristic that an editor would need - the ability to say no.

As I said, I wrote for the Advocate. Well, to be more specific, I wrote two articles. The first went find. It was a piece on my opinions as a non-drinking student and the attitudes towards "people like me". The second article was on ASBOs and how bringing them in to practice in Ireland wouldn't work. I kind of got the feeling that the second one wasn't as wanted as the first, but I was never told in as many words. I submitted it for the second edition and it wasn't printed. I started hounding John and he said he'd put it in, but I really got the feeling he was reluctant. I wouldn't have minded if he had outright told me he didn't want to put it in. I'd have respected that that was his discretion as the editor. But I was constantly left hanging

And the transparency issue is an interesting one as well. I doubt the college itself would ever issue decrees saying that they couldn't print articles on this or that, but at the same time, I know if I was the editor, I'd be worried over offending any higher powers and getting in trouble. I also feel that the problems with the SU I've felt over the last 4 years are never really addressed...and how could they be when its the people with the problems running the paper themselves.

Anyway, as I said, I loved the idea of The Advocate. But I think where it died was in advertising. I don't think there was ever a business head involved, and John (Jesus, I think that was his name. I can't fully remember >_<), as nice as he was, tried to do everything himself. The layout. Half the stories and interviews. The advertising. And ultimatly I think he just didn't have enough time to focus on the later. Really, there should be someone who is in charge of getting advertising and nothing else. No writing or anything. Again though, with all the business students in Maynooth, surely it wouldn't be hard to get even a group of people to take on that responsibility?

banquo

I was never invloved in The Advocate, but one of the staff told me directly that it was totally possible with a full-time advertising manager.

Could we get a local paper to do a spin-off publication? They'd already have the contacts and staff.

Lord TSC

I doubt they'd take on the responsiblity, if I'm understanding your thought process right. You mean get one of the smaller papers around Maynooth to start printing up a college edition of their paper? Would the students edit it and then send it on for them to print and distribute? Would the students or the paper organise the advertising?

My worry there is that whoever you approached with the idea would simply see it as too much work. The best I could see them doing is giving you the phone number of their printer and sending you off on your own.

On a related note, I'm generally new to the board so forgive my ignorance here Banquo. I don't really know who anyone really is <_<'' But am I right in saying you ran for the position on the SU which would have led to you being the editor of the Spoke?

banquo

Yup, that was me. The position was editor of the spoke/director of communications. But that's in the past, what I'm interested in is making sure that students have some kind of decent rag next year.

You're probably right about the other papers, I'm just throwing out ideas - partly in desperation. There must be some mechanism by which we can get a decent students' newspaper.

Lord TSC

I think once the position of editor of the Spoke goes, you're left with very little choice tbh. Short of either becoming the editor's Jimminy Cricket and camping in his office 24/7, or following the example of the Advocate and starting your own publication up, you're screwed. I had kind of hoped that even if the Advocate didn't hang round for long, it might have had a good affect on The Spoke, but alas. It's not to be....

banquo

Unfortunate but true tbh. Anything else is just wishful thinking.

I'm amazed that nobody called a vote of no-confidence in the current/previous guy. That clause should really be used more often.

Maybe nect year's will be kinda good. Never say never...

Lord TSC

We could call a vote of no-confidence? :O Or the other SU people could? Either way, I had no clue <_<

As for being better next year, I'm afraid my 4 years of bad Spokes has led be to remain bitter and expecting tripe >_>

banquo

A vote of no confidence requires half the student body to sign a petition, or 2/3's of Union Council. Since most of UC never turn up, it's a hard thing to get done. But not impossible. I know there was talk of it this year, and certain SU high-ups were very much in favour of it.

It's only fair to see if the next guy does an OK job - as I said, never say never. In the unlikely event that he's as bad as the present fool, there'd have to be a vote of no confidence - and if if didn't happen for RD then it's unlikely that it'd happen for anyone else - and then an election 15 days later. Since these elections don't always pick the best person for the job (not being vain here, i'm referring to Duffy over O'Callaghan last year) there's no guarantee that we'd get someone decent.

On the other hand, a vote of no confidence (successful or not) would send a pretty clear message to future candidates - for this and other positions.

conf101

Though all you spoke/comic sans fans might enjoy this:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123992364819927171.html

PrivateEye

conf101 wrote: »

Though all you spoke/comic sans fans might enjoy this:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123992364819927171.html

Good read, thanks!
I'm fully opposed to comic sans. I seen a lad in the West running as an independent for the council using it on his posters. Just lost the massive 'West of Ireland Internet User Vote'

They're all on dial-up anyway so its a small club.

banquo

conf101 wrote: »

Though all you spoke/comic sans fans might enjoy this:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123992364819927171.html

Interesting read!

@PrivateEye: I had to use dial-up last month. I don't remember it being that slow...

BuroniKiisu

Eoin Byrne asked me if I would be his Assistant Editor for next year due, so I can at the very least guarantee you that Comic Sans will never be seen on the pages of our publication.

And yes, this coming year The Spoke (if it's still called that come September) will actually be worthy of being called a publication.

Lord TSC

Yeay, a representative of the Spoke whom we can direct our complaints through. You're in for a fun year here :P

Ostrom

BuroniKiisu wrote: »

Eoin Byrne asked me if I would be his Assistant Editor for next year due, so I can at the very least guarantee you that Comic Sans will never be seen on the pages of our publication.

And yes, this coming year The Spoke (if it's still called that come September) will actually be worthy of being called a publication.

Can we expect investigatory journalism?

Seriously, the lack of critical content, which should rightly have been directed at NUI admin was shameful.

banquo

Since I'll probably be on the dole with my music degree, I look forward to going through every copy as it's released with a red marker and sending it back that you may learn from it.