Are you going to protest tomorrow

hughs

K4t wrote: »

It is. FG have outlined how the same amount could be saved this year without introducing the pension levy.

I have no allegiance to any political party. FG to not dispute the financial deficit, there proposals just have a different mix to the governments. In order to reduce the deficit, we need a combination of reducing expenditure and increasing taxes. FG proposals involve a different types of cuts/tax cuts including sacking 5,000 civil servants.

yankinlk

hughs wrote: »

FG proposals involve a different types of cuts/tax cuts including sacking 5,000 civil servants.

There are 300K civil servants right? How is axing 5000 fairness when compared to the public sector? Get real - fire at least 10% and you are at least near to reality.

MG

nursinghomes wrote: »

Thanks to all that attended the march today. It is important that we protect our nursing home jobs.

Rod

http://www.nursinghomes.ie

Is that what they were marching for?

hughs

yankinlk wrote: »

There are 300K civil servants right? How is axing 5000 fairness when compared to the public sector? Get real - fire at least 10% and you are at least near to reality.

I was not advocating their policy, merely stating one of their proposals.

Personally - I think you should be able to get rid of a lot more than 10% but politiclly this wont happen until next year, the Irish way is to wait until things get a lot worse and then to take action.

bobbbb

MG wrote: »

Is that what they were marching for?

They werent marching for anything. Or at least they dont know what they were marching for.
It was just a day out.

Remember like the students used to all march in Dublin on 17th November complaining that they had not enough money in their grants. Then that night youl see them all falling all over the city center puking, full of booze. No money indeed.

MG

bobbbb wrote: »

They werent marching for anything.

So they were marching against something

Yenwod

MG wrote: »

So they were marching against something

*boom tch*

ixoy

I see that Blegg has said that, as a result, the government must re-engage with social partners. Given that this march was, of course, for everyone and social partners do not represent everyone, shouldn't he be more open-ended with who he wants at the table?

NewDubliner

yankinlk wrote: »

There are 300K civil servants right?

No, it's far less. It was 38,000 in 2005.

irish_bob

hughs wrote: »

I was not advocating their policy, merely stating one of their proposals.

Personally - I think you should be able to get rid of a lot more than 10% but politiclly this wont happen until next year, the Irish way is to wait until things get a lot worse and then to take action.

thats the fianna fail way but same difference

hughs

irish_bob wrote: »

thats the fianna fail way but same difference

Do you really think a FG lead coalition with labour would have the courage to do it? Or the alliance of the left that Gerry Adams was on about today?

yankinlk

NewDubliner wrote: »

No, it's far less. It was 38,000 in 2005.

http://www.rte.ie/business/2005/0907/cso.html

"Figures from the Central Statistics Office show that 346,200 people were employed in the public sector at the end of March this year, up 7,300 on the same period last year. In the health sector, employment grew by 2,900 in the year to 99,700."

pete

the civil service only forms a small part of the overall public service

andrewdeerpark

ixoy wrote: »

I see that Blegg has said that, as a result, the government must re-engage with social partners.

The FAT cat union beardies missing walking down the corridors of power. Boo Hoo and good riddance I elected a government to govern not these socialists...

NewDubliner

yankinlk wrote: »

http://www.rte.ie/business/2005/0907/cso.html"Figures from the Central Statistics Office show that 346,200 people were employed in the public sector at the end of March this year, up 7,300 on the same period last year. In the health sector, employment grew by 2,900 in the year to 99,700."

The question is about Civil Servants and not Public Servants, who are a small minority of the PS. The difference is important because the T&C's are quite different.

MG

NewDubliner wrote: »

The question is about Civil Servants and not Public Servants, who are a small minority of the PS. The difference is important because the T&C's are quite different.

Ever notice that Civil Servants are obsessed with the difference between civil servants and public servants? Why is that?

NewDubliner

MG wrote: »

Ever notice that Civil Servants are obsessed with the difference between civil servants and public servants? Why is that?

In business, facts are usually an important ingredient in a productive discussion.

33% God

andrewdeerpark wrote: »

The FAT cat union beardies missing walking down the corridors of power. Boo Hoo and good riddance I elected a government to govern not these socialists...

I think you forget that the unions have no need whatsoever to "walk down the corridors of power" in order to get what they want. However they do so anyway in the interest of compromise and keeping the country going in the right direction.

yankinlk

NewDubliner wrote: »

The question is about Civil Servants and not Public Servants, who are a small minority of the PS. The difference is important because the T&C's are quite different.

So....my fault for mentioning CS and not PS...but the pension levy effects the PS correct?

seangal

hughs wrote: »

I have no allegiance to any political party. FG to not dispute the financial deficit, there proposals just have a different mix to the governments. In order to reduce the deficit, we need a combination of reducing expenditure and increasing taxes. FG proposals involve a different types of cuts/tax cuts including sacking 5,000 civil servants.

at FG last meeting they back away from doing anything to the public service and it would be a complete waste of time just letting 5000 go.
i also suggest you look up the difference between sacking and redundancy

seangal

MG wrote: »

Ever notice that Civil Servants are obsessed with the difference between civil servants and public servants? Why is that?

if u cant see that go back to school
terms and conditions are so different and most civil servents sit in offices
most public servents work very hard and are front line staff
spend a night in a&E in a hospital and then ask youself would you do that job for average 37k
Or go out to a crash scene and cut a body out of a car
idiots are calling for 30k to 40k public servents to be let go
well if it happens be ready for the folllowing
you or your family lying on a trolly outside of a&e
you or you family dying on a waiting list for a procedure
your kids in a class size of 50 kids
crime will be a free for all
we all know we need public sector reform but be very carefull as it will be the poor that will suffer and not the rich

ixoy

seangal wrote: »

we all know we need public sector reform but be very carefull as it will be the poor that will suffer and not the rich

Well your implied threat above is that people will die if PS numbers are cut... so how would you reform it if you recognise the need for reform? Because reform will come, despite the fact many won't like it.

NewDubliner

yankinlk wrote: »

So....my fault for mentioning CS and not PS...but the pension levy effects the PS correct?

Yes, it affects the PS, but the effect varies from one part of the PS to another and according to salary level as there are a variety of different T&Cs.

33% God

NewDubliner wrote: »

Yes, it affects the PS, but the effect varies from one part of the PS to another and according to salary level as there are a variety of different T&Cs.

The judges aren't getting it at all...

MG

seangal wrote: »

if u cant see that go back to school
terms and conditions are so different and most civil servents sit in offices
most public servents work very hard and are front line staff
spend a night in a&E in a hospital and then ask youself would you do that job for average 37k
Or go out to a crash scene and cut a body out of a car
idiots are calling for 30k to 40k public servents to be let go
well if it happens be ready for the folllowing
you or your family lying on a trolly outside of a&e
you or you family dying on a waiting list for a procedure
your kids in a class size of 50 kids
crime will be a free for all
we all know we need public sector reform but be very carefull as it will be the poor that will suffer and not the rich

What has this to do with saving the country from bankruptcy? Nothing. It's just emotive drivel.

The fact is that none of the above is affected by a pension levy and the public sector could easliy do with 30-40k people if it did not have such ingrained productivity issues

MG

NewDubliner wrote: »

In business, facts are usually an important ingredient in a productive discussion.

Relevant facts are more important. To the private sector, it doesn't really matter you are public sector or civil service - it's still a 20Bn deficit.

NewDubliner

MG wrote: »

Relevant facts are more important. To the private sector, it doesn't really matter you are public sector or civil service - it's still a 20Bn deficit.

One might as well say then that there's no difference between Waterford Glass workers and Anglo Irish Directors.

If you want to achieve cuts with minimal disruption to service, you negotiate a fair arrangement.

MG

NewDubliner wrote: »

One might as well say then that there's no difference between Waterford Glass workers and Anglo Irish Directors.

If you want to achieve cuts with minimal disruption to service, you negotiate a fair arrangement.

The Waterford Crystal works might have a public sector attitude but they are in the private sector.

Anglo Irish Directors might have a private sector outlook but they are in the public sector.

seangal

MG wrote: »

I don't think anyone protesting tomorrow gets it.

If any of these people did any of the following, then they were complicit in the mismanagement of the country so are hypocrites.

Anyone who voted Fianna Fail in 2006
Regulators
Unions who pressed for benchmarking and their members
Anyone who took out a 100% mortgage
Anyone who inflated their income to get mortgage approval
Anyone who bought BTL
Most people who used equity release
Anyone who borrowed excessively for day to day expenses
Anyone who said “renting is dead money”
Anyone who complained about people “talking down the economy”
There are probably more...............

mg i have being reading some of your post on this
you sound like the "blue eyed" boy who never did anything wrong or never took a risk in life but still think he is allways correct
live life a bit make the odd mistake take the odd risk you never know u might like it.

fraz1971

There have been no profits from the "billions of oil and gas reserves". Not a bit of it has been brought on shore.

Firstly it doesn't have to come ashore. Secondly what has been going on off Kinsale for years and how much of the revenue from that does the state see? There is no reason why, if handled properly that we have not seen any benefit from oil finds. Either the oil is there or it is not. It is obviously there as Exxon has been asked to assist in exploiting it. Crude oil can be loaded onto a tanker at an SBM and sent elsewhere for refining. I am sure that's what will happen most of it. We do not see any news on what is happening with Irelands oil. There is one thing for sure. Irelands oil should have been handled by a state oil company. Even Sudan can own 40% of a state oil company, why not Ireland?