Help. What to bid?

ascottdub

www.daft.ie/113030

Hi Everyone,

Would like to bid much lower than asking price, and just wanted some ideas of how low I should go.

House has been on sale since Apr 07, and was way overvalued to begin with.

It does need serious updating but overall is a sound house.

Suggestions please

Thanks in advance

Freddie59

ascottdub wrote: »

www.daft.ie/113030

Hi Everyone,

Would like to bid much lower than asking price, and just wanted some ideas of how low I should go.

House has been on sale since Apr 07, and was way overvalued to begin with.

It does need serious updating but overall is a sound house.

Suggestions please

Thanks in advance

In a nutshell? DON'T BID! Wait until prices fall further - and they will. Check these out:

www.treesdontgrowtothesky.com

www.irishpropertywatch.com

www.thepropertypin.com

www.irishhometruths.com

Then decide.......:)

Raskolnikov

€500k for a very average semi-detached house in Portmarnock? Madness. I'd say offer €300k if you really like it, but I imagine the EA will tell you to get stuffed.

ascottdub

That amount is somewhere along the amount that I was thinking. Would say I'll get a swift F off, but sure no harm in trying

Suppose, I just want back up that the vendor is in la-la land

The_Conductor

In short- while you could live in the place, ideally you'd need to gut it, redo the wiring, insulation and extend over the garage similar to the other houses in the street. The decor is seriously dated, and more suited to someone in their 60s/70s.

The only thing the place has going for it is its location- and even that is debatable.

Personally, in the current climate, I would suggest offering the 300k, with a view to possibly going to 350k.

I would also insist on getting a copy of the building's BER cert.

Ps- it looks like next door is derelict with its windows boarded up? Strange.....

Cicero

Calculate how much it will cost to get the house in good modern condition nice kitchen/good bathroom, etc etc(without going over the top). Then, try and determine what the 2003/4 prices were for these houses in good condition..then subtract your costs from this price- that's the price the house is worth.

The reason I say 2003 prices- predictions are that houses will fall overall by 40% of their highest price- this would place most houses back to somewhere between 2003/4prices.
I'd say 400K would have been the price back in 2003/4 for this..so offering 300- 340 (taking into account money required for any updating) would be a fair price.
(At least that's what I would be doing if considering buying right now)

SoupyNorman

I think that asking price is stuck in a time warp somewhere between Aug-2002 and Nov -2006

Bobeagleburger

ascottdub wrote: »

www.daft.ie/113030

Hi Everyone,

Would like to bid much lower than asking price, and just wanted some ideas of how low I should go.

House has been on sale since Apr 07, and was way overvalued to begin with.

It does need serious updating but overall is a sound house.

Suggestions please

Thanks in advance

250k at a push if you really want it.

ascottdub

I like the person saying 250K, but doubt the vendor would go for that.

Next door is grand actually. Saw the lady painting and putting up curtains the other day. I think it might just be a dark blind in the pic

At least everyone agrees that seller seriously needs to adjust price

dny123456

Yes, of course everyone will agree, why would they disagree? But will you manage to buy the house by listening to their advice? Almost definitely not. But maybe that's not a bad thing.

ascottdub

Yes, you're right, everyone will agree. However, I don't think there's much arguing as it's way over priced.

What would you offer DNY123456???, or are you saying run for your life?


Luckily, I am keeping an eye on some other houses, so don't think heart would be broken if I didn't get this one

Thanks

El Stuntman

wait two years and get it for 150k

dny123456

ascottdub wrote: »

Yes, you're right, everyone will agree. However, I don't think there's much arguing as it's way over priced.

What would you offer DNY123456???, or are you saying run for your life?


Luckily, I am keeping an eye on some other houses, so don't think heart would be broken if I didn't get this one

Thanks

I probably wouldn't buy at the moment, no. Neither would I sell. However, if you really want to and you really want to get that house, I would go in around 420 and allow myself to be talked up to maybe 440. Going in at 300, they will probably just ignore you... that's just my very uninformed opinion.

Eglinton

My opinion would be 300K.

If we say that the average first time buyer looking to purchase something in an area like Portmarnock perhaps have a salary of 40K each and you get 3.5 times of combined, you're looking at 280K and then maybe a 10% premium as it's a sought after area, you're looking at 308K.

That's all this house is really worth. It's a very ordinary family home. Why pay for luxury and get ordinary.

If the EA doesn't like it, stuff him. Ask to speak to the seller directly.

If they then don't like it, wait for better opportunities to arise. No harm done.

gurramok

Look at the trend OP, courtesy of the Property-Bee toolbar..

Sunday, 18. January 2009

* Price changed: from 'Region €525,000' to 'Region €500,000' [Found by ceebee]

Tuesday, 25. November 2008

* Price changed: from 'Region €540,000' to 'Region €525,000' [Found by cawley]

Thursday, 16. October 2008

* Price changed: from 'Region €550,000' to 'Region €540,000' [Found by RConundrum]

Tuesday, 27. May 2008

* Initial entry found.

ascottdub

Hi there,

Trust me, I know the price history of this house as I've been watching it for over a year.

Just trying to guess how low I can go

It's listed with 2 EAs with a 25K difference

I think the vendor is maybe quite happy to sit it out.

Still considering chancing my arm though

Cicero

ascottdub wrote: »

Hi there,

Trust me, I know the price history of this house as I've been watching it for over a year.

Just trying to guess how low I can go

It's listed with 2 EAs with a 25K difference

I think the vendor is maybe quite happy to sit it out.

Still considering chancing my arm though

Hi OP
Would be interested in your perception of what 'price history of this house ' has taught you in terms of what this house is worth both currently and into the future ..
I'm not being smart or trying to be, just wondering what a genuine buyer is thinking right now- I've seen a lot of buyer/seller threads on everything from cars to washing powder and most are based on 'current price' or 'downturn in price' or 'rate of exchange' etc ..would like to hear what the rationale of a current buyer is thinking, that's all.

Thanks and best of luck

wyndham

I wouldn't bid on anything at the moment, nor can I understand why anyone would even contemplate it. We are headed in 1 direction and 1 direction only and that is down. There are too many people still in denial and we are a long way from the bottom as yet.

Plenty of indicators but The Live Register is one of the most potent:

January 2009 327,861
December 2008 291,363
November 2008 268,586
October 2008 251,951
September 2008 240,217
August 2008 247,384
July 2008 238,240
June 2008 220,811
May 2008 201,756
April 2008 195,598
March 2008 197,992
February 2008 189,485
January 2008 181,449

February figures will be out next week, will probably top the 350k mark. These figures do not include the bulkier job losses that have already been announced, such as Dell, SR Technics, etc, as these redundancies are phased over a number of months and have not yet come into effect.
Several leading economists predict that it could go as far as the 500-550k mark. There is no way back from this level of unemployment in the short term.
We have yet to see the real pain.

In short, sit on your hands and watch.

As an aside, do you have mortgage approval or need it?

iguana

wyndham wrote: »

I wouldn't bid on anything at the moment, nor can I understand why anyone would even contemplate it. We are headed in 1 direction and 1 direction only and that is down.

There is no harm in looking at houses that interest you and making an offer based on it's value. As long as you are basing it's value on either income multiples of the type of person who historically lived in the area (3.5 times main salary + 1 times second income), or basing your value on rental values. You probably won't get any takers in the near future, but if you do you can decide if you are willing to risk any further falls in value and continue with the purchase.

At the very least if a lot of people were doing this it would help speed up sellers acceptance of the fact that prices need to fall further. And would prove the VIs wrong when they insist that the price doesn't matter, nothing is selling.

Eta; I don't know Portmarnock at all, so for all I know this house is a lot less desirable, but to me it seems to be the same general area. But it's an extended 3 bed in much better condition for €1300pm. That suggests to me that about €200k the actual value of these houses, when they are in reasonable condition. Though I'd imagine it will be 2 to 4 years before before they'll be changing hands for that amount.

johnnyskeleton

iguana wrote: »

There is no harm in looking at houses that interest you and making an offer based on it's value. As long as you are basing it's value on either income multiples of the type of person who historically lived in the area (3.5 times main salary + 1 times second income), or basing your value on rental values. You probably won't get any takers in the near future, but if you do you can decide if you are willing to risk any further falls in value and continue with the purchase.

At the very least if a lot of people were doing this it would help speed up sellers acceptance of the fact that prices need to fall further. And would prove the VIs wrong when they insist that the price doesn't matter, nothing is selling.

I'd agree with this.

The important thing for the OP is to bid what they are prepared to pay/borrow to live there. This has to have regard to:
* the deposit they have
* their income
* the security of their job
* what they think they can realistically sell the property for in a few years if it all goes pear shaped.

My advice to the OP is to have the figure in mind and stick to it. Or maybe reduce by a small amount e.g. 5% and if you are close to a deal you can increase it by that 5%. For me, the most important factor at the moment is the fourth (i.e. if I have to sell, can I sell the property for in or around what I paid for it). Otherwise, I won't buy a property.

So it's not a question of not bidding for a property, but rather if you bid and that offer is rejected, be prepared to just walk away.

ascottdub

Hi Everyone,

Got approval yesterday, so now I truly can bid. Chuffed so I am.

However, looking at the price history of this house tells me a couple of things.
1. I'd love to know what clown valued it, as it was an horrendous amount
2. It's still there 2 years later, and in my opinion is still not fairly priced.
3. I think the owner probably won't play ball
4. Maybe because I am approved, he may entertain a low bid, as approvals are few & far between.
5. Who cares? There's plenty of other houses, although I would like this one the most so far.
6. Finallly, come on Ireland in the rugby today as I got lucky on tickets for that 2. Good weekend so far
Thanks to everyone on these posts, so of your answers have been truly helpful

iguana

The thing to keep in mind when you are bidding is just how many properties are on the market and how few buyers there are. Keep this in mind and make sure the EA knows that you have it in mind. That you are a serious buyer, but that you know there is no hurry, you won't miss out by waiting and you are prepared to wait until prices match your expectations. If you feel yourself getting disheartened just go on to myhome.ie look at the map of the house you like and zoom out once.



I don't think anyone looking at that will feel too much pressure to buy a place in a hurry.

johnnyskeleton

ascottdub wrote: »

Hi Everyone,

Got approval yesterday, so now I truly can bid. Chuffed so I am.
...
4. Maybe because I am approved, he may entertain a low bid, as approvals are few & far between.

Approval in principle is different to actual approval for a loan. The reason being that the banks want to seem like they are giving out mortgages on the one hand while on the other trying to give out as little as possible.

Freddie59

ascottdub wrote: »

Maybe because I am approved, he may entertain a low bid, as approvals are few & far between.

Don't bet on it - there is a huge amount of vendor denial out there, encouraged by idiot EAs.

ascottdub

Hi There,

Just an update. Put my low bid in on the house today, and was politely told NO.

With all the giving out about EA's, I have to say, he was polite, no laughing at me, no smart remarks, no hanging up of phones. I know the next 1 may go through me for a shortcut, but it was nice to see there is still at least one who acts professional.

However, he did say, sure if we put it that low, we'd have a bidding war???
Is this not the point, to sell the bloody thing??

He said they are in no hurry. I was going to throw in "well good luck to them as it's alreay been on the market 2 years", but decided against it as he was being polite.

Pity though, liked the house

Eglinton

Congratulations on having the liathroidi to do it. You've done a good service for buyers in this country. He'll regret his decision in two years time.

And well done on being the bigger man. There'll be plenty more opportunities for you. I'm afraid he may be the one joining the dole queue in the not so distant future.

EKRIUQ

ascottdub wrote: »

He said they are in no hurry. I was going to throw in "well good luck to them as it's alreay been on the market 2 years", but decided against it as he was being polite.

That's probably the problem the people are in no hurry or pressure to sell and their mind might of changed since 2 years ago when they were more serious and now they mightn't have anything lined up or any place to go if they sell so they'll hold out for a higher figure.

Murtinho

ascottdub wrote: »

Pity though, liked the house

Im in a similar situation myself, mull over it though for a few weeks and you might be glad you didnt bid higher, i did the same a month ago and know if/when the EA comes back to me i wont be offering him as much, due to changes since, pension levy, income tax increases, child allowance decreases etc.
Good tactic to remain friendly with EA however, they may be utter bastards but better the utter bastard you know.