15 Greedy Men

The Raven.

bmaxi wrote: »

They'd be better off getting on to the environment department of all the local councils and asking if any large bonfires have been reported. Also if people have complained about the noise of lump hammers crashing on hard disks. :rolleyes:

You have hit the nail on the head! In the middle of all the gloom, I think that's the funniest post I've read all week !!

future_plans

kbannon wrote: »

Sure how would you know that?
neither groups have been officially named!

One of the Golden boys gives an interview (by proxy) in the Independent.

HE has been expecting to answer his front door to gardai since the 'golden circle' scandal first broke nearly a fortnight ago.

So for one of the 10 long-standing Anglo customers -- dubbed the 'golden circle' after they were loaned a total of €451m to buy stock in the bank last summer -- news that the Fraud Squad had begun searching the bank's headquarters yesterday brought no comfort.

But he has had no query from detectives, not a raised eyebrow from the Financial Regulator.

Neither has the Office of the Director of Corporate Enforcement nor the Stock Exchange's inquiry tried to make contact.

He used a go-between to speak to the Irish Independent and like the other nine golden Anglo stockholders, he is preparing a strategy to deal with the fallout when his name is made public.

Before the downfall, he could have been a poster boy for Anglo Irish Bank after their support for his successful developments.

And, he assures friends, he is currently up to date with his interest and capital repayments.

He has never done anything illegal in his life and, since the 'golden circle' scandal broke, he is reluctant to answer the phone or the door if he doesn't know who is calling.

"A golden circle?" quipped the intermediary. "That Anglo share deal was more like a millstone of lead around his (the developer's) neck."

A well-known Dublin stockbroker, who was not involved in any of the Anglo transactions, agreed that the 'golden circle' could never have made a profit from the July share deal.

Piecing together the information from a number of reliable sources, it is clear that senior Anglo executives panicked when they underwrote the cost of the bank's own shares for trusted customers.

According to sources, a meeting must have been called when they believed Sean Quinn's overhang would bring down the company if his shares were released on to the market.

Each executive who had a close relationship with a wealthy customer agreed to target their client and put the sweetheart share deal to them.

"Some of these customers had a more intimate relationship with their bankers than their wives," said a source. "And some of them felt they owed the bank a favour and others might have been deeply in debt to the bank and felt they had no choice."

Individual members of the 'golden circle' were not identified to each other and some of those approached said 'no', according to the developer.

"The so-called 'golden circle' were developers, with a specific knowledge of property, and they would not have known much about the stock market," said a source.

The developer told the go-between that the bank told him about the unwinding of Sean Quinn's CFD position and how he could help the country and Anglo by buying some of the shares he (Mr Quinn) couldn't take up.

The bank executive was asked the same questions as the Financial Regulator asked of Anglo: was the share deal legal and were the brokers satisfied no stock exchange rules were breached?

The Anglo executive assured him the bank's solicitors had signed off on the proposal and that a major international broking company, Morgan Stanley, would handle the deal.

The developer says he was given some comfort when he heard Morgan Stanley was involved but he was still very reluctant to go ahead, that he was never motivated by any potential profit and that the whole deal made him very uncomfortable.

He was just one of the 10 long-standing Anglo customers who were loaned a total of €451m to buy a whopping 10pc of the bank's stock through nominee companies last July.

It should have been a so-called sweetheart deal: 75pc of the loans were secured against the shares and the remaining 25pc against personal assets.

But, as the recession bites deeper and the property market slumps, it is not clear how many of the 10 have any substantial wealth left.

The bank believes it will have to write off the remaining €300m it loaned to the 10 investors and, since Anglo has been nationalised, the taxpayer will almost certainly be underwriting the loss.

The share deal was agreed with the executive in Anglo in breakneck time last July, about an hour, according to the developer. And that was a full year after the first reports of sub-prime loans undermining US banks and suspicions about Anglo were beginning to surface.

"I was not recommending bank shares, and certainly not Anglo Irish Bank shares, to my clients last summer," said a leading Dublin broker. "And I don't see how any of the so-called Gold Circle could ever have made a profit from Anglo shares."

And as suspicions about the bank mushroomed, some dealers said they wouldn't have taken them for nothing -- even with a free DVD.

It appears his defense is that he was tricked / duped / whatever you want to call it, into this deal. He's only a developer and knows nothing of stocks and shares!

bmaxi

future_plans wrote: »

One of the Golden boys gives an interview (by proxy) in the Independent.



It appears his defense is that he was tricked / duped / whatever you want to call it, into this deal. He's only a developer and knows nothing of stocks and shares!

Oh dear, I feel so bad, I was so wrong about Property Developers. Maybe the Management Company in my estate have cut the grass in the last three years and I just didn't notice. After all, they wouldn't have taken the fees if they hadn't, would they?

Langerland

The first line of that got me thinking, I wonder what kind of front door he has? Is he living in a small 2 bed duplex in North Dublin or in the surrounding counties that he sold for 400k?

His attitude is priceless. Oh your solicitors say its ok and Morgan Stanley are involved. Ok, I'm in. Make me richer!

Even if he was stupid enough to get involved without checking the full details, thats surely criminal negligence anyway.

PeakOutput

Langerland wrote: »

The first line of that got me thinking, I wonder what kind of front door he has? Is he living in a small 2 bed duplex in North Dublin or in the surrounding counties that he sold for 400k?

His attitude is priceless. Oh your solicitors say its ok and Morgan Stanley are involved. Ok, I'm in. Make me richer!

Even if he was stupid enough to get involved without checking the full details, thats surely criminal negligence anyway.

how is that criminal negligence? are you for real? you say yourself he was told by a solicitor that everything was ok. you go to buy a house tomorrow and have a solicitor go over everything for you he says its all gravy and you spend half a mill buying the house. a month later gardai arrive at your door saying the owner was under investigation and was ordered to not sell the house he has now scarpered with you half mill and the cab are taking over the house(i dont know if this is possible but say it is) would that be your fault? or your solicitors fault? or the criminals who sold you the house knowing full well what was going to happen?

im not suprised that so much attention is being paid to this 'golden circle' but it is simply a smoke screen for the real issues

the facts are that these business men were offered a very sweet deal by a bank and they would have been mad to turn it down. the bank was COMPLETELY WRONG to do this but i believe that the people accepted the offer thinking there was no problem

does anyone here think they really broke the law? from the article the police dont even seem to think they have broken the law.

i really hope that what anglo did was against the law so that someone can be punished but there is not one person here who, if approached last year being offered shares in one of the most succesful banks in europe WITH NO APPARENT RISK because the bank was using the shares themselves as collateral, would have refused this offer

Langerland

The Anglo executive assured him the bank's solicitors had signed off on the proposal and that a major international broking company, Morgan Stanley, would handle the deal.

Anybody buying a house would have their own solicitors counsel. Not accept the word of some bank exec who says that the "banks" solicitors have given it the green light. This suited the developers a lot better. A possible safety net should things go wrong, and they did.

Mr.Micro

Langerland wrote: »

Anybody buying a house would have their own solicitors counsel. Not accept the word of some bank exec who says that the "banks" solicitors have given it the green light. This suited the developers a lot better. A possible safety net should things go wrong, and they did.

Exactly Langerland, take the word of a bank exec, no way. There are plenty dodgy solicitors here as well.