Fianna Fail Hypocrisy

Scofflaw

dvpower wrote: »

FF are a political party, with TDs, Senators, Local Government Councillers, ordinary members and employees.

The Government are the cabinet made up of 13 FF members, two Green Party members and one Mary Harney.

You can draw the Venn diagram yourself

Ah - too gnomic. The point is that "the government" in the sense of having procurement rules to follow, is actually the civil service. Neither FF as a party, nor the Cabinet as elected representatives, have to follow procurement rules.

cordially,
Scofflaw

dvpower

Scofflaw wrote: »

Do you believe there are no Irish companies capable of offering internet strategy?

cordially,
Scofflaw

I sure there are, but Blue State Digital are not a generalist company; they specialise in the political sphere.

Its not inconceivable that FF could have found a company or a collaboration of companies in Ireland that would have fulfilled their need, but would they have got one with the track record / client list of this one? Doubtful.

The seed of this bout of FF bashing was that FF were going abroad to buy a simple commodity (some website design) that is readily available in Ireland, but it turns out that its just a little bit more complex than that.


(Now I'm off to throw up - defending FF makes me feel a bit queasy)

Scofflaw

dvpower wrote: »

I sure there are, but Blue State Digital are not a generalist company; they specialise in the political sphere.

Its not inconceivable that FF could have found a company or a collaboration of companies in Ireland that would have fulfilled their need, but would they have got one with the track record / client list of this one? Doubtful.

The seed of this bout of FF bashing was that FF were going abroad to buy a simple commodity (some website design) that is readily available in Ireland, but it turns out that its just a little bit more complex than that.

(Now I'm off to throw up - defending FF makes me feel a bit queasy)

There are several companies in Ireland with longer track records in the internet/political arena, as well as a lot of home-grown talent in terms of creating public-participation websites (it's not all rockthevote). None of them were even contacted - this is purely a case of buying in talent from abroad because it is talent from abroad. It's not talent with any experience of Irish politics, Irish society, or the Irish online environment, and it's not talent with any track record in assisting an incumbent government to communicate with citizens through the web. It has one thing to its name - it did Obama's campaign.

I'm by no means bashing FF purely to bash FF here - I'm in the web development industry, so I know what talent is available here, and sufficient talent is certainly available here. How much credibility can FF have in saying "buy Irish" if they won't? And if "it was cheaper/better abroad" is a good excuse not to buy Irish, then the whole idea of "buying Irish" is meaningless.

cordially,
Scofflaw

AlekSmart

Late last week the Independent carried a piece on new jobs.....Something like 600 new jobs in a call centre in Armagh (Other side of the Land Frontier) and wait for it.........2.....yep T W O new jobs in Carlow.

I`m assuming Ms Coughlan is currently seeking advice from President McAleese on the intricacies of foreign diplomacy in an Irish context......

Or perhaps Carlow actually qualifies as foreign as it`s landlocked ???

Hillel

Scofflaw wrote: »

I'm by no means bashing FF purely to bash FF here - I'm in the web development industry, so I know what talent is available here, and sufficient talent is certainly available here. How much credibility can FF have in saying "buy Irish" if they won't? And if "it was cheaper/better abroad" is a good excuse not to buy Irish, then the whole idea of "buying Irish" is meaningless.

cordially,
Scofflaw

+1

Not only is suitable expertise available here, but many indigenous companies could do with the work and the exposure.

Anyway, they simply don't get it. First you need the political credibility, then smart use of technology can help you reach your core constituency.

dvpower

Hillel wrote: »

+1

Not only is suitable expertise available here, but many indigenous companies could do with the work and the exposure.

Certainly many indigenous companies could do with the work and the exposure and maybe FF, given their position, could have rejected their first choice in favour of an Irish company.

But thats business. Ireland is built on free trade (and despite the gloom, exports are holding up reasonably well) and protectionism for the sake of protectionism isn't going to do us any good.

The 'patriotic' argument was made in the context of people traveling up North for their groceries. It was largely a pointless argument in the first place, but in any case it has little relevance to FF's decision to buy this service from a US company so the hypocrisy charge is over egging it a bit. Are they to be held to the same standard for every other purchase they make; their office equipment, their stationery, the coffee in their canteen...? Could anyone who agreed with the 'patriotic' argument ever hope to reach the standard that are being asked of FF here?

dvpower

Scofflaw wrote: »

There are several companies in Ireland with longer track records in the internet/political arena

But none that worked on the Obama campaign, and I guess that's what attracted FF.

Scofflaw

dvpower wrote: »

Certainly many indigenous companies could do with the work and the exposure and maybe FF, given their position, could have rejected their first choice in favour of an Irish company.

But thats business. Ireland is built on free trade (and despite the gloom, exports are holding up reasonably well) and protectionism for the sake of protectionism isn't going to do us any good.

The 'patriotic' argument was made in the context of people traveling up North for their groceries. It was largely a pointless argument in the first place, but in any case it has little relevance to FF's decision to buy this service from a US company so the hypocrisy charge is over egging it a bit. Are they to be held to the same standard for every other purchase they make; their office equipment, their stationery, the coffee in their canteen...? Could anyone who agreed with the 'patriotic' argument ever hope to reach the standard that are being asked of FF here?

Did any of us stand up and call for people to "buy Irish" on national TV? Are anonymous posters on internet forums expected to set an example for the country?

My other problem is that I regard the choice as indicative of FF's lack of 'getting it'. Blue State don't have anything to their name but a campaign for a charismatic non-incumbent challenger, in a country with a totally different social and political structure. They've been brought in because they did something high-profile enough to catch the attention of a party that has resolutely failed to do anything innovative with the web while touting the Irish "knowledge economy" - and that's not for lack of talent and innovation here, because other Irish companies and groups have been innovative with their use of the web.

Blue State are here because they're American (Americans "get the web"!) - because the media said they were web wizards. I've been in the industry for a dozen years, and I've seen all this before - this is the standard response by companies whose senior management haven't a clue: hire the American or British guy the CEO saw on TV. Coming on top of a decade of failure to support innovative Irish businesses - instead of importing US companies - it makes me more than a little annoyed. The only thing that will be more heavily ironic is FF talking up "green industry" after their even more obvious failure to understand environmentalism.

cordially, though,
Scofflaw

Hillel

dvpower wrote: »

The 'patriotic' argument was made in the context of people traveling up North for their groceries.

Exactly! For the little people. Doesn't apply to our political master's.

But, seriously, it does send out all the wrong messages. I don't actually believe that it was thought through, but, there you go.

AlekSmart

OH my God Scofflaw..You are SO correct...

I had to sit through just such motivational stuff last year..."Play from a 10" .....!!

Jesus,we are told wept....he is one lucky man not to be walking abroad in this Republic right now !!!! :rolleyes:

Dannyboy83

jmayo wrote: »

Dear God clutching at straws. True for Margaret Ward they are fiddling (literally in more ways than one) while the country goes down the pan.



They can rub and rub but all that is coming out of their lamp is sh**e :rolleyes:
Compare the Obama genie with Biffo.
Yes I am sure there are similarities, well apart from both involved in the legal world and being able to trace their routes back to Offaly and Eastern Africa (in Biffos case a few million years ago ), but that's about it I reckon.

Obama would be seen as intellectual, sauve, sophisticated, passionate, with a message of change.
On the other hand Biffo looks like an overfed ould curmudgeon stuffed into a new ill fitting suit for the daughters wedding, supposedly using his superior intellectual but really just making a few smart quips and braying for all the world like a jackass in search of love.

Remember old adage "never a silk purse was made out of a sows ear"

BTW I always thought that FG were the blue party ?
Maybe FF are adopting a new colour as well, I suppose it is the Obama influence :rolleyes:

ROTFLCOPTERS!!!!!:pac::pac::pac::pac::pac::pac::pac::pac::pac:

That had me in fcuking stitches:D

Dannyboy83

jim o doom wrote: »

Pretty sure they are required by law to issue tender to third parties; probably the US designer was cheaper - and government finances being crap, saving money everywhere is on the cards.

I can tell you for a fact that there are websites companies based in Slovakia and Romania (EU members), with equal expertise who do the job for one quarter of the cost.
I know this for a fact because a friend in my last company runs one on the side.
This is of course blatantly ignoring the exceptional talent in this country alone.

If they had issued, the contract would unlikely go anywhere West of Berlin.


Furthermore, given that BlueState designed the Obama website and are now celebrities, I find it difficult to believe that they would be the cheaper option - may be wrong now - but find it difficult to believe. (I've worked in roles in the past where my US based counterparts made double my salary for the same job)

Dannyboy83

Here is their newsletter.
I'd be interested to know who does it, anybody know?

I know that 10 Downing Street use a company in West Cork, the #1 SMB in Ireland and the European leader.

I feel a bit sick to be honest.

Dear s3xyB@st@rd,
I've just come off stage at Fianna Fáil's Ard Fheis, where I've outlined the difficult measures we're having to take to help return the country to growth. I was frank about the scale of the problems we face, but I'm optimistic about the ability of the Irish people to meet these challenges through the hard work and ingenuity we've always shown. We're a resilient and creative nation and we'll meet our challenges together.
You've heard from me, now I want to hear from you.
I'm asking each of you to submit a question for me, which I'll answer as many as I can via video right here on the new Fianna Fáil website. Submit your questions at:
http://www.fiannafail.com/askthetaoiseach
To better serve you, and to help lead us out of this recession, I want to hear what you thought of my speech, the questions you might have about some of the important measures I've announced and your ideas about how Fianna Fáil can set Ireland back on the road to growth and renewed prosperity.
Ask me questions - as directly as you want to - and I'll answer them in the clearest terms possible. I want to embrace a new openness and engage with you in honest conversation about the direction of the country. Post a question for me:
http://www.fiannafail.ie/askthetaoiseach
Our Ard Fheis is finishing up now and I'd like to thank the many thousands of Fianna Fail members who came and made their voices heard.
Wishing you and your family security in these difficult times,
Brian Cowen
Taoiseach
P.S. if you were unable to attend the Ard Fheis or missed the coverage on television and radio, we covered the event on our website and we'll be adding more speeches and video over the coming days.

I don't suppose these technological masterminds have heard of UTF-8


*chuckle*

Scofflaw

Dannyboy83 wrote: »

Here is their newsletter.
I'd be interested to know who does it, anybody know?

I know that 10 Downing Street use a company in West Cork, the #1 SMB in Ireland and the European leader.

Blue State Digital do the newsletter - it's in the email headers.

Dannyboy83 wrote: »

I feel a bit sick to be honest.

I don't suppose these technological masterminds have heard of UTF-8

*chuckle*

They're American - they've probably never had to deal with fadas.

cordially,
Scofflaw

Liam Byrne

Hillel wrote: »

I don't actually believe that it was thought through

Seems like FF are being consistent in all their decision-making lately, so!

Mind you, recession or not, if they'd asked me to quote for the job I'd probably have told them where to go......I'd prefer our name to be associated with reputable organisations.....

Liam Byrne

Scofflaw wrote: »

They're American - they've probably never had to deal with fadas.

And from the text of that newsletter, it seems like - having encountered a difficulty with the first fada, they chose to ignore consistency and leave out the second......

your ideas about how Fianna Fáil .....

I'd like to thank the many thousands of Fianna Fail members

BRILLIANT company if it can't even get its client's name right!

Anyway, you don't operate in a market that you don't understand or can't meet the needs of; next thing you know they'll be calling it an "organization" and doing a Paddy's day special about the "colour" green

As for asking US for ideas ..... f**k off, Brian......you've got enough overpriced w***kers on your wage bill with consulstants, think-tanks and quangos; if you want us to give you a heads-up on how to fix things, pay us what you're paying them!

Better still, quit and let one of us do your job.....if you can't think of ideas then you're as useless as a Financial Regulator......

Hillel

Dannyboy83 wrote: »

HI don't suppose these technological masterminds have heard of UTF-8


*chuckle*

+1
Wonder how'd they'd cope with Gaelic Characters and Polish Characters in the same newsletter.:D

jmayo

dvpower wrote: »

I sure there are, but Blue State Digital are not a generalist company; they specialise in the political sphere.

(Now I'm off to throw up - defending FF makes me feel a bit queasy)

BTW what do they know about Irish politics, or is just what ff told them ?
No sympathy for you about throwing up.

dvpower wrote: »

But thats business. Ireland is built on free trade (and despite the gloom, exports are holding up reasonably well) and protectionism for the sake of protectionism isn't going to do us any good.

The 'patriotic' argument was made in the context of people traveling up North for their groceries. It was largely a pointless argument in the first place, but in any case it has little relevance to FF's decision to buy this service from a US company so the hypocrisy charge is over egging it a bit. Are they to be held to the same standard for every other purchase they make; their office equipment, their stationery, the coffee in their canteen...? Could anyone who agreed with the 'patriotic' argument ever hope to reach the standard that are being asked of FF here?

You must be in ff, because you just don't get it :mad:
You can't one day tell people they should shop here, at greater expense, rather than going sometimes a few miles up the road and then a few weeks later go off to the states to hire a company to do work for you that Irish companies could do.
To most people that is a thing called hypocrisy.

Perhaps someone could ask Biffo on his webiste, Facebook page or whatever Offaly Auctioneers website his mug is plastered on, when will he ever f***off and take his incompetent shower of twats with him ?
That's the only answer I require

Sully

I had a good laugh at this thread, I must say. You would think that the party would focus their concerns elsewhere at the moment rather then paying out whatever amount of money for a new website and Internet strategy when there isn't even an election coming up (well, officially!).

I can understand if they had to go abroad as there was no Irish company specialising in this (I assume its more then just a website and other design services) and I think we would all have to understand this. However, I am sure there are Irish company's with this experience who can offer exactly what FF wanted - the whole political promotion strategy online to include a new properly designed website, bebo/facebook pages and other ways to get out there on the Internet. So its a bit rich for FF to be asking us to be patriotic when they shop abroad themselves for a product, which I think, can be obtained in Ireland. If it cant, well then fair enough.

To conclude... if a company outside of Ireland is dealing with the design and print for any election material then that is very insulting to the quality designers Ireland has. That hardly calls for specialist designers to be fair. But I don't think it does, as the other party's have graphic designers and printers all in their HQ.

scrumplod

Their was some kind of notince in the Sunday buiness Post that said a comapny in Dublin had been awarded a contract to do internet stratgey for the EU here! So their must be companies in Ireland that can do it. Heh, the EU buys Irish but FF doesnt. Says it all.

dvpower

jmayo wrote: »

BTW what do they know about Irish politics, or is just what ff told them ?

FF are the largest political party in the state with the most experience in government; FF are arguably the most qualified people in the state to tell them about Irish politics.

jmayo wrote: »

You must be in ff, because you just don't get it :mad:

Wrong again. Just a bit more speculation, rather than fact, to add to the rest of the speculation on this thread.

jmayo wrote: »

You can't one day tell people they should shop here, at greater expense, rather than going sometimes a few miles up the road and then a few weeks later go off to the states to hire a company to do work for you that Irish companies could do.
To most people that is a thing called hypocrisy.

It might be hypocrisy if there were Irish companies that could have fulfilled FFs requirements for this contract. But, to the best of my knowledge neither the requirements documentation, or details of the procument process, or the details of the contract itself are in the public domain. All we have is speculation.

Is there now any circumstance where FF could buy a product or service from outside the country without attracting the charge of hypocrisy? Should they be checking in their canteen that the biscuits they dip in their tea are from Jacobs, not McVities and that the tea is ... red lemonade?

Scofflaw

dvpower wrote: »

FF are the largest political party in the state with the most experience in government; FF are arguably the most qualified people in the state to tell them about Irish politics.

That's a fair point, at least to the extent that what FF get wrong will do nobody any harm but themselves, and insofar as FF's money is, of course, theirs to waste.

dvpower wrote: »

jmayo wrote:

You must be in ff, because you just don't get it

Wrong again. Just a bit more speculation, rather than fact, to add to the rest of the speculation on this thread.

Speaking with my moderator hat on, let us not go down the road of accusing anyone who defends a position as being some kind of shill, if that was what jmayo's remark was meant to suggest.

dvpower wrote: »

It might be hypocrisy if there were Irish companies that could have fulfilled FFs requirements for this contract. But, to the best of my knowledge neither the requirements documentation, or details of the procument process, or the details of the contract itself are in the public domain. All we have is speculation.

It's pretty informed speculation, though, what with us being the electorate. No, you can't dismiss this as "speculation" - it's obvious what FF's requirements are, unless you're suggesting that they actually plan a Moon landing as opposed to what is essentially a marketing campaign to the Irish electorate.

dvpower wrote: »

Is there now any circumstance where FF could buy a product or service from outside the country without attracting the charge of hypocrisy? Should they be checking in their canteen that the biscuits they dip in their tea are from Jacobs, not McVities and that the tea is ... red lemonade?

Hm. While that makes it sound trivial, the answer is that if FF gave their office catering contract to a non-Irish company, they would be engaging in exactly the same kind of hypocrisy as here. Of course, one could argue that, not having seen the details of such a catering contract, we couldn't be sure there weren't requirements in it that couldn't possibly be fulfilled by an Irish company...

cordially,
Scofflaw

jmayo

dvpower wrote: »

FF are the largest political party in the state with the most experience in government; FF are arguably the most qualified people in the state to tell them about Irish politics.

Ah yes they have mighty qualifications alright, the state is a credit to them :rolleyes:

dvpower wrote: »

Wrong again. Just a bit more speculation, rather than fact, to add to the rest of the speculation on this thread.

Is it just speculation or is it fact that Minister of Finance told people they should be patriotic and not go across the border tp shop but should spend THEIR money in the Republic ?
Yes or NO

Is it just speculation or is it fact that FF's new website (not some strategy or grand plan to conquer the univserse from Offaly but just the website) was developed by a US company ?
Yes or NO

dvpower wrote: »

It might be hypocrisy if there were Irish companies that could have fulfilled FFs requirements for this contract. But, to the best of my knowledge neither the requirements documentation, or details of the procument process, or the details of the contract itself are in the public domain. All we have is speculation.

Is there now any circumstance where FF could buy a product or service from outside the country without attracting the charge of hypocrisy? Should they be checking in their canteen that the biscuits they dip in their tea are from Jacobs, not McVities and that the tea is ... red lemonade?

Jeeze the things that should be in the public domain like who shafted the Irish taxpayers isn't even in the public domain :rolleyes:

I couldn't give a sh** what type of biscuits they are eating, who made them and what donkey bought them and where, if they didn't start telling me where I should buy my biscuits.
Same goes for the tea versus red lemonade

Can you not see this point ?

PS Jacobs moved their production overseas within the last couple of years so them versus McVities is a contentious argument.

Scoflaw, I was trying to make the point that dvpower just doesn't see how this whole episode looks to most people, in much the same as it doesn't seem to register with ff themselves.
To almost everyone else this whole thing appears as yet another example of double standards.

dvpower

Scofflaw wrote: »

...unless you're suggesting that they actually plan a Moon landing ...

For the record, I wouldn't be opposed to FF doing just that.

Scofflaw wrote: »

Hm. While that makes it sound trivial, the answer is that if FF gave their office catering contract to a non-Irish company, they would be engaging in exactly the same kind of hypocrisy as here.

My substantive question remains; where is the line beyond which FF can be called hypocrites but before which they are making a sensible purchasing decision?

Although I suspect that FF were dazzled by Blue State Digital's connection with Obama, I'm not at all convinced that it wasn't reasonable for FF to buy in this talent from overseas.

BSD appear to be a very highly regarded company with a pretty impressive client list (in the US and abroad - they've just opened an office in London to pitch for the British Labour Party's account). I'm willing to give FF the benifit of the doubt that they wanted to get the best possible company for the job and they couldn't find one as good in Ireland (even if one does exist). If it's hypocrisy for them not to have settled for second best, then, fair enough, but I'd say that making the stupid 'patriotic duty' call in the first place was their bigger mistake.

jmayo wrote: »

Ah yes they have mighty qualifications alright, the state is a credit to them :rolleyes:

They've been pretty much the largest party in the state since their inception. Like them or loath them, they know about Irish politics.

jmayo wrote: »

Is it just speculation or is it fact that Minister of Finance told people they should be patriotic and not go across the border tp shop but should spend THEIR money in the Republic ?
Yes or NO

That is a fact. Nowhere did I say it wasn't.

jmayo wrote: »

Is it just speculation or is it fact that FF's new website (not some strategy or grand plan to conquer the univserse from Offaly but just the website) was developed by a US company ?
Yes or NO

I'm not sure if you do nuance, but the website was developed by a Blue State Digital in conjunction with an Irish media firm called Strawberry media (a firm owned by a FF counciller, but that maybe the topic for a different thread).

On being just the website, you are wrong. They are working with FF on a web strategy, which is a much bigger thing altogether. They have said that the the work already done for Fianna Fail is 'only the beginning of the relationship'

jmayo wrote: »

Can you not see this point ?

Nope

Scofflaw

dvpower wrote: »

For the record, I wouldn't be opposed to FF doing just that.

My substantive question remains; where is the line beyond which FF can be called hypocrites but before which they are making a sensible purchasing decision?

Having called for people to "buy Irish" despite higher prices/lower quality, the answer has to be only when they cannot buy any such service in Ireland. That it is better than what is available in Ireland would not excuse them, I'm afraid, since "buy Irish except where the quality is better elsewhere, or it's cheaper, or whatever" wasn't the chosen exhortation.

dvpower wrote: »

Although I suspect that FF were dazzled by Blue State Digital's connection with Obama, I'm not at all convinced that it wasn't reasonable for FF to buy in this talent from overseas.

BSD appear to be a very highly regarded company with a pretty impressive client list (in the US and abroad - they've just opened an office in London to pitch for the British Labour Party's account). I'm willing to give FF the benifit of the doubt that they wanted to get the best possible company for the job and they couldn't find one as good in Ireland (even if one does exist). If it's hypocrisy for them not to have settled for second best, then, fair enough, but I'd say that making the stupid 'patriotic duty' call in the first place was their bigger mistake.

Alas, even without the "stupid patriotic duty call" this would still be hugely inappropriate at a time when Fianna Fail are the governing party of a country in a huge downturn - and who are touting a blueprint of recovery through indigenous 'smart companies'.

See, the main issue here is that making Web 2.0 work isn't about who you hire. Anyone can use the tools - email, blogs, twitter, facebook - they're extremely easy (indeed, that's the point). What is required for Web 2.0 is an organisational attitude change, and one that, judging by the launch, and judging by the hiring in of "talent" itself, is not something Fianna Fail have undergone at all.

Defend away as you wish - I can fully sympathise with the view that this looks like standard begrudgery and FF-bashing. Unfortunately, FF have chosen, at a time when they should be leading by example, to choose very clearly their perceived electoral advantage over leadership.

dvpower wrote: »

I'm not sure if you do nuance, but the website was developed by a Blue State Digital in conjunction with an Irish media firm called Strawberry media (a firm owned by a FF counciller, but that maybe the topic for a different thread).

On being just the website, you are wrong. They are working with FF on a web strategy, which is a much bigger thing altogether. They have said that the the work already done for Fianna Fail is 'only the beginning of the relationship'

A web strategy to do what, exactly, would you say? By the timing, all we're talking about is how to make FF look good online for the local/euro elections. If they gave a toss about more than their own advantage, they would have had a 'web strategy' for Lisbon, rather than putting one in place for the elections.

Put it whatever way you like, this is a grossly cynical move - buying in foreign talent to market FF to Ireland. In the light of the FF proposal that we should aim to pull out of the recession by fostering indigenous innovation and smart companies, it's not merely cynical but offensive. In the further light of the call to 'buy Irish' it becomes not merely cynical and offensive, but actually hypocritical. Finally, since it's clear that FF didn't even bother to find out whether anyone in the country had the ability to meet their needs (no Irish company was asked to pitch, full stop), it's ignorant as well as cynical, offensive, and hypocritical. That's quite impressive, really.

cordially,
Scofflaw

dvpower

Scofflaw wrote: »

Having called for people to "buy Irish" despite higher prices/lower quality, the answer has to be only when they cannot buy any such service in Ireland.

Which leaves FF in an impossible position; that's a standard that is virtually impossible for any organisation to reach, so the crime is not hypocrisy, it is stupidity.

Scofflaw wrote: »

What is required for Web 2.0 is an organisational attitude change, and one that, judging by the launch, and judging by the hiring in of "talent" itself, is not something Fianna Fail have undergone at all.

Not sure that the launch screw up can be attributed to FF, more Strawberry Media, who organised it not being up front that FF were involved in the event.

Scofflaw wrote: »

A web strategy to do what, exactly, would you say?

I don't know for sure what all the elements of the web strategy the BSD and FF will come up with are. They did launch an 'online engagement strategy' (I haven't seen it so I don't know what it contains) and they did talk about increasing communication with bloggers. They are still working together, so I guess this will evolve.

But I'm not arguing that FF know anything about new media or that they are not ignorant or cynical or evil or anything else.

Scofflaw wrote: »

By the timing, all we're talking about is how to make FF look good online for the local/euro elections.

It seems to me that it is a much longer term deal.

Scofflaw wrote: »

(no Irish company was asked to pitch, full stop)

That's not to say that no Irish Company was evaluated. We don't know what the procurment process was. We don't even know that there was a direct contractual relationship between FF and BSD. Perhaps BDS were contracted by Strawberry Media, we just don't know for sure.

Come to that, we dont even know when the relationship was entered into; it may have been way before the 'patriotic duty' call. There's lots that we don't know about this (private commercial arrangement), but somehow seem pretty clear that it involves FF hypocrisy.

dresden8

dvpower wrote: »

Not sure that the launch screw up can be attributed to FF,

Surely it was the job of the person signing the cheque (blank or not) to take a look at the website and say go ahead, that's grand.

dvpower

dresden8 wrote: »

Surely it was the job of the person signing the cheque (blank or not) to take a look at the website and say go ahead, that's grand.

Actually, we shouldn't refer to this as the website launch. The event organised by Strawberry Media, was for Joe Rospars from Blue State Digital to talk about his company and his work with Obama. Strawberry Media invited a pile of bloggers to attend and naturally, they jumped at the chance.

But when they got there, there was a pile of FF branding and, as I gather, some FF speakers. So, this backfired somewhat on FF, but I'd put most of the blame for this on Strawberry Media.

I think the actual website launch was done a couple of days prior to the FF/Strawberry Media/BSD event. I'm not sure that their was any offical event to mark this (just someone updating an endpoint somewhere).

LoveDucati2

Typical FF.

The Country is in ****e and they can't make a decision to save their lives.

Lets get team Obama involved.

jimmmy

LoveDucati2 wrote: »

Typical FF.

The Country is in ****e and they can't make a decision to save their lives.

Lets get team Obama involved.

Maybe we should look to our neighbours on the other side instead ( not unlike how other groups of islands in the world unite eg Japan, New Zealand etc. )
As Gay Byrne said, we should hand the country back to the British, with a note of apology. We are borrowing 25 billion ( after decades of EC handouts ) and still cannot feed ourselves at realistic prices - we have to go up north for our shopping. A letter from Dublin to London takes longer than it did 100 years ago, and the trains are no quicker either.