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HSP season 5

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    #302
    El Stuntman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,720 ✭✭✭El Stuntman


    LuckyLloyd wrote: »
    Apparently he is a very successful businessman away from Poker.

    speaking of which, where's that Canadian billionaire dude - he was great last time out


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    #303
    shano_88
    Registered Users Posts: 3,253 ✭✭✭shano_88


    El Stuntman wrote: »
    speaking of which, where's that Canadian billionaire dude - he was great last time out


    I was reading about him and apparently he lost 17 million on full tilt last year.


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    #304
    cuterob
    Registered Users Posts: 1,156 ✭✭✭cuterob


    shano_88 wrote: »
    I was reading about him and apparently he lost 17 million on full tilt last year.

    i think it was more like 7 million.. nothing when you're worth over 2 billion

    elezra and farha dont live off poker.. it's a hobby to them


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    #305
    Hectorjelly
    Registered Users Posts: 6,696 ✭✭✭Hectorjelly


    RedJoker wrote: »
    It's relevant in that we need to know what percentage of their opening range the continuing range makes up. The actual make up of the range is largely irrelevant. It's like saying you're going to 3bet somebody because you're "ahead of their range", it's nonsense.

    If somebody is opening 30% of hands but continuing with 20% are you going to 3bet bluff them? If somebody is opening 20% but continuing with 5% are you going to 3bet bluff them?

    Despite opening a lot less the second player is a far better candidate to bluff than the first.

    Whether or not "it can take much longer to have any true idea of someones continuing range", it doesn't change the fact that it's still the far more important range when deciding what hands to 3bet.

    How you can figure out Durrs continuing range before you 3 bet him? (No-one else is doing any 3 betting). It is going to be much more profitable 3 betting a very loose opener than a very tight opener, so since you can only make assumptions about the continuing range which are liable to be totally wrong, but you can have a good idea of their opening range, the opening range is more important.

    Also, this is a situation where it is definitely a mistake to not take the highest EV play available to you. You aren't here for the long run, you will only get to play for a few hours, and then you are probably going to be thrown of the show for not being loose or annoying enough.


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    #306
    RedJoker
    Registered Users Posts: 1,461 ✭✭✭RedJoker


    Hectorjelly wrote: »
    How you can figure out Durrs continuing range before you 3 bet him? (No-one else is doing any 3 betting). It is going to be much more profitable 3 betting a very loose opener than a very tight opener, so since you can only make assumptions about the continuing range which are liable to be totally wrong, but you can have a good idea of their opening range, the opening range is more important.

    You can 3bet with other hands than AJ to find out his continuing range. Regardless of whether you can figure it out or not, the initial opening range isn't as important.

    It's not more profitable 3betting a loose opener if they're continuing with a larger percentage of their range than the tight opener.
    Hectorjelly wrote: »
    Also, this is a situation where it is definitely a mistake to not take the highest EV play available to you. You aren't here for the long run, you will only get to play for a few hours, and then you are probably going to be thrown of the show for not being loose or annoying enough.

    That's like saying EV doesn't matter in tournaments because if you get knocked out you can't reload. Whether or not this is a weird situation where we should ignore poker theory, it doesn't change the poker theory.

    I'm not suggesting folding AJ or not 3betting at all, you can be loose without 3betting AJ. I assumed the range Durrr was continuing with would make 3betting AJ a mistake, if he's really continuing that loose then it should be fine.


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    #307
    Rakeline
    Closed Accounts Posts: 99 ✭✭Rakeline


    Does Durr play like that online or just live he opens alot of hands could see that been pretty bad for online. Have to say its not been great so far hope they bring in some new players soon.


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    #308
    a147pro
    Closed Accounts Posts: 585 ✭✭✭a147pro


    Rakeline wrote: »
    Does Durr play like that online or just live he opens alot of hands could see that been pretty bad for online. Have to say its not been great so far hope they bring in some new players soon.


    ??

    the AA Q10 42 was one of the best hands I've ever seen!


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    #309
    mormank
    Registered Users Posts: 4,547 ✭✭✭mormank


    a147pro wrote: »
    ??

    the AA Q10 42 was one of the best hands I've ever seen!

    really?? is this the only episode of a poker tv show u have ever seen too?

    id love to know what ppl would have thought of this hand had it been benyamine with the Q 10 or that guy who owns cirque de soleile..he fired a second bullet and ppl are talking about the hand like Durr is now god or something..


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    #310
    a147pro
    Closed Accounts Posts: 585 ✭✭✭a147pro


    I've watched every episode of HSP and watch any other poker else thats on. Most of poker on TV is complete crap. I like HSP because of the characters and because Gabe actually understands Poker, in my view, better than anyone else who commentates on it. He's also very funny.

    My interest in the hand has nothing to do with Durr cock worship. Usually hands are only interesting because its one big hand against another, reference Negreanu running into quads.

    I don't know about you, but I suspect you are in the only percentile of poker fans who do not find the fact that the uncrowned king of online poker manages to fire a $100,000 dollar bluff against the current world champion, who is probably regarded as as yet un-tested, getting him to fold trips where it is patently obvious that he has trips. And then proves this by taking a side bet with Doyle for a few K to say that Eastgate had the best hand. That is leaving out the fact that one of the most respected players and analysts in the game is also in the hand holding aces.

    I don't know about you but I find that pretty interesting. If you don't find it interesting I'm wonder why you're wasting your time posting on an internet forum. Presumably you play $200,000 pots all the time.

    And to answer your question, if Guy or David had done it I'd find it just as interesting (though personally I doubt Guy was capable of putting Eastgate on the trips, and knowing he could still get him off them).


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    #311
    Hectorjelly
    Registered Users Posts: 6,696 ✭✭✭Hectorjelly


    Yeah that was probably the most interesting hand I've ever seen on TV. i was stunned at the time


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    #312
    Drakar
    Registered Users Posts: 1,531 ✭✭✭Drakar


    It became a little more obvious after he'd made the bet that it was trips to be fair (or at least thats how it appeared on TV, barry said it was far quicker when it was played live).


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    #313
    a147pro
    Closed Accounts Posts: 585 ✭✭✭a147pro


    Drakar wrote: »
    It became a little more obvious after he'd made the bet that it was trips to be fair (or at least thats how it appeared on TV, barry said it was far quicker when it was played live).

    the fold? Eastgate folded quite quickly on TV as I recall. It was the check flat call on the flop which made it obv. Eastgate only does that with greenstein still to act with trips and above.


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    #314
    looserock
    Closed Accounts Posts: 302 ✭✭looserock


    Hectorjelly wrote: »
    Yeah that was probably the most interesting hand I've ever seen on TV. i was stunned at the time

    I can't think of a more interesting hand either, but does he play like that all the time or was it just for tv?


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    #315
    Slash/ED
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,163 ✭✭✭Slash/ED


    looserock wrote: »
    I can't think of a more interesting hand either, but does he play like that all the time or was it just for tv?

    Pretty much all the time I think


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    #316
    El Stuntman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,720 ✭✭✭El Stuntman


    that Zigmund character is either stoned or drunk

    or has no balls (which seems unlikely given what I've heard about his online play)

    why the hell did he not follow through with his bluffs?


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    #317
    White Knight
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,179 ✭✭✭White Knight


    El Stuntman wrote: »
    that Zigmund character is either stoned or drunk

    or has no balls (which seems unlikely given what I've heard about his online play)

    why the hell did he not follow through with his bluffs?

    He hit and run durr in a $330k pot earlier today (HU omaha)

    Maybe he is not comfortable with the 2 card game ...


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    #318
    mormank
    Registered Users Posts: 4,547 ✭✭✭mormank


    a147pro wrote: »
    I've watched every episode of HSP and watch any other poker else thats on. Most of poker on TV is complete crap. I like HSP because of the characters and because Gabe actually understands Poker, in my view, better than anyone else who commentates on it. He's also very funny.

    My interest in the hand has nothing to do with Durr cock worship. Usually hands are only interesting because its one big hand against another, reference Negreanu running into quads.

    I don't know about you, but I suspect you are in the only percentile of poker fans who do not find the fact that the uncrowned king of online poker manages to fire a $100,000 dollar bluff against the current world champion, who is probably regarded as as yet un-tested, getting him to fold trips where it is patently obvious that he has trips. And then proves this by taking a side bet with Doyle for a few K to say that Eastgate had the best hand. That is leaving out the fact that one of the most respected players and analysts in the game is also in the hand holding aces.

    I don't know about you but I find that pretty interesting. If you don't find it interesting I'm wonder why you're wasting your time posting on an internet forum. Presumably you play $200,000 pots all the time.

    And to answer your question, if Guy or David had done it I'd find it just as interesting (though personally I doubt Guy was capable of putting Eastgate on the trips, and knowing he could still get him off them).

    he got the tightest player yet to appear on HSP to fold a 2. he can pretty much disregard barry as having a 2 here. puts him on an overpair. puts eastgate on a 2. what if eastgate called the turn?? and then durr loses his stack with a bluff on the river?? is the hand still as interesting??

    i dunno i just think he has merely fired a second bullet (yes he knows eastgate has a two, but he also knows how tight he is playing). plenty of players have bluffed before. i dont see it as being any better than other hands. perhaps ye are all putting alot of weight on the fact that it was 100k?? i think this not relevant as this all relative to these guys i wouldve thought.

    fair enough yes he actualy had the balls to putt in these bullets where zigmund for example hasnt but as it has already been mentioned he is tryin oh so hard to be a massive poker celebrity. he will not achieve this by giving up on pots like this.

    and yes i find it interesting but no more or less paticularly than many of the other hands so i hope this justifies in your eyes my posting on this forum. i do find the hand interesting. i do like that it is the hand that you appreciate and not the player. durr would not have gotten away with this play on a standard 1/2 table...would probably be a 3 way all in on the turn!! :rolleyes:

    anyway feel free to continue as tho i had never 'opened my mouth'.


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    #319
    RedJoker
    Registered Users Posts: 1,461 ✭✭✭RedJoker


    mormank wrote: »
    he got the tightest player yet to appear on HSP to fold a 2.

    You forgetting Bob Stupak?


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    #320
    Hectorjelly
    Registered Users Posts: 6,696 ✭✭✭Hectorjelly


    Mormon, think about what you are saying. You say it wouldn't work at a 12 table. Of course it wouldn't, does that take away from it? Thats such a ridiculous thing to say I dont quite know where to go on from there...

    He wasn't just firing a random second bullet, he correctly analysed the situation, realising that although they both had very strong hands, they would both fold them even though he has a LAG image. This was as close to genius as you will see on televised poker.


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    #321
    a147pro
    Closed Accounts Posts: 585 ✭✭✭a147pro


    Mormon, the point of good poker is to be able to predict what other players will do and make them do what you want, to make them fold when you're behind and call when you're ahead. The rest of it is just math. This hand is a great example of this, with the highest level opposition, for the highest stakes. I don't think it really gets better than that!

    I can see why people think he's trying so hard to be a poker celebrity (I don't know enough about that to say if he is TBH) but that only makes it even more impressive as it would be seriously embarassing if it backfired on him. I'm also genuinely not sure how much of it is genius as HJ says and how much of it is his pure balls and ego, but given that he must have known Eastgate had the 2, and given that he's clearly a brilliant player, I'm inclined to think the former.

    Either way, its fascinating to watch and if I ever wanted to show somebody who was interested in poker one hand which summed up the beauty of poker, thats it.


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    #322
    mormank
    Registered Users Posts: 4,547 ✭✭✭mormank


    points taken gents..i realise all tha about making ppl do what you want etc..if im eastgate and i fold that hand i stnd up and leave the table after it. the man seems to be playing scared money and that is my motto if im playing scared money. as soon as i realise it i have to leave. Durr took advantage of this


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    #323
    looserock
    Closed Accounts Posts: 302 ✭✭looserock


    I've been having my doubts about this Durr fella, what with him being so creepy and all.

    Well now that I've seen some more of him on p.a.d cash games I'm starting to turn, those boys in the big game are in for a rough time I think.


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    #324
    KevinK
    Registered Users Posts: 659 ✭✭✭KevinK


    White Knight wrote: »
    He hit and run durr in a $330k pot earlier today (HU omaha)

    Maybe he is not comfortable with the 2 card game ...

    I think this is it, Zigimund is an Omaha specialist. Pretty sure I read somewhere that he admitted himself to not having an edge in this game.


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    #325
    El Stuntman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,720 ✭✭✭El Stuntman


    KevinK wrote: »
    I think this is it, Zigimund is an Omaha specialist. Pretty sure I read somewhere that he admitted himself to not having an edge in this game.

    not only does he not have an edge in this game, he wouldn't have an edge in a 1/2 PLHE game in the Aquarium from what I've seen


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    #326
    Flushdraw
    Registered Users Posts: 6,187 ✭✭✭Flushdraw


    El Stuntman wrote: »
    not only does he not have an edge in this game, he wouldn't have an edge in a 1/2 PLHE game in the Aquarium from what I've seen

    Nah he has a huge edge. I'd just fold, give him my money and ask him not to beat me up outside!

    This guy on the other hand...

    _MG_7422_Neil%20Stoddart.jpg


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    #327
    NickyOD
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,124 ✭✭✭NickyOD


    mormank wrote: »
    durr would not have gotten away with this play on a standard 1/2 table...

    Didn't you get bluffed off a JJ2 flop holding AJ in a 1/3 game?


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    #328
    keane2097
    Registered Users Posts: 17,771 ✭✭✭✭keane2097


    RedJoker wrote: »
    You forgetting Bob Stupak?

    The ghost of Christmas past :pac:


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    #329
    mormank
    Registered Users Posts: 4,547 ✭✭✭mormank


    NickyOD wrote: »
    Didn't you get bluffed off a JJ2 flop holding AJ in a 1/3 game?

    ha. thanks :D i said 1/2 not 1/3...and neither of us know for sure what that guy had in that hand so it coould still have been an amazing fold..P.S.like i said earlier too, if im making these folds i.e. scared money, i will leave the table and i left the table right after that hand!!


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    #330
    NickyOD
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,124 ✭✭✭NickyOD


    mormank wrote: »
    ha. thanks :D i said 1/2 not 1/3...and neither of us know for sure what that guy had in that hand so it coould still have been an amazing fold..P.S.like i said earlier too, if im making these folds i.e. scared money, i will leave the table and i left the table right after that hand!!

    I have it on good authority that he had air.


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    #331
    mormank
    Registered Users Posts: 4,547 ✭✭✭mormank


    well you can keep your good authority!! either wy, i was playin scared money at that stage, ill admit that. i had my reasons for it. still, it was laughable how nobody could comprehend how i could possibly fold the 3rd nuts!!!


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