Taxi driver protest

the_syco

oisindoyle wrote: »

Since when did any taxi driver want deregulation ?When please tell me when ?

Every single taxi person who has become one since deregulation. The numbers increased by the bucket load. How many of the "new" (by new, I mean those who became a taxi person after deregulation) want a cap?

[quote=oisindoyle;62351193As for your comment...."Soon, there'll be a happy compramise, of enough taxis, and not too much of a charge"....thats funny .Perhaps you need glasses but a blind man can see Dublin and many parts of the country have too many taxis .
Fact for you ,,,At present Dublin has MORE taxis than New York,,,,
So slag off taxi drivers all you like ,but try and get SOME facts right[/quote]
Too many is not enough. 20 taxis for 5 people is too many. 5 taxis for 5 people is enough. Before degulation there was 1 taxi for 5 people. Now there is 20 taxis for one person. Somewhere down the line a happy medium will happen, and there'll be enough taxis, but not overkill as there is today.

=-=

However, I do admit the way the government degregulated the taxi industry was the biggest joke of it all, esp when, 3 months after someone pays the guts of £150,000 (or more) for a taxi plate, people got a taxi plate for SFA.

=-=

The only way I can see this going forward is to do a London taxi type of test. This should cull most of the taxi drivers who are in the job for a quick buck (and allow those who want to get out, a way to get out). Once the numbers go down, and people cop that you have to know Dublin very well, will people stop "trying their hand" out in the business.

Mimikyu

This post has been deleted.

thebman

Should have all been towed TBH or clamped because that apparently solves problems.

congo_90

I always find it ironic that taxi drivers who most are essentially self employed believe illegally parking to cry their once monopoly is now go and they protest by leaving their cars (their income) empty, blocking up streets generating agreat image of themselves :rolleyes:

Seriously. The taxi office or whatever it is won't cap licence numbers because they're getting money thus don't give a damn.
I understand they have debts to pay off for example the car, licence, plate etc but again. Think of it like a business. Can't afford to run it so shut down

Bottom line:
If taxi drivers believe there's no money due to over crowding then get out of the game, off their arses and find another job!

To the minority of honest hard working drivers who stayed out and actually made some money (hopefully at the expense at the whinging idiots protesting), I do not wish to insult for the above reason.

As another poster pointed out, The gards should've documented the taxi numbers and send them a fine for illegal parking, disrupting traffic, cause for endangerment to other drivers, A bill for anyone trying to get to work who couldn't and to top it off take their plates. Now if the lazy gards done this they'd take this country out of a recession from the revenue generated by that alone!

Hang on I'll drive my car in town, block off a major road in the city and tell the gards I'm protesting because there's too many red cars on the road :rolleyes:

tinkerbell

*sigh* and the battle is commencing again today, just heard it on newstalk - they are starting their protest at 7 a.m. and apparantly are expecting bigger numbers than yesterday.

Arrest them all I say and tow their stupid cars.

ecom

has any Garda representative or anyone else for that matter actually gone on record and said why they arent arresting these people?

as numerous people have already pointed out if we decided to park on O'Connell street we'd be moved on and if we refused to move we'd be arrested. Why the one rule for them/us scenario?

triple-M

http://www.rte.ie/news/2009/1002/taxi.html
complete thugs shy should commuters be forced to suffer for their own selfish needs,really peed off,we get the point your protesting what the fcuk are they playing at this time,I hope they never cap the numbers just to pee off these guys,hopefully someone goes down the side of their cars with a sharp object when their not looking to teach em a lesson

P_1

If you are in town today, find your nearest guard and ask them why they're not moving this illegal blockage along. If enough of us do this surely they;ll do something about it.

Also would not be surprised if somebody lobs a brick at one of those striking cabs today.

Jip

Fair play Taxi Pete, we've been at logger heads before over this issue but that was an honest post.

Interestingly the National Taxi Drivers Union rep was on at the end of Morning Ireland, he said the protest is nothing to do with them, don't agree with it and think they shouldn't be blockading like they are, that most of the protesters aren't from Dublin.

So why not cause disruption in your own towns and cities ? I know why, because you probably have to live in them and don't want to face the backlash there, so you come to Dublin where you have no interest and do you what you want here. Dicks.

How can the gardai let 100 self serving pricks cause this must disruption to the city ? It's a pity some of those who slept in their cars didn't have a 'friendly' introduction to some of our less salubrious locals from that end of the city over night. No doubt gardai were out keeping an eye out on them in case such a thing should happen.

confused-dazed

ecom wrote: »

has any Garda representative or anyone else for that matter actually gone on record and said why they arent arresting these people?

it's not the G.R.A. that people need to talk to ,it's the T.D.'s the people in government. they should be asked why the law wasn't enforced. this thing about letting the taxi drivers run amok and take over the main street of the country would've come from the top. now maybe just maybe that the guards are afraid of these guys. ****ing hell you'd swear some of them had done hard time.even i'd be afraid of getting into a cab with some of these guys.

ecom wrote: »

Why the one rule for them/us scenario?

ahhhh ecom where have you been .the dogs on the streets have known for years that taxi drivers are a law onto themselves.
i heard this got out of control on the radio when the guards tried to remove a taxi.
what should happen is that every driver that blocked o'connell street should have their license revoked. or even better still the riot squad should've went in.
i believe in protests and all that. but you do not see any other strikers blocking the streets with their trucks, or buses. now theres one for ya. what do you think would happen if striking bus drivers blocked o'connell street with buses. the first people to complain would be "taxi drivers" of course.
well if this site is monitored i hope to god someone reads this.
next time send in the riot squad and if that doesn't work then the army.

ecom

confused-dazed wrote: »

it's not the G.R.A. that people need to talk to ,it's the T.D.'s the people in government.

i didnt specifically mean the GRA, I just meant the guards themselves (a superindendent or someone of similar rank)....they are responsible for enforcing law so why arent they enforcing it?

Kintarō Hattori

dub_commuter wrote: »

Still, the Gardai were actually doing somthing tonight, running after and grabbing Jaywalkers around the O'Connell Bridge area, one female Gardai ran quite a distance to get someone who jaywalked saying he could cause an accident or hold things up, yet they were perfectly happy for these selfish taxi drivers to hold the whole city centre to ransom.

They were really stopping people for Jaywalking? Seriously? I've never seen anyone stopped for this, possibly because 90% of the Gardai are guilty of it themselves. I'm off to the Emergency Forces forum!

positron

Un'effing'believable!! Guardaí standing around diverting traffic so that a small number of rogues could just hold the busiest part of the country in ransom?

If I had any sort of power, I would have the taxi drivers who caused this arrested, cars towed away, fined for causing intentional stress, trauma and despair to so many ordinary people. And the Gardaí should also be put thru the same scrutiny, and someone has to held accountable for what their inaction yesterday and punished for what they did.

If the system fails to work, and compels public to take action - I am certainty not suggesting anything here.. - but this is how they react in certain parts of the world..! http://www.jedburghgroup.com/_html/caltrop.htm

confused-dazed

ecom wrote: »

i didnt specifically mean the GRA, I just meant the guards themselves (a superindendent or someone of similar rank)....they are responsible for enforcing law so why arent they enforcing it?

well hopefully these questions will be asked now across the board.

TaxiManMartin

positron wrote: »

Un'effing'believable!! Guardaí standing around diverting traffic so that a small number of rogues could just hold the busiest part of the country in ransom?

If I had any sort of power, I would have the taxi drivers who caused this arrested, cars towed away, fined for causing intentional stress, trauma and despair to so many ordinary people. And the Gardaí should also be put thru the same scrutiny, and someone has to held accountable for what their inaction yesterday and punished for what they did.

If the system fails to work, and compels public to take action - I am certainty not suggesting anything here.. - but this is how they react in certain parts of the world..! http://www.jedburghgroup.com/_html/caltrop.htm

The problem is that most of the drivers expect money to just be given to them.
If they all worked like me instead of hassleing the travelling public they might earn their money, but no they want the easy option as usual

adrian522

Can somebody back up this claim that there are more taxis in Dublin than there are in new york?

According to Wikipedia, referenced by the New York City Taxi and Limousine Commission (2006-03-09).There are 13,087 taxis operating in New York City, not including over 40,000 other for-hire vehicles.

Are you claiming that there are over 50,000 taxis and hackneys in Dublin?

Show me the source for this or stop making this claim.

Taxipete29

adrian522 wrote: »

Can somebody back up this claim that there are more taxis in Dublin than there are in new york?

According to Wikipedia, referenced by the New York City Taxi and Limousine Commission (2006-03-09).There are 13,087 taxis operating in New York City, not including over 40,000 other for-hire vehicles.

Are you claiming that there are over 50,000 taxis and hackneys in Dublin?

Show me the source for this or stop making this claim.

Just to clarify, the 13,087 are the yellow medallion taxis which are the only ones permitted to respond to a street hail. In that way thats the only comparable figure.

The other 40,000 vehicles include commuter vans, limos and other vehicles.
The fact remains that Dublin does have more taxis than New York.

Mimikyu

This post has been deleted.

adrian522

Taxipete29 wrote: »

Just to clarify, the 13,087 are the yellow medallion taxis which are the only ones permitted to respond to a street hail. In that way thats the only comparable figure.

The other 40,000 vehicles include commuter vans, limos and other vehicles.
The fact remains that Dublin does have more taxis than New York.

Is there a source for the number of Dublin taxis?

Taxipete29

adrian522 wrote: »

Is there a source for the number of Dublin taxis?

The regulators office. I saw it on the quarterly newsletter we get sent. Not sure if the figure is available online.

positron

http://www.taxiregulator.ie/files/publications/Industry%20Newsletter%20Issue%2011_16_07_09.pdf

Co. Dublin - 11,800

Taxipete29

positron wrote: »

http://www.taxiregulator.ie/files/publications/Industry%20Newsletter%20Issue%2011_16_07_09.pdf

Co. Dublin - 11,800

Its actually 12504, you have to add in the number of wheelchair taxis also as they operate in the same way.

Dublin Taxis-12504 Population- 1.2m??

New York Taxis 13087 Population 12m ??

There is a huge difference here obviously.

hmmm

Apparently Department of Transport officials are meeting the taxi drivers in O'Connell Street. So there you have it, if you have a grievance all you have to do is illegally block the streets of Dublin and you will get attention with no consequences.

adrian522

But its > 13,000 for Dublin?

Edit: Eh, didn't refresh to read previous posts...

Ham'nd'egger

positron wrote: »

http://www.taxiregulator.ie/files/publications/Industry%20Newsletter%20Issue%2011_16_07_09.pdf

Co. Dublin - 11,800

The figure of taxis in Dublin that the Regulator states there is will always be flawed as the Regulator's Office actually has no idea as to many taxi drivers are actually operating in Dublin or indeed Ireland. The best they can give is the amount of Taxi Plate licences held by people giving Dublin addresses but this obviously doesn't take into account of people living in other counties who operate in Dublin or those who own more than one plate. The next best they can say is the amount of people issued with "active" PSV licences for Dublin but this won't take into account those are part time, no longer driving, licenced but not driving due to other work, illness etc so it is totally unreliable as an indicator of how many people are working in the trade.

According to the above newsletter, this number is 47, 529. The population of Ireland according to the 2006 census is 4,239,848.

petergfiffin

I seriously think the people of Dublin should hold their own day of protest by people using alternative transport (bus, train, getting a lift) on that day to show their anger with the taxi drivers. It would only need to be one day to get the message across and I reckon it would make them think twice about blocking up the city again. I know you could argue that you'd hit the ones who have no part in this but the taxi unions aren't exactly being discriminating about who they hurt.

I'm absolutely sick and tired of listening to the whinging that taxi drivers go on with, if you can't make money it's because there's too many of you same as any industry e.g. plumbers, electricians. I still remember the days pre deregulation and any problems the taxi industry have are purely self-inflicted because of their inability to compromise.

adrian522

Taxipete29 wrote: »

Its actually 12504, you have to add in the number of wheelchair taxis also as they operate in the same way.

Dublin Taxis-12504 Population- 1.2m??

New York Taxis 13087 Population 12m ??

There is a huge difference here obviously.

Yes but you are conveniently forgetting the Limos etc that make up a huge part of the New York market, 40,000 or so according to the above post.

sliabh

Taxipete29 wrote: »

Its actually 12504, you have to add in the number of wheelchair taxis also as they operate in the same way.

Dublin Taxis-12504 Population- 1.2m??

New York Taxis 13087 Population 12m ??

There is a huge difference here obviously.

Not to criticse you Tasipete29 or anyone else, but personally I don't think it is a valid comparison for 2 reasons.

First New York City (pop 8.3m) is very dense, and has a well developed subway system reducing the need for taxis. But any New Yorker will tell you how hard it is to find a taxi there as well.

Secondly, who cares how many taxis there are in New York?

It is hardly the gold standard or benchmark of ideal taxi availability. Maybe we should use Mumbai where there are over 56,000 taxis and god only knows how many auto-rickshaws for 14m people.

Each city needs to figure out for itself how many it needs based on its own situation, and whether or not a cap is even needed.

positron

Sorry, I might have missed some posts, but does anyone know what are these illegally parked taxi drivers who disrespect everyone else, are demanding?

Boom_Bap

sliabh wrote: »

Not to criticse you Tasipete29 or anyone else, but personally I don't think it is a valid comparison for 2 reasons.

First New York City (pop 8.3m) is very dense, and has a well developed subway system reducing the need for taxis. But any New Yorker will tell you how hard it is to find a taxi there as well.

Secondly, who cares how many taxis there are in New York?

It is hardly the gold standard or benchmark of ideal taxi availability. Maybe we should use Mumbai where there are over 56,000 taxis and god only knows how many auto-rickshaws for 14m people.

Each city needs to figure out for itself how many it needs based on its own situation, and whether or not a cap is even needed.

in an attempt to clear this up, Dublin has more taxi's per capita than New York

adrian522

Well that's an entirely different claim from what was posted earlier in this thread and TBH does not really mean a whole lot. Theres no reason why NY would have a higher per capita amount of taxis.

sliabh

Boom_Bap wrote: »

in an attempt to clear this up, Dublin has more taxi's per capita than New York

Correct.

And New York has more trains per capita. So it is apples and oranges really

bangersandmash

Had the pleasure of passing through O'Connell St twice this morning. It gave me plenty of time to admire the many 'No to Lisbon' placards, stickers and posters which the taxi drivers where sporting.

You have to wonder whether those drivers honestly believed that inconveniencing commuters in this way would encourage people to be sympathetic toward their side of the Lisbon debate, or indeed have any sympathy for their grievances with the government or the regulator.

crocro

The new DTA bill is at discussion stage so maybe this is a good time to insert an amendment allowing for the revocation of taxi licences and confiscation of vehicles where the owner has used the vehicle to blockade a road, railway, airport or cause public disruption.

adrian522

I'm sorry, but I don't see what any of this has to do with the Lisbon treaty. Theres nothing in there about Taxis or regulation or capping numbers etc.

Maybe they want a no vote to p!ss off the government but all the Opposition advocate a Yes vote too so I don't really see where they are coming from with this.

Ham'nd'egger

sliabh wrote: »

Not to criticse you Tasipete29 or anyone else, but personally I don't think it is a valid comparison for 2 reasons.

First New York City (pop 8.3m) is very dense, and has a well developed subway system reducing the need for taxis. But any New Yorker will tell you how hard it is to find a taxi there as well.

Secondly, who cares how many taxis there are in New York?

It is hardly the gold standard or benchmark of ideal taxi availability. Maybe we should use Mumbai where there are over 56,000 taxis and god only knows how many auto-rickshaws for 14m people.

Each city needs to figure out for itself how many it needs based on its own situation, and whether or not a cap is even needed.

Regardless of other public transport options, the fact remains that the taxi/population ratio between Dublin and other cities is far lower here and the fact remains that regulation in Ireland doesn't want to allow the market to find any standards or level ground, either directly by non issuing working licences on a hiatus, indirectly to increase service standards of drivers and facilitate better those who want to leave the trade or by enforcing sane industry rules to allow legal taxis to operate safely.

While many of taxi drivers concerns are self involved (lower takings, longer hours worked, inability to invest in new cars), many of them are customer related (Drivers working in poor cars, illegal drivers, drivers working unsafe hours, unskilled drivers with poor route/driving knowledge).

beeno67

sliabh wrote: »

Not to criticse you Tasipete29 or anyone else, but personally I don't think it is a valid comparison for 2 reasons.

First New York City (pop 8.3m) is very dense, and has a well developed subway system reducing the need for taxis. But any New Yorker will tell you how hard it is to find a taxi there as well.

Secondly, who cares how many taxis there are in New York?

It is hardly the gold standard or benchmark of ideal taxi availability. Maybe we should use Mumbai where there are over 56,000 taxis and god only knows how many auto-rickshaws for 14m people.

Each city needs to figure out for itself how many it needs based on its own situation, and whether or not a cap is even needed.

Of course the question should be "how many licenced taxi drivers are there in New York?" The answer is 42,900 as of 2005.

MOH

oisindoyle wrote: »

Fact for you ,,,At present Dublin has MORE taxis than New York,,,,
So slag off taxi drivers all you like ,but try and get SOME facts right

Any source for this "fact"? This is the sort of wild claim some taxi drivers make that gets everyone's back up.

Commission for Taxi Regulation shows 12,504 taxis in county Dubiln, as at end of June.

The New York TLC 2008 annual report shows 13237 medallion vehicles, and over 46000 licensed medallion drivers. There's also over 40000 other for-hire vehicles which include those servicing pre-bookings, which is business that regular taxis get over here.

beeno67

One of the big problems is that taxi driving is a semi-skilled job. There is very little to stop me setting up as a taxi driver and setting myself up in business. So it is not why are taxi drivers now earning so little but why did they ever earn so much?

Ham'nd'egger

beeno67 wrote: »

Of course the question should be "how many licenced taxi drivers are there in New York?" The answer is 42,900 as of 2005.

As of June 2009, Ireland has 47, 529 and the population of Ireland according to the 2006 census is 4,239,848.

MOH

Hamndegger wrote: »

As of June 2009, Ireland has 47, 529 and the population of Ireland according to the 2006 census is 4,239,848.

As of June 2009, Dublin has just over 13000, including taxis, hackneys and limos.
New York has over 100000 active driver licenses.

Jumpy

Hamndegger wrote: »

As of June 2009, Ireland has 47, 529 and the population of Ireland according to the 2006 census is 4,239,848.

So fcukin what?

If they are not making enough money, then quit and find something that does. This is how unskilled labour finds a balance.

sliabh

positron wrote: »

Sorry, I might have missed some posts, but does anyone know what are these illegally parked taxi drivers who disrespect everyone else, are demanding?

+1 to this. A far more important question than taxi ratios in New York, or who can come up with the most inventive way of punishing them for protesting (can we ask the US if they are still taking admissions in Guantanamo?)

WIZE

they should take the old Bangers off the Road to thin out the amount of Taxi's

beeno67

Jumpy wrote: »

So fcukin what?

If they are not making enough money, then quit and find something that does. This is how unskilled labour finds a balance.

I agree here. Isn't it time the taxi regulator began slashing fares.

Ham'nd'egger

MOH wrote: »

As of June 2009, Dublin has just over 13000, including taxis, hackneys and limos.
New York has over 100000 active driver licenses.

No, that figure are taxi plates registered to people with addresses in Dublin. This doesn't take into account taxi plates registered to people with addresses outside of Dublin who operate their taxi in Dublin; you could probably add at least another 1,500 to this amount.

Ham'nd'egger

Jumpy wrote: »

So fcukin what?

If they are not making enough money, then quit and find something that does. This is how unskilled labour finds a balance.

How silly of me for pointing out an over supply in a market in relation to population has no bearing in an debate that has over supply and an appalling ease of market entry for new supplier as key points.

adrian522

Yeah, it seems to me its the basics of supply and demand you don't understand. In a free market anyone who thinks they can make money is free to enter the market, this results in competition.

It seems many would like to go back to the 80's and 90's when people would have to Queue for several hours in the rain to get a taxi.

As with any other business there should be no restriction on the amount of operators.

Should we start closing down every Spar and Centra just so newsagents can earn x amount of €€€??

Should ALdi and Lidl be forced to Close because Dunnes are struggling?

Perhaps Bank of Scotland should be kicked out because AIB and BOI are not turning a profit?

Jip

Anyone listening to Joe Duffy ? Did you ever hear a bigger bunch on whingers in the world ? Everyones to blame but themselves, one guy, when the question was put to him was asked why don't they lower their fares as a protest against the regulator rather than do what they're doing, he couldn't answer directly but it's basically because he's afraid to do that.

So there you have it, a bunch of hard men, who claim there's no intimidation going on despite several people who were at the end of it phoning in, are willing to piss of the public but are afraid of the regulator.

By the way, it's all ok, the recession is only affecting taxi drivers.

Mitch Connor

adrian522 wrote: »

Yeah, it seems to me its the basics of supply and demand you don't understand. In a free market anyone who thinks they can make money is free to enter the market, this results in competition.

It seems many would like to go back to the 80's and 90's when people would have to Queue for several hours in the rain to get a taxi.

As with any other business there should be no restriction on the amount of operators.

Should we start closing down every Spar and Centra just so newsagents can earn x amount of €€€??

Should ALdi and Lidl be forced to Close because Dunnes are struggling?

Perhaps Bank of Scotland should be kicked out because AIB and BOI are not turning a profit?

isn't there a limit on pub licences?