Sick Use Of Pound Dogs As Art In Ireland

Busta Hyman

sorella wrote: »

Which is why Irish dogs have such a bad life - in general, there being so many great owners here on boards.

HOW dare you. we have a dog that is adored my us all.


this exibition does NO harm whatsoever to the dogs they are well cared for and instead of sitting in a cage at the p[ound they get to be in an "exibition" where they get to see and interact with lots of people ( albeit "atrsy" types that think modern art is high brow buts thats another thread). as a result the pound that supplied the dogs is happy the dogs are cared for. (so for them helping this travesty of animal welfare lets shut them down and put all the dogs they are trying to find homes for to sleep shall we?).

sorella wrote: »

If you cannot see that then trying to tell you is fuitile. The harm, I mean

you tell us all as you seem to beleive that you know better than us all. please let us benifit from your superior knowledge of doggie dignity and other moral matters

jim o doom

it's confusing to me that sorella is so annoyed by this whole thing. I simply can't understand it; but I know no actual logic is involved in the thought processes

I can say this with conviction due to the fact that any points any posters have made, are being ignored and responded to with "generalised" comments - these are the words/actions of a person who CANNOT think of a decent response to the points made and the generalisations are the last bastion of those for whom logic is impossible.

Skillie

if a 14 year old willingly has sex with person in their 20s and enjoys it; does it cease to be exploitation? Or would you still say its wrong?

I hope these dogs get homes but the handfull of modern art groupies that turn up in Louth is hardly gonna be massive. Whats questionable in this is the artists intentions and motives for all this not the dogs enjoyment or maybe not even the pounds judgement if they feel it can help as a side effect of this guys "art"

If raising awareness and finding these dogs homes was the overall prevailing target of this couldn't they come up with a better way of achieving it.

They could stand in the town centre with these dogs brandishing a banner say "these dogs will die if you don't take them home" etc or send flyers with the dogs pics into peoples homes in the area pleading for a home.

I don't doubt the dogs will be fine and happy i just don't agree with them being used as an art object for someones viewing and amusement especially the ego stroking of the artist.

we're all entitled to our opinions and freedom of speech though

Skillie

Busta Hyman wrote: »

HOW dare you. we have a dog that is adored my us all.

Unfortunately not enough of irish dogs are loved and taken care of as much as they deserve. I've seen too much of this first hand, its great that there are so many good dog owners out there but i do think they are outnumbered by the bad

Rory123

Skillie wrote: »

I hope these dogs get homes but the handfull of modern art groupies that turn up in Louth is hardly gonna be massive.

Skillie you should really check the facts. Drogheda is a very big town. I am quite local to there. I have lived there, my brother lives there, I worked with people from there, I have friends from there. There is not 1 person in Drogheda who does not know about this exhibition, the attendance has been huge. And I do believe at least one of the dogs has already been homed, and both have had hundreds of offers of homes

Skillie

Rory123 wrote: »

Skillie you should really check the facts. Drogheda is a very big town. I am quite local to there. I have lived there, my brother lives there, I worked with people from there, I have friends from there. There is not 1 person in Drogheda who does not know about this exhibition, the attendance has been huge. And I do believe at least one of the dogs has already been homed, and both have had hundreds of offers of homes

Great stuff i'm glad to hear that. I'm not a Drogheda basher just saying i wouldn't expect a big art community there which i think is reasonable.

Seems the artist got his/her wish then his exhibition got more exposure and attendance than ever would have been possible with old bits of furniture and fridges to evoke our wasteful nature. So the use of the dogs was a master stoke its up to people to decide for themselves if they think this is exploitation or not.

at least the dogs may come out of this with a result as well

dolly13

jim o doom wrote: »

Comparing someone cruelly starving an animal to death to an exhibition which does literally NO harm to an animal and in fact seems to bring the animals plight to the publics attention (regardless of what you seem to think the artists intention with the piece.. overreacting much???

An animals "right to dignitity"???? Is it dignified for a dog to roll and play in his own or an other animals crap, when he finds it? no. it isn't. But the dog CHOOSES to do it - because the dog has NO concept of dignity. Dogs love attention though.

What a totally pointless thread.

"What a totally pointless thread"

What a silly statement to make. The point of Justine Moe starting this thread is to highlight the important issue that Louth county council have allowed an artist to lock dogs that have ended up in the pound in a cage for the purpose of an art exhibition. You as a tax payer are paying for this to happen. It is an absolute disgrace and it is not a totally pointless thread. And while dogs do like attention, most of them coming out of the pound are very stressed as it is and they don't need to be put in a cage for "art" to stress them any further!

dolly13

sorella wrote: »

If you cannot see that then trying to tell you is fuitile. The harm, I mean

Which is why Irish dogs have such a bad life - in general, there being so many great owners here on boards.

Irish Dogs have such a bad life

What an unfair and untrue generalisation to make??

jim o doom

dolly13 wrote: »

"What a totally pointless thread"

What a silly statement to make. The point of Justine Moe starting this thread is to highlight the important issue that Louth county council have allowed an artist to lock dogs that have ended up in the pound in a cage for the purpose of an art exhibition. You as a tax payer are paying for this to happen. It is an absolute disgrace and it is not a totally pointless thread. And while dogs do like attention, most of them coming out of the pound are very stressed as it is and they don't need to be put in a cage for "art" to stress them any further!

eh - as you can see other posters who have viewed the exhibit state the dogs have plenty of space - not what you describe as a "cage" - and not only that but that the dogs seem happy.
In fact not only that - as you can see from one of the posts someone even put - I RETRACT MY SIGNATURE - and how the dogs are well cared for.

not only that - but regarding your point about me paying taxes for this exhibition; my taxes would already be paying for the animals keep, in the pound - correct? do you think they are adding extra on for an artist to move and display them in his own exhibition? of course NOT!

so - well I guess my taxes aren't affected & the animal is happy

In that case I reiterate; What a totally POINTLESS thread.

Skillie

jim o doom wrote: »

In that case I reiterate; What a totally POINTLESS thread.

why do you continue to post in this pointless thread? surely you have something better to do than waste you time being rude to people who are entitled to their own opinion.

Busta Hyman

but the problem is those ppl are refusing other people there opinion. as sad as i am to say it i feel the mods need to lock this thread

Skillie

Busta Hyman wrote: »

but the problem is those ppl are refusing other people there opinion. as sad as i am to say it i feel the mods need to lock this thread

I just find that wading in here straight off yesterday saying it was pointless etc instead of counter arguing it in a civilised manner ruined it from the getgo. Its no more pointless than any other thread on here where people wanna discuss something. i put this up to give people the oppertunity to sign a petition or not i didn't come looking for abuse due to the fact that i have an opinion on something. i'll admit i was wrong to call the person in question a clown and an idiot due to the fact that i'd felt badgered and like the individual was just looking for a wind up. Peoples attitudes to animals varies hugely and even as simple a question as "is it ok for my dog to sleep outside" escalated into lectures from all camps on how to keep your dog.

jim o doom

with regards to why I am posting; firstly in case this thread actually encourages someone to sign a patently WRONG petition -

I mean what are we crusading for here? the welfare of the reportedly HAPPY dog?
the fact that many people have seen it and that it has highlighted the plight of the animal?
Or ar we just annoyed IN PRINCIPAL about an animal being used for art - despite the fact that the art is clearling having a postive result in both the community and for the animals who are, as I said, reportedly enjoying themselves in a large enclosure - as opposed to a cell in a pound.

I'm just trying to ensure that anyone who reads through it can see how clearly insane signing a petition against something which (a) does no harm & (b) is in fact doing something positive - is completely counter productive & POINTLESS.

dolly13

jim o doom wrote: »

eh - as you can see other posters who have viewed the exhibit state the dogs have plenty of space - not what you describe as a "cage" - and not only that but that the dogs seem happy.
In fact not only that - as you can see from one of the posts someone even put - I RETRACT MY SIGNATURE - and how the dogs are well cared for.

not only that - but regarding your point about me paying taxes for this exhibition; my taxes would already be paying for the animals keep, in the pound - correct? do you think they are adding extra on for an artist to move and display them in his own exhibition? of course NOT!

so - well I guess my taxes aren't affected & the animal is happy

In that case I reiterate; What a totally POINTLESS thread.

Animal welfare organisations have reported that before and after exhibitions these dogs are kept in a cage. There have been a number of reports of particularly stressed animals Louth Co. Co received so many complaints about one dog in particular that they took the decision to remove the animal from the exhibition. I will try and find a link to websites backing this up for you.

You are right in stating that your taxes are used to pay for the running of the pound - they are not adding extra put you have missed my point comletely I do not think that it is appropriate that your taxes are being used to provide an artist with a living animal for use in an art exhibition. It should also be noted that the exhibitionist have not made it known if they have made any signficant contributions to the running of louth co co dog pound. I never said that your taxes were affected what I am saying is that I am not happy that tax payers money is being used in this way.

And if it is a pointless thread then surely it is odd that so many people have posted replies to it - however, you ae entitled to your opinion. Personally, I don't think it's pointless and it would appear many others don't either otherwise they would not have bothered replying to it.

Skillie

jim o doom wrote: »

with regards to why I am posting; firstly in case this thread actually encourages someone to sign a patently WRONG petition -

it is only wrong in your opinion so let those whose who want to form their own opinions and sign the petition if we like. Can you not have the good grace to accept people are entitled to an opinion

jim o doom

Skillie wrote: »

it is only wrong in your opinion so let those whose who want to form their own opinions and sign the petition if we like. Can you not have the good grace to accept people are entitled to an opinion

It's not so simple as a "matter of opinion" - several times I have raised points - about the dogs happiness, asking you precisely why you want to campaign against this art thing, and these are based within logic - not opion - but you more or less ignore the points I am making and then tell me to accept your opinion..

Which is all I can do seeing as you are patently either unable or unwilling to respond to any points I have made.

dolly13

jim o doom wrote: »

It's not so simple as a "matter of opinion" - several times I have raised points - about the dogs happiness, asking you precisely why you want to campaign against this art thing, and these are based within logic - not opion - but you more or less ignore the points I am making and then tell me to accept your opinion..

Which is all I can do seeing as you are patently either unable or unwilling to respond to any points I have made.

I think it is perfectly clear here that people are campaigning against the use of the dogs in an art exhibition.

I fail to see how you can't see what people are objecting too.

People are always going to have a difference of opinion you are being asked to accept that someone's opinion is different to yours not to accept that their opinion is right!

jim o doom

dolly13 wrote: »

Animal welfare organisations have reported that before and after exhibitions these dogs are kept in a cage. There have been a number of reports of particularly stressed animals Louth Co. Co received so many complaints about one dog in particular that they took the decision to remove the animal from the exhibition. I will try and find a link to websites backing this up for you.

You are right in stating that your taxes are used to pay for the running of the pound - they are not adding extra put you have missed my point comletely I do not think that it is appropriate that your taxes are being used to provide an artist with a living animal for use in an art exhibition. It should also be noted that the exhibitionist have not made it known if they have made any signficant contributions to the running of louth co co dog pound. I never said that your taxes were affected what I am saying is that I am not happy that tax payers money is being used in this way.

And if it is a pointless thread then surely it is odd that so many people have posted replies to it - however, you ae entitled to your opinion. Personally, I don't think it's pointless and it would appear many others don't either otherwise they would not have bothered replying to it.

Show me the back up - and I will agree that at least the facilities for the animals should be improved for when not being in the exhibition - but that does not mean the exhibition itself is wrong and should be closed.

As posters in Drogheda have stated; many people have visited this and it has a lot of publicity; good for the artist and guess what; good for dogs in pounds, who have more people knowing and hopefully caring and helping the situation with either donations or even better adoptions of said animals..

Not only that but people who have visited have posted the dogs seem happy and well looked after in the exhibition itself.

This is not just about opinion;simple logic can be applied to the situation.

jim o doom

dolly13 wrote: »

I think it is perfectly clear here that people are campaigning against the use of the dogs in an art exhibition.

I fail to see how you can't see what people are objecting too.

People are always going to have a difference of opinion you are being asked to accept that someone's opinion is different to yours not to accept that their opinion is right!

Of COURSE I understand that people are complaing the dogs are being used in an exhibition. What I do NOT understand is WHY.

Following simple logic; if the exhibition does no harm & in fact does good for the welfare of the animals and highlights their plight, why is it offensive?

dolly13

jim o doom wrote: »

Show me the back up - and I will agree that at least the facilities for the animals should be improved for when not being in the exhibition - but that does not mean the exhibition itself is wrong and should be closed.

As posters in Drogheda have stated; many people have visited this and it has a lot of publicity; good for the artist and guess what; good for dogs in pounds, who have more people knowing and hopefully caring and helping the situation with either donations or even better adoptions of said animals..

Not only that but people who have visited have posted the dogs seem happy and well looked after in the exhibition itself.

This is not just about opinion;simple logic can be applied to the situation.

Once again we are back to you not being able to accept others have a different opinion. In my opinion: I do not think that this exhibition is good in any way for dogs in the pound individuals who are looking to rescue dogs are aware of the existence of the dog pounds they do not need to see them in an art exhibition to persuade them. The pounds don't need advertising - people know they are there...

And again personally I think the exhibition is wrong and should be closed.. Sure maybe you could organise to set up an art exhibition for orphaned children??? Would you think that was wrong?

dolly13

jim o doom wrote: »

Of COURSE I understand that people are complaing the dogs are being used in an exhibition. What I do NOT understand is WHY.

Following simple logic; if the exhibition does no harm & in fact does good for the welfare of the animals and highlights their plight, why is it offensive?

Because: It does do them harm, reports have come back to say that animals are stressed. Granted a lot of them will be stressed in the pound anyway but moving their location will only serve to stress them more and this is all done for the enjoyment of others. I don't think it highlights their plight at all i think that it only serves to worsen it. As before I will post links to back this up.

jim o doom

dolly13 wrote: »

Because: It does do them harm, reports have come back to say that animals are stressed. Granted a lot of them will be stressed in the pound anyway but moving their location will only serve to stress them more and this is all done for the enjoyment of others. I don't think it highlights their plight at all i think that it only serves to worsen it. As before I will post links to back this up.

Finally an actualy logical point! and it isn't opinion! see if you can show me this actually does harm the animals; I will agree with you that they may not be being treated properly and it should be looked into.

This doesn't necessarily in my opinion mean the exhibit should be closed - but that how the animals are treated and looked after should detinitely be investigated.

You see - I am perfectly willing to engage, once I can see good reason and logic behind something; but opinion is something I wouldn't because we all have different ones, which I will engage once based in logic!

Busta Hyman

dolly13 wrote: »

Because: It does do them harm, reports have come back to say that animals are stressed. Granted a lot of them will be stressed in the pound anyway but moving their location will only serve to stress them more and this is all done for the enjoyment of others. I don't think it highlights their plight at all i think that it only serves to worsen it. As before I will post links to back this up.

if the animals are becomeing stressed they need to be removed immediatly. but this is only if it is actually the case and not a rant from a highly strung so called "animal protectionist"

Skillie

Jim using the word logic repeatedly doesn't really improve your statements. I have responded with what i have an issue with if you'd just read my posts. the goal and ambition of this is not to raise awareness of this problem it is solely for the artists benefit and to get his exhibit as much attention as possible. any positive spin off for the dogs is great but just a side effect. if they wanted to find homes for the dogs they could do it in a much better way. The issue is exploitation, the dogs don't have to be unhappy for it not to be exploitation. So again we're back to opinions, you don't think it is exploitation I do, so LOGICALLY we'll cease the schoolyard bickering and leave it there. I hope we never have to discuss Religion on the same thread

Our man in Havana

No discussion of reglion please. There are other forums you can use if you want to drag God into it.

~Thalia~

dolly13 wrote: »

Once again we are back to you not being able to accept others have a different opinion. In my opinion: I do not think that this exhibition is good in any way for dogs in the pound individuals who are looking to rescue dogs are aware of the existence of the dog pounds they do not need to see them in an art exhibition to persuade them. The pounds don't need advertising - people know they are there...

And again personally I think the exhibition is wrong and should be closed.. Sure maybe you could organise to set up an art exhibition for orphaned children??? Would you think that was wrong?

I totally disagree - I work in rescue and I have to say ANYTHING that highlights the plight of the 16K+ dogs pts annually in this country is a good thing. People, Irish people are unbelievably ignorant when it comes to animal issues and I guarantee you the VAST majority of people do NOT have an awareness of what goes in in pounds or in rescues.

From what I have looked into on this exhibitaion I have found out that both dogs already have new homes to go to once the exhibition is over, they will be keft in crates with food, water and toys and walked for an hour twice daily with a good home at the end of it all. Fair F*cks to them I say and if it brings to light the DISGRACEFUL way WE as Irish people treat dogs especially and makes people think twice then it can ONLY be a good thing.

In my opinion the likes af ARAN and all these hairy jumper wearing loudmouths just want something to campaign and shout about, most likely they have never been in a dog pound or sanctuary, never shovelled ****e at 6 am or fed litters of puppies 3 times a day.