The Sky Sports Generation

Savman

invincibleirish wrote: »

Helix v soccer fans. Just to make it fair is all im saying.

Fixed :eek:

CHD

+1 to the PL v LoI thread. Lets hav it in the test forum. Quiet there.

_blank_

Savman wrote: »

Y'see, I am both pot and kettle. A first for boards.

There's a joke here somewhere, I just can't put my finger on it :pac:

Savman

Des wrote: »

There's a joke here somewhere, I just can't put my finger on it :pac:

Always had you pegged.

_blank_

Savman wrote: »

Always had you pegged.

Yeah.

I only gave you a game just in case I was accused of picking on you

keane2097

Highsider wrote: »

Oh and one more thing,we all don't still live at home with our parents like you boggles.

Oooh sick burn :eek:

Headshot

_blank_

keane2097 wrote: »

Oooh sick burn :eek:

At the age Boggles is, I doubt if he lives with his parents.

Boggles

keane2097 wrote: »

Oooh sick burn :eek:

I've no idea what he is talking about, I don't live with his parents. :eek:

Boggles

Des wrote: »

At the age Boggles is, I doubt if he lives with his parents.

Was there need to bring that up.

Anyone remember Screensport? :pac:

Guy:Incognito

Des wrote: »

Yeah.

I only gave you a game just in case I was accused of picking on you

A-Ha. I ****ing knew it.:)

themont85

Dub13 wrote: »

Here is one of the worst examples of this,a mate took this pic back at the Liverpool Wigan in August.If this is you then all I have to say is you are a tool.

Thats me.

Personal abuse.

Reported.

LuckyLloyd

therecklessone wrote: »

You keep holding up tradition as a stick to beat others with on this forum, but what traditions would you like us to observe?

It used to be the case that footballers were amateurs and professionalism was a dirty word.

The game that was invented by the English, and whose rules at that stage were largely written by the four British FAs, featured no British side in it's premier competition until 1950, due to their withdrawal from FIFA in 1920, partly as a protest at the "general feeling that there was now too much foreign influence in what was surely a British game" Source

You rail against the idea of a European Superleague, yet the European Cup is in existence for less than half the time that football has been played as a codified sport. On a similar note to the point above, the inaugural tournament featured no English side.

It used to be the case that no foreigners could play in the Italian league.

Football evolves, you can piss and moan all you want that but is as much a certainty as the pope wearing a funny hat. Why do you get to decide what we keep as sacrosanct?

The blokes I usually travel to Spurs games with are mostly older than me, a lot went in the 70s and 80s when being a football fan meant fighting your way into and out of a football stadium, when you travelled on WW2-era British Rail rolling stock football specials and were met by police dogs and riot truncheons on arrival at your destination. In those days, violence and racism were rife, and if you didn't like it tough.

Most of those guys hate what football is now...you know what? The generation that came before them hated what my mates saw as the norm as well. Bill Nicholson walked away from Spurs after witnessing the carnage on the terraces in the 74 Uefa Cup final. For his generation that sort of behaviour was anathema.

Did you know that until quite recently, football fans in the UK capital would routinely go and see their rivals play at home if their own side was away and they couldn't afford to travel? Spurs one week, Arsenal the next. I know plenty that did it. West Ham and Spurs did the same up until the late 80s, when the ICF wrought havoc on the Park Lane and Shelfside terraces. Now the two sets of fans cannot abide each other.

Things don't always stay the way they were, you can try set yourself up as the boards.ie authentic football fantm all you want, but your experience is just one of many.

Bravo

OPENROAD

Dub13 wrote: »

.

I would like to add Irish lads who go to premiership games in GAA tops or with Celtic/Liverpool/Man Utd scarfs,or the ones who bring a tricolor.Why,just why..?

+1

Jazzy

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Bravo

+1

Dub13

This is a great article and illustrates the way football is going at certain clubs,I was going o start a new thread on it but I think its fits this one just fine.

From This is Anfield written by Paul Jones on April 29th, 2009


How long then before we have Craig Charles and Sinbad on the pitch before the game, waving a flag and bellowing out “Poor Scouser Tommy”, encouraging us all to join in as we wave plastic flags that were left on our seats by the club?

Or maybe we could witness Larry the Liverbird running along the Kemlyn Road as our whacky DJ screams, “Centenary Stand, make soooome noooise”; before Larry then races down to the far end and past the camera flashes of the Road End. “Anfield Road End, make soooome nooooissse”. The Main Stand come next before Larry slides onto his knees in front of The Kop as the DJ almost reaches a state of ejaculation as he screams for The Kop to “make some noooisssseeeee for the booooysss”.

(I shudder)

A little far fetched? Not if you’d been to Hull on Saturday and witnessed first hand the pre-game antics at the KC Stadium; then watched Newcastle v Portsmouth last night as “Top Chanter” sauntered around the pitch making a noise only Geordie’s could understand. The sight of a tiger mascot at Hull, whipping up a crowd of grown men in face paint and tiger hats will live with me forever.

The sight of that fat Geordie on the pitch last night, swaggering around to a backdrop of plastic flags will never leave me either. The name on the back of his shirt was just the icing on the cake. Who thought it’d be a good idea to do that before one of Newcastle’s biggest games in years? Surely the nation’s most passionate and noisy fans don’t need any encouragement, do they?

Has football really sunk this low?

This new found craze of manufactured support is growing by the day. Telling fans what to do and when to do it, and even handing them out the tools to do so. From the flags they hand out at Chelsea to the happy clapper things at Fulham, Birmingham and Blackburn. The music played after goals at the likes of Middlesbrough, Bolton and Wigan. Wimbledon even used to pipe music over the PA when they got a corner before they vacated Selhurst Park. How did football crowds used to cope in the 100 years before this craze began? Anyone would think the grounds were silent morgues and nobody thought to bring their own scarves, flags or banners.

Up and down the country, groups of fans do the same dance to “Chelsea Dagger” every time they score. They then break into renditions of “who are ya” or “easy easy” aimed towards the opposition before breaking into The Great Escape, adding in “Rovers” or “City” at the end. It’s like some sort of routine they have to follow from the idiot guide for “identikit fans in identikit stadiums” on how to support their team.

Thankfully, a handful of “traditional” clubs with large fan bases still maintain a core of their longstanding support that won’t allow this to happen at their homes. The likes of ourselves, Everton, Leeds, West Ham, Tottenham, Man City and a few others. I’d have added Man United into that pot, but I can’t after witnessing that clown on the pitch before the 4-1 win there, when he was singing “United Road” trying to get the crowd to join in. It was almost as embarrassing to watch as the episodes at Hull and Newcastle. Almost.

Some fans of those so called “identikit clubs” may see this as an arrogant and elitist view. I hope they do, as it indicates that our support does still retain a unique feel and highlights originality; that the club and our support still has some sort of identification and a culture of its own. Long may it continue. They day we resort to manufacturing an atmosphere like that is the day I give up going. Just leave us to it.

But what is the reason for this growth in manufactured support?

Is it a realisation that the atmosphere just isn’t what it used to be? A realisation that the fans filling the grounds every week are no longer capable of supporting the side as they used to, and need to be given a helping hand in doing so? They turn up to be entertained and this free flag or scarf, as well as ear damaging loud music for them to dance along to is the way to do it. Isn’t that all a little bit “ice hockey”?

As the commentary on ITV stated at the recent Chelsea v Liverpool tie, when zooming in on the travelling Liverpool support: “They hand out free flags to wave to the fans down here, but these lads don’t need them, they bring their own”; or words to that affect. Even the nations media realise the way things have gone and how it affects some clubs more than others. I’m sure the long standing Chelsea fans cringe at the way things have gone at Stamford Bridge these days, but when they are diluted by this new brigade, they’re fighting a losing battle.

The men in charge of these clubs will try anything to entertain their customers. We used to be called supporters I think. But when you’re paying £50 a ticket, you want to be entertained don’t you? Or so they think. We’re incapable of creating an atmosphere of our own and creating our own enjoyment; we’re now relying our clubs to do it for us.

Or is it more a case of them wanting to control everything we do? Music blasted out before the games to prevent the build up of a hostile atmosphere; instead having everyone singing along to the club’s choice of “happy” music. Playing music after goals to stop fans mocking and taunting the opposition, instead dancing along to Chelsea Dagger and being all joyful instead of angry. Anyone would think a riot might break out without this soothing music to keep us under control.

Don’t stand, don’t sing, don’t swear, don’t smoke, don’t fart, don’t breathe, don’t jump, don’t shout, don’t do anything unless we tell you to. Welcome to the wonderful world of modern football.

How much longer can this sanitisation of the game go on before the last remaining die hards walk away for ever? It may bring a smile to my face and make me laugh with embarrassment at some of the goings on, but in the greater scheme of things, it’s completely killing fandom and all it stands for.

_blank_

Stop trolling your own forum Dub13 :rolleyes:

If I, or any other LoI supporter, posted something like that we'd be pilloried form pillar to post by imbeciles on this forum.

Fooking cracking article.

Absolutely cracking.

Dub13

LOL,Des I knew you would like this one.

I think this is getting to be a huge problem for all football fans the world over,we need to try and stop the commercialization of our game.

keane2097

I think it's a load of cock to be honest.

The fella's main bone of contention (besides the infantile hatred of people getting flags from the club instead of bringing there own - wtf ) is that things in soccer stadia aren't the way they used to be.

Therecklessone's earlier post highlighted just how great a thing that is.

Draupnir

Dub13 wrote: »

we need to try and stop the commercialization of our game.

Eh....why?

If football was still as it was in the 70's or 80's pre Premier League then there is a very good chance it would be gone the way of cricket and we'd be watching the Football League trying to make 5-a-side the new format to revive it.

Unless you hadn't noticed, the WORLD is changing a lot. Society is so radically different to what it was before 1994 right now it is not even true, you only have to look at the video the BBC had of Giggs in 94 to highlight it.

Football as it once was just would not appeal to as many people as the football product that is being served now does and the sport would be in decline. This has happened MANY times before in the history of this sport and will continue to happen.

Things change, you are going to have to build a bridge, there is too much money to be made from football as a business for any "fan" to be able to stop the changes.

Look at it this way, in fifty years there will be sensors in the ball, sensors in the goals, sensors in the players jerseys, robotic linesmen etc. and there will be people watching highlights on their phones in real time at matches within the next 5 years. Be happy that at least now it's still slightly authentic, refs make real mistakes, managers really are on the touch line, replays are for the lads in the pub and at some stadiums you still get wet when it rains.

thegen

I have to agree with the term the premiership supporter, but have we forgotten the other bain of my life, the playstation supporter, the ones who never kicked a ball in their life and are suddenly experts on the game because their parent's bought them some game for their playstation

Dub13

keane2097 wrote: »

The fella's main bone of contention (besides the infantile hatred of people getting flags from the club instead of bringing there own - wtf ) is that things in soccer stadia aren't the way they used to be.

First off this is not just a Liverpool fans issue nor just a EPL issue and fan who goes to a lot of games will understand were Paul Jones is coming from,football is changing in front of our eyes on a weekly bases and it hurts.


Are you telling me you read that and the only point you see is 'people getting flags from the club instead of bringing there own'.Did you not read the bit about music playing,tools on the pitch before games,the who are ya” or “easy easy” chants,Don’t stand, don’t sing, don’t swear, don’t smoke, don’t fart, don’t breathe, don’t jump, don’t shout, don’t do anything.Did you miss these points..?

_blank_

thegen wrote: »

I have to agree with the term the premiership supporter, but have we forgotten the other bain of my life, the playstation supporter, the ones who never kicked a ball in their life and are suddenly experts on the game because their parent's bought them some game for their playstation

or my personal peeve, people who bang on about players who are "good in championship manager". Jesus wept.

invincibleirish

Hang if we're talking about crass commercialisation then weren't Liverpool the first team in the UK to have a McDonalds at their ground? and were they not the first to embrace shirt sponsorship?

As for flags & happy clappers, there is nothing wrong with them if their use is limited. Villa put flags out for the CSKA game & Spurs for their 125th anniversary. But the best way to stimulate an atmosphere is to fill the ground, which is why Blackburns offer of their last 3 home games for £20 is the way forward.

And i've heard 'who are ya' sung at opposition more times at Turners X then i have at Villa park so lose the moral high ground LoI militants.

angel01

Des wrote: »

or my personal peeve, people who bang on about players who are "good in championship manager". Jesus wept.

haha, don't you mean football manager these days..

Dub13

Draupnir wrote: »

Eh....why?

If football was still as it was in the 70's or 80's pre Premier League then there is a very good chance it would be gone the way of cricket and we'd be watching the Football League trying to make 5-a-side the new format to revive it.

Unless you hadn't noticed, the WORLD is changing a lot. Society is so radically different to what it was before 1994 right now it is not even true, you only have to look at the video the BBC had of Giggs in 94 to highlight it.

Football as it once was just would not appeal to as many people as the football product that is being served now does and the sport would be in decline. This has happened MANY times before in the history of this sport and will continue to happen.

Things change, you are going to have to build a bridge, there is too much money to be made from football as a business for any "fan" to be able to stop the changes.

Look at it this way, in fifty years there will be sensors in the ball, sensors in the goals, sensors in the players jerseys, robotic linesmen etc. and there will be people watching highlights on their phones in real time at matches within the next 5 years. Be happy that at least now it's still slightly authentic, refs make real mistakes, managers really are on the touch line, replays are for the lads in the pub and at some stadiums you still get wet when it rains.

I agree we cant stop the commercialization of our game its gone way to far for that,I probably should have said we need to try and stop the commercialization of our grounds.Let the corporate Dept's of clubs pull in all the cash they want from Asian TV deals and the likes but leave the match day going fan alone,stay away from the grounds.

Jazzy

what about those who had no choice but to watch sky sports? wat people here often forget is - kids are fickle

Draupnir

I can see where you are coming from, but it just is not going to happen. You have two options, live with it or give up on it.

Dub13

Jazzy wrote: »

what about those who had no choice but to watch sky sports? wat people here often forget is - kids are fickle

You can watch Sky Sports and not turn into a SS Generation fan,its just a term used to describe the 'modern fan'.I have met many young lads who are well clued in on issue's like this,its about respecting were your club comes from.

Gavin "shels"

invincibleirish wrote: »

As for flags & happy clappers, there is nothing wrong with them if their use is limited. Villa put flags out for the CSKA game & Spurs for their 125th anniversary. But the best way to stimulate an atmosphere is to fill the ground, which is why Blackburns offer of their last 3 home games for £20 is the way forward.

It's cringeworthy, club assisted displays which is one reason I respect Liverpool with their fan made tifos, etc... Clubs are trying to bring colour and atmosphere to dull stadia in England but really they can't, it takes the passion from the supporters.

Gavin "shels"

Jazzy wrote: »

what about those who had no choice but to watch sky sports? wat people here often forget is - kids are fickle

Kids are... but what about the thousands of grown men who love their pixelated football every weekend and on special ocassions they have their Champions League/UEFA Cup matches on during the week?

keane2097

Dub13 wrote: »

First off this is not just a Liverpool fans issue nor just a EPL issue and fan who goes to a lot of games will understand were Paul Jones is coming from,football is changing in front of our eyes on a weekly bases and it hurts.


Are you telling me you read that and the only point you see is 'people getting flags from the club instead of bringing there own'.Did you not read the bit about music playing,tools on the pitch before games,the who are ya” or “easy easy” chants,Don’t stand, don’t sing, don’t swear, don’t smoke, don’t fart, don’t breathe, don’t jump, don’t shout, don’t do anything.Did you miss these points..?

I reread the article to be sure I didn't miss anything just now fwiw.

My point about the flags was a bit flippant I admit - allow me to expand upon it.

Essentially what seems to peeve the author of the article isn't flags or mascots or, dare I say it, even that travesty to music that is Chelsea Dagger.

What's giving him the hump is simple - it's people having a laugh at games.

The things he has chosen to complain about are all along the same lines.

- people waving flags around or using those clapper things and having a bit of fun

- people laughing at an eejit in a bird costume

- people singing along to a bloody stupid catchy pop song to celebrate a goal

All these things are simple, harmless fun. They put a smile on people's faces, they make them enjoy their day a bit more.

It seems glaringly obvious that this man, who absolutely stinks of conceit by the way, only wants dour, angry, testosterone-drunk men like himself beside him in the stands harping on about how it's all a matter or life-or-death whether we get a 0-0 draw or a 5-0 win.

Anyone there to simply enjoy themselves watching what is, after all, a fúcking game is an accomplice in destroying the game? I'm sorry but it's just nonsense.

The gall of some plastic fans to actually laugh at a man dressed up in a bird suit like - they must be braindead :rolleyes:

The conceit of these so-called real fans is embarrassing as it is aggravating.

Jazzy

Dub13 wrote: »

You can watch Sky Sports and not turn into a SS Generation fan,its just a term used to describe the 'modern fan'.I have met many young lads who are well clued in on issue's like this,its about respecting were your club comes from.

aye thats true. about those fans you describe though - as a man said once about an elephant "elephants are like people mr simpson, and some of them are just jerks"

and when was the last time you were in a "dull stadium in England" gavin "shels" ? or were you watching through your tellybox and decided to make a presumption that would make you feel better?

and what of those thousands of grown men who watch football on the telly? unless you are calling them sad for doing so, in which case i would look above at my quote about elephants

Gavin "shels"

Jazzy wrote: »

and when was the last time you were in a "dull stadium in England" gavin "shels" ? or were you watching through your tellybox and decided to make a presumption that would make you feel better?

and what of those thousands of grown men who watch football on the telly? unless you are calling them sad for doing so, in which case i would look above at my quote about elephants

Never been at a football match in England, BUT from a Liverpool fan I talk to whos in one of Liverpools Supporters Group (The Spirit Of Shankly or Sion Ultras can't remember which) he tells me how poxy the atmosphere is in most EPL stadiums, with the odd exception.

I was picking you up on the point that you said "kids are fickle", so are the majority of Irish "supporters".

BTW what the feck does this mean "what about those who had no choice but to watch sky sports?"???

invincibleirish

Gavin shels wrote: »

It's cringeworthy, club assisted displays which is one reason I respect Liverpool with their fan made tifos, etc... Clubs are trying to bring colour and atmosphere to dull stadia in England but really they can't, it takes the passion from the supporters.

Lol such bitter nonsense, here's a club orchestrated campaign that had the support of the fans. Note the fans voted online to pick a flag, and it gets an airing before a big game and no one seems to mind.

Dave!

invincibleirish wrote: »

Lol such bitter nonsense, here's a club orchestrated campaign that had the support of the fans. Note the fans voted online to pick a flag, and it gets an airing before a big game and no one seems to mind.

The INTERNET??? :eek: Sure that's ruining football!

Gavin "shels"

invincibleirish wrote: »

Lol such bitter nonsense, here's a club orchestrated campaign that had the support of the fans. Note the fans voted online to pick a flag, and it gets an airing before a big game and no one seems to mind.

I've just the view that club orchestrated displays are disgraceful, look at Chelsea for example. The thing that gets me is that nearly every football club in any divison in the world their own supporters can organise displays without the funding,etc... from clubs except in the EPL where they have one of the biggest sest of crowds, obviously there are exceptions e.g. some Man U displays, Liverpool, Middlesborough, Newcastle, think thats about it.

Jazzy

Gavin shels wrote: »

Never been at a football match in England, BUT from a Liverpool fan I talk to whos in one of Liverpools Supporters Group (The Spirit Of Shankly or Sion Ultras can't remember which) he tells me how poxy the atmosphere is in most EPL stadiums, with the odd exception.

I was picking you up on the point that you said "kids are fickle", so are the majority of Irish "supporters".

BTW what the feck does this mean "what about those who had no choice but to watch sky sports?"???

oh right, so its a presumption based from a mate who says so. comprehensive

as in - if they wanted to watch PL football, there would be either MOTD highlights or sky sports.. not much choice there.

but then u are going to harp on about going down to tolka or watching live games... but lets put it this way - in my school ppl barely knew of the existence of shels, rovers etc. by the time they were in 2nd/3rd class. is that the fault of sky or the FAI ? closing the gate when the horse has bolted.
and even if they did, it still wasnt attractive enough to lure the kids in at that age.. which is why there is so many problems in the LoI right now.

its easy to hate sky. its easy to hold them up as the figurehead for all that is "wrong" with football. its convenient and convenience is the worst reason for hate

keane2097

Gavin shels wrote: »

I've just the view that club orchestrated displays are disgraceful, look at Chelsea for example.

What are you on about? How is it disgraceful for a club to encourage it's supporters?

I mean really this is just mind-boggling...

_blank_

keane2097 wrote: »

What are you on about? How is it disgraceful for a club to encourage it's supporters?

I mean really this is just mind-boggling...

the fact that "supporters" need to be told how to support their team is what's mind-boggling.

invincibleirish

Do you mean something like this Gavin Shels?






What you're suggesting is the importation of the tifosi culture that some Irish clubs have done so well, in England a lot of teams have always stuck to the traditional methods. Nothing wrong with with having your scarf out. I just don't see the correlation between being a hardcore fan and spending hours/days working on banners and the like, yeah it can be impressive and fan groups can do a lot of work for a club just look at Villa.

Jazzy

keane2097 wrote: »

I mean really this is just mind-boggling...

no its not. all the answers are right there in his post.
he wants to feel and prove that he is better then other people here. that our meagre efforts of fandom are nothing compared to his cocky gait as he walks through the turnstile. he wants to remind us of his obvious superiority and how much of a better person he is compared to "plastics".

thats right, better and smugger and all round greater human being.... at football supporting.

think im wrong? look at the sig. he advertises these facts in every post he makes. as such his opinion is biased, flawed and full of personal objectives. and what weight do we put on such opinions?

Gavin "shels"

Jazzy wrote: »

oh right, so its a presumption based from a mate who says so. comprehensive

as in - if they wanted to watch PL football, there would be either MOTD highlights or sky sports.. not much choice there.

but then u are going to harp on about going down to tolka or watching live games... but lets put it this way - in my school ppl barely knew of the existence of shels, rovers etc. by the time they were in 2nd/3rd class. is that the fault of sky or the FAI ? closing the gate when the horse has bolted.
and even if they did, it still wasnt attractive enough to lure the kids in at that age.. which is why there is so many problems in the LoI right now.

its easy to hate sky. its easy to hold them up as the figurehead for all that is "wrong" with football. its convenient and convenience is the worst reason for hate

Well a mate who puts time and alot of effort and money into producing the displays on the Kop, who attends most, if not all Liverpool matches home and away, so ye very comprehensive.

It's the fault of the FAI for not helping clubs more to branch out to more people, in schools, etc... combined with the fickleness of the majority of Irish football "fans".

You and many Irish and foreigners who can't make matches in England may think Sky is the motherlord of TV on a Saturday and Sunday, but try telling that to the fans who had been supporting the EPL pre-Sky who now can't afford to go to home matches, or get get tickets to matches. I couldn't give a flying f*ck about Sky but I know that if the same happened over here and i couldn't afford to go to Shels matches, or couldn't get tickets to matches etc... I'd be p*ssed off at Sky and the prawn sanadwich brigaders who pop over the odd weekend to a match.

keane2097

Des wrote: »

the fact that "supporters" need to be told how to support their team is what's mind-boggling.

But that's not what it is - it's just the club getting involved in the support. People are acting like it's something dirty for the club to acknowledge that there are fans in the ground on match day.

This argument only holds any water if you think the fans would just sit there and say nothing without the MC and the mascot there to rile them up, which just isn't the case.

The only thing this does is take the old aggressive, confrontational atmosphere and turn it into a fun, party atmosphere that people can take their kids to enjoy, safe in the knowledge that it's at least possible to avoid getting your head kicked in.

Gavin "shels"

keane2097 wrote: »

What are you on about? How is it disgraceful for a club to encourage it's supporters?

I mean really this is just mind-boggling...

Des somes up exactly what I was about to say above.

keane2097

I've responded...

Draupnir

We won't be able to watch the Olympics without going to Morton Stadium each week next.

Gavin "shels"

invincibleirish wrote: »

Do you mean something like this Gavin Shels?






What you're suggesting is the importation of the tifosi culture that some Irish clubs have done so well, in England a lot of teams have always stuck to the traditional methods. Nothing wrong with with having your scarf out. I just don't see the correlation between being a hardcore fan and spending hours/days working on banners and the like, yeah it can be impressive and fan groups can do a lot of work for a club just look at Villa.

See I don't think its traditional methods personnally, I just think it's the lack of passion, etc... look at any other leagues in the world and you'll see some sort of "tifosi culture", sure even look down the divisons in England at Aldershot, Accrington Stanley York City along with a few others.

Gavin "shels"

Draupnir wrote: »

We won't be able to watch the Olympics without going to Morton Stadium each week next.

Football and the javelin throw are two completely different matters tbh, so a useless comparsion.

invincibleirish

Gavin shels wrote: »

You and many Irish and foreigners who can't make matches in England may think Sky is the motherlord of TV on a Saturday and Sunday, but try telling that to the fans who had been supporting the EPL pre-Sky who now can't afford to go to home matches, or get get tickets to matches. I couldn't give a flying f*ck about Sky but I know that if the same happened over here and i couldn't afford to go to Shels matches, or couldn't get tickets to matches etc... I'd be p*ssed off at Sky and the prawn sanadwich brigaders who pop over the odd weekend to a match.

I think the hypocrisy of the LoI militant mindset is best at show here. On the one hand you complain bitterly about 'barstoolers', 'plastics' etc. and how because they follow teams in the UK the LoI is in trouble without their support. But clearly if these people start attending LoI games and SKY got involved you'd complain just as hard about the prawn sandwich brigade and people willing to pay top dollar for tickets pricing you out etc.