The Sky Sports Generation

Draupnir

Gavin shels wrote: »

Football and the javelin throw are two completely different matters tbh, so a useless comparsion.

Why are they different? They are both sports. What about the 4x100m relay, thats a team sport that I enjoy at the Olympics, the lads in Santry are brutal at it mind you, why would I want to watch them falling over themselves in the rain of a Friday night?

Xavi6

invincibleirish wrote: »

I think the hypocrisy of the LoI militant mindset is best at show here. On the one hand you complain bitterly about 'barstoolers', 'plastics' etc. and how because they follow teams in the UK the LoI is in trouble without their support. But clearly if these people start attending LoI games and SKY got involved you'd complain just as hard about the prawn sandwich brigade and people willing to pay top dollar for tickets pricing you out etc.

As much of an LOI supporter as I am, the above is spot on.

invincibleirish

Gavin shels wrote: »

See I don't think its traditional methods personnally, I just think it's the lack of passion, etc... look at any other leagues in the world and you'll see some sort of "tifosi culture", sure even look down the divisons in England at Aldershot, Accrington Stanley York City along with a few others.

Those teams are still in the minority. My relations are ST holders/regular match goers to teams in the Championship & League 1, scarves & occasional flags are the order of the day. Anything else is club organised.

Jazzy

Gavin shels wrote: »

Well a mate who puts time and alot of effort and money into producing the displays on the Kop, who attends most, if not all Liverpool matches home and away, so ye very comprehensive.

you dont get it. its just one guy and his opinion on the matter. thats not worth d1ck in a debate and you cant use it as point of fact. you can try, but it does set the tone of what you are trying to say for the rest of your points. as in - stuff you want to believe more then is actually fact and an over-the-top 'hope it carries weight' emotional plight of the poor stricken fans. But wont someone please think of the children?!
if ticket prices are too high - then surely the club selling those tickets has something to do with that rather then some "poxy" tv channel.
convenience can get ya thinking that way though...
clubs are business's now. you might not like it, but its true. even shelbourne... but unfortunately they were terrible at business practice

5starpool

keane2097 wrote: »

I reread the article to be sure I didn't miss anything just now fwiw.

My point about the flags was a bit flippant I admit - allow me to expand upon it.

Essentially what seems to peeve the author of the article isn't flags or mascots or, dare I say it, even that travesty to music that is Chelsea Dagger.

What's giving him the hump is simple - it's people having a laugh at games.

The things he has chosen to complain about are all along the same lines.

- people waving flags around or using those clapper things and having a bit of fun

- people laughing at an eejit in a bird costume

- people singing along to a bloody stupid catchy pop song to celebrate a goal

All these things are simple, harmless fun. They put a smile on people's faces, they make them enjoy their day a bit more.

It seems glaringly obvious that this man, who absolutely stinks of conceit by the way, only wants dour, angry, testosterone-drunk men like himself beside him in the stands harping on about how it's all a matter or life-or-death whether we get a 0-0 draw or a 5-0 win.

Anyone there to simply enjoy themselves watching what is, after all, a fúcking game is an accomplice in destroying the game? I'm sorry but it's just nonsense.

The gall of some plastic fans to actually laugh at a man dressed up in a bird suit like - they must be braindead :rolleyes:

The conceit of these so-called real fans is embarrassing as it is aggravating.

I would say that the people who are annoyed by the cringe worthy stuff they do at some matches outnumber the amount of people who enjoy and participate. Why annoy half the people to do something that might be liked (but not needed) by the other half?

Gavin "shels"

invincibleirish wrote: »

I think the hypocrisy of the LoI militant mindset is best at show here. On the one hand you complain bitterly about 'barstoolers', 'plastics' etc. and how because they follow teams in the UK the LoI is in trouble without their support. But clearly if these people start attending LoI games and SKY got involved you'd complain just as hard about the prawn sandwich brigade and people willing to pay top dollar for tickets pricing you out etc.

You got me there to be fair, but it's never going to happen in reality.:pac:

Draupnir wrote: »

Why are they different? They are both sports. What about the 4x100m relay, thats a team sport that I enjoy at the Olympics, the lads in Santry are brutal at it mind you, why would I want to watch them falling over themselves in the rain of a Friday night?

Do you feel the same passion to the club you support as you do to Billy Murphy thowing the javelin for Ireland in the Olympics?

Gavin "shels"

Xavi6 wrote: »

As much of an LOI supporter as I am, the above is spot on.

You're a barstooler though!;)

invincibleirish wrote: »

Those teams are still in the minority. My relations are ST holders/regular match goers to teams in the Championship & League 1, scarves & occasional flags are the order of the day. Anything else is club organised.

Thing I'm trying to say, if the fans like the club organised stuff so much and get involved with it, why not just do it off their own backs, set up a group, etc... like what happens at Liverpool?

keane2097

5starpool wrote: »

I would say that the people who are annoyed by the cringe worthy stuff they do at some matches outnumber the amount of people who enjoy and participate. Why annoy half the people to do something that might be liked (but not needed) by the other half?

Well that's a whole different argument in a way I guess.

I know what you're saying certainly, if most of the fans hate the stuff and want rid of it then yeah by all means turf it.

I'd argue that only people who really get any way irritated about that kind of stuff though are the people like the article writer who will, even if a stop is put to the stuff he complains about, simply find some other reason to complain and elevate himself above the level of the ordinary fan.

He just has a superiority complex and he's going to find some way to manifest it whatever you do.

Draupnir

Gavin shels wrote: »

Do you feel the same passion to the club you support as you do to Billy Murphy thowing the javelin for Ireland in the Olympics?

I'd actually say I feel more passion for someone representing Ireland than for anything else in any sport. But then again, I'm one of those weird Irish football fans who goes to Ireland matches.

I just have this insane ability to enjoy many different things without getting to worried if nobody else likes them as much as I do. You should try it out.

keane2097

Gavin shels wrote: »

Thing I'm trying to say, if the fans like the club organised stuff so much and get involved with it, why not just do it off their own backs, set up a group, etc... like what happens at Liverpool?

What difference does it make who organises it?

I guarantee you if the fans organised the same stuff you'd have the exact same complaints from conceited fans simply looking to point out how superior their fandom is to everybody else's.

Draupnir

Gavin shels wrote: »

Thing I'm trying to say, if the fans like the club organised stuff so much and get involved with it, why not just do it off their own backs, set up a group, etc... like what happens at Liverpool?

I think what you are missing is that you class a fan only as someone capable of setting up a group or doing it off their own back.

At any EPL game you could have:

1. Hardcore fan such as yourself.
2. Football fan who has an interest in one club only but isn't too hardcore such as myself.
3. Tourist who was in town when the match was on and fancied seeing what the fuss was.
4. Travelling fan from China.
5. Disabled fan.
6. Parent fan with 2 kids of his own plus 2 of their mates (2 is an example figure.)
7. Wife of Parent fan who doesn't want to be there.
8. Granny and Grandad fan along for the ride.
9. Corporate fan who is there to network.
10. Relative of player who got in free and follows a different club.

Football is changing, the make up of the crowd is changing.

invincibleirish

Gavin shels wrote: »

You're a barstooler though!;)



Thing I'm trying to say, if the fans like the club organised stuff so much and get involved with it, why not just do it off their own backs, set up a group, etc... like what happens at Liverpool?

Well i think there are plenty of examples in English football where fans have set up trusts and the like for more serious matters, generally concerning ownership/direction of the club and that includes Pool. But i don't see it as a requirement to establish a fans group for huge colourful displays, at least not until the moment times requires them, noise & support is the main thing. There are often home made banners on the Holte End for example but you won't see them on TV.

_blank_

Draupnir wrote: »

the make up of the crowd is changing.

If people start wearing make up at football then I'm afraid it's already gone too far.

Gavin "shels"

invincibleirish wrote: »

Well i think there are plenty of examples in English football where fans have set up trusts and the like for more serious matters, generally concerning ownership/direction of the club and that includes Pool. But i don't see it as a requirement to establish a fans group for huge colourful displays, at least not until the moment times requires them, noise & support is the main thing. There are often home made banners on the Holte End for example but you won't see them on TV.

Ofcourse, sure I know from over here nearly every club has some sort of Trust which just supplies money to the clubs, but saying that look at Shamrock Rovers, the fans own the club and had a strong (back on the up mind you) Ultras group, it's possible to do both. I just think it would be get to see fans outside of Liverpool organsing colourful displays, and adding atmosphere to stadia in England, if it can be done in the Lower Leagues of England, Scotland, Ireland, Northern Ireland, etc... why not the EPL.

Draupnir

Des wrote: »

If people start wearing make up at football then I'm afraid it's already gone too far.

It's a matter of time really, half the players already do.

Gavin "shels"

keane2097 wrote: »

What difference does it make who organises it?

Des wrote: »

the fact that "supporters" need to be told how to support their team is what's mind-boggling.

keane2097 wrote: »

I guarantee you if the fans organised the same stuff you'd have the exact same complaints from conceited fans simply looking to point out how superior their fandom is to everybody else's.

That's the point, then the displays will start getting better and better. Look at Chelsea for example, every big European match, etc... this club organised displays occur which are compiled of small flags for fans and then 2/3 tifo flags on the pitch.

sneakyST

Boggles wrote: »

Part of the premiership remit was to make stadiums more friendly, I'd take all the bananas and wigs in the world before I would go back to crowd trouble and dozens been stamped to death, I think most would.

Not too sure on this one Boggles - when I was 11 or 12 I remember standing on a creaky wooden bench at the back in White Hart Lane trying to see Liverpool beat spurs (Aldo and Beardsley scored). I could hardly see a thing but every now and again one of the Liverpool fans would pick me up so I could see. The atmosphere was magic and it was the same for all the matches I went to back then. Fast forward 19 or so years and I brought my nephew to Anfield for his first game against Man City. It was like sitting in Mass. I know which I prefer and those days will never be back.

Highsider wrote: »

They're embarassing. Was going to a game on the ferry to Anfield there about a year ago and two "fans" of Liverpool reading the s*n newspaper and not a bother in the world. I had a word with them and was told to mind my own business.."the past is the past" etc...Not a violent person but felt like smashing my fist into their faces.:mad: Typical of fans of the club who have jumped aboard in the last 10 years or so.

Spot on

therecklessone wrote: »

The game that was invented by the English,

errrm Dont let the Scottish hear you say that;)

Anyway, I thought this thread was going to be about all the rubbish pundits that are on Sky Sports that are afraid to give their true honest opinion as they will upset someone or the fact that Andy Gray is misinforming people about the rules with his tripe.

I skimmed though this thread so I'm not sure how Bananaman fits into all this....but I think he's not a bad lad.

Super-Rush

Dub13 wrote: »

We were talking about this in another thread maybe it could do with its own dedacated one.

They do my head in.

According to them football only started in 1992 when sky won the contract.They are the same lads who shoot 'who are,yea' & 'easy,easy,easy'.

I would like to add Irish lads who go to premiership games in GAA tops or with Celtic/Liverpool/Man Utd scarfs,or the ones who bring a tricolor.Why,just why..?

For me its the Roy Keane fans. When he was with Utd he was their favourite player, then there was a Celtic explosion for a season, then a lull for a while and its all aboard the Sunderland express. Fans buying and wearing Sunderland shirts, going on football trips to sunny Tyneside. RTE giving us Championship reports (well one match per week) and their total orgasmic delight when Premier Keague football beckoned. Now its starting again. Keane goes to off to manage the 'Tractor Boys' and Setanta licks its lips...championship reports during its premier league coverage!!! I've seen three Ipswich jerseys since monday and i am waiting for the Marathon Travel ad offering weekend trips to Suffolk or walking into the local when Norwich come to Portman Rd for derby day and watch the same fans cheer for Utd/Celtic later that evening.

_blank_

Gavin shels wrote: »

small flags for small fans

fyp

CiaranC

Draupnir wrote: »

Why are they different? They are both sports. What about the 4x100m relay, thats a team sport that I enjoy at the Olympics, the lads in Santry are brutal at it mind you, why would I want to watch them falling over themselves in the rain of a Friday night?

Good grief

Draupnir

CiaranC wrote: »

Good grief

Is that all you can say? Don't you see that it is the exact same, a sport with low attendances locally because of inferior quality but gains global support and interest as quality improves.

It's you guys who have your heads in the sand, face the real problems holding back Irish football instead of pretending you are superior beings because you and your mates like spending your Friday down the club singing songs and having a pint.

SectionF

Draupnir wrote: »

Is that all you can say? Don't you see that it is the exact same, a sport with low attendances locally because of inferior quality but gains global support and interest as quality improves.

It's you guys who have your heads in the sand, face the real problems holding back Irish football instead of pretending you are superior beings because you and your mates like spending your Friday down the club singing songs and having a pint.

Good grief.

stovelid

Draupnir wrote: »

It's you guys who have your heads in the sand, face the real problems holding back Irish football instead of pretending you are superior beings because you and your mates like spending your Friday down the club singing songs and having a pint.

The real problem with Irish football is Irish people. All the other problems are ancillary to that.

For the record, I nearly added Good Grief.

Boggles

Jaysus can't wait to read Jones next article.

"Evolution and the down side to opposable thumbs"

Move on Paul FFS.

:rolleyes:

Draupnir

Great constructive posts lads.

You are wrong when you say that the problem with Irish football is Irish people, to a degree. The problem with Irish football is the administration of it, the organisation of it and the presentation of it.

I was thinking about it and I've been to a lot of LOI matches in my life, I hadn't really realised how many but my Dad used to take me to the RDS to watch Rovers when I was a kid (we got the tickets through Stella Maris) and I remember the crowds back then were reasonably decent. In fact, Rovers at the RDS was probably my first ever exposure to football, long before United or the Premier League (I'd imagine it was 1989 or 1990 when I was going).

The point I'm making is, there was nothing at that time to hook me on the club or the league as a football mad 7 year old. There was no press, there was no marketing hype, there was no league of ireland sticker album, there was no big name players, there were no matches on TV. I think if there had been then I'd be posting Good Grief on boards.ie today.

But you think the problem is that Irish people aren't interested in it? You think that the quality of football, the quality of facilities and the welcoming atmosphere is in place, but people are just indifferent?

CiaranC

I think the Irish public dont differentiate between following a football team and following a javelin thrower, and need "marketing hype, sticker albums, celebrity and television" in order to support football. This is an anathema to what being a football fan is elsewhere.

Which sums it up really.

thegen

The reason loi is not supported is that the "product" is simply not good enough. Added to the exposure premier league football gets its on a loser.

The facilities do not help, neither do the administration.

I am saying all this as an ex player. What the loi requires is a good marketing manager that will attract people back to the game.

LOI supporters please do not come back and say it is great quality, if it was we'd have a team playin CL every year in the group stage.

Sorry for being OT but it has gone that way in this one.

CiaranC

"The product" comes after the support, not before it.

Draupnir

CiaranC wrote: »

I think the Irish public dont differentiate between following a football team and following a javelin thrower, and need "marketing hype, sticker albums, celebrity and television" in order to support football. This is an anathema to what being a football fan is elsewhere.

Which sums it up really.

Eh, I was talking about when I was a 7 year old, which is the kind of age range the league should be trying to build interest.

It is not anathema to what being a football fan is, it's just anathema to what diehard football fans WANT being a football fan to be.

Draupnir

CiaranC wrote: »

"The product" comes after the support, not before it.

You couldn't be more wrong I am afraid. I've been in packed Dalymount over the last 6/7 years when Champions League football came to town, that was the product bringing the support.

The support of you and your mates isn't exactly bringing the product to LOI football now is it?

thegen

CiaranC wrote: »

"The product" comes after the support, not before it.

I think you might be off the mark there. If you have no product you have no support.

I am one who is going back to loi games as Rovers are only a couple of miles up the road from me. I do hope the loi get the product right. I want to be able to bring my kids to games as as I was at Milltown.

Boggles

CiaranC wrote: »

"The product" comes after the support, not before it.

Rubbish.

See Munster Rugby Club.

CiaranC

Ok then. Please detail how LOI clubs are to provide a higher standard "product" (e.g. football on the pitch as per the OP) with no money and little public interest.

How did Munster do it?

Draupnir

CiaranC wrote: »

How did Munster do it?

With the support of Central Council (IRFU), centralized contracts and the re-imagining of the whole structure and organisation of the game.

CiaranC

Interesting.

Excuse my ignorance, but didnt Munster/Leinster etc exist before this new found popularity? Were they given franchises to the new professional leagues or something?

How could they suddenly afford world class players on going pro? I could have sworn Leinster were attracting crowds in the hundreds ten years ago.

Draupnir

CiaranC wrote: »

Interesting.

Excuse my ignorance, but didnt Munster/Leinster etc exist before this new found popularity? Were they given franchises to the new professional leagues or something?

How could they suddenly afford world class players on going pro? I could have sworn Leinster were attracting crowds in the hundreds ten years ago.

Yeah you are correct, Rugby turned professional about 10/15 years ago and with that (in Ireland at least) all professional players became contracted to the IRFU rather than to the specific team they player for.

Leinster, Munster, Connacht and Ulster are the four professional teams in Ireland. All the original clubs still exist but are amateur, so you have guys like Brian O'Driscoll playing professionally for Leinster, being paid by the IRFU but they are still club players/members with their original clubs (in O'Driscoll's case that is Blackrock, O'Connell is professional with Munster but a club member with Young Munster I believe).

All the original clubs are still there but are not professional and amateur guys still play for them in the AIB League, it still has pretty dismal support and I am sure there are LOI fan equivalents who watch AIB League rugby and despise some of the fans who watch the pro game.

The Irish model of central contracting is hugely successful and is the main reason that Ireland is so strong internationally now. The model is being copied now in Wales and Scotland I believe.

CiaranC

I see, thanks for the info. Not really a runner with football though, is it.

Draupnir

No not really, it would be horrible in fact.

iregk

Draupnir wrote: »

All the original clubs are still there but are not professional and amateur guys still play for them in the AIB League, it still has pretty dismal support and I am sure there are LOI fan equivalents who watch AIB League rugby and despise some of the fans who watch the pro game.

Just a foot note on this. Club rugby used to draw huge crowds. I remember going to St Marys back in the Brennan/Costello days and there was 12k at the game. When the provinces went pro many fans simply transferred from club to pro. Munster and Leinster tickets can be very hard to come by these days where as you'd walk into St Marys now and could be the only person there.

stovelid

Draupnir wrote: »

But you think the problem is that Irish people aren't interested in it? You think that the quality of football, the quality of facilities and the welcoming atmosphere is in place, but people are just indifferent?

The Munster/Premiership success model has polluted our expectations so much that we directly equate 'quality' with validity. The 'quality' (as in the style of football played and the excitement) of many games in the LOI can be quite good, but the league is not as good as the Premiership or La Liga. Does it have to be to be enjoyable?

As for the facilities, if you can provide a business plan for clubs like Shels and Bohs to completely revamp Tolka and Dalyer on gates of 900-2000, you should let them know. Rovers have an advantage here because they have a municipal facility, albeit one used for a very large rent, but still don't have to watch the place fall down around them like Shels or Bohs.

A point worth noting is that even though Bohs won the double at a canter last year, and still have a great team this year, their gates are still shit. In addition, your 'superior product' thesis doesn't address the thousands of Irish fans that doggedly support teams outside the top four, teams that may be 'better' than the LOI, but don't exactly play 'better' football by any means.

As for the 'atmosphere', anybody that actually thinks a couple of thousand match-goers will collectively conspire to freeze out newcomers (or even notice them) at games, you're either a paranoiac of gargantuan proportions, stupid or - most likely - justifying non-attendance.

Fair enough about the bad administration and the need to bring kids to games. That said, small crowds will beget small crowds in that sense. You have to already be a fan to bring your kids. Most clubs have promos for schoolchildren, but without a historical/family link to the club, you will lose them to the big clubs.

It's wearisome even typing this to be honest. I like the premiership - and actually have a valid geographic reason for doing so. I like the LOI. I like football.

At this stage, I'm losing interest in any other factor.

Johnny Utah

Interesting you should mention Munster Rugby Boggles. You see, the IRFU have a proper structure to their game, unlike the FAI here. The truth is Ireland cannot support a full-time professional football league, even of mediocre standard. The IRFU recognise that a similar problem exists in their code, so instead of trying to pursue a league consisting of a dozen Irish rugby teams, the IRFU have joined forces with Scottish and Welsh clubs in the Magner's League, and they managed the four professional rugby teams on this island brilliantly. It's been a great strategy adopted by the IRFU when you consider the success that Irish provinces have enjoyed in Europe. Indeed, look at how the big two Irish provinces are regularly beating English premiership teams in Europe, and you will understand just how strong Irish rugby is at present.

Face it, Ireland will never be able to sustain a full-time professional football league of any standard of note. The problem at the moment is that we are a very small country and we are trying to support too many clubs as it is. Obviously, this leads to less revenue, less facilities etc for the clubs involved, and consequently the standard of football is quite poor. In effect, there is no product for fans to support.

At most, we could probably sustain four professional teams on the whole island (one for each province in line with the Rugby model), and even that is extremely optimistic. The truth is League of Ireland standard is probably equivalent to Division 3 in England; it will never be able to compete in Europe, and the sooner League of Ireland fans realise this the better!

invincibleirish

What do you want then for the LoI Stovelid? whats your big idea? will you ever accept that we cannot maintain a full time league in this country? you mention Munster the premiership and all sorts, you ignore Munster have an enormous support base to draw from, as do most of the PL teams. Why can't you accept that the LoI and its clubs future is as amatuer or semi pro, there is no shame in that.

stovelid

invincibleirish wrote: »

What do you want then for the LoI Stovelid? whats your big idea? will you ever accept that we cannot maintain a full time league in this country? you mention Munster the premiership and all sorts, you ignore Munster have an enormous support base to draw from, as do most of the PL teams. Why can't you accept that the LoI and its clubs future is as amatuer or semi pro, there is no shame in that.

Hold on there.

I do accept that the LOI should be semi-pro at the moment. I'd like growth, if possible, but only in realistic terms.

What I'm sick of is the relentless pie-chart waffle around here about superior product that we have to listen to. While I'd like to see the league being successful, and would do anything in my power to help it grow, i have no problem with supporting a team that won't ever be as successful as Liverpool or Munster. For the majority of Irish people, the model for sporting support is mega-success, either ours, or gatecrashing the parties of other countries.

This forum is full of people 'who used to go to LOI' advising people that do about what we should want for our clubs, and what level of success qualifies them as worthy of support.

Draupnir

stovelid wrote: »

Does it have to be to be enjoyable?

You agree then that someone must enjoy something to be at all interested in it? Then you will agree that if someone doesn't enjoy LOI football then they don't have to go and if they do enjoy watching PL football or La Liga football or Park football then they are welcome to watch that and not be looked down upon by people who enjoy the other type of football.

I'm not trying to preach to you about anything by the way, as you have alluded to in your other post, just trying to make it clear that you and a lot of your fellow LOI fans are wrong when you think you are real football fans and others are not. Football is 11 blokes kicking a ball for 90 minutes, whatever way you watch it.

Draupnir

stovelid wrote: »

As for the 'atmosphere', anybody that actually thinks a couple of thousand match-goers will collectively conspire to freeze out newcomers (or even notice them) at games, you're either a paranoiac of gargantuan proportions, stupid or - most likely - justifying non-attendance.

Is there not a possibly that the issue would move from "you are not a real football fan because you don't go to games" to "you are a better football fan now, but you are not as real as me because I have been going longer"?

This is just a question based on life experience, don't jump down my throat. But the type of personalities I'm reading here having a pop at EPL fans strike me as just the type of personalities that would always be looking for superiority and oneupmanship.

CiaranC

Draupnir wrote: »

Is there not a possibly that the issue would move from "you are not a real football fan because you don't go to games" to "you are a better football fan now, but you are not as real as me because I have been going longer"?

This is just a question based on life experience, don't jump down my throat. But the type of personalities I'm reading here having a pop at EPL fans strike me as just the type of personalities that would always be looking for superiority and oneupmanship.

Not at all, Rovers attendances have more than trebled from last year and every fan I talk to is delighted about it. You just have to take a look at the welcome new fans get over on the Rovers forum.

I see lads from the locality who are lifelong barstoolers at the games and I think its fantastic. The more the merrier.

invincibleirish

stovelid wrote: »

What I'm sick of is the relentless pie-chart waffle around here about superior product that we have to listen to. While I'd like to see the league being successful, and would do anything in my power to help it grow, i have no problem with supporting a team that won't ever be as successful as Liverpool or Munster. For the majority of Irish people, the model for sporting support is mega-success, either ours, or gatecrashing the parties of other countries.

I fail to understand why it is you make sweeping generalisations about 'most Irish people'. People have millions of different reasons why they follow a sport or team, you pigeon hole these people as glory hunters. Yeah it must be annoying to for you to read people giving reasons why they dislike the LoI, but the flip side is true when we hear another bitter (usually Shels) LoI supporter giving out about barstoolers, plastics and all that, its prejudice & ignorance dressed up as opinion.

Jazzy

i see ciaranc has arrived to throw his weight against the paupers.
its like pokemon. my level 6 Gavin "shels" failed to win so im sending out my evolved level 10 CiaranC

CiaranC

Jazzy wrote: »

i see ciaranc has arrived to throw his weight against the paupers.
its like pokemon. my level 6 Gavin "shels" failed to win so im sending out my evolved level 10 CiaranC

Still with the "Levels" gags Jazzy? Shouldnt you be off polishing your remote control?

Jazzy

CiaranC wrote: »

Still with the "Levels" gags Jazzy? Shouldnt you be off polishing your remote control?

yeah, been watching pokemon. its amazing how you can apply whats going on in a fictional japanese anime to do with tournaments where pocket monsters do battle to real life.

the levels thing aint that much of a gag anymore. its just kinda sadly true. whats funny is the lengths people will go to to get that feeling of smug self satisfaction over other people through the most trivial means. and whats even funnier is that they have the exact same mentality as those they lambast... the "sky sports" generation who spend all day on here in a constant game of one-upsmanship via teams that are hundreds of miles away from them. same rules, different game