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Mr. Nice Guy vs. Eagle Eye
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06-03-2009 10:16pm#1Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »I'm very pleased to be able to introduce to you fine people of the soccer forum my Premiership draft write-up. Firstly I'd like to say I enjoyed the game as well as the spirit of the contest so credit to Lloyd for overseeing everything. Hopefully the good nature of the game will continue. OK then without further ado may I present to you F.C. (First Class) Athletic, a team I hope you'll agree is the classiest, most stylish team of the draft.
Team Formation:
Defoe
Bergkamp
Zenden
Petit
Carrick
Robben
Heinze----Ferdinand (c)----Brown
Geremi----
Van Der Sar
Right folks I'll break down my argument on why I feel my team is a worthy winner of the contest in three parts. Firstly, I'll explain my overall strategy and line of thinking, secondly I'll give a brief final explanation on why I picked the guys I did, and lastly, I'll give my overall assessment on the strengths and weaknesses of my team. By doing so I hope you'll be impressed with my efforts.
My strategy:
I enjoy good, attacking football as I'm sure you all do and I set out from the outset to mould a team that would have great passing and movement. I believed from the beginning that the core areas of all teams would be up front, central defence, central midfield and to a lesser extent on the wings. These are the areas where I feel more often than not games are won and lost.
I'll be brutally honest here - I think those people in the game who picked full backs and goalkeepers early on made a mistake. I don't see the benefit in choosing an outstanding full back or goalkeeper when, with a bit of patience, you could have gotten very good players in these areas later on. I felt confident I would get a good goalkeeper if I was patient. This turned out to be the case. I also feel I ended up with solid full-backs despite me picking them in the latter half of the draw.
I was keen to get myself a great, versatile winger early on who could play either flank as I believed this would give me greater scope later on when picking my second winger. For example, if you choose someone who works solely as a left winger you're forced later on choose a right-winger. However if like I did you go for a player like Robben who can work either flank (Duff was in my thoughts too some of you may recall), by adopting this strategy you are free to choose from a wider range of wingers from both flanks later on and you're not leaving yourself limited. I feel that was a smart strategy.
I think stategy-wise it was important to plan out the importance of not just the players you're thinking of, but also the positions themselves. I would argue I did well in this regard and I hope you'll agree!
Some final thoughts on my picks...
Pick 1: Dennis Bergkamp
I was fortunate in that I was given a fairly early pick in the first round. I can honestly say the only guy I would have wanted ahead of Bergkamp would have been Roy Keane. Bergkamp as I've said before on this board is one of my favourite players of the nineties and is a genuinely world-class player and a legend. I was delighted to get him and I feel he is a magical player that would grace any team.
Pick 2: Rio Ferdinand
Ferdinand in truth was a pretty easy pick for me for the second round. I felt I needed to pick a great defender as I planned on prioritising other areas in the next rounds. In Rio I got one of the most praised defenders in the Premiership. As I recall I was going to go with him or Carragher and would have been happy with either as both are leaders. I plumped for Ferdinand as I felt he was a classier option. He will be my team's captain.
Pick 3: Arjen Robben
Robben as I touched on above was the versatile winger I felt I needed and I'm very happy to have him. I'd say one of the most explosive, impactful wingers the Premiership has seen.
Pick 4: Emmanuel Petit
At this point I turned my attention towards central midfield and felt I needed a defensive-minded player who was also a good passer of the ball. Manu Petit certainly fit the bill as he provided a combatative presence in the middle and yet meant I didn't have to compromise class for brawn.
Pick 5: Michael Carrick
I'd decided on the type of midfield I wanted - one that would be built on good passing. I didn't feel I needed an 'attacking midfielder' as I believed in Bergkamp I had the best playmaker around. This pick, as I kind of expected, got a bit of criticism as Carrick is someone that seems to divide people. Personally I believe he does an underrated job at Man United and I think alongside Petit, Carrick would have a great partnership. I reckon they'd compliment each other well. The only other guy I had in my thoughts for this role was Alonso but I felt his dip in form last season for Liverpool meant Carrick was the better overall draft choice.
Pick 6: Edwin Van Der Sar
As I mentioned above I felt a bit of patience would lead to a good goalkeeper pick and I feel relative to the rounds, Edwin Van Der Sar was one of my better picks. To get a guy I consider a man for the big occasion at round 6 was very pleasing. I'd acknowledge he's had his shaky moments at times but I think overall he's been an outstanding success at United and the best goalkeeper since Schmeichel.
Pick 7: Jermain Defoe
At this point I felt I needed to act fast to ensure I had a true goal machine up front. Defoe was the logical choice. His stats speak for themselves and alongside Bergkamp I felt the two of them would pose a frightening threat.
Pick 8: Wes Brown
I regarded Brown as a really important pick. I was surprised he was left at round 8 as he can do a fine job in two positions. My only concern really was where I would play him but because as mentioned above I don't really rate the full-back positions as that significant, I felt more confident having him play alongside Rio.
Pick 9: Gabriel Heinze
Again, relative to the rounds this was probably one of my better picks. To get such a talented guy in the third-last round was a great bonus.
Pick 10: Boudewijn Zenden
Initially I had gone for Stewart Downing not realising the guy had been picked beforehand but I'm happy to end up with my second choice of Zenden. I think Downing would have provided a better crossing ability for me but I think in my team that's not really going to be that important. With my team I think wingers who can run at defenders and link up with the front men matters more so I think my two Dutch wingers provide a good threat for me.
Pick 11: Geremi
Right-back was the last slot I needed and other than Geremi I considered Abel Xavier and a few others but I felt Geremi was the smartest choice available to me as he is strong and a good distributor, plus he can provide some set-piece competition with Bergkamp. I also felt the Robben/Geremi partnership on the right was a nice Chelsea-style combination.
My overall thoughts:
Funnily enough when I look at this team I think this is the kind of team Giovanni Trapattoni would give his right arm to have. It strikes me as a formation and style similar to the current Irish one. The central midfielders in my team won't be asked to do anything too elaborate. Just keep things tight and distribute to the wings and forwards. I feel my defence and goalkeeper are as solid as any in the game. I also feel I have wingers who can cause problems, a legend in Bergkamp who can pull the strings and in Defoe, a goal machine who can take chances that come his way.
I see this team's major strength being in its passing play. I have players comfortable on the ball whose job would be to try and get it to the quicker, pacier players. I feel this is a team that won't leak many goals but will create many chances. I think that's a fair assessment when you look at the talent on show.
I also feel I have created a team of winners, something I spoke of often when making my picks. My back four and goalkeeper for example have all won the Premiership. In fact only two players in my team haven't won the league, Defoe and Zenden. Five of my eleven have won the Champions League. One of them has won a World Cup. So this is not a team that is going to panic if it encounters some difficulty.
What are my team's weaknesses? Well I think my main concern would probably be the defensive nature of my wingers. I'd be concerned that Zenden and Robben whilst good up front, wouldn't be thorough enough in getting back and helping out. I would hope that the full-backs behind them would be able to cover in such instances and that my deep-sitting central midfield would be able to deputise too. I believe they would.
Overall I think this is a team with enough class, resilience, tenacity and ingenuity to be able to provide a tough match-up for any team. I feel my team strikes the best balance in attack and defence. I feel it's able to cause problems for opposition back fours and yet able enough to fend off and deal with attacking threats. I guess that's up to others to determine though.
Well that about sums up my case and assuming you've read this far I thank you for your time and hope you've been suitably impressed. Cheers. :cool:
vs.My team name: The Eagle Rovers
1. Neville Southall
One of the best the Premiership has seen. A legend of the game and one of the greatest keepers ever. He made incredible stops time and time again. He was magnificent in Evertons last FA Cup win in 1995 against Manchester United for which he received the Man of the Match award. He was the first player to make 200 Premier League appearances. He is one of the few goalkeepers to have won a football of the year award but that was before the Premier League began. The MBE award in 1997 was a fitting tribute to his legendardy career.
2. Roland Nilsson
Roland was the best full back bar Denis Irwin that I have seen play in the Premier League. There are some good full backs currently in the league who might over time be considered as good or maybe even better than those two, but at this moment I have yet to see a better right back play the game in England. Roland played his best years with Sheffield Wednesday, he is in their hall of fame and is a legend among supporters of Wednesday. He came back to the Premier League at 34 years of age and showed he was still a top full back when he played with Coventry City until he retired in 1999. I am certain that I have the best right back in this draft. With 116 caps for his coutry he has shown just how consistently good he was thoughout his career.
5, Marin Laursen
Martin Laursen is well known to all and without doubt for me is currently the best Centreback playing outside of the big four in the Premier League, some would argue that he is the best including them, but I rate his partner in my team as that. Laursen has been top class for a long time now, and has overcome injury to come back and regain his place as one of the best in the world in his position. He is known for his fearlessness and his magnificent ability to head the ball. He is so dangerous from corner kicks in the opposing box also, a talent that Martin O'Neill has used to full affect over the last two seasons. Lionheart was both the Aston Villa supporters player of the year last season and also received the Denmark player of the year award. He has been promoted by Martin O'Neill to Club Captain of Aston Villa. His goal scorng record is incredible over the past season and a half for a Centre Back. I'm not sure of exact numbers right now, but he has definitely over ten for Villa in the last year or so. Laursen will be my leader at the back.
6. Nemanja Vidic
Nemanja Vidic joined Manchester United in January 2006. United went on an incredible run shortly after he joined them and at one stage reduced the gap between them and Chelsea from 18 points down to only 7 points. He has been magnificent for them ever since. United have won two League titles and the Champions League in the two full seasons he has been with the club, he has been in the Premier League team of year on both occasions and received his second Serbian football of the year award in 2008. He has been shortlisted for all the major awards as a defender in both those seasons also. Along with Martin Laursen he is one of the best headers of a ball in the League and is a real danger to the opposition from Corner Kicks. His aggressive style of defence is a joy to watch, and I don't think I have ever seen anybody else who can play that way and be successful at it.
3. Alan Wright
Alan Wright was a dependable left back, loved at Aston Villa during his time there, he was previously part of the Blackburn Rovers squad that won the Premier League. He was always highly regarded and his fee of 1 million sterling when moving to Villa in the summer of 1995 is a testament to just how good he was. He spent the next eight years at Villa Park. He was an excellent tacker and possessed incredible speed which was often used to set up quick counter attacks. Alan Wright completes my back four.
4. Claude Makelele
Well what can you say about this man, they thought they had a replacement for him at Chelsea, but since his departure things seem to be getting worse and meanwhile his new team PSG in France which struggled last year is flying high in Ligue1. Makelele was the engine in the Chelsea team that won two Premier Leagues in a row. He is widely regarded by those who have played with him to be the best they have played with. When the Real Madrid Galacticos lost him to Chelsea, their team fell apart very quickly. Frank Lampard has said that once he played with him he understood what the other greats that had played with him were talking about. Claude will be my engine room in my team, he will stop my awesome defence from having to deal with a lot of pressure and set up attacks with his immaculate passing ability. I can't see many goals being scored against my side with this man in front of an awesome defence.
11. Andy Townsend
He liked the 11 shirt and I'll give it to him. Andy Townsend is my workhorse, my box to box midfielder. Andy was another leader of men, he worked tirelessly for both club and country. Andy's £2.2 million pounds trasfer fee when moving to Aston Villa was one of the biggest fees payed out in the early days of the Premier League. His performances for Ireland were such that he kept Roy Keane out of the team for a long time. A fantastic midfielder he will be available when Claude looks for him and will cause opposing defences to spread due to his accurate passing and also the fact that he possesses a wicked shot from distance. I'm choosing Andy as my Team Captain.
8. Jason Wilcox
Jason was a mainstay in the Blackburn Rovers team that won the Premier League and stayed with the club for a long time after that playing 271 times in total and scoring 31 goals. He eventually moved on to Leeds United in 1999 where he displaced Harry Kewell on the left side of midfield with his consistently high class displays. One of the best Corner Kick takers in the Premier League he will be my no.1 corner taker on both sides of the pitch. His link up play makes him very dangerous and his crossing ability is as good as it gets in football. With Alan Wrights speed he can set up attacks down the left with his link up play.
10. Steve Stone
Steve was one of the crucial players in the Nottingham Forest team that has a great Premier Leauge run in the '90s, he was eveywhere on the pitch for them but his ability on the right side of the pitch earned him rave reviews and also England caps. He was bought for big money by Aston Villa and was rumoured to be moving to Manchester United after only one season at Aston Villa. His career took a down turn shortly after that with the arrival of Graham Taylor at Villa Park. He moved to Portsmouth and was a vital part of their promotion and played for them in the Premier League until that great French manager Alain Perrin:rolleyes: decided to release him. He moved to Leeds and struggled from his arrival there with injury before he eventually had to retire from injury at the end of the '95/96 season. Steve will play down the right side for me and he will move in from time to time depending on the opposition as he can be dangeous when he does having scored 37 league goals during his career as well as assisting well over 100 times. He will be my no.2 corner taker staying out there with Jason Wilcox for most corners.
7. Peter Beardsley
The little wizard was to me the Mardona of the Premier League. He was magnificent for Newcastle and provided most of the assists in Andy Cole's record breaking season with Newcastle. He also scored plenty himself. I will play the maestro in the hole just behind Alan Shearer. With both Stone and Wilcox well able to provide crosses and this man able to cut open defences with ball at his feet or by passing it, I'm salivating at the prospect of opoosing defences being ripped apart. Having tremendous tacklers behind him in Makele and Townsend he does not have to worry about taking chances. He is a one of a kind in this draft, there is no player that posesses the ability to beat players and create opportunities for others like this man. I was completly shocked when I was able to pick this man up with the 76th pick in the draft.
9. Alan Shearer
Well what can you say, what can you say? I have the most potent goalscoring machine in the history of the Premier League, nobody has come close to equalling this man's records. I have so much class to provide for this man and he and Beardsley are the biggest nightmare partnership for any defence. They can both score goals from anywhere, they can both go it alone or lay it on for the other man. I see this as the best partnership possible in this draft. Alan Shearer will take my free kicks and penalties.
I am extremely happy with my team, I have winners all over the pitch, I expect to score 2+ goals per game and I don't see how anybody can put goals past with any consistency so I expect to concede less than .5 goals per game with my defence. I have two ball winners in the centre of the park and two exceptional passers in Makelele and Townesend, I have one of the best link up players that ever played the game in Jason Wilcox.
When we go to this cup thing, I will provide tactics after I see who I am playing.MNG vs. Eagle Eye 42 votes
MNG0%Eagle Eye100%
42 votes
0
Comments
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Eagle EyeI am happy enough with this draw to be honest because I honestly believe eagle eye's team is probably the weakest team I've come up against in the contest thus far. I'll explain why below using the system I did in the last round.
Defense
This is a real problem area for him I feel. Southall's best days were behind him in his Premiership run. He does have two admirable, strong, gutsy central defenders ahead of him in Vidic and Laursen, though for me they would be better suited to dealing with two strong, gutsy strikers. Unfortunately for eagle eye many of the teams he would come up against would not fit this bill and my pairing of Bergkamp and Defoe certainly don't! I am confident in a one-on-one match they would create numerous chances and then finish some of those chances off. At the full-back positions he is extremely weak indeed. Nielsen and Wright strike fear into no one. I would immediately urge Robben and Zenden to go for the jugular in that area. In a straight-up match between ourselves - with his defenders getting pulled wide - Bergkamp and Defoe would have an absolute field day with the space. I think a lot of teams in the draft would actually.
My central pairing of Ferdinand and Brown will prove a match for any team, ably supported by Geremi and Heinze in the full-back positions, with Van Der Sar in goal. This is not a team which is going to concede many over the course of a season. I feel compared to eagle eye's defence, over the course of a season, I'd concede around twenty fewer goals at the very least. That will prove important.
Midfield
In terms of central midfield options I do not believe his pair complement each other as well as mine do. As I said in a previous post, the real heart of my team is its central core and while Makelele is one of the best holding midfielders around, and while Townsend was an industrious player with a good engine, realistically this is not a pair that is going to be able to dominate possession which I feel is of crucial importance. I believe my pairing of Carrick and Petit would do just that. In a one on one match I feel my team would have at least 60% possession which would be very bad news indeed for his team which has a brittle full-back pairing and with my attacking options being what they are.
On the wings, Stone and Wilcox aren't going to do much damage in my opinion. I can't see those two causing headaches against my guys and with Heinze and Geremi facing them, I can't see them hurting my team much if at all.
Attack
Clearly his strength in his team is up front. Shearer is one of the greatest strikers in Premiership history of course and Beardsley could still be effective in his Premiership run - but there is a big problem. My concern for eagle eye is that he has not gone and placed enough emphasis on midfield. It's all well and good having two quality strikers but if you can't supply them then you are in big trouble! A midfield quartet of Stone, Townsend, Makelele and Wilcox are not going to provide Shearer with the ammunition he needs over the course of a season. No way.
My attacking pair of Bergkamp and Defoe, supported by Robben, Carrick, Petit and Zenden, will be assured of plenty of the ball over the course of a season and indeed up against eagle eye. I feel my team would score probably around twenty goals more minimum in a season.
eagle eye's criticisms
I think the fact his first paragraph was directed at the idea my players could pick up injuries is pretty telling about his real thoughts. At the end of the day we have no squad in this game so I don't see the point in pondering potential wear and tear since the point of the game is to see how the players we pick would perform over the course of a season. I'm confident mine would perform better. I think he suspects this as well.
I'm frankly ASTONISHED that he feels the best way to get at my team is on the flanks when I'm certain that is where he is weakest. He wants to pit Jason Wilcox against Geremi on the wings? Fine by me. He wants to have Steve Stone go against Gabriel Heinze? Your funeral, mate. If his plan to get Shearer involved is that way then the great Geordie is going to have a miserable afternoon. By the way, I'm quite confident in Brown and Ferdinand, who kept Messi and Henry quiet last year, handling eagle eye's efforts. I can't remember when Brown scored an OG last so I think that's a pretty desperate jibe on a guy who has made the PFA Team of the Year as a central defender.
eagle eye adds he is 'licking his lips' at the thought of getting corners and the 'aerial bombardment' on my defense. What I want to know is, how are you going to get corners and aerial bombardment when your team won't even have the ball? Or are we to believe Townsend and Makelele are going to play Arsenal-style football? I think my pairing of Petit and Carrick are more likely to do that. Your team will experience aerial bombardment alright but it will be from Robben and co. terrorising Nielsen and Wright on the wings and other teams no doubt attempting similar.
Also I think the only one licking his lips will be Shearer who will be starved of chances all game.
Summary
Over the course of a season in this draft I actually believe eagle eye's team would be lower half of the league. I doubt he'd make the relegation places as I'm sure Shearer and Beardsley would take the chances that do come their way, but good teams like mine ought to be able to dominate his limited midfield quartet, weak flanks, and goalkeeper who'd seen his best years go by.
I reckon my team would be a title contender and would be very optimistic of taking 6 points against eagle eye over the course of a season. I believe I am better in every department and I would hope the good folks of Boards would conclude the same.0 -
I find this laughable, first you say that Vidic and Laursen are only able to deal with a certain type of attacker. You mention you don't have a gutsy striker, I think that shows another weakness in your team. You are expecting flair to come through, I suggest your team is too frail to have any impact. Tell me where this flair will come from, you mention Robben and Zenden going for the jugular, tell me how. You are criticising imo the best right full back ever to play in the Premiership in Roland Nielsen. I have a left back full of pace on the other side which is exactly the type of guy you need to mark Robben. And that is of course on the odd occasion that both your wide players are fit enough to perform their tasks. As for your assertion that Bergkamp and Defoe are going to have a 'field day' with space, lol. Where are you seeing this space? In between Makele and my central defensive pairing?Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »I am happy enough with this draw to be honest because I honestly believe eagle eye's team is probably the weakest team I've come up against in the contest thus far. I'll explain why below using the system I did in the last round.
Defense
This is a real problem area for him I feel. Southall's best days were behind him in his Premiership run. He does have two admirable, strong, gutsy central defenders ahead of him in Vidic and Laursen, though for me they would be better suited to dealing with two strong, gutsy strikers. Unfortunately for eagle eye many of the teams he would come up against would not fit this bill and my pairing of Bergkamp and Defoe certainly don't! I am confident in a one-on-one match they would create numerous chances and then finish some of those chances off. At the full-back positions he is extremely weak indeed. Nielsen and Wright strike fear into no one. I would immediately urge Robben and Zenden to go for the jugular in that area. In a straight-up match between ourselves - with his defenders getting pulled wide - Bergkamp and Defoe would have an absolute field day with the space. I think a lot of teams in the draft would actually.
Geremi is not a full back. Plain and simple, he has played there but he is a midfielder. He is very average as a full back to say the least. Heinze was very good as I said during his first season, after that injury I'm afraid he has never reached that standard again and over the course of his entire career he is no better than average. How does your team do when they are both hobbling around the place along with Wes Brown?Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »My central pairing of Ferdinand and Brown will prove a match for any team, ably supported by Geremi and Heinze in the full-back positions, with Van Der Sar in goal. This is not a team which is going to concede many over the course of a season. I feel compared to eagle eye's defence, over the course of a season, I'd concede around twenty fewer goals at the very least. That will prove important.
You attack the legendary goalkeeper Neville Southall. I mentioned when I picked him that he was the first player in the Premier League to reach 200 appearances, hardly an achievement you would expect from someone whose past it. And be honest your assertion is just laughable anyways and probably like so many of your other attacks trying to sway the minds of those who don't remember all my players.
In midfield you have a strong central pairing, that is if I am going to attack up the centre. You have two deep lying midfielders, I will keep them busy with Andy Townsend buzzing around the pitch and Beardsley coming deeper from time to time. However there is nothing attack minded about your midfield at all and I am certain that my midfield pairing negates any attacking threat through the middle. So now you are back to the two frail wide men again.Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »Midfield
In terms of central midfield options I do not believe his pair complement each other as well as mine do. As I said in a previous post, the real heart of my team is its central core and while Makelele is one of the best holding midfielders around, and while Townsend was an industrious player with a good engine, realistically this is not a pair that is going to be able to dominate possession which I feel is of crucial importance. I believe my pairing of Carrick and Petit would do just that. In a one on one match I feel my team would have at least 60% possession which would be very bad news indeed for his team which has a brittle full-back pairing and with my attacking options being what they are.
On the wings, Stone and Wilcox aren't going to do much damage in my opinion. I can't see those two causing headaches against my guys and with Heinze and Geremi facing them, I can't see them hurting my team much if at all.
Its very important that your team stand the test of a full season, you are trying to dismiss this but you can't. I mentioned five players who will have problems in this department. You have no defense for this, in fact three of them are defenders and the other two are your wide men which leaves you trying to beat me through the centre and thats not going to happen.
I have shown in my formation that Beardsley will play in the hole. Beardsley can beat anybody on his own, that ability means defenders have to stand off him a bit and this allows him the room to create, he needed very little room to create(note 23 assists in 93/94). I have the best striker in the business in Alan Shearer, he does not need many opportunities to put the ball in the net. Its laughable that you think Wes Brown will be able to prevent anything, imo he is more likely to make mistakes and create chances for Sherer and Beardsley and the only result of this is goals for my team. Without a tough tackling central defender you have no hope of stopping my attacking threat through the middle but I don't even need to go through the middle due to the acres of space I will have out wide with your players hobbling around the place half the time.Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »Attack
Clearly his strength in his team is up front. Shearer is one of the greatest strikers in Premiership history of course and Beardsley could still be effective in his Premiership run - but there is a big problem. My concern for eagle eye is that he has not gone and placed enough emphasis on midfield. It's all well and good having two quality strikers but if you can't supply them then you are in big trouble! A midfield quartet of Stone, Townsend, Makelele and Wilcox are not going to provide Shearer with the ammunition he needs over the course of a season. No way.
My attacking pair of Bergkamp and Defoe, supported by Robben, Carrick, Petit and Zenden, will be assured of plenty of the ball over the course of a season and indeed up against eagle eye. I feel my team would score probably around twenty goals more minimum in a season.
You mention a game where Brown and Ferdinand had a clean sheet. Firstly it was a Champion's League game and is irrelevant to this Premier League draft. Its also one game and over the course of a campaign the defensive errors of Wes Brown at center back will be costly, again when he is not hobbling around the place.
Jason Wilcox was a fantastic left midfielder/winger, you don't have a defender on that side of the field, and you are expecting Geremi who is a midfielder to negate this threat when he is not hobbling around the park. On his very best day Geremi would not stop Jason Wilcox.Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »eagle eye's criticisms
I think the fact his first paragraph was directed at the idea my players could pick up injuries is pretty telling about his real thoughts. At the end of the day we have no squad in this game so I don't see the point in pondering potential wear and tear since the point of the game is to see how the players we pick would perform over the course of a season. I'm confident mine would perform better. I think he suspects this as well.
I'm frankly ASTONISHED that he feels the best way to get at my team is on the flanks when I'm certain that is where he is weakest. He wants to pit Jason Wilcox against Geremi on the wings? Fine by me. He wants to have Steve Stone go against Gabriel Heinze? Your funeral, mate. If his plan to get Shearer involved is that way then the great Geordie is going to have a miserable afternoon. By the way, I'm quite confident in Brown and Ferdinand, who kept Messi and Henry quiet last year, handling eagle eye's efforts. I can't remember when Brown scored an OG last so I think that's a pretty desperate jibe on a guy who has made the PFA Team of the Year as a central defender.
Steve Stone was a sturdy no nonsense right midfield player, one of Henze's common traits at United was pulling and dragging at lightweight wide players and although he could tackle, he is not getting many opportunities to dispossess a player of the quality of Steve Stone who is well able to protect himself and the ball. I contend that Heinze is left in the position of either fouling the player or somehow getting the ball into touch, he certainly won't be footballing his way out of defence against Steve Stone when in possession, and he certainly won't be taking the ball off Steve Stone without help and the likelyhood is that he has no help for most of his games as when he is not injured, then Zenden is injured. Therefore I see a good battle with many corners/free kicks coming my way from wide on the right when Heinze is not hobbling around the place during one of his 17/18 games a season.
I explained how I am going to get the corners on the left side. I expect delivery from the right as Wilcox has a free reign with no defender of note on his side of the pitch.Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »eagle eye adds he is 'licking his lips' at the thought of getting corners and the 'aerial bombardment' on my defense. What I want to know is, how are you going to get corners and aerial bombardment when your team won't even have the ball? Or are we to believe Townsend and Makelele are going to play Arsenal-style football? I think my pairing of Petit and Carrick are more likely to do that. Your team will experience aerial bombardment alright but it will be from Robben and co. terrorising Nielsen and Wright on the wings and other teams no doubt attempting similar.
Also I think the only one licking his lips will be Shearer who will be starved of chances all game.
You bring up Arsenal style football, who said I want to play Arsenal style football? My team tactics here are a polar opposite to that type of football, firstly I expect my goals against your team when its fully fit to come from crosses, free kicks and corners and not by walking the ball into the net. Secondly I have a guy up front who can head the ball or score with both feet in Alan Shearer.
You are right though, against the right type of opposition my team can play those tactics.
The ridiculous comments above are a desperate attempt to cover the cracks in your team.Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »Summary
Over the course of a season in this draft I actually believe eagle eye's team would be lower half of the league. I doubt he'd make the relegation places as I'm sure Shearer and Beardsley would take the chances that do come their way, but good teams like mine ought to be able to dominate his limited midfield quartet, weak flanks, and goalkeeper who'd seen his best years go by.
I reckon my team would be a title contender and would be very optimistic of taking 6 points against eagle eye over the course of a season. I believe I am better in every department and I would hope the good folks of Boards would conclude the same.
I submit that my fellow dratees will be able to see far beyond your laugable comments that my team would be in the lower half of a table.
In fact with the amount of injury prone players, and with Geremi at right back and Wes Brown at center back, I submit that your team might indeed be in trouble over the course of a full season.
If you want to do a player vs player analysis you are welcome to try, but please don't forget to take marks off for injury and that would be huge in relation to your team. I believe that if I was to mark your team players out of ten while including the injury prone nature and the players out of position that your teams total team rating would be close to if not less than 50 which is pathetic.
You tried a neat trick in this draft imo in picking players who have all played in recent times so as not to run the risk of losing out because somebody doesn't remember the players. You took a further huge risk by picking players who were very injury prone. A quick glance over your team looks good, but with indepth analysis of each player your team does not stand up to the rigours of a full premier league campaign and over the course of a season you get rightly hammered many times. Your defense is particularly frail and against a solid and dependable front line of Shearer and Beardsley you will concede a large number of goals. In midfield you also fail due to the injury prone nature of both Zenden and Robben. I suggest that this leaves me free to unleash my full backs on either side for half my games over the season against you. I believe that once off with all your players fit we will have a great game but over the course of a season you have no chance.
Finally:
Clearly like any good tactician I am going to focus on your weaknesses and you have many, not alone the injuries but having players out of position. You play Wes Brown and CB, Geremi at RB, Robben at RM.Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »I think the fact his first paragraph was directed at the idea my players could pick up injuries is pretty telling about his real thoughts. At the end of the day we have no squad in this game so I don't see the point in pondering potential wear and tear since the point of the game is to see how the players we pick would perform over the course of a season.
I submit that your team is not alone weakened through injury but by having players in positions where they do not perform at their very best.0 -
Eagle EyeYikes, must have hit a nerve! I'll try and answer your points though since I've a spare hour or so.I find this laughable, first you say that Vidic and Laursen are only able to deal with a certain type of attacker. You mention you don't have a gutsy striker, I think that shows another weakness in your team. You are expecting flair to come through, I suggest your team is too frail to have any impact. Tell me where this flair will come from, you mention Robben and Zenden going for the jugular, tell me how. You are criticising imo the best right full back ever to play in the Premiership in Roland Nielsen. I have a left back full of pace on the other side which is exactly the type of guy you need to mark Robben. And that is of course on the odd occasion that both your wide players are fit enough to perform their tasks. As for your assertion that Bergkamp and Defoe are going to have a 'field day' with space, lol. Where are you seeing this space? In between Makele and my central defensive pairing?
I didn't say your central defenders were 'only able to deal with a certain type of attacker', I said they were 'better suited' to attackers that are used to using brute strength. Do you disagree? Do you think Vidic and Laursen have more class and craft than Bergkamp and Defoe? I didn't mean to suggest my strikers have no guts. I don't think anyone would accuse Bergkamp of that in particular. :cool: I'm merely noting your defenders would have an easier time against the likes of a Heskey or a Kevin Davies and not a Bergkamp or a Defoe. I stand by that. Where is the frailty in my team eagle eye? Most of them have won titles, several have won Champions Leagues and one has won a World Cup. You say you want me to show you my team's flair? Must I? Where is it lacking? Do you see my team struggling to get goals in a season? I'm criticising one of the best full-backs ever in Roland Nilsson am I? Hardly. Not even close. You claim Alan Wright is marking Robben for pace but the trouble is he won't be able to keep up with him! Where am I seeing the space you ask? Well mainly with Robben and Zenden pulling your full-backs apart. Makelele is a great holding midfielder and can tidy up a lot of problems, but not even he can fill in for two flawed full-backs and a pairing of Carrick and Petit that will dictate possession. You're asking a lot of a guy who by this stage was in his late thirties!eagle eye wrote:Geremi is not a full back. Plain and simple, he has played there but he is a midfielder. He is very average as a full back to say the least. Heinze was very good as I said during his first season, after that injury I'm afraid he has never reached that standard again and over the course of his entire career he is no better than average. How does your team do when they are both hobbling around the place along with Wes Brown?
I would take Geremi (who I got as my final pick) over your Roland Nilsson any day. I have a guy that was entrusted by Jose Mourinho of all people in the right full position. Heinze was a terrific left-back at Man Utd and is better than any of your full-backs. Probably combined. How he did over the course of his career is irrelevant as he is judged on his Premiership career which was damn good. This tactic of yours to hope for injuries for my team is most amusing since we all have to deal with 11 players only and judge them over a season. Pretty desperate imo.eagle eye wrote:You attack the legendary goalkeeper Neville Southall. I mentioned when I picked him that he was the first player in the Premier League to reach 200 appearances, hardly an achievement you would expect from someone whose past it. And be honest your assertion is just laughable anyways and probably like so many of your other attacks trying to sway the minds of those who don't remember all my players.
I don't think I 'attacked' Neville Southall. I said his best years were behind him which is my view. I think most people would share that. I'd accept prior to the Premiership he was one of the best goalkeepers around but this is a Premiership draft and in that sense he's only an average keeper in this game.eagle eye wrote:In midfield you have a strong central pairing, that is if I am going to attack up the centre. You have two deep lying midfielders, I will keep them busy with Andy Townsend buzzing around the pitch and Beardsley coming deeper from time to time. However there is nothing attack minded about your midfield at all and I am certain that my midfield pairing negates any attacking threat through the middle. So now you are back to the two frail wide men again.
I liked Andy Townsend as much as any Irish fan but if you're telling me he is going to single-handedly keep Michael Carrick and Emmanuel Petit quiet then I think you're being extremely optimistic, and dare I say it deluded. Beardsley is going to help him is he? Sure mate well that negates him from causing me problems high up the pitch. I agree Townsend will be 'buzzing' around the pitch alright but only as he chases Petit and Carrick passing the ball about the park. Also how are Robben and Zenden frail when they were both established internationals for Holland?
Let's add that we are judging this over a season. Will this be your tactic for other games against other teams? Defensive play?eagle eye wrote:Its very important that your team stand the test of a full season, you are trying to dismiss this but you can't. I mentioned five players who will have problems in this department. You have no defense for this, in fact three of them are defenders and the other two are your wide men which leaves you trying to beat me through the centre and thats not going to happen.
I'm not dismissing anything. The rules of the game are as stated. You seem to want to pray that my team catches injuries. You might as well suggest doping them before a game in the hope they fail a drug test! Let's stick to the rules and judge the teams over a season. I'm not afraid to pit my team against yours. Also I won't be trying to beat you through the centre eagle eye, although if I did I still believe I have the advantage.eagle eye wrote:I have shown in my formation that Beardsley will play in the hole. Beardsley can beat anybody on his own, that ability means defenders have to stand off him a bit and this allows him the room to create, he needed very little room to create(note 23 assists in 93/94). I have the best striker in the business in Alan Shearer, he does not need many opportunities to put the ball in the net. Its laughable that you think Wes Brown will be able to prevent anything, imo he is more likely to make mistakes and create chances for Sherer and Beardsley and the only result of this is goals for my team. Without a tough tackling central defender you have no hope of stopping my attacking threat through the middle but I don't even need to go through the middle due to the acres of space I will have out wide with your players hobbling around the place half the time.
Beardsley is in a hole alright, but only due to your tactics. Wes Brown did pretty well against Lionel Messi last season at centre-back but you think Beardsley will best him do you? Rio Ferdinand meanwhile isn't going to be intimidated by any forwards. I respect your front pairing as I said previously, but without service they can't harm me. You already intimated in a previous post that you want Beardsley to help out Townsend in central midfield so that sounds like Shearer will be left all alone up top. As for my players hobbling, I think my defense will be very well rested from the sound of things.eagle eye wrote:You mention a game where Brown and Ferdinand had a clean sheet. Firstly it was a Champion's League game and is irrelevant to this Premier League draft. Its also one game and over the course of a campaign the defensive errors of Wes Brown at center back will be costly, again when he is not hobbling around the place.
It's not irrelevant at all to point out that Ferdinand and Brown have been able to deal with arguably the most impressive attacking outfit on the planet. You see fit to try and besmirch Wes Brown at centre-back when he has been a PFA Team of the Year member there and done admirably whenever Fergie has used him there. I am in good hands.eagle eye wrote:Jason Wilcox was a fantastic left midfielder/winger, you don't have a defender on that side of the field, and you are expecting Geremi who is a midfielder to negate this threat when he is not hobbling around the park. On his very best day Geremi would not stop Jason Wilcox.
Steve Stone was a sturdy no nonsense right midfield player, one of Henze's common traits at United was pulling and dragging at lightweight wide players and although he could tackle, he is not getting many opportunities to dispossess a player of the quality of Steve Stone who is well able to protect himself and the ball. I contend that Heinze is left in the position of either fouling the player or somehow getting the ball into touch, he certainly won't be footballing his way out of defence against Steve Stone when in possession, and he certainly won't be taking the ball off Steve Stone without help and the likelyhood is that he has no help for most of his games as when he is not injured, then Zenden is injured. Therefore I see a good battle with many corners/free kicks coming my way from wide on the right when Heinze is not hobbling around the place during one of his 17/18 games a season.
If Jose Mourinho had faced up to the prospect of Wilcox facing Geremi I do not think he'd be worried. Neither am I. Steve Stone was an average to good player in my view. For me Heinze was a great to terrific left-back. There really is no concern for me in this area of the field.
Again you keep focusing on the one-on-one element but I'd like you to explain how Wilcox and Stone will provide ammunition for Shearer over the course of a season. I don't think they would, nor indeed against my team.eagle eye wrote:I explained how I am going to get the corners on the left side. I expect delivery from the right as Wilcox has a free reign with no defender of note on his side of the pitch.
You bring up Arsenal style football, who said I want to play Arsenal style football? My team tactics here are a polar opposite to that type of football, firstly I expect my goals against your team when its fully fit to come from crosses, free kicks and corners and not by walking the ball into the net. Secondly I have a guy up front who can head the ball or score with both feet in Alan Shearer.
You are right though, against the right type of opposition my team can play those tactics.
See, here is a telling problem that you somewhat acknowledge. You say you won't play Arsenal-style football - which will be my aim incidentally - and yet you expect your 'polar opposite' type of football, which I'm guessing will be route 1 style football, to work. One problem though - how are you going to do that when you won't have the ball? You admitted earlier that you plan to have Beardsley help out Townsend so that suggests you'll play long spells with Shearer up front on his own. My duo of Carrick and Petit will be delighted to just keep the ball and pick you apart at will down the flanks. Picture if you will Petit and Carrick spraying balls down the lines dragging Wright and Nilsson across whilst Bergkamp and Defoe lurk in the centre. You would be in big trouble my friend.
Your tactics will not work well over the course of a season or against me.eagle eye wrote:The ridiculous comments above are a desperate attempt to cover the cracks in your team.
I submit that my fellow dratees will be able to see far beyond your laugable comments that my team would be in the lower half of a table.
In fact with the amount of injury prone players, and with Geremi at right back and Wes Brown at center back, I submit that your team might indeed be in trouble over the course of a full season.
If you want to do a player vs player analysis you are welcome to try, but please don't forget to take marks off for injury and that would be huge in relation to your team. I believe that if I was to mark your team players out of ten while including the injury prone nature and the players out of position that your teams total team rating would be close to if not less than 50 which is pathetic.
I don't know what you find ridiculous. I gave a detailed view on the strengths and weaknesses of your team and concluded I would finish significantly higher in a league table. I stand by that. You have offered me nothing to make me change my mind. In fact your tactics seem to suggest you accept my analysis that my team would dominate the possession and force you to limit your own attack. Your main criticism of my team seems to centre around this notion of them picking up injuries!eagle eye wrote:You tried a neat trick in this draft imo in picking players who have all played in recent times so as not to run the risk of losing out because somebody doesn't remember the players. You took a further huge risk by picking players who were very injury prone. A quick glance over your team looks good, but with indepth analysis of each player your team does not stand up to the rigours of a full premier league campaign and over the course of a season you get rightly hammered many times. Your defense is particularly frail and against a solid and dependable front line of Shearer and Beardsley you will concede a large number of goals. In midfield you also fail due to the injury prone nature of both Zenden and Robben. I suggest that this leaves me free to unleash my full backs on either side for half my games over the season against you. I believe that once off with all your players fit we will have a great game but over the course of a season you have no chance.
I didn't take risks at all. I was completely honest throughout the draft when I said my intention was to create a team that oozed class and could play good, attacking football. I think everyone recalls this. That was my aim and I'm happy with the results. I think you have tried to do a bit of a smoke and mirrors act actually by hyping up players that made little impact in the grand scheme of things. For instance trying to convince people that the likes of Nilsson, Wilcox, Wright, Stone etc are world beaters. They aren't. Not even close.
Over the course of a season I feel my team will score plenty and concede little. That is why I feel my team will finish around the top. I think your team has areas that other sides could exploit and punish. You remind me a lot of the modern-day Newcastle really. It's all well and good for them to have Michael Owen but with little support he can only do so much. Similarly it's all well and good you having Shearer but likewise he can only do so much with limited service. I reckon your team would be a Bolton-style outfit. Limited tactics and style, and attempting to deal with other teams' style rather than focusing on your own style, like my team.eagle eye wrote:Finally:
Clearly like any good tactician I am going to focus on your weaknesses and you have many, not alone the injuries but having players out of position. You play Wes Brown and CB, Geremi at RB, Robben at RM.
I submit that your team is not alone weakened through injury but by having players in positions where they do not perform at their very best.
In all honesty a good tactician would not try to go at me along the wings when this is your problem area. Wes Brown has been praised for his service at centre-back, Geremi operated well at right-back for Mourinho and I'd like to remind you that Robben, as I've outlined numerous times, will be used on both flanks by me as he was used at Chelsea. In fact Robben will be very important to me against your weak full-backs.
As I noted above, you have acknowledged the need to bring Beardsley into play in order to deal with my midfield which indicates you'd have Shearer living off scraps up top on his own. You've also said you will pit your full-backs like-for-like against my wingers which to me is near-suicidal (though you want Geremi to help) and you expect Andy Townsend to sort out Carrick and Petit pretty much single-handedly (with Beardsley as sidekick).
As all of this takes place, Denis Bergkamp is going to be rubbing his hands together with glee at the prospect of all that free space with Geremi being dragged off to assist his weak full-backs and Townsend running about after the ball with Carrick and Petit keeping possession.
Now that I think of it I note you never mentioned Bergkamp or Defoe when talking about how you'd deal with my team. Or do you expect them to pick up injuries too?
At the end of the day if this is your strategy of dealing with me then presumably you'll do so against other teams and that kind of negative, hoof-the-ball stuff isn't going to see you top half eagle eye, but lower-half as I suggested before.0 -
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Eagle Eyeeagle eye wrote:I don't know what age you are or how much your memory is of his whole career. He was magnificent at Blackburn for his whole time there and then went on to prove himself again at Leeds during their Premier League years.
I'm old enough to have seen Steve Stone and Jason Wilcox play
Wilcox didn't break into the team until he was 22/23, 4 years after joining the club. He played 6 seasons, only 4 of which were as a first choice player.
Stone played a mere 5 seasons of top level football, his others being hampered by injury.I rate Wicox and Stone, you don't rate them. Alex Ferguson rated Steve Stone by the way as I've said earlier. He was very close to buying him.
Yes and AF decided against him based on his injury record.0 -
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Eagle Eyeno. your ratings are an overly biased farce no matter how well u present them. u are giving ur team ratings they dont deserve and the MNG team over the top low ratings.
if im to be perfectly honest, i think what you are doing amounts to propaganda and should be part of this competition. it definitely doesnt seem in the spirit of it anyway
i dont have anything against you either, i think ur generally a good poster. im just giving my view... and mr alan can testify to my lack of bias 0 -
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