Non- Nationals

veronica

Can someone please explain to me why so many Irish are losing there jobs and yet there are so many non-nationals still in work? This to me is absolutely crazy in that Irish nationals should have the pick of the jobs first and if they refuse then non-nationals should be offered the job. Also state benefit for non-nationals should be for one year after this nothing please return home and no child benefit, rent allowance, or any other benefit after one year. We should also close down refugee centres all over the country and take away their free mobile phone, free cars, shuttle buses, allowances and return them home. This money should then be given to the Carers association, Simon shelters, rape Crisis centres, ISPCC etc., It's time to bring down the shutters on these Vampires and look after our own and all this should be brought in in the next Budget. Thank u for your help during the Celtic tiger but you have been well paid and we cannot support u anymore! I know I am going to have the bleeding hearts saying I am a racist but talking about these issues does not make u a racist but a realist ...we are in a depression and non-nationals, refugees should be a burden on their own country not ours. As Dunnes stores logo goes the difference is we are Irish we are not a bottomless pitch for other countries to take advantage of. Let the debate begin now.

spudington16

IBTL.

Mena

veronica wrote: »

Can someone please explain to me why so many Irish are losing there jobs and yet there are so many non-nationals still in work?

What do you base this assumption on? From every media report I have seen, foreign nationals are losing their jobs at a higher rate than their Irish counterparts.

Is this just an observation you've made? Are you lumping EU citizens into the "non national" group as well or only targeting non eu/non Irish nationals?

veronica wrote: »

This to me is absolutely crazy in that Irish nationals should have the pick of the jobs first and if they refuse then non-nationals should be offered the job.

This is the case with non-EU citizens already.

veronica wrote: »

Also state benefit for non-nationals should be for one year after this nothing please return home and no child benefit, rent allowance, or any other benefit after one year.

I am going to have to assume you're not factoring in other EU non-nationals here because I can't seriously believe you're advocating chucking them out. Removing Ireland from the EU is another thread I would imagine.

The problem you then face is the massive amounts of "different" non-EU nationals currently in Ireland. From migrant workers on work visa's to migrants on permanent residency visa's. Are you saying that those who have lawfully attained permanent residence should be turfed out?

veronica wrote: »

We should also close down refugee centres all over the country and take away their free mobile phone, free cars, shuttle buses, allowances and return them home.

Why are you bringing asylum seekers into this debate? They are not permitted to work so this is a totally new topic of discussion. Are you saying Ireland should withdraw from the Geneva convention?

As to your point about free cars, mobile phones etc, all I will say is I cannot stomach to argue this point as to be fair, this is plain wrong and you damn well know it. There are no free cars/phones etc. Get some facts before coming here and ranting.

veronica wrote: »

This money should then be given to the Carers association, Simon shelters, rape Crisis centres, ISPCC etc., It's time to bring down the shutters on these Vampires and look after our own and all this should be brought in in the next Budget.

Personally I don't appreciate being called a Vampire thank you. I've contributed well over my fair share of taxes to the state in the nine years I have been here.

veronica

yes just go to any refugee centre and u will see them come out after their three free square meals a day and get into 99-2004 cars and just look at the Nigerians driving our taxis 2008/ 2009 cars and in this country for between 4-5 years. How could they get a bank loan? Enough is Enough Irish people for irish Jobs.

peasant

veronica wrote: »

Can someone please explain to me why so many Irish are losing there jobs and yet there are so many non-nationals still in work? .

Possibly because you've been so pre-occupied with Gucci handbags, moccachinos and your holiday home in Spain that you forgot what "work" actually is?

seanybiker

yawn. This topic is to old.

Mena

veronica wrote: »

yes just go to any refugee centre and u will see them come out after their three free square meals a day and get into 99-2004 cars

So an asylum seeker is by definition poor?

veronica wrote: »

and just look at the Nigerians driving our taxis 2008/ 2009 cars and in this country for between 4-5 years. How could they get a bank loan?

By showing a good credit rating and an ability to repay said loan? It's not rocket science but if you can't understand it, I could spell it out in simpler terms for you.

veronica wrote: »

Enough is Enough Irish people for irish Jobs.

Please. I call troll here. Nobody with an ounce of intelligence could spout this crap.

dvpower

veronica wrote: »

yes just go to any refugee centre and u will see them come out after their three free square meals a day and get into 99-2004 cars and just look at the Nigerians driving our taxis 2008/ 2009 cars and in this country for between 4-5 years. How could they get a bank loan? Enough is Enough Irish people for irish Jobs.

I was wondering when the xenophobes would start crawling out of the woodwork.

mikemac

Are there not 4-5 open threads on boards already for taxi drivers to rant on?

seanybiker

mikemac wrote: »

Are there not 4-5 open threads on boards already for taxi drivers to rant on?

Theres more than that.

Winter

By this argument, surely this means that all the Irish who have ever emigrated should also be returned back to Ireland from the countries where they currently reside.

I fancy if that occured, you would have exactly the same problems with not enough jobs for everyone who wants/needs one

.. yawn!

veronica

If EU Non-nationals are losing there jobs then why are they staying here if not only for the fact that the benefits are better here. why don'they go home. Wake up please we cannot afford these spongers anymore it's crazy that anybody living here and not a resident should get any benefit. look at our schools special needs children are to lose 1,000 teachers next september and yet non-national kids are to keep their special english teachers... this is madness and child benefit also going out of this country millions a year... for god sake are u people for real you want us this country go bankrupt because of these spongers!

peasant

veronica wrote: »

it's crazy that anybody living here and not a resident ...

NEWSFLASH
Anybody living here for more than six month IS a resident

Wipe the foam off your mouth and get your terminology right at least.

mike65

veronica what is a non national? We all come from somewhere.

veronica

Regarding the Irish abroad. irish people always spent money in the coutry they live in...the local pub, supermarket etc., they contribute to the economy but lets take the Polish they spend nothing here they even have their own supermarkets wire money home and benefits. They bring in dangerous cars onto our roads no NCT, No Tax, No repairs, taken money out of this state and into their own they don't care about us they only care about themselves. Now I am not saying all Non-Nationals are the same the French, German, are not spongers when work runs out they do return home.

ongarite

The so called spongers are you call them, have the same exact rights to claim benefits here if they have worked for 2 years and paid their PRSI.
They are Irish tax-payers, working hard in probably crappy jobs and deserve the benefits they can get if they lose their jobs.

peasant

veronica wrote: »

Now I am not saying all Non-Nationals are the same the German, are not spongers when work runs out they do return home.

I'm still here

ongarite

veronica wrote: »

Regarding the Irish abroad. irish people always spent money in the coutry they live in...the local pub, supermarket etc., they contribute to the economy but lets take the Polish they spend nothing here they even have their own supermarkets wire money home and benefits. They bring in dangerous cars onto our roads no NCT, No Tax, No repairs, taken money out of this state and into their own they don't care about us they only care about themselves. Now I am not saying all Non-Nationals are the same the French, German, are not spongers when work runs out they do return home.

:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:
The flip are you on? If they shop and spend in Ireland, that income tax, VAT, PRSI, rental, business rate income that they are all paying.

You know you sound like a American, Oz right wing weirdo complaining about the Irish illegals abroad.

You are a quite frankly an idiot..

mikemac

mike65 wrote: »

veronica what is a non national? We all come from somewhere.

Fair point but people use it as the Government, RTE and the newspapers constantly use it.
it's not suprising that many people picked it up, I use the term no problems anyway

ongarite

obligatory South Park video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q2fGl9587X8

Mena

mikemac wrote: »

Fair point but people use it as the Government, RTE and the newspapers constantly use it.
it's not suprising that many people picked it up, I use the term no problems anyway

I'm a non-national, the term does not bother me at all, so feel free to use it.

OP, you've ignored many of my points raised in my first two posts. Please go back and answer them.

veronica

Well I am glad to see that must of you bleeding hearts are still in Jobs and hope u will continue to do so but don't blame me if u do or our government just look around u as our country has been taken over the Invasion of the Body snatchers ....polish, LT, Nigerians. I hope your children will get a job when they finish school and I hope your parents will get a hospital bed when they need one. I wish I could go around with blinkers on just like u. thanks for the one sided debate but maybe when u start to live in the real world of today we can debate some more.

DenMan

Don't be so harsh on the OP guys. They are some valid and realistic points she is making. Ireland needs to look at and adress it's immigration status. For me personally I lived and worked in Malta up until a few years ago. There is no such thing as benefits for European member's who wish to live there. In fact you have to be a resident of the state for three years in order to be entitled to 50 euro a week there (European members only). Malta has huge problems with Libyan nationals who are living there in great numbers (due to the close contact both nations have enjoyed since Gaddafi's deal in the 80's).

The way the economy is going here right now a lot of people will be complaining about the foreign nationals in this country. Having been one myself and worked from the ground up I can see how some people would react that way. I am not like that myself and have just returned to full time education last Sept. Right now it is the best place to be.

peasant

veronica wrote: »

thanks for the one sided debate

oh the ironing

Yes, thank you indeed !

Alessandra

veronica wrote: »

Regarding the Irish abroad. irish people always spent money in the coutry they live in...the local pub, supermarket etc., they contribute to the economy but lets take the Polish they spend nothing here they even have their own supermarkets wire money home and benefits. They bring in dangerous cars onto our roads no NCT, No Tax, No repairs, taken money out of this state and into their own they don't care about us they only care about themselves. Now I am not saying all Non-Nationals are the same the French, German, are not spongers when work runs out they do return home.

Sorry but I have seen Polish buying things in Irish shops before.. Is their tax money not as good as ours or something?
This kind of bigotry irks me.. You cannot generalise. These people were enticed to Ireland in the boom and have made lives for themselves here and paid their due. I think there are many Irish who have emigrated who sent money home because they had to. It is not some big conspiracy bye Polish or any other nationality. Why should they give up their jobs? Totally unreasonable post tbh.

ongarite

DenMan wrote: »

For me personally I lived and worked in Malta up until a few years ago. There is no such thing as benefits for European member's who wish to live there. In fact you have to be a resident of the state for three years in order to be entitled to 50 euro a week there (European members only). Malta has huge problems with Libyan nationals who are living there in great numbers (due to the close contact both nations have enjoyed since Gaddafi's deal in the 80's).

There are no benefits in Ireland either for EU workers until they have been working >21 months and paid enough PRSI contributions.

Dannyboy83

veronica wrote: »

Can someone please explain to me why so many Irish are losing there jobs and yet there are so many non-nationals still in work? This to me is absolutely crazy in that Irish nationals should have the pick of the jobs first and if they refuse then non-nationals should be offered the job. Also state benefit for non-nationals should be for one year after this nothing please return home and no child benefit, rent allowance, or any other benefit after one year. We should also close down refugee centres all over the country and take away their free mobile phone, free cars, shuttle buses, allowances and return them home. This money should then be given to the Carers association, Simon shelters, rape Crisis centres, ISPCC etc., It's time to bring down the shutters on these Vampires and look after our own and all this should be brought in in the next Budget. Thank u for your help during the Celtic tiger but you have been well paid and we cannot support u anymore! I know I am going to have the bleeding hearts saying I am a racist but talking about these issues does not make u a racist but a realist ...we are in a depression and non-nationals, refugees should be a burden on their own country not ours. As Dunnes stores logo goes the difference is we are Irish we are not a bottomless pitch for other countries to take advantage of. Let the debate begin now.

There is no debate.

To make such proposals, you clearly don't have the foggiest iota about economics or law.


I'm not going to tackle the refugee issue, just the non-nationals issue:

1) If they people contribute to our tax system and our social welfare system, then they are entitled to the same benefits.

2) If we remove that right, then we legally have to give them back every cent of tax they've paid, that would bankrupt the country a lot quicker.

3) If you remove the support system, where people are living on the street and have nothing to eat, they will turn to crime. The Irish gangsters were by far the most profligate in the US. The Irish gangsters did most of the dirty work for the Italian Mob, just the mafia were more organised but none were more ruthless than the Irish

4) What will we do if our country goes tits up and we need to export people?

5) Lots of the non-nationals have already been ripped off by Irish people anyway. Why do you think the Poles have posters on their building sites - "No dogs and No Irish"

6) What ever happened to Irish hospitality?

7) By importing young people into this country, in the short term its harder but in the long run, when jobs return, its economically much more sound. Otherwise there will be a tiny bunch of middle class Irish supporting a growing mass of Irish pensioners.


There are millions of issues

mike65

The OP is just ranting though,

It's time to bring down the shutters on these Vampires

an EU citizen is free to stay, they can't be turfed out. Many from other nations will be domiciled. So the "throw em out" (or should I say throw us out) argument is a nonsense.

Mena

DenMan wrote: »

Don't be so harsh on the OP guys. They are some valid and realistic points she is making.

Point them out. Is it perhaps all the free cars and mobiles the asylum seekers get, as she claims? Or perhaps the "fact" that all the Irish are losing their jobs to foreign nationals?

I'm all for debate, and immigration should be discussed, but you cannot debate when the opposing side uses sweeping generalisations, mistruth, rumour and lies and won't budge from the untenable position.

Dannyboy83

veronica wrote: »

Well I am glad to see that must of you bleeding hearts are still in Jobs and hope u will continue to do so but don't blame me if u do or our government just look around u as our country has been taken over the Invasion of the Body snatchers ....polish, LT, Nigerians. I hope your children will get a job when they finish school and I hope your parents will get a hospital bed when they need one. I wish I could go around with blinkers on just like u. thanks for the one sided debate but maybe when u start to live in the real world of today we can debate some more.

I'm gobsmacked to be honest.
No shame in being ignorant, shameful to defend the ignorance tho.

Could you please outline the ideas and benefits:

Why should non-nationals NOT be allowed to work here?
What are the benefits for Ireland?

veronica

Why should Non Nationals be entitlied to any benefits after two years here can they not get it at home and when they return apply for a rebate of their PRSI. We gave them a job with a wage is this not enough and rent allowances, child benefit, free hospital cover if they needed it for them and their families. Come on now especially Poles it's time u moved on have a bit of dignity and stop bleeding oue system!