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Double standard,football and tv.

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2

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    #32
    invincibleirish
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,219 ✭✭✭invincibleirish


    Eventually the PL and everyone else will come up with an Itunes for football that is the ultimate solution to this current gap between product offered and wanted. The rightsholders have not kept up with the times.

    In the meantime no one loses when people get to see their team play online when they otherwise would not.
    NekkidBibleMan wrote: »



    Yeah, great. See also:

    We just want to watch a new movie, killjoys.
    We just want to listen to the latest albums, killjoys.
    We just want to play free videogames, killjoys.

    Not really applicable, you can buy all those here. There is no facility for people to watch their team if the rights holders are not televising it here. They can watch it on the internet as a substitute.


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    #33
    Spear
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Help & Feedback Category Moderators Posts: 25,315 CMod ✭✭✭✭Spear


    5starpool wrote: »
    Yes, but it is a legal issue for the sites hosting them not to the sites linking to it.

    That was Pirate Bay's defence and they're still looking at the possibility of prison time. If linking to illegal material is tolerated, what's the difference beteen boards.ie and TPB?


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    #34
    5starpool
    Subscribers Posts: 32,855 ✭✭✭✭5starpool


    DeVore wrote: »
    There are no definites in the world of law but we have been given very clear assurances that we are not responsible for the legality of what is linked to on Boards.
    .
    .
    .
    DeV.
    5starpool wrote: »
    Yes, but it is a legal issue for the sites hosting them not to the sites linking to it.
    Spear wrote: »
    That was Pirate Bay's defence and they're still looking at the possibility of prison time. If linking to illegal material is tolerated, what's the difference beteen boards.ie and TPB?

    .


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    #35
    Dont be at yourself
    Registered Users Posts: 10,581 ✭✭✭✭Dont be at yourself


    5starpool wrote:
    Yes, but it is a legal issue for the sites hosting them not to the sites linking to it.

    I'm not sure that that has been tested in court. However, numerous sites linking to content hosted on justin.tv or ustream etc have had cease-and-desists from rights-holders.
    There have been 'legal' issues before that cannot be (rightly) discussed on boards, but people have been encouraged to write about it in a blog and link it in their sig. How is that much different?

    Is it then OK to link to torrent sites and so on? There is a line somewhere, and boards.ie needs to be careful not to overstep it. Better to be over-cautious on an issue like this than not.

    The games boards have a zero-tolerance policy on linking or discussing warez. The film and music boards are equally heavy-handed. The TV boards go as far to prohibit the mentioning of .torrent filenames. Why should the soccer forum exist in a bubble?

    What benefit does linking to dodgy content bring to boards? If the links are legal, let them stay. If they're linking to illegal streams, then delete the posts. Legally and morally, it's the way to go.


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    #36
    Dont be at yourself
    Registered Users Posts: 10,581 ✭✭✭✭Dont be at yourself


    Invincible Irish wrote:
    Eventually the PL and everyone else will come up with an Itunes for football that is the ultimate solution to this current gap between product offered and wanted. The rightsholders have not kept up with the times.

    Hey, guess what? UEFA, Sky and Setanta do stream football online. But, you know, you have to pay for it. Just like you pay for stuff on iTunes. They're not going to 'wake up' to a business model of spending billions on rights and giving them away to cheapskates on the internet. It's you who needs to wake up.

    It's a horribly naive and self-centered view to think that 'oh well, that's how the market's going now, the rights holders need to wake up to it.' The emergence of P2P and bittorrent over the last 5-10 years may have led to people expecting to get everything they want for free. However, companies - and more to the point, the people they employ - rely on money from TV subscriptions, cinema tickets, album sales, videogame sales, TV deals, advertising and so on.


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    #37
    Helix
    Closed Accounts Posts: 17,661 ✭✭✭✭Helix


    Spear wrote: »
    Setanta do streaming on their own sites. These are the only sites legally permitted to do so.


    sky stream sky sports for anyone who has an account with them


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    #38
    invincibleirish
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,219 ✭✭✭invincibleirish


    Are they not just streaming their TV channels or are they actually showing all the games?


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    #39
    Mossy Monk
    Closed Accounts Posts: 28,128 ✭✭✭✭Mossy Monk


    Just their channels.


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    #40
    invincibleirish
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,219 ✭✭✭invincibleirish


    NekkidBibleMan wrote: »
    Hey, guess what? UEFA, Sky and Setanta do stream football online. But, you know, you have to pay for it. Just like you pay for stuff on iTunes. They're not going to 'wake up' to a business model of spending billions on rights and giving them away to cheapskates on the internet. It's you who needs to wake up.

    Yeah but you can't watch most of the games i want to watch on UEFA, Sky & Setantas website. No domestic broadcaster shows them. In time the clubs & the PL will come up online season tickets.


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    #41
    Dont be at yourself
    Registered Users Posts: 10,581 ✭✭✭✭Dont be at yourself


    Yeah but you can't watch most of the games i want to watch on UEFA, Sky & Setantas website. No domestic broadcaster shows them. In time the clubs & the PL will come up online season tickets.

    There are reasons why broadcasters don't broadcast every game by every team. For one, the football associations will not allow it - they've been very delicate in managing the impact of TV on attendances at the ground. It would be fantastic if we could buy a 'season ticket' for our favourite team, to watch all their games live. In time broadcasters may move that way.

    Until then, however, the answer is not to resort to watching the games illegally. And if that is the solution, at least have the courtesy not to put a website like boards.ie in jeopardy when a simple google-search will throw up the links you're looking for.


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    #42
    redout
    Registered Users Posts: 11,435 ✭✭✭✭redout


    The Setanta links are more often than not the United States Setanta and not the the Irish one. Sky Sports links ? not that I have seen.


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    #43
    opr
    Registered Users Posts: 8,267 ✭✭✭opr


    If someone comes into my kitchen and steals a knife then goes and stabs someone with it. Lets say i didn't lock my kitchen door can i be held responsible in any part for the stabbing ?

    Opr


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    #44
    SantryRed
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,224 ✭✭✭✭SantryRed


    I've seen many Sky Sports links. Loads for the Carling Cup Final last weekend.

    I don't understand how boards wouldn't be on dodgy ground. Take the Liverpool game last weekend. That game was available on Setanta Sports 1 and not Setanta Ireland which is the freeview channel on normal NTL.

    Instead of people paying subscriptions to watch the game legit, there was many streams put up in that thread. How is that legal?


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    #45
    invincibleirish
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,219 ✭✭✭invincibleirish


    NekkidBibleMan wrote: »
    There are reasons why broadcasters don't broadcast every game by every team. For one, the football associations will not allow it - they've been very delicate in managing the impact of TV on attendances at the ground. It would be fantastic if we could buy a 'season ticket' for our favourite team, to watch all their games live. In time broadcasters may move that way.

    Until then, however, the answer is not to resort to watching the games illegally. And if that is the solution, at least have the courtesy not to put a website like boards.ie in jeopardy when a simple google-search will throw up the links you're looking for.

    Hang on you're deeming it illegal, not boards. Online season tickets will come in time or similar deals like they have for NFL and the like.

    In the meantime i can't see any reason why the practice can't continue, particularly as other sites like you mention have the links, if they can post them then so can boards.


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    #46
    tony1kenobi
    Registered Users Posts: 3,748 ✭✭✭tony1kenobi


    opr wrote: »
    If someone comes into my kitchen and steals a knife then goes and stabs someone with it. Lets say i didn't lock my kitchen door can i be held responsible in any part for the stabbing ?

    Opr

    Yes, unless you were uploading live sporting events from television to the internet at the time. Then it's a grey area.


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    #47
    SantryRed
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,224 ✭✭✭✭SantryRed


    I don't think online season tickets will ever come about for people living in the UK unless it costs more than a season ticket for going to games.


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    #48
    DeVore
    Business & Finance Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 32,387 Mod ✭✭✭✭DeVore


    Your understand of what is and isnt legal is very relevant if we were living in your head, unfortunately what is and isnt legal in the real world is considerably different to what people "presume". Often to our detriment as a society... :/

    The server which serves the content is the issue here. As I understand it (and I am not a lawyer) the offence occurs when the material is rendered on your screen. Until then its 1s and 0s. (This is certainly how it is for paedophile material).

    We are not in any way shape or form involved in the request for the data, nor for the subsequent serving of the data. None of it comes through our servers nor is it stored on our servers nor is it transmitted through our servers. Technically we are simply not involved in the requesting or transmission of copywritten material.

    We are not required by law to ensure anything we are linking to is copywritten, we are only required to manage what is stored and transmitted from our servers. At the very most we may have a duty of care not to "aid and abet" but I have made it clear that if anything is brought to our attention as being copywritten, we will act upon it. That however, is a moral/ethical decision which we take. It is not, to the best of my knowledge and our legal advice, a legal requirement.

    You could ask this on the Legal Discussion forum if you wanted too, I'm sure they could point you the right way to some further reading.

    DeV.
    ps: this thread wont see out the night.


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    #49
    joe123
    Registered Users Posts: 6,521 ✭✭✭joe123


    cuppa wrote: »
    Just wondering every week there are links put up for football matches in the soccer forum.
    Now if someone put up a link for a tv show it would be closed.
    Can some one tell me the difference.

    rgds
    Cuppa

    What the hell was the point in making this post?? My god some people :mad:


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    #50
    SantryRed
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,224 ✭✭✭✭SantryRed


    DeVore wrote: »
    We are not in any way shape or form involved in the request for the data, nor for the subsequent serving of the data.

    I could be reading this wrong but what if someone leaves a post saying any streams lads? Followed by someone giving them the link. Is that not being involved in the request of data?


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    #51
    Charlie
    Registered Users Posts: 9,813 ✭✭✭Charlie


    Threads like these, and the nosey neighbours that occupy them, make me very sad indeed. :(


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    #52
    Headshot
    Registered Users Posts: 54,361 ✭✭✭✭Headshot


    Charlie wrote: »
    Threads like these, and the nosey neighbours that occupy them, make me very sad indeed. :(

    panda.gif
    Im a sad panda too


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    #53
    Ponster
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 10,912 Mod ✭✭✭✭Ponster


    DeVore wrote: »
    At the very most we may have a duty of care not to "aid and abet" but I have made it clear that if anything is brought to our attention as being copywritten, we will act upon it. That however, is a moral/ethical decision which we take. It is not, to the best of my knowledge and our legal advice, a legal requirement.


    I think that the OP's question was why streaming sports channels were allowed but not streaming tv/movies. Are you saying that the decision to allow a link to a site which streams movies (cams, dvdrips, whatever) is ok as long as the mod of that forum has deemed it to be ok ?


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    #54
    cuppa
    Registered Users Posts: 538 ✭✭✭cuppa


    joe123 wrote: »
    What the hell was the point in making this post?? My god some people :mad:

    My point was you can link to sports streams and not tv streams.
    Wasent talking about torrents.


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    #55
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Can people not listen to Dev?

    It's legal to post links (to anyything!) as long as they don't go through your server.

    None of the soccer links are actually hosted by boards or their server.

    Boards DECIDED not to allow TV shows/films/etc. And ALLOWED live streaming to games that are not easily accessible.

    Boards is not, nor will ever be a democracy. It's a private site. Their choice.

    My 2c.

    Now, can someone stop this stupid thread?


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    #56
    RuggieBear
    Registered Users Posts: 17,958 ✭✭✭✭RuggieBear


    when a sport is broadcast you nearly always see a copyright to the broadcaster at the end of the broadcast.

    pubs trying to show football from foreign satellite might be similar(maybe?):
    http://archives.tcm.ie/businesspost/2008/08/24/story35282.asp


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    #57
    mayordenis
    Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 9,634 Mod ✭✭✭✭mayordenis


    wow, you like it, everyone else likes it,
    but yet you want it banned?
    Are you looking for browny points or something?

    capital idea.


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    #58
    DeVore
    Business & Finance Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 32,387 Mod ✭✭✭✭DeVore


    Papa... I despair. My linguistics are clearly not up to this but I will try one more time.



    1. If its illegal, anywhere on the site, report it and it will be deleted.

    2. Some things are not illegal, you can link them.

    3. Preemtively we ban Bittorrent links to music and tv and warez out of hand because they are almost always point to illegal files. The links themselves are not illegal (currently).

    4. We dont HAVE to do #3 but we choose to because its good citizenship imho.

    DeV.


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    #59
    cuppa
    Registered Users Posts: 538 ✭✭✭cuppa


    I never said i wanted it banned, nothing wrong with talking about.
    Anyhow the mods were all ready talking about it in the backround.

    They said its the mod's choice, I know i wont be reporting any links.


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    #60
    Ponster
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 10,912 Mod ✭✭✭✭Ponster


    DeVore wrote: »
    If its illegal, anywhere on the site, report it and it will be deleted.

    And risk the wrath of the poker mods... no thanks :)


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    #61
    oleras
    Registered Users Posts: 2,724 ✭✭✭oleras


    DeVore wrote: »
    Papa... I despair. My linguistics are clearly not up to this but I will try one more time.



    1. If its illegal, anywhere on the site, report it and it will be deleted.

    2. Some things are not illegal, you can link them.

    3. Preemtively we ban Bittorrent links to music and tv and warez out of hand because they are almost always point to illegal files. The links themselves are not illegal (currently).

    4. We dont HAVE to do #3 but we choose to because its good citizenship imho.

    DeV.

    #3...just ask to be put on the cousinlinks...:pac:

    yeah, if you dont know its not really that funny.


This discussion has been closed.
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