** Police officer shot dead in Armagh

Red Sleeping Beauty

Bond-007 wrote: »

They are correct, it is the United Kingdom.

The United Kingdom is made up of Great Britain and Northern Ireland. That's what is on their passports.

sylvestersuntan wrote: »

Mass unemployment, sensless killing north of the boarder.
All the old memories of life during the 80's and early 90's in Ireland are coming flooding back, and I dont like it!
The next few years are gonna be some shock to the system for anyone under 25!

Vincent Browne said something similar tonight on his show. Things are not looking good at all.

iseethelight

I really hope this doesn't mean the ira will come out of retirement to 'protect' Sinn Fein and the peace process.

God forbid they return to the darkness the decent people up there don't deserve it.

segaBOY

Dannyboy83 wrote: »

Important that you understand this clearly mate:
The IRA are totally different to the PIRA or the RIRA or whoever use the letters IRA.


IRA
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irish_Republican_Army
http://www.corkcity.ie/aboutcork/historyofcork/theburningofcork/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irish_Potato_Famine


P-IRA:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Provisional_Irish_Republican_Army
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bloody_Sunday_(1972)


R-IRA:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Real_IRA
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Omagh_bombing




Read the links and make your mind up.


Anyone who knows Irish history will be incredibly angry if you mistake the IRA with the R-IRA

?? I disagree, I know a great deal about Irish history and many of my relatives fought for what I would term the "Old IRA'. During the troubles most people referred to the Provos simply as the IRA. I don't take any offence and I think you are getting offended just for the sake of it.

Sorry.

Dannyboy83

sylvestersuntan
IRA?
You might want to check your facts their boss.........


Quote:
Originally Posted by KevR
Not having a go at you but I just have to say who the **** do the IRA think they are?! Catholics (and people of any other religion) in the Republic of Ireland and the United Kingdom can have any occupation they want; it's none of the IRA's business.

Terrible events tonight and on Saturday. Condolences to the families, friends and colleagues of the deceased.

segaBOY wrote: »

?? I disagree, I know a great deal about Irish history and many of my relatives fought for what I would term the "Old IRA'. During the troubles most people referred to the Provos simply as the IRA. I don't take any offence and I think you are getting offended just for the sake of it.

Sorry.

Mate, I'm far from offended.
I'm just trying to diffuse any argument in the works between KevR and sylvesterSunTan.

If you refer to my above posts, you'll see why I'm distinguishing between P-IRA and R-IRA.

I really can't sit through another 20 odd pages of bickering, so I'm off to bed,
nite nite

youcrazyjesus!

Alot of sensationalism going on here. Some peoples understanding of the dynamics of the
north is way off. These 3 murders of innocent people don't change the fact that
the militants are a tiny number of die hards who will be put out of business sooner
rather than later. Sooner because of these attacks. The bad times in the North are
never coming back. These people represent nobody but themselves and without
some level of community support they have no future. I firmly believe the attackers
will be caught.

Dannyboy83

youcrazyjesus! wrote: »

Alot of sensationalism going on here. Some peoples understanding of the dynamics of the
north is way off. These 3 murders of innocent people don't change the fact that
the militants are a tiny number of die hards who will be put out of business sooner
rather than later. Sooner because of these attacks. The bad times in the North are
never coming back. These people represent nobody but themselves and without
some level of community support they have no future. I firmly believe the attackers
will be caught.

I hope you're right mate.
Lets hope they don't galvanise any dissident support.

Its claimed they have 150 people and still have substantial weapon caches reamaining from the former Provo weapons dumps raided by McKetvitt.
That info could be way off tho.
Who really knows?

Bottle_of_Smoke

youcrazyjesus! wrote: »

Alot of sensationalism going on here. Some peoples understanding of the dynamics of the
north is way off. These 3 murders of innocent people don't change the fact that
the militants are a tiny number of die hards who will be put out of business sooner
rather than later. Sooner because of these attacks. The bad times in the North are
never coming back. These people represent nobody but themselves and without
some level of community support they have no future. I firmly believe the attackers
will be caught.

I wouldn't be so complacent. The RIRA may target soldiers/psni but they will hit Protestant bystanders inevitably, when this happens loyalists may react. That could bring popularity to the RIRA, especially if security checkpoints and civillian harrassment are brought back.

youcrazyjesus!

I can't see it happening. These are the same people who flew to Eastern Europe to buy weapons off MI5.
They are inept, poorly skilled, few in number. They have a few guns and are big enough men to shoot
pizza delivery boys and unarmed soldiers. That's about all there is to them. They are heavily infiltrated
and monitored by intelligence services, the only difficulty is turning it into convictions. As omagh proved
this is easier said then done but you have go be optimistic. We've come this far and were not going
back.

Bottle_of_Smoke

youcrazyjesus! wrote: »

I can't see it happening. These are the same people who flew to Eastern Europe to buy weapons off MI5.
They are inept, poorly skilled, few in number. They have a few guns and are big enough men to shoot
pizza delivery boys and unarmed soldiers. That's about all there is to them. They are heavily infiltrated
and monitored by intelligence services, the only difficulty is turning it into convictions. As omagh proved
this is easier said then done but you have go be optimistic. We've come this far and were not going
back.

They're also ex provos and the PIRA was probably the most well run terrorist group in the world given their circumstances. They know how to get around informers by giving need to know based orders, otherwise Saturday night wouldn't have happened.

Do you not think Senior Provos saw the Good Fr'iday Agreement coming and decided to stash away some of their hold before decommissioning? They've already used semtex in a makeshift RPG and machine guns were used on Saturday

Ask any Sinn Fein counciler in the North about their door to door picketing, theres a certain percentage of the republican community who accuse them of selling republicans out. Just as many unionists will say the same to the DUP, a new party the Traditional Unionist Voice has even been set up by ex DUP unhappy with the leaders for going into government with Sinn Fein.

It's not quite as rosy up here as a lot in the south believe. I think the Nationalist/Republican community should come out and protest on the streets against millitant republicans. It may not matter much to the terrorists but it would be seen as a good gesture to the overall community and perhaps turn some of the back up support of the RIRA/CIRA etc

youcrazyjesus!

They've had 10 years, why now?

And even those who do believe the IRA sold out prefer peace to
conflict. They recognise the war is over for good.

Bottle_of_Smoke

youcrazyjesus! wrote: »

They've had 10 years, why now?

And even those who do believe the IRA sold out prefer peace to
conflict. They recognise the war is over for good.

I don't know. I do know people are accusing Sinn Fein of selling them out and the recession can't help.

You must admit you don't know they all prefer peace. This very well may get out of hand.

Started a group on bebo. There's bound to be peace marches coming up

Citizens Against Militant Republicans

FTA69

Loyalist reaction??

Do you know what the Good Friday agreement is?

The UVF, LVF, OV and elements within the UDA remain organised and armed to the teeth. These people have no qualms about selling hard drugs to their own people and have killed many times, as well as initiating riots and targeting Nationalists while they were supposed to be on ceasefire.

There are elements of Loyalism who would love to countenance retaliation over this matter, and if more attacks of this nature occur then a Loyalst reaction is inevitable. That's the simplicity of their strategy, murder as many innocent Nationalists as possible in order to pressurise the Republican support base. They aren't all like David Ervine you know.

FTA69

Bottle_of_Smoke wrote: »

Started a group on bebo. There's bound to be peace marches coming up

Citizens Against Militant Republicans

There were numerous peace marches throughout the war in the north, none of them really made a blind bit of difference because more often than not they focussed on platitudes as opposed to the root cause of violence in this country.

RiverWilde

To my mind the law should be suspended to deal with these murdering bastards. If the govt. in the north knows who these people are - send in the SAS and execute them. The same in the south - send in the Ranger Wing and take them out.

If these people do not accept the rule of law then the rule of law should not apply to them.

Riv

FTA69

Another towering intellect...

Because that's just what's needed in a climate of rising tensions and violence, British death squads running around the place shooting Nationalists. That'll definitely lead to a drop in support for armed Republicans like.

:pac:

yoshytoshy

FTA69 wrote: »

Another towering intellect...

Because that's just what's needed in a climate of rising tensions and violence, British death squads running around the place shooting Nationalists. That'll definitely lead to a drop in support for armed Republicans like.

:pac:

You never know ,they might end up bearing the brunt of the recession.

RiverWilde

FTA69 wrote: »

Another towering intellect...

Because that's just what's needed in a climate of rising tensions and violence, British death squads running around the place shooting Nationalists. That'll definitely lead to a drop in support for armed Republicans like.

:pac:

These people are not nationalists - they're murderers - murderers who refuse to accept the rule of law. They think they have some divine right to go around murdering people to achieve their goals. Nevermind the fact that they are trying to undermine the democratic will of the people.

So if these people choose to use terror tactics against the state, the state should have no qualms about returning the favour.

Riv

djpbarry

FTA69 wrote: »

There were numerous peace marches throughout the war in the north, none of them really made a blind bit of difference because more often than not they focussed on platitudes as opposed to the root cause of violence in this country.

Which is? Small man complex?

FTA69

RiverWilde wrote: »

These people are not nationalists

The innocents whom the SAS will inevitably end up killing in the event of your dream scenario will be Nationalists. The fact you would call for the deployment of a British death squad with an abysmal record in your own country says a lot about your mindset to be honest.

So if these people choose to use terror tactics against the state, the state should have no qualms about returning the favour.

And do you honestly thing that the Brits going in guns blazing will undermine support for armed Republicans? Seriously like? The darkest days of Republicanism arose in the mid-20th Century when people simply ignored those concerned.

FTA69

djpbarry wrote: »

Which is? Small man complex?

No, the continued British presence in a part of this country which has always led to someone or other deciding to employ political violence. Similarly that same presence sustains and exacerbates sectarian tensions which are often compounded by the armed struggle of some Republicans.

RiverWilde

FTA69 wrote: »

Seriously like? .

Oh I'm not just referring to the northern security forces. I am also referring to 'our' security forces. If any of these murderers live in the republic they should also be taken out.

Riv

yoshytoshy

What annoys me about all of this is ,England always benefits from this stuff in a political way.
They gain sympathy from a far greater number ,than republicans gain support. It's actually discredited a large amount of republican's who have spent their lives working for the people of northern ireland.

djpbarry

FTA69 wrote: »

No, the continued British presence in a part of this country...

Why is it so impossibly difficult for you people to accept that Northern Ireland is not part of this country?

MOVE THE **** ON!

Irlbo

Its amazing how times change,Irish natives calling for the SAS to murder republicans,incredible,British soldiers are legitimate targets as are the PSNI/RUC,they run the risk of death everyday being stationed in the 6 counties,their deaths should not be labeled murder,but as casualties of war,regardless of what anyone thinks,aslong as this island is occupied forcibly by a foreign power ala Britain,there will be substansial amount of this country opposed to it,there will be dedicated resistance,through a host of different means,there will always be frustated young men and women living under occupation or observing it from the South,who will take the law into their own hands,and events which have happened in the past week are inevitable,there will always be violence aslong as Britains maintains its grip over the North,..............................................I am not advocating the Real IRA or their actions,the random natue and lack of stagedy is not what is needed in the current climate,but there will always be republicans who take this form of action,you can arrest them,imprison them ,shoot them,but there will be others who take there place...............................................................................................................................Irish republicanism isnt fecle,its a complex ideaology with a deep and strong history,its all about legitimacy,continuity and principles,its not something that will 'go away'

Irlbo

djpbarry wrote: »

Why is it so impossibly difficult for you people to accept that Northern Ireland is not part of this country?

MOVE THE **** ON!

It will always be impossible to accept,and will never be accpeted,are you proud of having no sense of patriotism?

yoshytoshy

Irlbo wrote: »

Its amazing how times change,Irish natives calling for the SAS to murder republicans,incredible,British soldiers are legitimate targets as are the PSNI/RUC,they run the risk of death everyday being stationed in the 6 counties,their deaths should not be labeled murder,but as casualties of war,regardless of what anyone thinks,aslong as this island is occupied forcibly by a foreign power ala Britain,there will be substansial amount of this country opposed to it,there will be dedicated resistance,through a host of different means,there will always be frustated young men and women living under occupation or observing it from the South,who will take the law into their own hands,and events which have happened in the past week are inevitable,there will always be violence aslong as Britains maintains its grip over the North,..............................................I am not advocating the Real IRA or their actions,the random natue and lack of stagedy is not what is needed in the current climate,but there will always be republicans who take this form of action,you can arrest them,imprison them ,shoot them,but there will be others who take there place...............................................................................................................................Irish republicanism isnt fecle,its a complex ideaology with a deep and strong history,its all about legitimacy,continuity and principles,its not something that will 'go away'

Your getting carried away with what has happened ,the shooting in antrim was of unarmed young lads. They were murdered plain and simple ,there was no battle or engagement ,it was all one way.

The police officer that was shot ???

Irlbo

RiverWilde wrote: »

Oh I'm not just referring to the northern security forces. I am also referring to 'our' security forces. If any of these murderers live in the republic they should also be taken out.

Riv

So you are disgusted by the murder of British soldiers and sercurity services,but advocate the murder of Irish republicans,your some tulip,tell you what,take a trip up to West Belfast and tell some of the residents how you feel about republicans and your ideas of having the SAS murder them,see how long you remain intact,theres a ferry leaving the harbour for Britain tommorow,go home

bmaxi

Irlbo wrote: »

It will always be impossible to accept,and will never be accpeted,are you proud of having no sense of patriotism?

Other people's interpretation of patriotism may not be the same as yours.
Is patriotism ruination of your local economy?
Is patriotism having barbed wire fences erected around your homes and schools?
Is patriotism having your family in fear of turning the next corner?
I could go on, but if this is the road patriotism is going to take us, I'm not a patriot.

ionix5891

Irlbo wrote: »

It will always be impossible to accept,and will never be accpeted,are you proud of having no sense of patriotism?

nationalism never got anyone far, just ask the nazi's

the man is right get over it, both countries are in EU and people have equal rights, this is not the 70s anymore, these scumbags have no support

killing innocent people is not patriotism its murder

.

OhNoYouDidn't

djpbarry wrote: »

Why is it so impossibly difficult for you people to accept that Northern Ireland is not part of this country?

MOVE THE **** ON!

Blatant trolling.