** Police officer shot dead in Armagh

Latchy

Dannyboy83 wrote: »

But the RIRA's point is simple.

There are British Soldiers, RIRA believe they have no right to be here.

So why not put in German, French or UN soldiers?

Then there are no excuses for the violence and even the diehards will see that the RIRA are just criminals.

Would the locals accept German ,French, Ghanian soldiers just because they are under a UN flag and not a British one? . As a short term solution 30 odd years ago maybe, to late now ? I am not sure .


The NI assembly were working together ,to find a common ground that suits everybody which might eventually see less and less of the BA in NI .But 30 odd years of killings,murders of civilian ,police and military alike shows that the answer is not through violent means .The criminal elements might find they have more to gain by continuing this way , otherwise it defies logic why anybody would want to continue down same road and inflict utter misery and heartache on their 'own people ' . (Some of these people imo are just cold hearted psychopaths ) . Once the suspision and fear remains between both communities ,aggrivated by killings such as of the soldiers /police there will always be this gap to exploit .

Mr.Micro wrote: »

You mean rammed down our throats in school in my experience?

My expierence to .We wern't allowed an objective view even if we had one .

ejmaztec

Tom65 wrote: »

Jaysus, he would've been 3 for the 1994 IRA ceasefire. I know I'm not much older, but at least I can remember it. Also, I'm not going around killing policemen.

I bet the on-call human rights lawyer is chatting to him at this very moment, making certain that he has access to his rightful supply of Clearasil.

gd1987

That child should never be allowed see daylight again.

Duiske

gd1987 wrote: »

That child should never be allowed see daylight again.

Before condemning him to a life behind bars, it might be an idea to find out if he is actually guilty of anything first.

****BREAKING NEWS***
18 year old kid arrested for suspected murder of Police officer.

carlop

GuanYin wrote: »

I like how you try and use language to cover up facts.

There is no such thing as a significant minority in democracy.

You are a minority or a majority.

The majority support the peace process and Sinn Fein.

The dissidents want to abandon the will of the majority of the people, force their political views on people who don't want them through violence and terror, in the guise of a quest for the right to be an independent, democratic republic.

That is a lie. The truth is they are entering into tactics no better than any despot dictator organization such as the Taliban or Khmer Rouge.

You either respect democracy or you don't.

When dealing with a historically divided community this can be a very dangerous attitude to hold, and it is an attitude similar to this that helped spark the Troubles. In Northern Ireland in the 1960s the Catholic, nationalist community were a significant minority. Does this justify their treatment as second class citizens on the part of the majority?

Obviously today's situation is different. Those behind these atrocious killings do not represent a significant minority, they represent a miniscule minority with no political mandate whatsoever, and the sooner the perpertrators are apprehended and brought to justice the better.

Dannyboy83

I'm all talked out but for anyone interested:

Two men, aged 17 and 37, have been arrested in connection with the murder of a policeman in Northern Ireland.


Protests are being staged in Belfast tonight (Peaceful ones putside the City Hall apparently, but who knows for how long)

Dr Galen

i think its so funny (and not in a ha ha way) to hear all these so called Irish Republicans talking about rights, about being oppressed by the Brits etc etc from the comfort of the Republic.

I grew up in the north, moved here when I was 19, and saw first hand for all of that time the effect that the troubles/war, call it what you will had on the people of MY home.

Anyone calling for SAS or Army Ranger death squads to go rooting out the perpetrators of these acts needs their head examined. Thats exactly what we had in the 70's. These are exactly the types of teams that spilt open my grandad years ago as he walked across the town to meet my granny. She was a nurse and often dealt with RUC and soldiers who had been shot or blown up. This was a man who had many friends on the "opposite" side of the divide and helped to bring me up in a tolerant and non sectarian household.

You can all go on about wars and fighting oppression all you want, but until you are in the situation that only for a set of broken traffic lights holding you and your mother up on the way to the video shop you'd have been parked in pretty much the spot where a fecking great mortar blew up, you have no idea.

Before anyone goes accusing me of being un-patriotic or somesuch, let me jsut state that I believe that Ireland should not be partitioned, but jesus shooting people has been proven not to work. I'm proud to be Northern Irish, to be honest, I see us as neither British or Irish, we're a very different people from you all, but the actions of the few over the last few days have shamed us all.

What we really need in the North is for real politics to set in and take hold. People of my generation aren't actually that bothered in the main about all this sectarian ****e. We care about jobs, healthcare, taxes and all the things that people in normal democratic societies care about too. The suspension of the assembly has certainly not helped things, but if we're ever going to get moving again, well maybe the 3 deaths will not be in vain. Maybe the political parties will now have their hands forced, get their arse in gear and get things moving again. At least then some good will come from these senseless murders

Manic Moran

There is no such thing as a significant minority in democracy.

You are a minority or a majority.

The majority support the peace process and Sinn Fein.

Fortunately there are very few true democracies in the world. (By the true definition of democracy.. which also can include two wolves and a sheep voting on what's for dinner) Most democratic-leaning governments tend to require a supermajority in order to run roughshod over opposition, and in cases where a supermajority is lacking, then yes, absolutely there is such a thing as a significant minority.

NTM

The Raven.

Mystic Monkey, it is very refreshing to read a post that is honest and down to earth, without malice or cynicism, in light of the grim reality of recent events.

Mystik Monkey wrote: »

i think its so funny (and not in a ha ha way) to hear all these so called Irish Republicans talking about rights, about being oppressed by the Brits etc etc from the comfort of the Republic.

I grew up in the north, moved here when I was 19, and saw first hand for all of that time the effect that the troubles/war, call it what you will had on the people of MY home.

I agree. It is impossible to fully appreciate the shocking state of things in Northern Ireland from a safe distance. One can only imagine what it is like. The stories we hear from people who live there are a lot more graphic and informative than what we gather from the media. I’m sorry to hear about your grandfather.

Before anyone goes accusing me of being un-patriotic or somesuch, let me jsut state that I believe that Ireland should not be partitioned, but jesus shooting people has been proven not to work. I'm proud to be Northern Irish, to be honest, I see us as neither British or Irish, we're a very different people from you all, but the actions of the few over the last few days have shamed us all.

In theory, as Ireland is a small island, it should not be partitioned. However, you have said something here that I have been saying for a very long time: something that few people seem to have noticed or indeed even want to. You referred to the difference between the people in the North and South. I understand this very well, as I come from both stock, brought up in the south. It is a difficult thing to define in terms of culture, but it is more to do with different ways of thinking. For that reason alone it is hard to imagine a united Ireland.

The taking of human life is always wrong, no matter who does it or why. It should not be tolerated under any circumstances. It is tragic that all the progress that has been made in the peace process should be threatened by the callous actions of a few warped minds. It is grossly unfair that anyone on this island should have to feel the shame brought on us by the perpetrators of these cowardly atrocities.

Nodin

Manic Moran wrote: »

Fortunately there are very few true democracies in the world. (By the true definition of democracy.. which also can include two wolves and a sheep voting on what's for dinner) Most democratic-leaning governments tend to require a supermajority in order to run roughshod over opposition, and in cases where a supermajority is lacking, then yes, absolutely there is such a thing as a significant minority.

NTM

True, though it should be pointed out that in this case, neither grouping would amount to one, alone or combined.

P. Breathnach

Mystik Monkey wrote: »

... Before anyone goes accusing me of being un-patriotic or somesuch, let me jsut state that I believe that Ireland should not be partitioned...

I pick this out of a post that otherwise I broadly agree with.

There are people who accept the idea of partition. Some think it is the only arrangement that has a chance of giving us long-term stability. It is doing them a wrong to brand such people as unpatriotic.

Dr Galen

P. Breathnach wrote: »

I pick this out of a post that otherwise I broadly agree with.

There are people who accept the idea of partition. Some think it is the only arrangement that has a chance of giving us long-term stability. It is doing them a wrong to brand such people as unpatriotic.

agreed. but then most of those who brand like this i would guess are the celtic shirt wearing tracksuit mafia "republicans" who will really have no idea of what its all about.

prinz

I can see how this went down*, the brave 37 year old volunteer in the fight against the British occupiers, gives a gun to a teenager to do the dirty work and destroy his own life and the lives of countless others. we've seen it time and time again. Always the big men, sending kids who dont know any better out to do the dirty work and/or get blown away themselves. Not cowardly at all. Scum.

*alledgedly hypothetically of course.

Benny Mack

i think its very sad if we see a return to the "troubles." the two soldiers were about to fight a real war in afghanistan and they got shot dead while being off duty in northern ireland. 3 innocent lives have been taken and two lives critical in hospital. at the end of the day the people who carried out these cruel acts are cold blooded murderers simple as. and how they can take it upon themselves to re-igninte the whole troubles after so many years of peace is beyond me.

and just to add, how many of these young people that are carrying out these cruel acts, actually know the whole history surrounding Northern Ireland, Ireland and England. The majority havent a clue what happened back those many years ago

JohnnyMarr

Its a sad story and I hope this isn't the start of another bloody period in the history of the 6 counties.

1huge1

RIP

ilkhanid

"The murder of these 4 men is justified because a poxy language act was not passed? Are you serious?"

Citing the failure to pass a language act as if it tantamount to some kind of brutal repression is ridiculous. The Catholic/Nationalist minority in the North has come a long way in the last ten years and feel themselves to be part of the State and have a new confidence. They are not interested in the cul-de-sacs of killing any more.
The fact is that, even if Martin McGuinness was first Minister; even if 75% of the PSNI was Catholic,even if the Nationalist community in the North was more prosperous than the Unionist community, they would still be trying to kill and wreck destruction because it is the fact that Northern Ireland is part of the UK and that the British Government has influence there that they object to. The actual condition of Nationalists and the wider population of Ireland and their expressed wishes are irrelevancies to them. To them, "Ireland" as an idea, and it's supposed national "rights" are what matters, not the actual population.

Dave!

Gangs attack PSNI officers with petrol bombs



Police came under petrol bomb attack from masked gangs tonight after a high-profile republican was arrested in connection with the murder of two soldiers in the North.

Former IRA prisoner Colin Duffy, 41, has broken away from mainstream republicans and criticised Sinn Féin's decision to back the new Police Service of Northern Ireland (PSNI).

Following his arrest, gangs took to the streets near his home in Lurgan, Co Armagh, and police were pelted with stones before petrol bombs were hurled at PSNI vehicles.

Duffy was one of three men arrested this morning by police probing the murders of Patrick Azimkar, 21, and Mark Quinsey, 23, who were gunned down by the dissident republican Real IRA as they collected pizzas at the gates of Massereene Barracks in Antrim last Saturday night.

A tense stand-off developed in Lurgan tonight, with youths forming makeshift barricades to block the railway lines in the town.

Duffy and two other men, aged 21 and 32, were arrested in police raids this morning in Lurgan and Bellaghy, Co Derry.

All three were being questioned at Antrim police station tonight.

Duffy came to prominence in the 1990s after he was acquitted of the murder of a soldier when it emerged that a key witness against him was a loyalist paramilitary. He was later arrested in connection with the subsequent murder of two police constables, but the case collapsed.

His solicitor, Rosemary Nelson, received threats after representing him in court and she was murdered in a loyalist car bomb attack at her Lurgan home in 1999.

Her death is now the subject of a high-profile public inquiry.

Police teams in forensic suits carried out extensive searches of Duffy's house on a private estate in Lurgan today.

The two soldiers were killed in the Real IRA ambush at their barracks hours before they were to fly to Afghanistan. Two other soldiers and two pizza delivery men were wounded in the attack.

Detectives are examining CCTV footage from the area around the barracks and also what is believed to be the gunmen's getaway car which was found abandoned seven miles from the scene of the murders.

The green Vauxhall Cavalier, registration TDZ 7309, had been bought two weeks earlier.

It is understood the gunmen had tried to burn the car, but it had not ignited.

The claim has led to speculation that the vehicle's discovery may have provided police with opportunities to obtain forensic evidence.

The two young soldiers were the first to be murdered in the North in 12 years. Lance Bombardier Stephen Restorick was killed by an IRA sniper in 1997.

Police are also questioning three people over the murder of Police Constable Stephen Carroll, 48, who was killed by gunmen from the Continuity IRA in an attack launched in Craigavon, Co Armagh, on Monday night.

His funeral yesterday was attended by senior officers, politicians and leaders from across the community.

The Continuity IRA and the Real IRA are dissident republican groups which broke away from mainstream republicanism in opposition to the peace process.

They rejected the decision of the mainstream IRA to end violence, decommission weapons and follow purely peaceful means to pursue republican political goals.

Duffy is a member of the republican protest group Eirigi, which has not supported the new police service, but which insists it is a peaceful pressure group.

He attracted criticism last year when serious rioting in the Lurgan area led to attacks on police, which he failed to condemn.

After police came under gun and petrol-bomb attack during two days of rioting, he said the episodes were a symptom of a section of the nationalist community refusing to accept the PSNI.

But in the wake of the murder of the soldiers in Antrim and of Pc Carroll in the Lurgan/Craigavon area, Duffy and the Eirigi group were challenged to condemn the killings.

Eirigi, which is Irish for "rise up", released a statement in response to the pressure, claiming it did not support violent groups.

Earlier this week it said: "Eirigi is an open, independent, democratic political party which is not aligned to, or supportive of, any armed organisation."

But it added: "While supporting the right of any people to defend themselves from imperial aggression, Eirigi does not believe that the conditions exist at this time for a successful armed struggle against the British occupation.

"As can be seen from the recent attacks on Britain's Armed Forces, it is clear that not all republicans agree on how the British occupation should be resisted at this time.

"Those who carried out those attacks are best placed to explain their own rationale."

The Eirigi group includes Breandan Mac Cionnaith, who was unavailable for comment today, but who came to prominence in the 1990s as the leader of the nationalist Garvaghy Road Residents Coalition which opposed Orange Order parades through the Catholic enclave in Portadown, Co Armagh.

He resigned from Sinn Féin in protest over its decision to back the new police service, but has in the past said Eirigi is a purely political group.

Police searching Duffy's house came under attack today from youths who hurled missiles at officers.

Bricks littered the scene this afternoon as the police searches continued.

The PSNI activity came after politicians from all sides united against the dissident republican murders.

Earlier this week, First Minister and Democratic Unionist Party (DUP) leader Peter Robinson reaffirmed his party's commitment to the power-sharing government at Stormont.

Deputy First Minister Martin McGuinness, of Sinn Féin, branded the killers criminals and traitors who had defied the expressed wishes of the people of Ireland to support the political structures born out of the Good Friday Agreement.

Both political leaders are in the United States and will meet President Barack Obama on Tuesday in Washington as part of St Patrick's Day events.

Today, Ulster Unionist leader Reg Empey said: "It is in no-one's interests to drag Northern Ireland back to the past and it is in no-one's interests that fear and instability become the hallmarks by which the rest of the world recognises us."

LordSutch

Little did Kate Carroll know that when she kissed her husband goodby that morning it would be for the very last time. PC Carroll & his colleagues answered yet another call for help, just like on every other day when the Police are called out for help and assistance, only this time it was a deliberate trap so that PC Carroll could be murdered.

Not much more to say really, I grew up watching the troubles on TV, & what happened last weekend to the two young soldiers & PC Carroll is identical to what was happening on a weekly basis back in the 70s & 80s .............

I really hope & pray that these three sad deaths are a 'one off' and that the perpetrators are found & locked up for life (and I mean LIFE).


R.I.P. Stephen Carroll

FTA69

Best of luck to Colin Duffy and I hope he gets out soon. Political policing at its worst.

junder

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

Blatant trolling.

why for declearing the truth

junder

yoshytoshy wrote: »

Sky news are as bad as Max clifford with stuff like this.
God help the people up there ,as if things weren't bad enough for everyone at the moment.

last time i cheacked i was living in the united kingdom so i fail to see how accurate reporting can incite violence surly inaccurate reporting would be more likly to cause trouble

mrtaylor1981

Camelot wrote: »

Little did Kate Carroll know that when she kissed her husband goodby that morning it would be for the very last time. PC Carroll & his colleagues answered yet another call for help, just like on every other day when the Police are called out for help and assistance, only this time it was a deliberate trap so that PC Carroll could be murdered.

Not much more to say really, I grew up watching the troubles on TV, & what happened last weekend to the two young soldiers & PC Carroll is identical to what was happening on a weekly basis back in the 70s & 80s .............

I really hope & pray that these three sad deaths are a 'one off' and that the perpetrators are found & locked up for life (and I mean LIFE).


R.I.P. Stephen Carroll

Yes, too often it was the case. I remember in particuliar two young Scottish officers were befriended in a bar by two women who invited them to a party back at their flat. When they entered the flat the IRA were waiting for them and shot both dead. Low life scum.

oscarBravo

FTA69 wrote: »

Best of luck to Colin Duffy and I hope he gets out soon. Political policing at its worst.

You obviously know something that the PSNI don't. Care to share?

Or are you simply conforming to stereotype, and assuming that the 'Tans are rounding up the usual Fenian suspects?

Maybe we should let the police do their jobs.

Dr Galen

FTA69 wrote: »

Best of luck to Colin Duffy and I hope he gets out soon. Political policing at its worst.

even if it is, that hardly gives a load of wasters the right to start mini riots?

isn't one of the lads in the picture wearing a celtic top? Aren't they a foreign team playing a foreign game? :rolleyes:

CSC

I believe the group Colin Duffy now belongs to, eirigi, are opposed to violence so it is being seen as a political move to arrest him. Obviously we will have to wait and see the outcome of the PSNI investigation though.
The riots that followed his arrest though I would think are mainly youths and troublemakers having an excuse to attack the police.

Dr Galen

just because a person is a member of a group that says they are anti-something, doesn't mean that the person won't/can't/isn't carrying out said action. Sure look at the Catholic church for a perfect example. Your right though, lets see what turns up, after all the guy is innocent until proven guilty of a crime.

FTA69

oscarBravo wrote: »

You obviously know something that the PSNI don't. Care to share?

The Continuity IRA claimed this attack, Colin Duffy is a leading member of Éirigi which has absolutely no connection to that organisation or any other armed group for that matter. Basically the cops are lifting any prominent Republican and using this attack as an excuse to do so, even though the cops know full well Duffy or the party he represents had f*ck all to do with it.

Or are you simply conforming to stereotype, and assuming that the 'Tans are rounding up the usual Fenian suspects?

No, unlike yourself I have a clue about the person in question.

FTA69

Mystik Monkey wrote: »

isn't one of the lads in the picture wearing a celtic top? Aren't they a foreign team playing a foreign game? :rolleyes:

:rolleyes:

Dr Galen

you know i was referring to the picture of the scumbags who decided to use Duffy's arrest as an excuse to cause grief.

As for your thoughts on the reason for Duffy's arrest, I hope your wrong mate. Most of us thought that we had left this kind of nonsense behind us, and that we could start afresh, and begin to trust the PSNI as a whole.