Booking deposit not returned

midwest

I placed large deposit on a new house and then unfortunatly lost my job. So when I asked for the money back the auctioneer is seriously giving me the runaround. I really think they've used my "client accounts" to keep their business afloat. Is this legal, and is there any comeback possible ?

antoinolachtnai

The following is vague generalities. You really need some sort of legal advice here. It is definitely worth keeping after the agent too.

To be an auctioneer or to deal in property, you need a licence. To get the licence, you have to put down a surety and apply to the court.

The local Garda Superintendent is basically in charge of this.

If the auctioneer is really not returning your deposit, you will need to find out who the relevant Garda is, contact him and ask him what to do. This is probably the only situation in which the Garda would intervene. Make it very clear that he has not returned a booking deposit.

Before you do that, if your auctioneer is a member of a trade body (iavi or ipav) they might be able to suggest a way to work things out between you and the agent.

EKRIUQ

Your going a bit fast getting in contact with the Garda super, Firstly, your booking deposit is in the auctioneers account or a solicitors account or possibly a developers account if their home bonded. The auctioneer acts as stake holder and can not use this money for any purposes other than forwarding it to the vendors solicitor.

I really think they've used my "client accounts" to keep their business afloat. Is this legal,

No it's not and every year he'll have to get an accountant's certificate to show who owns what in the account.

When you say giving you the run around what do you mean? is he slow posting the cheque? why not call to the office and ask for the cheque then it's only a matter of writing a cheque if you can't get it that way then I'd be suspicious.

(I'm assuming you haven't signed a contract and you are entitled to your deposit back)

GerardKeating

midwest wrote: »

I placed large deposit on a new house and then unfortunatly lost my job. So when I asked for the money back the auctioneer is seriously giving me the runaround. I really think they've used my "client accounts" to keep their business afloat. Is this legal, and is there any comeback possible ?

Are you entitled to the deposit back?

You might even be commited to complete the purchase of the house, if you actually signed a contract to buy it..

lynchie

GerardKeating wrote: »

Are you entitled to the deposit back?

You might even be commited to complete the purchase of the house, if you actually signed a contract to buy it..

Its a booking deposit which is refundable. He didnt mention anything about signing contracts.

dlambirl

No your right the OP didnt mention anything about signing contracts but at the same time they never said that they didnt sign any contract.

Also, the auctioneer shouldnt return the deposit until your solicitor has returned the contracts to the buyers solicitor and the vendors solicitor should then either fax/email/post/phone the auctioneer to let them know that its ok to refund the deposit.
Has your solicitor returned the contracts? Maybe the vendors solicitor hasnt let the auctioneer know that its ok to refund the deposit - solicitors are slow to do anything like that

partyguinness

If you put down a booking deposit and no contracts signed you must get the deposit back as soon as possible.

I would get your solicitor to write to them straight away, give them 14 days and then issue debt collection proceedings...it is critical you act quickly here.

faceman

You are entitled to the booking deposit back if you signed no contracts. anything longer than 14 days is taking the mick.

The gardai cant do anything for you, either write to the EA demanding the refund within 7 days or have your solicitor do it.

Act fast though, if they go in liquidation or are insolvent, you wont get diddly back.

grizzly

I think you're right to move fast. There's plenty of auctioneers going to the wall. If they collapse you could be waiting months to see your deposit.

antoinolachtnai

I'd say you could recover the money from the agent or agent's directors personally if it isn't there. If an agent were to spend the deposit funds, he would be trading recklessly and would be liable to creditors.

The Garda can at least let you know if the licence is coming up for renewal and can give you the opportunity to object, or he may object himself.

But better if it doesn't come to any of that obviously.

midwest

I eventually got the money back after formally complaining in writing to the IAVI. In fairness IAVI were on the case rapidly and did a good job. This step was necessary after a cheque from auctioneer bounced and a lot of phone calls/meetings and hassle seemed to be getting nowhere (including with solicitors).

There must be another way of transacting in cases like these, such as an independant bank/authority who takes your depost, but only releases it to the seller or auctioneer when the property is transferred legally and completely
/Midwest

antoinolachtnai

Good to hear the IAVI came through.

The issue of a cheque bouncing for a deposit should just never arise. The client account should always be in credit.

Adding an extra level of security should not be necessary, any more than it should be necessary for solicitors' client accounts.

Adnerb

In May 2006 we paid €4.5 cash deposit directly to a builder on a house in a developing estate that had not yet been started. We left the country and returned in April 07 looking forward to seeing our new home but it had not been started. We choose a different house in the estate that work had commenced on and were told that it would be ready in a few months... With the down turn in 08 we had approached the builder a number of times to see would he reduce the price of the house to which he refused. We watched as prices dropped dramatically but we were still expected to pay over the odds for this house. To try to save money we decided to do all wiring to the house ourselves and put in our own kitchen and bathroom suites but soon realised we would still end up paying way over the odds for the house. We heard of a great deal on another house and decided to view this house and put an offer on it. We paid a deposit on the Tuesday and called to the builder the next day and told him we would no longer be buying the house. He was accepting of this and wished us well and asked that we give him a month to return the deposit to which we agreed. We offered to complete the wiring of the house but he said his electrician would do this (we were leaving €1.5k worth of cable in the house). We also had shower trays installed and we left those also – good will jester. The builder is now refusing to return our deposit and has threatened to bill us for the electrical works that his electrician did on house. There was also a few adjustments we requested to the house and he is threatening to bill us for these also. We have been waiting almost 3 years for this house and really could not wait any longer, we would have ended up paying at least €100k more for the house upon completion – in comparison to similar houses. The builder is also saying that we have left him with an unsellable house but I know for definite he has made no effort to complete the house or to advertise it as FOR SALE. Where do we stand????

lynchie

Adnerb wrote: »

In May 2006 we paid €4.5 cash deposit directly to a builder on a house in a developing estate that had not yet been started. We left the country and returned in April 07 looking forward to seeing our new home but it had not been started. We choose a different house in the estate that work had commenced on and were told that it would be ready in a few months... With the down turn in 08 we had approached the builder a number of times to see would he reduce the price of the house to which he refused. We watched as prices dropped dramatically but we were still expected to pay over the odds for this house. To try to save money we decided to do all wiring to the house ourselves and put in our own kitchen and bathroom suites but soon realised we would still end up paying way over the odds for the house. We heard of a great deal on another house and decided to view this house and put an offer on it. We paid a deposit on the Tuesday and called to the builder the next day and told him we would no longer be buying the house. He was accepting of this and wished us well and asked that we give him a month to return the deposit to which we agreed. We offered to complete the wiring of the house but he said his electrician would do this (we were leaving €1.5k worth of cable in the house). We also had shower trays installed and we left those also – good will jester. The builder is now refusing to return our deposit and has threatened to bill us for the electrical works that his electrician did on house. There was also a few adjustments we requested to the house and he is threatening to bill us for these also. We have been waiting almost 3 years for this house and really could not wait any longer, we would have ended up paying at least €100k more for the house upon completion – in comparison to similar houses. The builder is also saying that we have left him with an unsellable house but I know for definite he has made no effort to complete the house or to advertise it as FOR SALE. Where do we stand????

Your post is not too clear.. You said you only paid a booking deposit and no mention of signing contracts? Did you actually sign contracts? If not, then I fail to understand why a builder would allow you into a property to do your own wiring etc without signing contracts.

EKRIUQ

That seems like a very messy situation,

Were contracts signed?
Was there a solicitor involved?
You paid 4.5K cash did you get a receipt for this?
Are you a qualified RECI electrician and will you be able to sign off on the house, the house isn't worth much to the builder unless he has this certificate.

Bathroom suites and kitchen's are of a personal choice and the builder could be right the house could be unsaleable I've seen some people with awful taste decorating new houses.

It amazes me that the builder would let anyone do work to the house unless there was a substantial amount paid. The builder is probably pissed off at you because you pulled out of the sale but too thick to realise that house prices have gone down

Adnerb

No contracts have been signed. The builder is local he uses no auctioneers I dont think he has ever even advertised his houses for sale! There was also no solicitors involved, and no receipt!! He gave us and other buyers keys from the beginning to carry out works, and my boyfriend is an electrician and was doing to wiring.
When we pulled out of the house it was only 1st fixed and the shower trays were in, the house wasnt even slabbed...3 years on. So there is no tasteless decorating done, we had to cancel our kitchen with the promise we would use the company in our new house.
I can understand that he is pissed it is hard times for everyone, we have even suggested he holds the deposit until the house sells but he has said he will never get €230k for it now, so I was like why should we pay €230k if the house is not worth that? HE never even offered to knock so much as a penny off the house when we told him we found something cheaper, that was enough for me to not give a sh!t about how he felt anymore...

lynchie

Adnerb wrote: »

No contracts have been signed. The builder is local he uses no auctioneers I dont think he has ever even advertised his houses for sale! There was also no solicitors involved, and no receipt!! He gave us and other buyers keys from the beginning to carry out works, and my boyfriend is an electrician and was doing to wiring.
When we pulled out of the house it was only 1st fixed and the shower trays were in, the house wasnt even slabbed...3 years on. So there is no tasteless decorating done, we had to cancel our kitchen with the promise we would use the company in our new house.
I can understand that he is pissed it is hard times for everyone, we have even suggested he holds the deposit until the house sells but he has said he will never get €230k for it now, so I was like why should we pay €230k if the house is not worth that? HE never even offered to knock so much as a penny off the house when we told him we found something cheaper, that was enough for me to not give a sh!t about how he felt anymore...

No contracts signed.. so you can walk away no questions asked. And you are entitled to your deposit back assuming you have a receipt for it. You said you never got a receipt.. Why give somebody a sizable amount of cash with no receipt?? That's just crazy!

As for works done to the house.. Well.. As there is no contract.. the builder should not have let you into the premises to make alterations as you had not committed to the sale. The fact he did I would assume one could argue that he has given you implied permission to make those changes and I would assume now he has no comeback on it now.

Dixie Chick

Hi adnerb,

You really left yourself completely open here. As you have no receipt, its basically word of mouth that wuld be relied upon if these ever was to go to court for you to get the money back.

In one way, you are almost lucky yopu didnt enter into contract with a builder cos that way he cannot force ye to buy the house at the inflated 2006 price like a lot of poor people are getting stuck with now

Duckjob

Adnerb wrote: »

No contracts have been signed. The builder is local he uses no auctioneers I dont think he has ever even advertised his houses for sale! There was also no solicitors involved, and no receipt!! He gave us and other buyers keys from the beginning to carry out works, and my boyfriend is an electrician and was doing to wiring.
When we pulled out of the house it was only 1st fixed and the shower trays were in, the house wasnt even slabbed...3 years on. So there is no tasteless decorating done, we had to cancel our kitchen with the promise we would use the company in our new house.
I can understand that he is pissed it is hard times for everyone, we have even suggested he holds the deposit until the house sells but he has said he will never get €230k for it now, so I was like why should we pay €230k if the house is not worth that? HE never even offered to knock so much as a penny off the house when we told him we found something cheaper, that was enough for me to not give a sh!t about how he felt anymore...

By what method did you pay the deposit? Please don't say cash :eek:

If you paid by cheque/draft or by bank transfer you should be able to get proof from your bank that the amount was transferred to his bank account. If you have proof of payment of the deposit, then getting it back should not be an issue legally.

Adnerb

Yep we paid cash!! As did most of the people who have bought houses in this estate over the last 10 years. This builder is from the town, he has never advertised a house for sale all sales were local people just walking up to him agreeing to buy and paying as much cash as possible until the contracts are signed... i think it is worth pursuing even if we are to walk away with €3k it is by far better than nothing!