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Is this legal

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  • 12-03-2009 6:21pm
    #1
    Juice_Terry
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2 ✭


    I unfortunately work for PricewaterhouseCoopers.
    Over the last 4 weeks we have had a 10% pay cut and at least 200 people have been sacked with statuary minimum redundancy (which is brutal to say the least).. Is it legal to just totally disregard your staff after years and years of service?
    I know the other 3 (of the big four) have done the decent thing and announced voluntary redundancies etc. But this turning up for work every day and people disappearing from there desk's (escorted off site by security) just waiting for your turn...
    Its like a flippen death camp...

    Is it legal?? :confused:
    Can they do this? :mad:


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    #2
    delop
    Registered Users Posts: 490 ✭✭delop


    Juice_Terry wrote: »
    I unfortunately work for PricewaterhouseCoopers.
    Over the last 4 weeks we have had a 10% pay cut and at least 200 people have been sacked with statuary minimum redundancy (which is brutal to say the least).. Is it legal to just totally disregard your staff after years and years of service?
    I know the other 3 (of the big four) have done the decent thing and announced voluntary redundancies etc. But this turning up for work every day and people disappearing from there desk's (escorted off site by security) just waiting for your turn...
    Its like a flippen death camp...

    Is it legal?? :confused:
    Can they do this? :mad:

    I don't know 100% for sure, I think it probably is, but its lousy for the moral of ppl left behind as you know, If there were better prospects for the economy they would nt have done it, i.e. they would be worried about ppl left behind leaving first opportunity, but thats not likely in this market...

    If you ask me its very dangerous, Im sure PWC has lost of interesting info that they dont want out in the public domain, and 200 pissed off staff... who knows


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    #3
    seamus
    Registered Users Posts: 68,317 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    It's mostly legal.

    It's worth nothing that the other 3 of the big four haven't all gone for voluntary redundancies, some have gone for mandatory ones.

    The only thing is that I'm not sure how valid it is to escort someone off site immediately. The law requires the employer to enter into a reasonable consultation period with the employee so they understand why they're being laid off or otherwise can convince the employer that they shouldnt' be laid off.


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    #4
    jimmycrackcorm
    Registered Users Posts: 14,339 ✭✭✭✭jimmycrackcorm


    Totally legal but really bad to do as it creates a risk for what the remaining staff might do in anticipation of a firing. I'd guess that this particular dictat was issued by an american manager as that is the style in the us.
    Pay cuts have to be agreed. But he the alternative is being fired...


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    #5
    Juice_Terry
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2 ✭Juice_Terry


    Yeah the atmosphere in here really does suck at the mo..
    It would be nice to know one way or the other..
    I wish we had a union...........


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    #6
    delop
    Registered Users Posts: 490 ✭✭delop


    Juice_Terry wrote: »
    I wish we had a union...........

    Careful what you wish for, you'd probably know half of what you know now, if you job had union representation....

    A friend of mine works in a UNI and the things he tell me that their Union rep gets involved in are just nutz. He has often told me that he on many occasion s wanted to vote against Union interference in his job, but he just gave up and goes with the flow. They would have the whole Dept on strike if a staff member had his knuckles wrapped for anything legit or not, and the mad thing is the boss is in the same union too...

    hated the union in good times, but ill bet he secretly loves them now...


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    #7
    jhegarty
    Registered Users Posts: 6,440 ✭✭✭jhegarty


    Juice_Terry wrote: »
    I unfortunately work for PricewaterhouseCoopers.
    Over the last 4 weeks we have had a 10% pay cut and at least 200 people have been sacked with statuary minimum redundancy (which is brutal to say the least).. Is it legal to just totally disregard your staff after years and years of service?

    I know the other 3 (of the big four) have done the decent thing and announced voluntary redundancies etc. But this turning up for work every day and people disappearing from there desk's (escorted off site by security) just waiting for your turn...
    Its like a flippen death camp...

    Is it legal?? :confused:
    Can they do this? :mad:

    Yes, completely legal. They would not have been sacked , they would have been made redundant. Statuary minimum redundancy is exactly what it says it is, the minimum they have to give.


    And I don't think you really know what is death camp is.


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    #8
    nesf
    Registered Users Posts: 27,645 ✭✭✭✭nesf


    Juice_Terry wrote: »
    Over the last 4 weeks we have had a 10% pay cut and at least 200 people have been sacked with statuary minimum redundancy (which is brutal to say the least)

    Statutory minimum is exactly what it says on the tin, it's lowest legal amount that you can be given for redundancy. It's not brutal, it's life most friends of mine who've been made redundant (even in the good times) only got statutory.

    You won't get legal advice here, talk to a solicitor if you need that.


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    #9
    leeroybrown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,563 ✭✭✭leeroybrown


    I'll also add that while employees being escorted off site by security happens more than people would think, particularly in certain sectors of employment. Given the sensitivity of some of the information available to some big four employees it's not surprising that it's cropped up in one of them.


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    #10
    Godge
    Closed Accounts Posts: 21,727 ✭✭✭✭Godge


    Yeah, it is legal. One of those times to keep your head down and keep working.


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    #11
    nowye'retalkin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 35 ✭nowye'retalkin


    Juice_Terry wrote: »
    I unfortunately work for PricewaterhouseCoopers.
    Over the last 4 weeks we have had a 10% pay cut and at least 200 people have been sacked with statuary minimum redundancy (which is brutal to say the least).. Is it legal to just totally disregard your staff after years and years of service?
    I know the other 3 (of the big four) have done the decent thing and announced voluntary redundancies etc. But this turning up for work every day and people disappearing from there desk's (escorted off site by security) just waiting for your turn...
    Its like a flippen death camp...

    Is it legal?? :confused:
    Can they do this? :mad:

    It's sh1tty but these are the time we live in now. IMO people made redundant in the last 6 months had it good, redundency wise, but as it becomes more common place getting the statuary will be the norm :(


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    #12
    LegacyUser
    Registered Users Posts: 166,026 ✭✭✭✭LegacyUser


    It's horrible, but I've a friend working in an architect's office who said something similar. They were bringing people in to tell them they were being laid off and while they were being told, IT was closing down their accounts in the office, they couldn't log back in when they got back to their desks, and they had to leave immediately.And another company that told it's staff they'd be laying people off on a certain date in 2 weeks time.Everyone spent the 2 weeks terrified they were going to be made redundant.And everyone else had to take a 5% pay cut afterwards.
    It sucks royally, and it's a god-awful way to treat your staff.Says everything about a company.
    I'm not trying to be smart, but I would have thought one of the few companies making money out of this whole thing would have been PWC.Since there's so much auditing going on.
    It's horrible to be treated like that when you've worked so hard for a company.


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    #13
    dade
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,178 ✭✭✭dade


    seamus wrote: »

    The only thing is that I'm not sure how valid it is to escort someone off site immediately. The law requires the employer to enter into a reasonable consultation period with the employee so they understand why they're being laid off or otherwise can convince the employer that they shouldnt' be laid off.

    if it was mandatory redundancy would this "escorting" be considered gardening leave, where by they pay you for your 30 days notice and let you leave. I thinks its to protect IP or theft from the disgruntled employee. they probably have some clause in their contract about it.

    that said i think if the company just sprang it on people in the sense that you come in and are asked to a meeting while someone in IT locks out your user account, that's a bit low


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    #14
    leeroybrown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,563 ✭✭✭leeroybrown


    dade wrote: »
    if it was mandatory redundancy would this "escorting" be considered gardening leave, where by they pay you for your 30 days notice and let you leave. I thinks its to protect IP or theft from the disgruntled employee. they probably have some clause in their contract about it.
    You could call it gardening leave all right. I once worked for a company with US based operations who called out the State Sheriff's Department to escort staff offsite after a round of redundancies. On the other end of the scale I knew someone who was paid over six months gardening leave when moving to a new position.
    dade wrote: »
    that said i think if the company just sprang it on people in the sense that you come in and are asked to a meeting while someone in IT locks out your user account, that's a bit low
    If they're concerned about data loss or damage then that's the only thing to do.


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    #15
    dade
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,178 ✭✭✭dade


    true

    company i work for now did that with a contractor. he had asked for weeks prior to his contract expired he was asking was it being renewed they never answered, on his last day they got the IT Dept to lock his account before he came in, when he got in he was told to clear his desk and they'd pay him for the day. kinda under handed imo.


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