Why raising cost of transport makes no sense

L.R. Weizel

The buses in Ireland, let's face it, are dire compared to other countries. Poorly managed.

Recently they hiked the price of city buses(at least in Cork) to 1.60, claiming that the buses were empty. This of course makes no sense in of itself - if demand is low, you lower the price. But a lot of buses are still packed since none come for an hour in some cases.

The thing is that transport isn't like welfare - they actively make money off it, you pay 1.60 for a 10 minute journey, and there can be around 40 people on the bus or more at any one time - even with the high petrol costs(which are still lower than during the summer, when the bus was still 1.40). That's a lot of money. There is no reason it shouldn't be scalable - so there's no reason to cut back on services unless the managment is very incompetent(which it is).

What's more is that they now have huge adverts on buses. Not only are they annoying since you can't see out of them at night, but they also aggrivate when you think about it - those adverts are huge, and mobile. Anyone who gets on a bus regularly is guaranteed to see them multiple times, anyone walking in town will see them. They must be taking in quite a bit of money from it, and if they aren't, they could.

Transport is not something that needs that much "funding" in that regard since it's a business, they provide a service for a premium price. Not to mention a lot of the monthly/weekly passes are a joke and hard to make a saving on.

Also, it costs 71 euros for a return train to Dublin from Cork. That's ****ing insane. The same journey in the UK would probably cost around £20.

Cool Mo D

While I agree with most of what you say, we are a lot better than the UK for train prices. If you want a standard class anytime open return from London to Manchester, leaving tomorrow, it will cost you £195!

€71 euro is expensive for a return, but if you book online and travel offpeak, it's €40 return Dublin to Cork.

Euro_Kraut

L.R. Weizel wrote: »

The same journey in the UK would probably cost around £20.

Are you sure about this? Out of interest I checked a return ticket from London to Manchester and it cost £72 on an advance booking. The 'Anytime' fare was £253.

A return ticket with Deutsche Bahn from Berlin to Hamburg is €136.

Otherwise most of what you said is correct.

L.R. Weizel

Euro_Kraut wrote: »

Are you sure about this? Out of interest I checked a return ticket from London to Manchester and it cost £72 on an advance booking. The 'Anytime' fare was £253.

A return ticket with Deutsche Bahn from Berlin to Hamburg is €136.

I guess the UK was a bad example then. I thought that travel was a lot cheaper there. Those are crazy prices, you could buy a laptop for that. I don't get how you can justify those prices.

nesf

L.R. Weizel wrote: »

The buses in Ireland, let's face it, are dire compared to other countries. Poorly managed.

Recently they hiked the price of city buses(at least in Cork) to 1.60, claiming that the buses were empty. This of course makes no sense in of itself - if demand is low, you lower the price. But a lot of buses are still packed since none come for an hour in some cases.

The thing is that transport isn't like welfare - they actively make money off it, you pay 1.60 for a 10 minute journey, and there can be around 40 people on the bus or more at any one time - even with the high petrol costs(which are still lower than during the summer, when the bus was still 1.40). That's a lot of money. There is no reason it shouldn't be scalable - so there's no reason to cut back on services unless the managment is very incompetent(which it is).

What's more is that they now have huge adverts on buses. Not only are they annoying since you can't see out of them at night, but they also aggrivate when you think about it - those adverts are huge, and mobile. Anyone who gets on a bus regularly is guaranteed to see them multiple times, anyone walking in town will see them. They must be taking in quite a bit of money from it, and if they aren't, they could.

Transport is not something that needs that much "funding" in that regard since it's a business, they provide a service for a premium price. Not to mention a lot of the monthly/weekly passes are a joke and hard to make a saving on.

Also, it costs 71 euros for a return train to Dublin from Cork. That's ****ing insane. The same journey in the UK would probably cost around £20.

Relatively high wages of bus drivers + running uneconomical routes and schedules = higher fare tickets for all.

gandalf

To be honest we need a government who have a clue and can stick to a plan. This current bunch have flip flopped so much on transport policy its pathetic. Their so called green policies are proven to be the farce they are with increases like the ones the OP talks about in Cork and the recent Dublin Bus and Luas price increases.

givyjoe81

Euro_Kraut wrote: »

Are you sure about this? Out of interest I checked a return ticket from London to Manchester and it cost £72 on an advance booking. The 'Anytime' fare was £253.

A return ticket with Deutsche Bahn from Berlin to Hamburg is €136.

Otherwise most of what you said is correct.

Most of what the original chap said is NOT correct. The simply isnt money to be made from regular commuter transport, im talking about your 1.60 fares all over the city. Many of these routes are unprofitable for dublin bus and a direct reason why they are losing so much money. Having briefly worked for a private operator on a limted number of routes with little competition, i have seen this lack of viability/profitablity first hand.

acontadino

its a bit like the league of ireland and comparing prices to tickets in the bundesliga. if pats for example could get 45,000 in their gate every week you'd be sure there price for tickets would be much lower likewise because of irelands low population density they need to have higher prices....seriously immigration would be far better for this country in long term.

nesf

acontadino wrote: »

its a bit like the league of ireland and comparing prices to tickets in the bundesliga. if pats for example could get 45,000 in their gate every week you'd be sure there price for tickets would be much lower likewise because of irelands low population density they need to have higher prices....seriously immigration would be far better for this country in long term.

Or just sensible planning, but oh, to dream..

Dannyboy83

L.R. Weizel wrote: »

The buses in Ireland, let's face it, are dire compared to other countries. Poorly managed.

Recently they hiked the price of city buses(at least in Cork) to 1.60, claiming that the buses were empty. This of course makes no sense in of itself - if demand is low, you lower the price. But a lot of buses are still packed since none come for an hour in some cases.

The thing is that transport isn't like welfare - they actively make money off it, you pay 1.60 for a 10 minute journey, and there can be around 40 people on the bus or more at any one time - even with the high petrol costs(which are still lower than during the summer, when the bus was still 1.40). That's a lot of money. There is no reason it shouldn't be scalable - so there's no reason to cut back on services unless the managment is very incompetent(which it is).

What's more is that they now have huge adverts on buses. Not only are they annoying since you can't see out of them at night, but they also aggrivate when you think about it - those adverts are huge, and mobile. Anyone who gets on a bus regularly is guaranteed to see them multiple times, anyone walking in town will see them. They must be taking in quite a bit of money from it, and if they aren't, they could.

Transport is not something that needs that much "funding" in that regard since it's a business, they provide a service for a premium price. Not to mention a lot of the monthly/weekly passes are a joke and hard to make a saving on.

Also, it costs 71 euros for a return train to Dublin from Cork. That's ****ing insane. The same journey in the UK would probably cost around £20.

The buses in West Cork are mad, its about E17 for a return trip to the city, it would cost you about E10 return in the car.

My girlfriend has started learning to the drive as a result.
The prices are going up and up and they've cut a number of buses.
The buses used to be near full when my GF was going, but they've weaned off now it seems.

I think to be fair though, people out here probably accepted a long time ago that if you didn't have a car, you could forget about going anywhere.

antoinolachtnai

It sounds like you the OP has two problems rather than one (although they are obviously linked).

1. Quality
2. Price

With Irish costs, those prices aren't high. Payroll costs are relatively high at the state bus companies. They receive a large subsidy, both for operating and capital. On the input side, BE has lost its duty rebate and is now paying more for diesel than a year ago.

Would you be happy if the service was better?

Train: what about travelling by coach instead? How does that work out for you?

At the end of the day, transport in Cork is an exchequer-funded service. Realistically, that could mean that there are more price increases.

Manic Moran

I don't know, the cost of intercity transport is daft.

I like trains, and would be well disposed to sitting on IE for three hours on the way to Limerick. I've half a mind to visit Galway as well.

Dublin-Limerick Return is E60 according to the company website. I get off the airplane at DUB, I ride over to Hertz, and I've booked a Ford Focus for four days for E90, which will get me from Dublin to Limerick to Galway and back at my convenience, door to door, for the cost of fuel.

Sorry, CIE, but your price doesn't cut it. I bought my 'plane ticket from San Francisco to Dublin for $220 USD (Aer Lingus), you're going to be hard pressed to tell me that the maintenance and staffing requirements for a train with 400 seats moving for six hours is that much compared to that of an airplane with 300 seats moving for 8 hours.

NTM

Rented Mule

gandalf wrote: »

To be honest we need a government who have a clue and can stick to a plan. This current bunch have flip flopped so much on transport policy its pathetic. Their so called green policies are proven to be the farce they are with increases like the ones the OP talks about in Cork and the recent Dublin Bus and Luas price increases.

I think you nailed it with the opening sentence.

I have never seen a situation where each minister is flip flopped between ministerial positions with absolutely no background in the areas they are meant to manage.

One could overlook this if it weren't for the fact that their managerial skills are even worse that their lack of knowledge in each area.