Is the single €urrency of the "New World Order" now becoming a reality?

King Mob · 31-03-2009 1:08pm

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

You obviously haven't a clue about Gold, its properties or its uses.

Gold is the most malleable and ductile of all known metals. A single ounce of gold can be beaten into a sheet measuring roughly 5 meters on a side. Thin sheets of gold, known as gold leaf, are primarily used in arts and crafts for gilding. One sheet of gold leaf can be as thin as 0.000127 millimeters, or about 400 times thinner than a human hair.

Pure gold is soft and is usually alloyed with other metals, such as silver, copper, platinum or palladium, to increase its strength. Gold alloys are used to make jewelry, decorative items, and coins. The amount of gold in an alloy is measured with a unit called a carat. One carat is equal to one part in twenty-four, so an 18 carat gold ring contains 18 parts pure gold and 6 parts alloy material.

Gold is a good conductor of heat and electricity and does not tarnish when it is exposed to the air, so it can be used to make electrical connectors and printed circuit boards. Gold is also a good reflector of infrared radiation and can be used to help shield spacecraft and skyscrapers from the sun's heat. Gold coated mirrors can be used to make telescopes that are sensitive to infrared light.

A radioactive isotope of gold, gold-198, is used for treating cancer. Gold sodium thiosulfate (AuNa3O6S4) is used as a treatment for arthritis. Chlorauric acid (HAuCl4) is used to preserve photographs by replacing the silver atoms present in an image.

Gold has been used in dental work for centuries and is still used today for crowns and fillings, it does not tarnish when oxidized.

In an event of a "Global Electronic" currency merge we could possibly see a revival of gold being used as an "unauthorized" underworld trading currency. It is and always will be highly sought after.

And we all know how important gold leaf and jewelry are in a survival situation.
The reason gold might be used as an "unauthorized" underworld trading currency is because people place a value on it, just like cash.

But how is everyone using gold any different to a global currency?

meglome · 31-03-2009 2:03pm

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

You obviously haven't a clue about Gold, its properties or its uses.

I'll try one more time. Gold isn't useless but it is useless to your survival if people don't place value in it. Sure it's a lovely shiny malleable and ductile metal. But you can't eat it if you're starving, you can't use it to plant crops, you can't use it to put a roof over your head in a physical sense. The only way gold will help in these situations is if people place value in it just like they do now, and exactly like they do now with cash. Why is this so hard to grasp? Anything could be used as currency as long as people place a value in it.

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

In an event of a "Global Electronic" currency merge we could possibly see a revival of gold being used as an "unauthorized" underworld trading currency. It is and always will be highly sought after.

So you're saying that introducing this global electronic currency wouldn't work?

Mahatma coat · 31-03-2009 2:16pm

well maybe because at the end of the day the gold I hold in my hand is GOLD not some abstract concept of value based on other peoples perceptions and needs but actual physical GOLD with actual physical uses outside of being a means of comercial exchange, I have some here its not as shiny as you might think, tis pretty tho.

Ibid again you missed my initial point, what is your money WORTH?

what is its intrinsic value, as ya say yereself it only has the value we ascribe to it there is nothing PHYSICAL backing it besides your faith that its worh something

I gave the example of other things that can be made from gold, requiring little to no tools, at the end of the day gold/copper/Iron/shiny glass beads are physical things that have uses outside the facilitation of trade.

What is Digital Cash?

King Mob · 31-03-2009 2:20pm

MC what is the intrinsic value of gold?
How much is it worth say in labour or food?

Run_to_da_hills · 31-03-2009 2:33pm

meglome wrote: »

So you're saying that introducing this global electronic currency wouldn't work?

A full blown Global Electronic Currency would be fine for those that have "nothing to hide" but for others that respect their civil liberties they would prefer the anonymity of dealing outside the system.

meglome · 31-03-2009 2:42pm

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

A full blown Global Electronic Currency would be fine for those that have "nothing to hide" but for others they would prefer the anonymity of dealing outside the system.

hmm didn't I make the point a while back that this global electronic currency couldn't work because of the black economy that exists in every nation?

So are we agreeing for once?

In my experience most cash businesses that can will skim off a small percentage of that cash so that they can pay, for example, staff that are not on the books. Do you think all these business people are going to agree to a purely electronic currency? In general, nations are the better for some small back economy.

Mahatma coat · 31-03-2009 2:43pm

King Mob wrote: »

MC what is the intrinsic value of gold?
How much is it worth say in labour or food?

well as with all mediums of exchange its value must be mutually agreed by both parties to the transaction.

however outside the transaction Gold/silver/copper/tin/iron/shiny glass beads still have an intrinsic value.

can you grasp that point?

King Mob · 31-03-2009 2:48pm

Mahatma coat wrote: »

well as with all mediums of exchange its value must be mutually agreed by both parties to the transaction.

SO both parties place a value on what's being traded?

Mahatma coat wrote: »

however outside the transaction Gold/silver/copper/tin/iron/shiny glass beads still have an intrinsic value.

can you grasp that point?

Then what is their intrinsic value in hours of labour?

Mahatma coat · 31-03-2009 3:02pm

nah

King Mob · 31-03-2009 3:04pm

Mahatma coat wrote: »

either you dont get it or you are being obtuse for a quick egowank, whichever you're goin on the ignore list

You're the one claiming it has and intrinsic value. Why is it hard for you to define that value?
How much work would I get for a kilo of gold?

Run_to_da_hills · 31-03-2009 3:04pm

meglome wrote: »

hmm didn't I make the point a while back that this global electronic currency couldn't work because of the black economy that exists in every nation? So are we agreeing for once?.

We can agree that it could exist but it may not be tolerated.

It may work in theory, but in effect if one dose not conform to the "system" imposed they may not be able to recieve benefits from it. I.E pay stamps to collect welfare, pensions, travel in public transport, buy fuel, food in a supermarket etc, , the Electronic system would be so tied up it would be virtually impossible to escape from it unless you are willing to live in a commune in the outback or on some isolated desert Island.

meglome wrote: »

In my experience most cash businesses that can will skim off a small percentage of that cash so that they can pay, for example, staff that are not on the books. Do you think all these business people are going to agree to a purely electronic currency? In general, nations are the better for some small back economy.

One reason for bring in the Global Electronic system of buying & selling is to weed out this black economy. The black economy has been the bain of successive governments for centuries it has been blamed for terrorism, murder, and almost every sort of crime. People would opt for such a system if they could see an end to drug related gangland killing. Money is not the root of all evil.....Cash is.

meglome · 31-03-2009 3:05pm

Mahatma coat wrote: »

well as with all mediums of exchange its value must be mutually agreed by both parties to the transaction.

however outside the transaction Gold/silver/copper/tin/iron/shiny glass beads still have an intrinsic value.

can you grasp that point?

Metals have uses other than currency, I certainly not suggesting otherwise. If I live next to a mountain of iron ore it may not be very valuable to me. But someone who has no access to iron ore may place a high value on it. So any commodity will have different intrinsic values to different people. If you have too much food it's less valuable to you than to someone who hasn't enough.

So intrinsic value would vary from person to person and from place to place. We trust cash money as we've been using it from so long now, thousands of years.

Mahatma coat · 31-03-2009 3:08pm

King Mob wrote: »

SO both parties place a value on what's being traded?

Duh, why would you enter into a transaction for something you didnt place a value in?

Then what is their intrinsic value in hours of labour?

depends on whats achieved in that hour donit

if I go fishin for an hour and catch 15 macrel then the vlue of that hour is 15 macrel however if i catch nothin then that hour was a waste of effort

King Mob · 31-03-2009 3:16pm

Mahatma coat wrote: »

Duh, why would you enter into a transaction for something you didnt place a value in?

I would only place value in gold if i could trade it for goods or services.
I can only trade it for goods and services if others place value on it.

People put value on gold nothing intrinsic about it.

If it had an intrinsic value I could go into any shop and pay with chunks of gold.

Mahatma coat · 31-03-2009 3:16pm

ah but we havent been using 'cash money' fpr thousands of years, we have had a comodoties based system for thousands of years, wher I would grow spuds and exchange tme for some of your iron, we would most likely use an agreed method of exchange for this transaction, often gold, or whatever was acceptable to both of us.

FIAT money is something new, and different thats only really been around for a century or less

6th · 31-03-2009 3:17pm

Mahatma coat wrote: »

nah

Mahatma coat wrote: »

either you dont get it or you are being obtuse for a quick egowank, whichever you're goin on the ignore list

Ninja edit or not if you post anything like that again you are gone for a long time.

Mahatma coat · 31-03-2009 3:20pm

OK, again a first hand experience, but
i once assisted in facilitating the trade between some visiting PNG islanders and a second hand car dealer of a toyota hilux for 2 coffe jars of shmuggled gold

meglome · 31-03-2009 4:08pm

Mahatma coat wrote: »

ah but we havent been using 'cash money' fpr thousands of years, we have had a comodoties based system for thousands of years, wher I would grow spuds and exchange tme for some of your iron, we would most likely use an agreed method of exchange for this transaction, often gold, or whatever was acceptable to both of us.

But we have been exchanging money for thousands of years. Often this money was made of metal that had an intrinsic value in itself but also often this money had little intrinsic value and was trusted as it was issued by the state and a value placed on it by that state. No matter what way you look at it any system of currency only works because of the value we place on it.

meglome · 31-03-2009 4:21pm

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

We can agree that it could exist but it may not be tolerated.

So if it wouldn't be tolerated why would it exist in the first place? I'm a little confused.

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

It may work in theory, but in effect if one dose not conform to the "system" imposed they may not be able to recieve benefits from it. I.E pay stamps to collect welfare, pensions, travel in public transport, buy fuel, food in a supermarket etc, , the Electronic system would be so tied up it would be virtually impossible to escape from it unless you are willing to live in a commune in the outback or on some isolated desert Island.

But we're both saying it wouldn't be tolerated nor could it work for every transaction. So why would we need to escape from something that we wouldn't tolerate the introduction of in the first place.

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

One reason for bring in the Global Electronic system of buying & selling is to weed out this black economy. The black economy has been the bain of successive governments for centuries it has been blamed for terrorism, murder, and almost every sort of crime. People would opt for such a system if they could see an end to drug related gangland killing. Money is not the root of all evil.....Cash is.

Ah I see. So does that mean every electronic transaction that happens right now is completely honest and above board?

And I think you'll find that, money, nor cash, nor guns are the root of evil... it's people who do 'evil'. All through history people have done terrible things for many different reasons, and long long before cash existed. Communism on paper was the fairest system of government we've had, but in practice because people are greedy and power hungry that wasn't the case.

King Mob · 31-03-2009 4:37pm

Mahatma coat wrote: »

OK, again a first hand experience, but
i once assisted in facilitating the trade between some visiting PNG islanders and a second hand car dealer of a toyota hilux for 2 coffe jars of shmuggled gold

And?
The PNG islanders obviously placed value in the gold and could use it. As could the car dealer who found the trade agreeable apparently.

I personally would not like to be paid in gold, due to the fact I wouldn't be able to do anything with it nor would I know where to get it exchanged into some I could use.

Is the single €urrency of the "New World Order" now becoming a reality?

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