Ganley to stand as candidate in the North West constituency for European Elections

r14

This was in the Times today. Seems Spanish Libertas is being run by an immensley rich, shady, insider dealing kinda guy. Hmmm now who does that remind me of.

Also I love the way Libertas manage to unite two parties with diametrically opposed policies. Sure it's only politics... you don't actually have to stand for anything :mad:

the_syco

ionix5891 wrote: »

BlitzKrieg wrote: »

The dublin constituency candidates will be available for questions at the Northside Civic Centre in Coolock

on thursday 21st of may at 7pm.

Not confirmed yet if the libertas candidate will appear.

If she does I will post back, I will probably be filming the event as its our community organisation hosting the event with the northside community forum.

So if there is a list of questions for all the candidates (and specifically on libertas) I will list the panel once its confirmed and you can post them here.

* where is the money coming from?

:cool:

Or more importantly: as there's a limit (or so I'm told) to the amount you can spend, will you adhere to the limit?

K-9

Got a leaflet through the door this morning from Mr. Ganley. Extremely vague and general stuff. He's going to create jobs for us apparently because he's an entrepreneur.

JonathanAnon

Usual Ganley smoke and mirrors, deny everything negative. Wouldn trust him as far as I can throw him. And why the hell does he keep saying that he is doing this on behalf of the Irish people - he is an immigrant from Watford.

BlitzKrieg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GH9hmhOZ12c

my very quick youtube rant on case 2. Any errors you see needing correction feel free to point them out so I can put in correction annotations. Feel free to spread it around if you feel its worthy of mention.

Criticisms or advice on how I can improve are welcomed.

note I didnt have time to edit this on my mac so I did on my PC on after effects (which you shouldnt) in the space of 30 minutes. I did the recording using my rock band microphone so the quality isnt great.

If I decide to do more I will use my mac for a more consistent and faster edit process.

nesf

Libertas. Like the beginning of tassle. Not like tess.

BlitzKrieg

yeah I cut out a 3 minute waffle at the start where I was going is it libertes or li-ber-tas etc etc.

I ended up opting for libertes cause it ran off the tongue easier. I'll add an annotation apoligising for the mispronounciation.

is_that_so

nesf wrote: »

She did indeed top the poll: http://electionsireland.org/result.cfm?election=1994E&cons=524

Her support dropped over the following years.

She was indeed the poll topper but she already had a profile. To top the poll she got 14.54% of the first preference votes. Looking back to North West in 2004 Pearse Doherty of SF who failed to get in got 15.5% of the first preferences.
http://electionsireland.org/result.cfm?election=2004E&cons=241

With O'Neachtain out then the 3rd seat is up for grabs and I suspect this is what he is going after. But it's very very long way from 2% to double digits, which is why I question whether he really has any chance at all. Like SF he needs a very big first preference vote because transfers will be hard to come by. Doherty has a very big core vote anyway and must be strongly favoured. Also that ever popular politician Dana who soaked up a further 13.52% does not look to be involved. That can only make it easier for Doherty.

Sure anything can happen and FF in particular will suffer but that doesn't necessarily suggest that people will look in the direction of Libertas.

View

FF just need to find someone like a GAA player or IFA leader from Galway - ideally, from the Tuam area of course - and they'll soak up a lot of votes from there. Not enough to be elected but enough to transfer handily and get Mr. Mooney over the line.

ionix5891

interesting

try maybe present the ideas with bullet points in power point slide format?

actually learn from Libertas themselves emphasize the negatives

K-9

is_that_so wrote: »

She was indeed the poll topper but she already had a profile. To top the poll she got 14.54% of the first preference votes. Looking back to North West in 2004 Pearse Doherty of SF who failed to get in got 15.5% of the first preferences.
http://electionsireland.org/result.cfm?election=2004E&cons=241

With O'Neachtain out then the 3rd seat is up for grabs and I suspect this is what he is going after. But it's very very long way from 2% to double digits, which is why I question whether he really has any chance at all. Like SF he needs a very big first preference vote because transfers will be hard to come by. Doherty has a very big core vote anyway and must be strongly favoured. Also that ever popular politician Dana who soaked up a further 13.52% does not look to be involved. That can only make it easier for Doherty.

Sure anything can happen and FF in particular will suffer but that doesn't necessarily suggest that people will look in the direction of Libertas.

Is it MacLochlainn running?

is_that_so

K-9 wrote: »

Is it MacLochlainn running?

Oops apologies,it is indeed. Even so SF do have a large core vote in that constituency.

Scofflaw

Just looking at the thread there on the Swedish Pirate Party, which says

"Membership has shot up to a record 42,000+, and a recent poll to check out the frontrunners in the E.U. election showed even rosier numbers."

42,000? What's Libertas' membership? Is it more or less than that? Anyone any idea?

interested,
Scofflaw

ionix5891

Scofflaw wrote: »

Just looking at the thread there on the Swedish Pirate Party, which says

"Membership has shot up to a record 42,000+, and a recent poll to check out the frontrunners in the E.U. election showed even rosier numbers."

42,000? What's Libertas' membership? Is it more or less than that? Anyone any idea?

interested,
Scofflaw

is there a pirate party in Ireland?

i feel very strongly about the mess our IP laws are in and am worried about any restrictions on freedom of speech especially in new mediums such as internet

BlitzKrieg

so anyone follow his speech today where he was meant to outline his policies for the upcoming election?

only home now and so far I see no policies.

Just finished reading it.

Disapointed to see he had the common sense to remove the policy of bringing referendums to every state.

But happy to see he still seems to retain the inability to grasp the european process.

From missing the notion of political groupings (over 190 small parties, yes. but they work together to form 5-10 political alliances) to his completely arseway attack on MEP's and the lack of knowledge of holding national governments accountable (in his defence, this is an issue alot of people seem to miss seeing that nobody ever talks about the EU at general elections.)

and again he completely goes at article 48 in the wrong way (again.)

Something is happening, all across Europe.

An ancient voice is calling us… one that some of us had almost forgotten about. An old force is pulling us together once more.
DEMOCRACY… People are coming together to take Europe back for themselves.


Your leaders have just done something that has NEVER been done before. They have signed a solemn, DEMOCRATIC pledge…


A pledge that says, right across Europe… wherever Libertas exists… we will ALWAYS fight so that the PEOPLE have the final say.

We are one month away from delivering on that promise.

We are gathered here today because fifty two years ago, the leaders of six European countries made history in this magnificent city. The Treaty of Rome pledged its authors to creating “an ever-closer Union”. Firstly, this was as a trading bloc, an economic pact… but they were really promising so much more.

They were promising NOTHING less than an end to war on the European continent, and a means of ensuring lasting prosperity for us all. They succeeded… beyond their wildest hopes. Over half a century of peace and growth has now passed on our continent. An unprecedented achievement.

However, we are not here today to wrap ourselves in the history of Europe... but to remind ourselves of what our generation MUST live up to... today. The time has come for us to ask, ‘which way now, in the future?’

Most of you have travelled a long way. Europe is a big place! You have come from many countries, and you tell a thousand different stories. As I stand here and look out on this crowd, I see faces that barely twenty years ago were imprisoned behind an iron curtain that divided our people.

Today, that we are re-united as one family, should give EVERY one of us faith that our better days truly lie ahead of us.

Yet, as we meet here, Europe is failing us. The most tragic economic crisis in a generation has laid bare the inability of Brussels to respond to our call for help.

And this recession has only just begun. Dark days and stark choices lie ahead.

Meanwhile, the ongoing farce of the Lisbon Constitution illustrates just how deaf to our voice those who would rule in our name have become.

I say to you today, this is just NOT good enough.

But, we in this room know that the situation can only change if we, as a PEOPLE, rediscover Europe’s own democratic roots. We must do it for ourselves.

So I am here today… WE are here today… to renew the promise that those wise men made in the shadow of war, over half a century ago. Because we know that the time has come for Europe to reform or die.

The decision is in OUR hands. Europeans’ hands. If we let the chance pass us by, we know that we will only have ourselves to blame.

It may sound a bit dramatic to those, in the cozy media bubble, that enjoy telling us what to think… but there has NEVER been a more important European election than this one. It is, quite simply, the LAST chance we have to ensure that our voice – Europe’s voice – is heard.

That is the choice that will confront us in June. Who rules Europe in the future? The unelected elites or the people?

Will you take a chance, and take a stand to make sure that your voice is heard?

Your leaders signed a pledge today… and one that will stand the test of time. But from today, it is down to you. Because I believe that this campaign will be decided, not by me, but by what YOU do next.

I believe that you have what it takes to create the momentum we need, to smash down the walls of apathy and cynicism… to take on the unelected elites in Brussels and WIN.

I believe that YOU can bring reform… and renew the hope of Europe.

* * *

I see Europe today and I still see the hope that created the modern world... But I see a force in decline… a continent that has lost its way. We have become content to accept our fate, and tolerant of what is second-best.

What exactly do I mean?

Well, over EIGHTY PERCENT of the laws that govern us… govern YOU… are now dreamt up by bureaucrats in Brussels.

I have sometimes called them ‘mediocrities’… which some have taken as an attack on them personally. It is not a personal attack at all. It is just that BY DEFINITION, the cream rises to the top in a DEMOCRACY.

On the other hand, when you HAVE to be unelected to make the law… it is the mediocre that will ALWAYS flourish. The nearly-men and the rejects of our national governments always seem to find a happy home in the European Commission, don’t they? Now, I don’t know about you, but shouldn’t the highest decision-making body have the BEST people in it?

Can’t we create a system which gives us confidence that those at the top are making the RIGHT decisions in our name? That allows the best and the brightest to rise to the very pinnacle of European politics.

To coin a phrase… “Yes We Can”!

We’ve got TWENTY SEVEN Commissioners dreaming up endless laws we don’t need, watched over by a toothless parliament of over one hundred and NINETY separate parties… All those politicians add up to just ONE, BIG, EXPENSIVE mess.

The European Parliament has become a standing joke among democrats the world over and that… in the continent that gave BIRTH to democracy… to egalité, liberté and fraternité… makes me sad beyond belief.

We should be ASHAMED that our European elections turn so many voters off.

And no, we will not tolerate it. Today we say to the people of Europe that YOU can make a difference… You WILL make the difference.

* * *

And if where we are makes me sad, where the bureaucrats want to go next just makes me ANGRY.

The Lisbon Constitution – the same rumbling tectonic plate that led to a Tsunami of democratic opposition in France… in the Netherlands… and in Ireland… is the most naked power-grab in history.

We all saw it. Everyone in this room recognized it… and I suspect it is why many of you joined our movement in the first place… Simply because, somewhere deep inside, you thought ‘enough is enough’.

We often only ask questions when something isn’t working… and I suppose that is why it has taken a new party to question the wisdom of what Brussels has planned.

An unelected President… An unelected Foreign Minister for Europe… The loss of our national commissioners…

All in all, FIFTY new areas where Brussels would take power over our sovereign, national governments. Power without control. Authority without accountability.

Such subtle shifts might have been missed, but for the sheer arrogance of the way that Lisbon was written.

Article 48 is effectively ‘the blank cheque’ provision. Not only does it leave large areas of policy to be decided AFTER the states have signed away their authority… It declares that Brussels NEVER needs to bother to ask our permission again.

Let me say it in four words: Over my dead body.

I have actually read the Lisbon Treaty. A feat that took a lot of coffee! I sometimes say that I began reading the Lisbon Treaty as a businessman... because I thought it could be of benefit to my company.

But I finished reading it as a father. I was HORRIFIED.

I realised that I was looking on as the last strands of democracy governing my children’s future were finally swept away. We would have no means at ALL of holding these people to account.

That is why the Lisbon CONSTITUTION is, actually, totally ANTI-European. To misquote Winston Churchill – author of the phrase ‘United States of Europe’... Never has so much been decided... for so many... by so few.

So I left my business, and I took up our cause.

So many of us in France, the Netherlands and other countries campaigned against the blatant violation of our rights and hopes, but still Brussels fought back using EVERY dirty political trick in the book.

Well, we are fighting back.

And, on behalf of everyone in Europe who does NOT have a six-figure taxpayer-funded income, we have to ask them... “which part of ‘non’ do you not understand?”

That’s the Europe we are confronted with today, where ‘no’ means ‘yes’... parliament is allowed NO voice and NO veto... and is instead composed of pampered, toothless lackeys... Only the unelected can make the law...

Which is ALWAYS done out-of-sight, and far from public scrutiny...

North Koreans would recognise the set-up quite well, I think!

Ours is not just a campaign about the Lisbon Treaty, however. We know that it is not enough just to oppose... We must PROPOSE a new way forward.

So, we join together today to establish a common vision. No, we will not agree on every issue... nor should we. We are Irish, Polish, Slovenian, French first... and Europeans second. But where we can work together, we must.

The great challenges that confront us today... the jobs crisis, the climate crisis, illegal immigration... are too great for us to face alone.

On these great issues... at this critical time in our history... Europe must speak with ONE, clear, positive voice.

* * *

So it is down to EACH of us in this room to draw the contrast between us and the rest of the political establishment that we shall replace.

I’ll tell you what I mean.

Firstly, if the politicians in Brussels want to think of themselves as an elite... then let Libertas proudly declare that ours is a movement of the PEOPLE. They insist that they will decide... we say that ‘NO’... the PEOPLE should decide.

Secondly, if they insist on a closed shop... doing the big deals behind closed doors, then we will define ourselves by our OPENNESS. That is why we call today for FULL TRANSPARENCY of what our MEPs are earning... and the decisions they are taking on our behalf. Let the PEOPLE into politics once more.

Third, if Brussels carries on the waste of ‘jobs for the boys’ and gold-plated pensions that don’t lose a penny thanks to the poor, European taxpayer... then WE will make it our mission to ensure that the EU delivers value-for-money. Now, more than ever.

If they continue not to listen... not to respond... to blithely steamroller on, as if the will of the people is an annoyance to be ‘dealt with’ or simply ignored... Then WE shall create a lean, agile EU.

A Union that fit-for-purpose in the Twenty-First Century.

Finally, and most importantly... If they insist on pursuing a path which sees Europe’s citizens as spectators... or passive observers in the political process... Libertas will be the party that calls on YOU to participate. We will create new ways for YOU to have YOUR say, and for your say to count. In other words, to be part of a DEMOCRACY.

Over a MILLION of you have joined us through libertas.eu so far... One MILLION voices speaking as one, and that number is rising every day.

Don’t let them tell us that we are divided, when we know what unites us... DEMOCRACY. It is the reason Europe exists and thrives. It is our proudest invention and our noblest cause. Democracy in Europe is what we fight for today.

Democracy MATTERS. If you cannot be heard at the ballot box, you cannot change a thing. And if you can’t change things... you can bet that somebody else will do so on your behalf. And that’s NOT what so many of you in this room fought against.

Power without a check or balance is dangerous. Decisions taken behind closed doors... far from public scrutiny, are NEVER good decisions. After all, isn’t that what happened with the financial crisis? Too many men making decisions on our behalf... far from public scrutiny or oversight?

I say to you today... NEVER AGAIN.

* * *

This is why our national parties have failed us all.

Even if the largest party in the largest country in the European Union won EVERY single vote in that country, they would still only control a TINY percentage of seats in the European Parliament. They couldn’t change a THING.

Let’s face it... a vote for ANY national party in the European election is a wasted vote. And, of course, that suits the bureaucrats just FINE.

While one hundred and ninety fragmented, national parties squabble over petty divisions, they can accumulate more and more power.

It is down to US to get out there and say “there IS another way... You can choose Libertas INSTEAD”.

Libertas is a pan-European force. A new voice and a new hope for Europeans, quite unlike anything else that has existed before. That is why this election is not a contest between different parties, like so many different brands of petrol... We are offering Europe a whole new means of transportation.

Libertas only exists as a way of letting YOU say... “LISTEN TO US”.

We reject the idea that people are less qualified than politicians.

And we reject the idea, so prominent in Brussels, that ‘no’ means ‘yes’.

We say to them from the depths of our souls that this path can lead ONLY to failure and decline... and that a million voices are saying ‘there IS another way’.

There will be no second chances on Lisbon if we let the Brussels elite succeed. They will NOT ask us again. They will take our silence as a mandate which has no limits... and cannot be revoked.

Their hearts may be pure... but the road to hell is paved with good intentions. Let US be the people that said, ‘NOT IN OUR NAME’.

* * *

Thirty years after the Treaty of Rome... with the Single European Act... Europe found a level of economic integration that we are happy with. A truly single market. The free movement of people, capital and services... to the benefit of us all.

A common currency for those who want to take part... but more importantly, a market that WORKED.

Now, another two decades on, is the time to create a POLITICAL movement that WORKS for the people of Europe.

It is no longer a question of “ever-closer integration”... It is a question of balancing the benefits of economic co-operation with ensuring that the PEOPLE will ALWAYS have the final say.

Of course, it suits the men in suits in Brussels to present us with a false choice. ‘In’ or ‘Out’ of Europe. Pro-European or Euro-sceptic. Lisbon or nothing.

You don’t need me to tell you that this is RIDICULOUS. That is why Libertas candidates are the real PRO-EUROPEANS... We are the movement offering the REAL choice... and the real VOICE for the people.

The question EVERY voter should ask themselves on 7 June is not ‘should we be in or out of Europe?’... It should be, ‘how can we make Europe work BETTER for ALL the people?’

The answers are not easy, and I don’t think I should pretend that I have them all here. Nor would we all agree if I tried to.

But don’t let them say that we can NEVER act as one...

Here are four, core policies that ONLY Libertas can offer this June:

First, GENUINE accountability. Your national parties... the Socialists, the Conservatives, the Communists and the Nationalists... ALL of them have failed you.

None of them work... because NONE has the necessary power in the heart of Europe. One movement can. Only Libertas can HOLD THEM TO ACCOUNT.

Second, the European Union MUST... as a MATTER OF PRINCIPLE, demonstrate real VALUE FOR MONEY, beginning today.

It disturbs me that €100,000 was spent by our leaders to build a ski slope in Denmark on a flat piece of land... where it never snows.

It would be funny, were it not tragic.

And it really worries me that €2.4 billion was spent by our leaders on Public Relations, in order to promote themselves at OUR expense.... just as the recession bit the poorest and most vulnerable, hardest.

THAT is why we are the only party to have committed to 10 billion Euros in savings from the Commission budget.

When times are tough for families, it isn’t just wasteful to burn money like this… it is OBSCENE. And we cannot afford to take them for granted.

Third, because it is right and proper that politicians have the same ethical standards that we would apply to ourselves, we must have FULL DISCLOSURE OF what they EARN and what they DECIDE.

We can NOT continue the practice of back-room deals, meetings behind closed doors and gold-plated pensions.

It may be good business for Bernie Madoff… Believe me, it’s not good for us!

FINALLY, only our ELECTED politicians should make the law. If we elect our MEPs, we should give them real power. The representatives of the people must not only have the power to represent the people, but they must have the power to defend the people.

To those who would pass the Lisbon treaty... I ask this question:

In Europe today, if I want to hold accountable the person who approved €100,000 to build a ski slope on flat ground, where it never snows... whom do I vote out?

If I am a French farmer who wants to get rid of the Commissioner responsible for negotiating a bad Trade deal, whom do I vote against?

If I am a worker, who wants to work longer hours to pay my mortgage but find a strange, foreign regulation in my way, who do I vote against?

The answer to that question cannot be found. And in any society, that is DANGEROUS.

So, it is down to US. We must start the change... TODAY.

* * *

And so, our message... our medium... our movement... ends where it began.

With DEMOCRACY.

We are not here to break Europe... we are here to improve it.

We are not here to tell you to follow, we want YOU… the PEOPLE… to LEAD.

Our movement depends on people like YOU deciding not to simply accept the status quo… and instead choosing to get involved, to stand up and speak out.

Some people call this a ‘grassroots approach to campaigning’.

To me, there is a much better way of describing it: DEMOCRACY.

Right across Europe, right now, we are a MILLION strong. And millions more are coming together. Young, old, families and friends.

Voter by voter, country by country, people are signing up to Libertas.eu. They are giving their names… lending their opinions… offering their time… to renew the promise of Europe.

Join us.

Now… five years after the Great Eastern Accession to the Union, it has NEVER been more important that you STAND UP to have your say in Europe’s future.

It is time to take Europe back for the PEOPLE.

Our future is in YOUR hands.

Thank you.

Scofflaw

You know, that speech actually makes me angry. To think that this unelected wide boy has the nerve to describe himself as "your leader" (did you spot that?), that he lies, and lies, and lies....

I mean - look at this:

Your leaders have just done something that has NEVER been done before. They have signed a solemn, DEMOCRATIC pledge…

He means him.

BY DEFINITION, the cream rises to the top in a DEMOCRACY.

And he means him again. Self-satisfied, unctuous, lying...

angrily,
Scofflaw

ionix5891

Scofflaw wrote: »

You know, that speech actually makes me angry. To think that this unelected wide boy has the nerve to describe himself as "your leader" (did you spot that?), that he lies, and lies, and lies....

angrily,
Scofflaw

whats worse is the way hes buying power ...

... a certain word comes to mind thats thrown alot in the above pile of steaming crap

"elite"

dec25532

Don't fret. His ratings in the private polls being conducted across the north west constituency are abysmal. He is trailing the Sinn Fein candidate by a big margin. Jim Higgins, Marian Harkin and a Fianna Failer will win the three seats. Fianna Fail will stumble across the line although it is hard to credit that Paschal 'cowboy' Mooney is now the party's frontrunner. AAAggh

r14

Ganley makes no sense whatsoever. He wants a directly elected President of Europe with a Parliament that makes all the laws (forgetting that unelected bureaucrats draft laws in national systems as well)... At the same he claims to resist giving up sovereignty to Europe.

Having a directly elected President is completely inconsistent with retaining MS sovereignty. It is a major step in becoming a Federal State - I wish all the people voting for him could stop Government bashing long enough to see a) that his "policies" make no sense and b) if you believe what he says he is a major federalist so no point giving him a protest vote.

Also I notice that Ganley claims to want all European laws decided by a simple majority vote in Parliament and a 3/4 vote in the Council. At the smae time he wants to maintain the national veto. We either go for unanimity in the Council or majority but you can't have both.

He's so infuriating because there are so many out and out lies and half-truths that it is very hard to pick him up on all of them. I really hope a Libertas candidate calls around to my house in the campaign because I want to give them an earful.

r14

If I am a French farmer who wants to get rid of the Commissioner responsible for negotiating a bad Trade deal, whom do I vote against?

Your national government who agreed to the appointment of the Commissioner.

If I am a worker, who wants to work longer hours to pay my mortgage but find a strange, foreign regulation in my way, who do I vote against?

Your national government who help draft and implement the regulation.

The answer to that question cannot be found. And in any society, that is DANGEROUS.

It can be found Declan because the EU is primarily an intergovernmental organisation. The national governments should be held accountable for their actions rather than being allowed to hide behind the shield of big bad Europe.

Some people call this a ‘grassroots approach to campaigning’.

Textbook astroturf campaign imo.

BlitzKrieg

so anyone want to help me put together a more concrete video pointing out the flaws of his speech? I got my mac running up again so editing a video etc will be quicker, better put together and easier.

P. Breathnach

BlitzKrieg wrote: »

so anyone want to help me put together a more concrete video pointing out the flaws of his speech?

Just play his speech.

BlitzKrieg

Can I juse confirm the following

FINALLY, only our ELECTED politicians should make the law. If we elect our MEPs, we should give them real power. The representatives of the people must not only have the power to represent the people, but they must have the power to defend the people.

If the executive powers were moved to the Parliament instead of the commission how much will Irish influence in the drafting of laws diminish?

From 1/27 (pre. Nice ruling) in the commission

and 1/27 in the council of ministers (who select the commission)

to

13/785 as our MEP's in the Parliament.

Under Ganley's europe we look to loose alot of power and influence.

turgon

And surely under ganleys logic we should have voted yes to Lisbon, to give parliament more powers?

Scofflaw

turgon wrote: »

And surely under ganleys logic we should have voted yes to Lisbon, to give parliament more powers?

Under his what now?

rhetorically,
Scofflaw

PHB

The problem has always been that Ganley created a false dichotomy.

The choice isn't between democracy and non-democracy,
it's between democracy and intergovernmentalism.

Scofflaw

PHB wrote: »

The problem has always been that Ganley created a false dichotomy.

The choice isn't between democracy and non-democracy,
it's between democracy and intergovernmentalism.

Indeed, between a sort of federal democracy and a sort of confederal intergovernmentalism. As it is we have a bit of both.

cordially,
Scofflaw

Euro_Kraut

UPDATE: Libertas have failed to get themselves on the ballot in Austria. All parties had until 1700 on May 1 to register. The Federal election office has released the list of parties that will take part in the European Election (http://www.bmi.gv.at/wahlen/EUW_09_parteien.asp) and Libertas are not there.

BlitzKrieg

*ouch*

so how many candidates do they have in how many countries?

Cause they need 25 candidates in 7 countries to be anyway close to their promise of a pan european movement.

EDIT: It seems the BZO candidate is the *possible* libertas candidate aswell, as they have stated that depending on how libertas do in the election they might go into an alliance with them.

oscarBravo

Ganley's speech wrote:

We’ve got TWENTY SEVEN Commissioners dreaming up endless laws we don’t need...

This from the same people who told us to vote against Lisbon in order to keep "our" commissioner...?