What's the point of D class?

Tim_Murphy

No need to be getting huffy about it Barry. :pac:

John wrote:

I also think we need to move back to just having five minute rounds (2 fives for C class, 3 fives for A and because again, it's just confusing the issue.

I prefer having three rounds for all fights. For one thing it’s much easier to score a fight that way.

John wrote:

And from the point of view of promoting the sport, in my own opinion, the current trend of having a lot of C and D class fights on a show isn't a good way to pull in an interested crowd. Personally, I'm much less inclined to go to a show if the majority of the fights are C class or lower. I feel a small bit cheated to pay the same entry prices I've always paid if I'm only going to get two of three pro fights (if that) for my money. Maybe I'm in a minority on this one.

Not at all, I agree completely. If someone runs the show as semi-pro then that’s great but if they are not then a majority of the fights should be A and B, but maybe some C class fights to start it off. It pretty misleading to advertise your show as Ultimate Fighting and then have a majority of D class fights on the card.
The Tribal Warfare show tomorrow night is a good example of how to do it right IMO. Some semi-pro fights to start off the night, some K1 matches and then a shot of pro fights.

Tim_Murphy

For the record I think Tribal Warfare this week so going to be awesome. There’s plenty of good fights on the card, there was a lot of good matchmaking done by Mark in fairness.

Speaking of matchmaking… Good matchmaking is how you get a good night of fights, it’s also how to keep fighters safe and help them get experience. It beats trying to use loads of different rulesets to try to get the same result any day.

Roper

Right well clearly the emnity is towards my shows and the D class/C class format of those, so I think people should come right out with that instead of tipoeing around it. I can't think of another show in Ireland that uses the same D format as mine bar Tribal Warfare so apart from TW, I don't see who anyone could be talking about. Maybe I can answer some points if people came out and honestly said "I don't like the format of your show because..."

Tim_Murphy

Roper wrote: »

Right well clearly the emnity is towards my shows and the D class/C class format of those, so I think people should come right out with that instead of tipoeing around it. I can't think of another show in Ireland that uses the same D format as mine bar Tribal Warfare so apart from TW, I don't see who anyone could be talking about.

Do John K's shows not use the same D class? I haven't been at one since the last ROT in the stadium but I thought you were using John's set of rules for your show.?

Maybe I can answer some points if people came out and honestly said "I don't like the format of your show because..."

I didn't like the fact that there was 5 different set of rules on your show. Other than that I thought it was a great night, bar the main event. That sucked, but I suppose I can't blame you for that.

Roper

Tim_Murphy wrote: »

Do John K's shows not use the same D class? I haven't been at one since the last ROT in the stadium but I thought you were using John's set of rules for your show.?

John hd them listed but I've never seen them used at one of his shows. I missed the last one though.

I didn't like the fact that there was 5 different set of rules on your show. Other than that I thought it was a great night, bar the main event. That sucked, but I suppose I can't blame you for that.

In my defence, and Mark will back me up here I'm sure, there was supposed to be only 3, D, C and B. Then I decided to add a tasty A class bout, then myself and Mark made a boo boo and we had to change two bouts to League class rules that were scheduled for D.

All in all though I still don't see the difficulty. The audience got a programme with the ruleset marked "A", "B" and so on, and the MC declares the rules beforehand with a brief explanation. If you go to a thaiboxing show tomorrow night you might see some amateurs in full padding, then C class, B class and finally A class fights. It's pretty standard really. Full pro shows are rare anywhere.

I would understand all of this if at the end of my show people were bumping into the walls with confusion, forgetting their name etc. but in fact everyone who I spoke to was very happy with the show. I'm very honest and straight with people as you know and as a result I get the same honesty back and there were some criticisms which I took on board and which I'll change for next time out. A few said they would have liked more pro fights which was going to happen for my next show but which can't now unfortunately.

But fear not, when I do this again for The Fight Before Christmas 2 I intend to make it a 100% professional card. For now though I'm going to take the KO show in April and make it all about the amateurs because they need love as well. I'll also put a disclaimer on the end of the tickets "The Promoter is not responsible for any confusion caused by attending this show".

Bad morning to have a debate with me I'm cutting weight.

Tim_Murphy

Cutting weight certainly explains the crankiness! I'm not having a go at your show at all, and hope that you don't think I am.

In my defence, and Mark will back me up here I'm sure, there was supposed to be only 3, D, C and B. Then I decided to add a tasty A class bout, then myself and Mark made a boo boo and we had to change two bouts to League class rules that were scheduled for D.

Ya that’s fair enough.

All in all though I still don't see the difficulty. The audience got a programme with the ruleset marked "A", "B" and so on, and the MC declares the rules beforehand with a brief explanation. If you go to a thaiboxing show tomorrow night you might see some amateurs in full padding, then C class, B class and finally A class fights. It's pretty standard really. Full pro shows are rare anywhere.

Oh I know. I’m not advocating full pro shows. I like the idea of having semi-pro, B and A. I just don’t like the idea of splitting semi-pro into two. I don't think it was well thought out. At the end of the day its not a big deal either, its just a touch unneccesary.
As long as it’s explained in the programme and marked clearly on the card I’m all for having 3 rulesets on a show. There's an obvious progression as the night goes on.

Best of luck with making weight anyway. I’m off to breakfast, today I shall be eating cake. :cool:

Roper

Tim_Murphy wrote: »

Cutting weight certainly explains the crankiness! I'm not having a go at your show at all, and hope that you don't think I am.

The last few posts came across that way.

Oh I know. I’m not advocating full pro shows. I like the idea of having semi-pro, B and A. I just don’t like the idea of splitting semi-pro into two. I don't think it was well thought out. At the end of the day its not a big deal either, its just a touch unneccesary.
As long as it’s explained in the programme and marked clearly on the card I’m all for having 3 rulesets on a show. There's an obvious progression as the night goes on.

Genuinely, I think you have a really good point. I will be reviewing the rules and classes I'll be putting in place for the next show I put on, but for now, I like D and C class rules for what they're giving the less experienced fighters.

Best of luck with making weight anyway. I’m off to breakfast, today I shall be eating cake. :cool:

In two hours, I shall also be eating cake. Right now though I'm posting to keep my mind off my belly's rumblings. I'll be a much happier camper at TW tomorrow!

Jason Mc

If you want locals guys on your show you gotta go with c class fights too

Its them that put the bums on seats and at some point if all goes well for them they get to go Pro

Talent must be built from the bottom up on a local scene

Eneveitably there will end up being big shows with more Pro fights and smaller shows that feed into them

RealJohn

Barry, I'd like to assure you that my comments weren't intended as a dig at your shows (or Mark's). I seem to be upsetting people a bit lately. Maybe I should retire from the internet.

I think Tim has covered pretty much everything I want to say and I agree with all of it I think, save the timing thing (I don't agree that two rounds make it hard to come to a decision, it just makes it hard to come to a decision which leaves a winner. Are more draws in close fights necessarily a bad thing?)

Hope you made weight (I assume it's either done or not by now) and best of luck.


PS: re: Tribal Warfare, I'm not knocking your match-making Mark, I'd just like to see more "names" on the card (and I haven't come across a full card so maybe I'm being unfair). Maybe I'm just greedy.

mark.leonard

RealJohn wrote: »

re: Tribal Warfare, I'm not knocking your match-making Mark, I'd just like to see more "names" on the card (and I haven't come across a full card so maybe I'm being unfair). Maybe I'm just greedy.

If by names you mean guys you recognize, I know what you mean. This show is the Next Generation and feature future stars of Irish MMA from Point Blank and more Galway fighters on a TW card than ever before. The standard is just as high as ever though so I do think you will be pleasantly surprised.