UEFA Champions League Q/Final draw 20/3 11am

FrostyJack

Some utter tripe there. Bye into final ! A team can only beat those who are put in front of them and United will have a tough semi if they face Arsenal who will have been strengthened by Fabregas their key player. AS FOR THE CRAP YOU WROTE ABOUT BARCA YOU KNOW NOTHING. Barca were playing below par in la liga but raised their game against United in both legs to play like the real Barca. I know as I was watching them week in week out. I am actually sick of people using your arguement. Here are the stats from the two games. Braca dominated possession in both legs like no team I can ever recall against United and the amount of shots also. Bottom line is that Uniteds defence deprived of its first choice locked them out and did a great job of it.

Eh where did I say Barca played crap? I said they were crap all season. They destroyed United in the Nou Camp but thanks to Eto being lazy and off form and Henry being half injured they couldn't finish their dinner despite Messi running United ragged. This is not the case this season, Henry is on fire (nearly back to his best) and Eto is motivated again hence they are flying high in La Liga destroying everyone (though the previous 3 games they had a dip). If it wasn't for their defence this season they would be clear favourites by a mile.

As for the arguement you can only play the team that's put infront of you, that's easy to say if it's always someone handy, and don't even get me started on the group stages draw. I noticed you didn't show the stats of Lille or Roma games? Arsenal may be good come the semi if they make it but they are usually hopeless in Europe so I won't hold my breath.

CHD

Barca have no chance

redout

FrostyJack wrote: »

Eh where did I say Barca played crap? I said they were crap all season. They destroyed United in the Nou Camp but thanks to Eto being lazy and off form and Henry being half injured they couldn't finish their dinner despite Messi running United ragged. This is not the case this season, Henry is on fire (nearly back to his best) and Eto is motivated again hence they are flying high in La Liga destroying everyone (though the previous 3 games they had a dip). If it wasn't for their defence this season they would be clear favourites by a mile.

As for the arguement you can only play the team that's put infront of you, that's easy to say if it's always someone handy, and don't even get me started on the group stages draw. I noticed you didn't show the stats of Lille or Roma games? Arsenal may be good come the semi if they make it but they are usually hopeless in Europe so I won't hold my breath.

See you failed to mention a makeshift United defence in both legs with Brown moved to CB, Hargreaves to RB and Vidic injured for both games. Rooney also missed the first leg through injury. I dont buy them excuses you gave as United had plenty of their own problems to deal with.

Why are the Lille and Roma stats necessary ? It was Barca you made the excuses for not the other two. "Always someone handy" ffs are you listening to yourself ?

United have played te following sides in the knockouts since 2004:
Porto the year they won it 2004
AC Milan the following year 2005
Lille, Roma and AC Milan again in 2007
Lyon, Roma, Barca and Chelsea in 2008

Now please point out all the handy draws a part from Lille and possibly Porto I suppose who went on to win it.

We played the winners in 2004. Finalists in 2005. Winners in 2007 and the sides in 2008.

Warper

Disastrous draw for all 4 teams in the bottom half - namely Barca, Bayern, Chelsea and Liverpool

Chelsea and Liverpool is anybody's guess - it really will be extremely tight and the fact that Liverpool are at home the first leg might just swing it in Chelsea's favour. As has been proven in the past, the last team you want be facing away in a second leg in a closely contested CL tie is Liverpool.

Barca would obv. rather be away in the first leg but should still have enough firepower for Munich. Klose looks like he is out for this as well though they have got one of the best players in the world in Ribery.

Provided all goes to plan Barca will again be at home in the first leg of the semi versus Chelsea/Liverpool. As a Barca fan i would rather play Chelsea at Stamford Bridge than Liverpool at Anfield in the second leg.

Utd must be laughing at the draw and are surely in the semi's.

Arsenal - Villareal will be close enough but i hope Arsenal get through and they will give Utd. a good run in the semi especially with the first leg being on at Old Trafford.

Arsenal - Man Utd and Chelsea - Barca to qualify with a repeat of the final a few years back with Barca and Arsenal.

Same result.

Boskowski

Seems like a foregone conclusion here

Prove me wrong but if I recall corrrectly Bayern has yet to lose a Champions League tie to Barcelona. Barca clearly are favourites but Bayern is a team you don't want to take lightly as (hopefully) Liverpool will learn in the semis.

evad_lhorg

Im goin to put a cheeky bet on Bayern to win it at 16-1. cant be any harm. I can see them beating Barca anyway. even without Klose.

FrostyJack

Porto the year they won it 2004
AC Milan the following year 2005
Lille, Roma and AC Milan again in 2007
Lyon, Roma, Barca and Chelsea in 2008

Now please point out all the handy draws a part from Lille and possibly Porto I suppose who went on to win it.

Okay Roma, Lyon, Roma and a poor peforming Barca side there happy?

Why are the Lille and Roma stats necessary ? It was Barca you made the excuses for not the other two

Eh no re-read my post I said

Lyon, Roma, Barca? Lyon- French Champions ie nothing, Roma- Rubbish and Barca when they had a terrible season (and were very lucky to beat too).

Year before that: mighty Lille, Super Roma again then knocked out by Milan.

I made "excuses" for Barca in the next post. I don't think you understand where I'm coming from. If you were to pick one team in the knock out stages that you think you could beat the easiest, more times than not United get them, just like today. You didn't draw Chelsea in the final or AC the previous semi they were just the other team that got there.

Highsider

Absolutley disgusted with the draw. Sick to death of playing Chelsea. I predict a Man Utd v Barca final. We where totally out of luck today:(

Boskowski

Highsider wrote: »

Absolutley disgusted with the draw. Sick to death of playing Chelsea. I predict a Man Utd v Barca final. We where totally out of luck today:(

Hey, it's cool. If you want to win the champions league you gotta leave a couple of good teams behind, right? Who cares at what stage you doing it. Having the (seemingly) easier side of the draw isn't always an advantage in terms of winning the title.

FrostyJack

realcam wrote: »

Hey, it's cool. If you want to win the champions league you gotta leave a couple of good teams behind, right? Who cares at what stage you doing it. Having the (seemingly) easier side of the draw isn't always an advantage in terms of winning the title.

Worked for United last season. It's better someone else takes out all the good teams so you only have to play one in the final.

jaykay74

FrostyJack wrote: »

Okay Roma, Lyon, Roma and a poor peforming Barca side there happy?



Eh no re-read my post I said

I made "excuses" for Barca in the next post. I don't think you understand where I'm coming from. If you were to pick one team in the knock out stages that you think you could beat the easiest, more times than not United get them, just like today. You didn't draw Chelsea in the final or AC the previous semi they were just the other team that got there.

Lyon in 08, bollocks.

Utd won their group so were faced with 2nd placed non english teams. These were Schalke 04, Olympiacos, Celtic, Lyon and Fenerbahçe. Lyon was the hardest draw available not the easiest

Highsider

FrostyJack wrote: »

Worked for United last season. It's better someone else takes out all the good teams so you only have to play one in the final.

That's the way i see it. We will IMO have to beat Chelsea,Barca and Utd to win the Cup. Possible? yes..but in reality it's a big ask. That said over two legs i would only fear Chelsea out of that lot. Really think Hiddink can win them the Cup this time around.

pierrot

evad_lhorg wrote: »

Im goin to put a cheeky bet on Bayern to win it at 16-1. cant be any harm. I can see them beating Barca anyway. even without Klose.

That is a very cheeky one alright, i may just join you.

FrostyJack

jaykay74 wrote: »

Lyon in 08, bollocks.

Utd won their group so were faced with 2nd placed non english teams. These were Schalke 04, Olympiacos, Celtic, Lyon and Fenerbahçe. Lyon was the hardest draw available not the easiest

I disagree Fenerbahçe were the toughest draw, they knocked out Sevilla and beat Chelsea 2-nil, I'd even put Schalke 04 above Lyon at the time. I never said they get the easiest team ALL the time, just seems like most of the time.

ImJohn

Like other people have said , I'm pretty sure the Cheslea fans are a lot more upset than the liverpool and barca fans imo. However, Chelsea have the advantage with the first leg at Anfield , a new manager and Essien returning so that gives them a very good chance. The odds are stacked against us (as usual) but I love being the under dog.

redout

FrostyJack wrote: »

I disagree Fenerbahçe were the toughest draw, they knocked out Sevilla and beat Chelsea 2-nil, I'd even put Schalke 04 above Lyon at the time. I never said they get the easiest team ALL the time, just seems like most of the time.

I think you have a odd understanding of the game going by some of the stuff which you have said in your last few posts. Seem to be pushing an anti-United agenda yet I dont see anyone backing you and your claims up.

FrostyJack

redout wrote: »

I think you have a odd understanding of the game going by some of the stuff which you have said in your last few posts. Seem to be pushing an anti-United agenda yet I dont see anyone backing you and your claims up.

And your pointing a very pro-united agenda it seems? I showed the results and my opinion, I'm pretty sure the majority of Liverpool and Chelsea fans would agree with me, though that could be put down to the ABU culture, but I'm sure the majority of Spurs, Villa etc fans would agree also, I know all the ones I talked to today agreed.

K4t

Warper wrote: »

Utd must be laughing at the draw and are surely in the semi's.
.

I highly doubt it. Our last two displays have stunk of arroagnce and pure laziness. Looks like fergie needs to give that yearly "we don't have the divine right to beat everyone" talk.

For football and for a neutral's point of view, the ideal final will include either Bayern, Barca, Utd or Arsenal.

I think it's going to be United-Liverpool.

jaykay74

FrostyJack wrote: »

I disagree Fenerbahçe were the toughest draw, they knocked out Sevilla and beat Chelsea 2-nil, I'd even put Schalke 04 above Lyon at the time. I never said they get the easiest team ALL the time, just seems like most of the time.

When did Fenerbahçe beat Chelsea 2-0

Also.................

You might have rated Fenerbahçe and Schalke as better than Lyon but the bookies didn't...........

Champions League Final; Moscow, 21st May 2008

Odds for information purposes only, published 27 October
Current odds from Coral here

Outright win

Barcelona 4/1
Man United 6/1
AC Milan 8/1
Arsenal 8/1
Chelsea 8/1
Real Madrid 8/1
Inter Milan 9/1
Roma 20/1
Sevilla 20/1
Liverpool 22/1
Valencia 33/1
Lyon 40/1
Porto 40/1
Marseille 50/1
Rangers 66/1
Fenerbahce 80/1
Schalke 80/1
Shakhtar Donetsk 80/1
Werder Bremen 80/1
PSV 100/1

redout

FrostyJack wrote: »

And your pointing a very pro-united agenda it seems? I showed the results and my opinion, I'm pretty sure the majority of Liverpool and Chelsea fans would agree with me, though that could be put down to the ABU culture, but I'm sure the majority of Spurs, Villa etc fans would agree also, I know all the ones I talked to today agreed.

Well I support United as many on here could have told you. I dont see any merit in your accusations of United been given "handy" ties in the champions league this season and previous seasons. Where are all these people you talked about supporting your stance ?

L'prof

iregk wrote: »

The most fixed tournament I've ever seen. We all said in work before the draw, guaranteed Liverpool Chelsea. The good aul hot / cold balls again.

In all fairness, yes ye have met each other every year for the last 5, but 3 of those times were in the semi finals and personally if I was going to fix a draw, it certainly wouldn't be Chelsea v Liverpool!

mayordenis

My main worry is it's just turned into a bland affair between the 2 - Guus will no doubt spice it up a little though.

I was p*ssed off with the draw at the time simply because its Chelsea again for Liverpool but I'd rather we play them now rather than draw them in the semis again tbh.

I think whoever wins in chelsea/pool game has a great chance against Barca. I don't think they would be able to cope with the fast english game and will fold. I think the winner of the Chelsea/Pool game wil go to the final.

The top half will be united and arsenal, and for me its a toss of a coin. Arsenal seem to play better against the top english teams and would give united a real run for their money.

So, I'm going for an Arsenal-Liverpool final :cool:

JerryHandbag

If this draw was rigged then Platini made the mother of all balls-ups behind the scenes.....there can still be an all Premiership final.....oh Michel Michel Michel!!

If theres another all english final I can see him enforcing a rule where only 1 foreigner is allowed in a premiership team. In which case Aston Villa will be league champions

PHB

Maybe it's not rigged for nationality, maybe its rigged for style of football. By my count, if things go as expected in the other 3 semis, there will be 3 clubs there who are dedicated to attacking football. Putting Chelsea and Liverpool next to each other at least elimates one of them

Boskowski

Wtf are you all on about? Rigged? Jesus lads cop on to yourselves. Conspiracy theories that way ->

FrostyJack

redout wrote: »

Well I support United as many on here could have told you. I dont see any merit in your accusations of United been given "handy" ties in the champions league this season and previous seasons. Where are all these people you talked about supporting your stance ?

Well you don't see any handy ties because you seem to think all teams are equal, I bet you also don't see the advantage of United playing all their big games at home in the business end of the season, but that's slightly off topic. The people I talked were in real life, they probably have better things to do on a Friday and Saturday than post on a forum, unlike us...

Anyway good luck in the final (as I have no doubt you's will be there), hopefully it will be a good match like last year.

Mr Alan

PHB wrote: »

Maybe it's not rigged for nationality, maybe its rigged for style of football. By my count, if things go as expected in the other 3 semis, there will be 3 clubs there who are dedicated to attacking football. Putting Chelsea and Liverpool next to each other at least elimates one of them

Utd aren't dedicated to attacking football in Europe.

& somebody better tell Ramos & Ferguson that Liverpool can't play attacking football.

that sort of arrogance pisses me off no end.

PHB

Hey, I'm the first one to admit that United don't play attacking football in Europe. You've heard me bitch about that for years haven't you?

That said, most people don't realise that Alan, and I'd wager that Platini is one of them.

Unearthly

PHB wrote: »

Maybe it's not rigged for nationality, maybe its rigged for style of football. By my count, if things go as expected in the other 3 semis, there will be 3 clubs there who are dedicated to attacking football. Putting Chelsea and Liverpool next to each other at least elimates one of them

So why didn't these evil dark forces of corruption make it that Chelsea played Liverpool at the Quarter final stage 3 times out of the last 4 years in champions league?

monkey9

And you'd think they'd want to avoid a Liverpool - Utd final in Rome of all places!!

monkey9

rarnes1 wrote: »

So, I'm going for an Arsenal-Liverpool final :cool:

I actually concur with this!

PHB

Look. Anyone who was around the forum last year remembers that a poster on some Liverpool fan site posted up the exact draw about 3-4 days before it happened. He was dismissed as talking ****e, and then his draw was bang on the money.

Everybody has always suspected that they mess with draws so to be honest, I don't think its that ludicrous a conspiracy theory.

killwill

PHB wrote: »

Look. Anyone who was around the forum last year remembers that a poster on some Liverpool fan site posted up the exact draw about 3-4 days before it happened. He was dismissed as talking ****e, and then his draw was bang on the money.

Everybody has always suspected that they mess with draws so to be honest, I don't think its that ludicrous a conspiracy theory.

As a matter of interest, did he predict who played at home first and semi final roundups too?

Mr Alan

yep, it was everything spot on.

Uefa are bent bent bent, i'm not saying i think the draw is rigged, but it wouldnt surprise me.

redout

Mr Alan wrote: »

yep, it was everything spot on.

Uefa are bent bent bent, i'm not saying i think the draw is rigged, but it wouldnt surprise me.

If Pool got Porto, Chelsea got Villarreal and United got Arsenal would you still be on here talking about the draw been rigged ?

Mr Alan

redout wrote: »

If Pool got Porto, Chelsea got Villarreal and United got Arsenal would you still be on here talking about the draw been rigged ?

Mr Alan wrote:

i'm not saying i think the draw is rigged

are you blind young man?

redout

Mr Alan wrote: »

are you blind young man?

But you said that you wouldnt be surprised if it was implying that you certainly thought that it could be.

Mr Alan

because the world & its mother knows how bent Uefa are as an organisation...

saying i wouldnt be surprised if something was the case, and i think something is the case, are quite different.