Are there some things that just shouldn't be cut?

Permabear

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Lobelia Overhill

I got a letter the other day from the Carer's Association cautioning that Carer's Allowance and the respite grant may well suffer in the mini budget - not a lot Carers can do about it since we can't go on strike or anything.

According to an ad on the radio over 160,000 people are caring for a family member at home. How much would it cost for all the Carees to be in Homes, hospitals etc? Respite last year cost me €110 per day (and yes I had to pay for it, no one else is giving me the money) CA is currently €235 per week ... no days off, no holidays, on duty 24/7, no training.

Anyone want to march somewhere on our behalf?

jmayo

oscarBravo wrote: »

Topic, people - this isn't (or shouldn't be) yet another Dubs-versus-ignorant-mucksavages debate.

I resent that description ... and you being resident in the West you should know better.
Let me correct it for you...
It is another "Gravel accented West Brit Rugby Loving Snot Nosed South Siders and Gun toting horse ridin heroin sniffing North Sider skangers versus ignorant mucksavages" debate.

Please note poetic license was taken for effect and the poster knows that description only covers a small portion of the population of Dublin

NewDubliner wrote: »

Yes, but coupled with removal/restriction of commuter parking and access to the city.

On-street parking needs to be removed to make way for cycle tracks.

Once we reduce the car commuters who waste so much space, the buses will move more freely and will be attractive, even if not subsidised. The Luas is quite pricey, yet very popular because it's frequent and reliable. That's because it has a mostly traffic-free run.

Yes, it's unthinkable to cut the Dublin bus subsidy, but direct action to help the buses run more freely could turn out to be more cost-effective.

Rather than throwing money around, we should look at ways of making more efficient use of existing infrastructure.

What infrastructure, the one that is inadequate not matter which form of transport you choose ?
Actually the Luas line from Tallaght is not mostly traffic free as it encounters traffic for most of it's way in from red cow, unlike the other line which only encounters traffic close into the city centre.
Also they only service two specific arteries into the city.

Do you want to ban cars altogether ?

Back to topic ...
Anyway as can be seen by our government they don't believe in reational thought. They decided to keep their current number of junior ministers.
I know as pointed out by other posters it will not make a massive saving in the grand scheme of things, but it would be great example that cuts start at the top.
Also to anyone that says sure it is only a little amount, have these people ever thought that all the little amounts add up to major amounts.
That is the attitude that some spout out in defense of white elephants such as e-voting, national stadium, PPARS etc :rolleyes:

A million or two saved one place can be more wisely used somewhere else, lets see ... perhaps in cervical cancer vacinations :rolleyes:

Also why does that useless partyless Mattie Harney need 13 advisors at cost of 900,000 odd, seen as she always defers the hard questions to that other fine overpaid and well bonused body, the HSE top executives, who it appears paid 50 odd million to advisors over 3 years.

Can anyone tell me why Drumm got a bonus or is the bar set so low in the HSE that turning up for work is considered bonusable ?

jmayo

Lobelia Overhil wrote: »

I got a letter the other day from the Carer's Association cautioning that Carer's Allowance and the respite grant may well suffer in the mini budget - not a lot Carers can do about it since we can't go on strike or anything.

According to an ad on the radio over 160,000 people are caring for a family member at home. How much would it cost for all the Carees to be in Homes, hospitals etc? Respite last year cost me €110 per day (and yes I had to pay for it, no one else is giving me the money) CA is currently €235 per week ... no days off, no holidays, on duty 24/7, no training.

Anyone want to march somewhere on our behalf?

You see sadly you are a little minority, you are not part of a bigger powerful lobby group that has lots of votes or you don't provide wads of cash to politicans.
You are an easy target.

Alcatel

donegalfella wrote: »

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Agreed. But I think that symbolism is a huge part of politics: If the politicians took a big pay cut (and they could afford to) then there'd be a lot less to grumble about when they're cutting everyone elses pay.

Also, as for one TD for 25,000 people, that was stipulated in a 60something year old constitution. We don't need that many anymore.

Liam Byrne

Alcatel wrote: »

one TD for 25,000 people, that was stipulated in a 60something year old constitution. We don't need that many anymore.

Could well be worth looking at.....we're talking about a constitution which was put together at a time when people wouldn't have been able to travel 30 miles relatively easily....nowadays, with [some-bit] improved infrastructure, more cars, email & partial broadband, etc, it should be a hell of a lot easier for larger numbers of people to get in touch with politicians....

.....if only we could get them to listen and represent us properly!

P.S. As for the "Dubs v mucksavages" reference - I'm upset that I was left out of that, what with me living on the outskirts of one of our cities.....also odd that only one of the words used was derogatory, but we'll leave that go....

oscarBravo

Liam Byrne wrote: »

P.S. As for the "Dubs v mucksavages" reference - I'm upset that I was left out of that, what with me living on the outskirts of one of our cities.....also odd that only one of the words used was derogatory, but we'll leave that go....

I see there are a number of irony detectors overdue their annual service...

Lobelia Overhill

jmayo wrote: »

You see sadly you are a little minority, you are not part of a bigger powerful lobby group that has lots of votes or you don't provide wads of cash to politicans.
You are an easy target.

Yup, this is why they sent out the letters to warn us (there was a list of people to write to about it) ...

Seriously, I'll do the placards if anyone wants to march in an orderly fashion somewhere...

*tumbleweed*

Permabear

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AlekSmart

We need to find ways to encourage & promote efficient, economically productive use of the existing roads & discouraging wasteful use (such as commuting in private cars). That way, we won't need to spend billions building bigger roads.

This is all very well and good,laudable stuff indeed.
However,it demands a high degree of acceptance of the "Greater Good" principle which is not something that the native Gael ever really took to.

Take,mar shàmpla,the current Bus Atha Cliath/Bus Èireann situation.
Both of these companies were/are moving steadily,though slowly,forward with new Vehicles,New Routes and differing ranges of services such as 24Hr and Airport Connections on major routes.

In terms of European societal structure none of these elements could be termed ground breaking,but in Irish Public Transport terms they represented serious shyt indeed.

Yea! we were seeing a payback from the NDP2000-2006 and even more subsequent to Transport 21..."A wee bit done-LOTS more to do".

Then suddenly,without warning,something happens (Great Band!).

We still are`nt quite sure what,but suddenly we have a situation where any continuance of a Modal Shift to an Improving Public Bus/Coach Transport network represents a MAJOR threat to another area of the Minister for Transports brief........The PPP Toll Road programme :eek:

Oh dear,Minister...we do actually have a Government policy regarding "sustainable" Transport Alternatives......some of those "alternatives" are actually required under NDP/T21 to be provided by Bus Atha Cliath/Bus Èireann and were in fact actually beginning to show results....perhaps a bit too much in fact.....

Since my Boss,The Minister for Transport,is also responsible for the continuance of the Largest Road Building programme ever and also for the major expansion of Toll Road programmes we now have one HELL of a Conflict of Interest situation.

Minister Dempsey is fully engaged with some of the largest consortia of Toll Road designers/developers/operators currently active in Europe.
Minister Dempsey and his Senior Officials have negotiated/are negotiating many PPP projects in which they have provided the Private Sector operators with specific useage figures for the "New Toll Schemes".

With the sudden and total collapse of the Irish motor "Industry" and the subsequent reduction in spending power to jant around in big flashy motors,it stands to reason that those Private Sector consortia may have reason to be worried about the level of return on their investment,which by any stretch of inagination,will be well down on the Minister`s projections.

I for one would be concerned that the Minister and his Department may well have Guaranteed these Toll Facility developers a certain level of Private Traffic Flow business which has now evaporated.
If Minister Dempsey has presided over some form of Guarantee regarding Toll Road useage levels then WE (The Peeple) need to know.

This scenario is the only sensible reason I can divine for a Minister for Transport (My Boss) removing some 270 Large Capacity vehicles and their support infrastructure from the National Vehicle parc.

These assets are being removed at a VERY strategic point in time from a Publically Owned Transport perspective as,come December 2009,the respective State Owned Public Transport fleet will be benchmarked as part of the Public Service Contract Obligation process.

Therefore,reducing the State Owned Fleet by some 10-15% at this early juncture effectively caps the States future involvement in the provision of such services.

This is all up for Debate,as it is throughout Europe.
The difference in Ireland is that we have a Government and Minister for Transport who are somewhat mired deeply in a dubious mess whose causes are not yet fully explained,save for some small revelations within the Banking sector.

I contend that Minister Dempsey is being somewhat disingenous in his support of the CIE Board`s decision to reduce State Owned Road Passenger Assets below the level described only as "adequate" by the Minister`s latest yardstick,The Deloitte Report.

I further believe that the National Interest requires Minister Dempsey to intervene in this regard and for him to direct the CIE Board to concentrate on the retention and effective utilization of these recently accquired assets.

Withdrawing these now is tantamount to National Sabotage (come the upturn).

Sadly,in years to come,some judicial personage will probably have to follow a paper trail someplace to make sense of it all......."Will we get a receipt,Boss ?--- Will we fcuxk !!!" :eek:

RiverWilde

donegalfella wrote: »

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Constitutional hurdles aside, a cull of the number of TD's would be an excellent beginning. As a later poster stated, it isn't so much the immediate effect on the public coffers that matters. It is more the ethos promoted and demonstrated by those 'in power.'

If the example set by our 'exhaulted' leaders is one of flagrant profligacy, how on earth can they expect the rest of us to swallow 'belt tightening measures' in 'the national interest?'

Riv

Permabear

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NewDubliner

AlekSmart wrote: »

I for one would be concerned that the Minister and his Department may well have Guaranteed these Toll Facility developers a certain level of Private Traffic Flow business which has now evaporated.
If Minister Dempsey has presided over some form of Guarantee regarding Toll Road useage levels then WE (The Peeple) need to know.

The public service were guaranteed agreed pay scales, then the government just passed a law and cut the pay.

Can't the government just pass a law and tell the roads/construction industry to suck it up?

nice_guy80

proper investment in primary and secondary education. slash monies to private schools... 3rd level should be fee paying. not too high a fee though.

post hospital beds - step down beds for patients in the local communities. frees up hospital beds like no other

get long term dolers out to work for their dole - i'm thinking picking up rubbish, gardening for tidy towns etc

carers allowance. keeps more people out of hospital than any other supplement. you would not believe the number of people being cared for by their relatives at little or no cost to the state

NewDubliner

jmayo wrote: »

Do you want to ban cars altogether ?

No, we do need some cars, but we need to reform road usage and get rid of inefficiency, waste and bloat.

Hard decisions (cuts) will need to be made. This will affect people's habits and lifestyles. Single-occupant commuter cars are blocking the road to economic recovery.

We don't need more roads, we just need to use the ones we have more efficiently. We can save billions by cutting road building projects.

Alcatel

NewDubliner wrote: »

No, we do need some cars, but we need to reform road usage and get rid of inefficiency, waste and bloat.

Hard decisions (cuts) will need to be made. This will affect people's habits and lifestyles. Single-occupant commuter cars are blocking the road to economic recovery.

We don't need more roads, we just need to use the ones we have more efficiently. We can save billions by cutting road building projects.

Infrastructure isn't for private road users, they just happen to be able to use the M50. It's actually for business. There's always money for infrastructure, as the saying goes. It provides jobs to build and when it's built it's there to haul goods and help business.

So it seems we've lost another 3bn off the end of year accounts. There's no way we can sustain this kind of spending. We'll earn 34bn now this year. We spend 20bn on social welfare. 20bn paying the civil servants.

We had and are still having a big crying match over 2bn worth of cuts. Sheesh. We have no choice now but to cut deep.

spank_inferno

I agree
I just read the article on Irishtimes.com about lehihan saying that revenues for 2009 are expected to be just 34 billion now.

Expenditure is expected to be 58 billion, of which Welfare makes up 21 billion!!

This means that on current projections 61% thats right 61%! of all government revenues for this year will be spent on welfare!!

I wasnt of the opinion that welfare should have been cut but I never realised that the figures were that bad!
Is there any nation on earth currently projecting a higher deficit?
(as a percentage of income)

thebman

spank_inferno wrote: »

I agree
I just read the article on Irishtimes.com about lehihan saying that revenues for 2009 are expected to be just 34 billion now.

Expenditure is expected to be 58 billion, of which Welfare makes up 21 billion!!

This means that on current projections 61% thats right 61%! of all government revenues for this year will be spent on welfare!!

I wasnt of the opinion that welfare should have been cut but I never realised that the figures were that bad!
Is there any nation on earth currently projecting a higher deficit?
(as a percentage of income)

This is why it has to be reduced. I would say by about 100 euro per person (recent decreases in, for lack of a better catch all word, stuff means this is possible IMO).

It is also why we should privatise Dublin Bus. We just can't afford not to. It is a liability that if privatised would generate revenue instead of losing it for the taxpayer. You can't argue against that logic. You can argue, god what will happen if you privatise it but it is sh** at the moment so services can't get much worse IMO and you can put in service obligations when floating if necessary.

Same with Irish Rail (but we need to keep the infrastructure). We can't afford either and they will be better run by private companies. With competition in the market, we can actually have better services, running profitably and more jobs in this market. It serves no purpose to keep them public. They are liabilities.

NewDubliner

spank_inferno wrote: »

Is there any nation on earth currently projecting a higher deficit?
(as a percentage of income)

The UK?

RiverWilde

donegalfella wrote: »

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All that takes is a referendum.

FF seem rather fond of them at the moment.

Couple a referendum with drastic cuts in TD salaries and bonuses and we'd be grand.

It would be nice to amend the rules whereby Ministers are accountable for their actions. At the moment the perception seems to be that govt. TD's can do whatever the hell they like.

Where is the accountability?

Riv

Alcatel

RiverWilde wrote: »

All that takes is a referendum.

FF seem rather fond of them at the moment.

Couple a referendum with drastic cuts in TD salaries and bonuses and we'd be grand.

It would be nice to amend the rules whereby Ministers are accountable for their actions. At the moment the perception seems to be that govt. TD's can do whatever the hell they like.

Where is the accountability?

Riv

Comes every new dail. We just keep re-electing them.