Ripped Off By Local Garage

The Minute Men

I'm in shock after getting turned over by a local garage and I'm putting this on up to warn others.

About two months ago I bought a new battery for my "01" car. Big mileage so not worth much now).

Didn't drive it for about a month. When I tried, didn't start.
Called the AA, who arrived, jump started it and got it going, they told me 'Battery could be a dud" , call a garage and get them to check battery and alternator.

This I did. They came around, jump started car took it away.
(On a Monday)
Telling me "we have to take it to the garage to check it."
We'll call you Wedns. Heard nothing. Thurs rang , "we'll have news lunchtime". Heard nothing. 5pm Thursday I rang and finally spoke to someone.

They told me "You need a new battery." Oh by the way we had to take out and check all the wiring. There was a (wiring) short in the boot you didn't know about, we fixed that. !!!!
(Work they did without checking with me.) They justified this saying "oh we had to do that to find out if there was a problem."
The bill they gave me was 289.43 incl VAT.

They charged me this and basically told me same as AA man had said.
I went back to the shop in Balbriggan where I bought battery and the guy nearly had a heart on my behalf looking at their invoice. "You've been royally ripped off."

This is their breakdown:
Battery 85.00
Labour 140.00
Call Out 30.00

(All before VAT)

He's right, it's amazing what people like this can get away with. Carrying out work you have no idea if you needed or even sure was done.

Your thoughts please?

johnnyrotten

Is the garage with the SIMI?
If so report them

Gillo

AFAIK if they did work which you did not authorise you are not liable for it, normally they'd contact you first and say it's going to cost x amount and you can then say yes or no.

The Hill Billy

Moved to Consumer Issues from Dublin County North.

The Minute Men - Please be sure to read this forum's Charter to ensure that you adhere to its rules.

HB

eth0_

How did they rip you off?
It sounds to me like the short drained the battery, they had to trace the fault which takes time, and they repaired it and replaced the battery.

Yes they should have informed you of the extra cost but I don't think they have ripped you off if there was a short in the electrical system of the car.

Darragh29

The Minute Men wrote: »

I'm in shock after getting turned over by a local garage and I'm putting this on up to warn others.

About two months ago I bought a new battery for my "01" car. Big mileage so not worth much now).

Didn't drive it for about a month. When I tried, didn't start.
Called the AA, who arrived, jump started it and got it going, they told me 'Battery could be a dud" , call a garage and get them to check battery and alternator.

This I did. They came around, jump started car took it away.
(On a Monday)
Telling me "we have to take it to the garage to check it."
We'll call you Wedns. Heard nothing. Thurs rang , "we'll have news lunchtime". Heard nothing. 5pm Thursday I rang and finally spoke to someone.

They told me "You need a new battery." Oh by the way we had to take out and check all the wiring. There was a (wiring) short in the boot you didn't know about, we fixed that. !!!!
(Work they did without checking with me.) They justified this saying "oh we had to do that to find out if there was a problem."
The bill they gave me was 289.43 incl VAT.

They charged me this and basically told me same as AA man had said.
I went back to the shop in Balbriggan where I bought battery and the guy nearly had a heart on my behalf looking at their invoice. "You've been royally ripped off."

This is their breakdown:
Battery 85.00
Labour 140.00
Call Out 30.00

(All before VAT)

He's right, it's amazing what people like this can get away with. Carrying out work you have no idea if you needed or even sure was done.

Your thoughts please?

If you didn't start the car for a month then there is nothing unusual at all about your battery not being able to start the car one month later, especially at this time of the year and especially after having a new battery fitted which was probably partially charged. The AA man should have advised you to drive the car to charge up the battery again and see if the problem happened again, if it did, then get it to a garage, if not don't.

Suggesting that you take your car to a garage to have it "looked at", after it has been sitting in your driveway for a month without being started is just stupid advice to be honest. Also you should have posted this over in motors, people post there all the time looking for motoring advice, if you posted over there when you're car wouldn't start initially, you would have been given the above advice and probably wouldn't have had to call out the AA or get into the expense that you have gotten into now.

The Hill Billy

Darragh29 wrote: »

Also you should have posted this over in motors, people post there all the time looking for motoring advice, if you posted over there when you're car wouldn't start initially, you would have been given the above advice and probably wouldn't have had to call out the AA or get into the expense that you have gotten into now.

Hold your horses there Darragh29.

Firstly, if you had read the thread you would have seen that I moved this post here from Dublin County North.

Secondly, the OP isn't looking for motoring advice - they are looking for comment on how they were treated by the garage from a consumer perspective.

It is also the OP's first post - so give them a bit of of a chance, huh?

Darragh29

Hill Billy wrote: »

Hold your horses there Darragh29.

Firstly, if you had read the thread you would have seen that I moved this post here from Dublin County North.

Secondly, the OP isn't looking for motoring advice - they are looking for comment on how they were treated by the garage from a consumer perspective.

It is also the OP's first post - so give them a bit of of a chance, huh?

The OP was given the wrong advice to start with. This subject cannot be discussed without delving into motoring advice because the actual issue here isn't one of value for money, but one of the OP being given the wrong technical advice in respect of their vehicle, from the outset.

If the OP had been given the right advice from the outset, the visit to the garage and the subsequent bill would not have occurred, so the consumer issue would not have emerged. Also, sorry, didn't see it was a first post.

jor el

Did you pay the bill, or is this still awaiting payment? If you paid, then you're in a bit of a poorer situation, as paying it suggests you accepted the work was done. Did you question the bill with a senior person at the garage (like a manager)?

Not that it really matters much, but did the AA guy know the car was sitting idle for a month? That would normally leave your battery in a dead state, but a charge would often sort it out.

eth0_

Darragh29 wrote: »

If the OP had been given the right advice from the outset, the visit to the garage and the subsequent bill would not have occurred, so the consumer issue would not have emerged.

I get the feeling the OP didn't tell the AA guy that the car had been sitting for a month and that it was a brand new (and therefore likely to be) partially charged.

The AA are highly trained and i've personally never been given dodgy advice by their roadside assistance guys..

jor el

eth0_ wrote: »

I get the feeling the OP didn't tell the AA guy that the car had been sitting for a month and that it was a brand new (and therefore likely to be) partially charged.

The AA are highly trained and i've personally never been given dodgy advice by their roadside assistance guys..

I was thinking the same.

Just remembered, I've had the AA out for a dead battery once before, and after giving it a quick charge and getting the car going, he hooked up some probes to the battery terminals to check if anything was draining it (like a wiring short). He found nothing, so we assumed it was just time for a new batter, and it was 7 years old.

OP, did your AA guy do any kind of test like this? If he did, and found nothing draining the battery, then that would suggest no shorts in wiring.

Darragh29

eth0_ wrote: »

I get the feeling the OP didn't tell the AA guy that the car had been sitting for a month and that it was a brand new (and therefore likely to be) partially charged.

The AA are highly trained and i've personally never been given dodgy advice by their roadside assistance guys..

The AA lads are very helpful, but they are no better trained or capable in the technical/mechanical sense than other qualified and experienced mechanics out there. Don't get me wrong here, I'm not knocking them, they are professional, courteous and well trained in customer service, but they are not the absolute wizards that they are sometimes made out to be because they work for a strong brand.

If the OP was advised to replace a battery or that the battery that was replaced could be a "dud", as appears to be the case, and the car was lying up for a month without being started, then this constitutes bad advice in my book. The first question any mechanic should ask when a battery problem is suspected, is, "has the car been lying up for any length of time?" If it has, then there is a good chance that it has just discharged and given a jump start and a run down the motorway, you won't have any more issues with it for a few years.

Darragh29

jor el wrote: »

I was thinking the same.

Just remembered, I've had the AA out for a dead battery once before, and after giving it a quick charge and getting the car going, he hooked up some probes to the battery terminals to check if anything was draining it (like a wiring short). He found nothing, so we assumed it was just time for a new batter, and it was 7 years old.

OP, did your AA guy do any kind of test like this? If he did, and found nothing draining the battery, then that would suggest no shorts in wiring.

He wasn't checking to see if any devices were draining the battery. He was checking to see if the alternator was outputting the correct voltage to charge the battery. You can't find a leaking circuit by connecting anything to the battery.

GreeBo

Darragh29 wrote: »

He wasn't checking to see if any devices were draining the battery. He was checking to see if the alternator was outputting the correct voltage to charge the battery. You can't find a leaking circuit by connecting anything to the battery.

Could he not be checking the charge on the battery to see if it was draining?

Darragh29

GreeBo wrote: »

Could he not be checking the charge on the battery to see if it was draining?

No.

GreeBo

Darragh29 wrote: »

No.

Because?

Darragh29

GreeBo wrote: »

Because?

Because how can you test a battery for slow discharge when it is being charged by an alternator at the same time and is also being discharged by hundreds of subcircuits that are being fed with current? The battery is always being discharged anyway even when the ignition is off, even if you put a battery in a room with nothing connected to it, the charge in the battery will still decay away and eventually will not start a car. Anyone driving a car should know that if you leave it for a month and don't start it, it will discharge and probably won't start the car when you eventually do go to start it, especially in winter time. The obvious thing to do here was to jump start the car and drive it for a few miles to recharge it.

This thing of calling out the AA for wheel changes and jump starts, how are you going to learn anything about your car and be able to communicate with your garage when you need work done, if you call the AA everytime you have a problem???

GreeBo

Its not only being charged by the alternator when its running.

Couldnt he have been testing for drain on the battery when the car was off by connecting a meter into the circuit to measure the current being drawn from the battery?

Darragh29

GreeBo wrote: »

Its not only being charged by the alternator when its running.

Couldnt he have been testing for drain on the battery when the car was off by connecting a meter into the circuit to measure the current being drawn from the battery?

The car is drawing current from the battery even when it is not running to run certain low current systems. This is why if you leave your car for a month without starting it, the charge will decay.

GreeBo

Darragh29 wrote: »

The car is drawing current from the battery even when it is not running to run certain low current systems. This is why if you leave your car for a month without starting it, the charge will decay.

Exactly, so the AA guy could have been trying to determine if the draw was higher than normal thus indicating a short or some other electrical issue, especially since he wasnt made aware that the car had been idle for a month.

Darragh29

GreeBo wrote: »

Exactly, so the AA guy could have been trying to determine if the draw was higher than normal thus indicating a short or some other electrical issue, especially since he wasnt made aware that the car had been idle for a month.

Look, I'm telling you that the first thing you do as a mechanic if you have to jump start a car is you ask if the car has been off the road for any length of time recently. If it has, this explains on most occasions why the car currently has starting problems. It's all grand coming out with a sexy tool and looking like your the man out of Star Trek with the expensive looking gadget. It isn't worth a sh*t to your customer if your using that gadget to create the impression that you know what you are doing, and are sending your customer off to a garage and exposing them to additional and unnecessary costs, when the problem most likely is that the car just needs a jump start and a good run, but you were too busy showing off your fancy gadget, to be able to properly diagnose the root cause of the problem. And if you send someone off to get a new battery on the basis that you think it is a "dud", when all along, it just needed a charge because it hasn't been started in a month, but you didn't think to ask that question, then you are not doing your job.

The Minute Men

Firstly, after the AA jump started me, the battery wouldn't take charge.

This is when it was suggested to me I should consult a garage because the
AA felt it was a problem with alternator.

I would have to say after they took my car the garage did not return calls.
They took it on Monday, "We'll ring you Wednesday", nothing Wednesday and was ringing all day Thurs, before and after lunch, when I finally got somebody at 5pm it was "we done 150 Euros worth of work and you owe us" and "you need a new battery."

They kept it Friday and when I went there on Monday, I asked for the guy who had spoke to me on phone, who wasn't available. Another guy at garage was justifying this bill. The attitude was just appalling but I didn't have any option other than pay.

Forget the battery for a moment, when I spoke to the head guy at 5pm on Thursday, I had told him there as a problem with the radio, the head guy told me, "two of your speakers are blown."

When I called to get the car on Monday and asked the other guy, he shouted to engineer who shouted back "the radio itself is broken."
The complete opposite of what I'd been told on phone.
This sets off alarm bells with me! Am I wrong?
It turns out the speakers are gone on one whole side of car, which leads me to believe, I STILL have an electrical fault but not the one this garage claims to have fixed. Funny how in the 140 Euros wire testing didn't fix this.

I won't forget in a hurry the ignorant attitude of the guy when I tried raise any of these points. The main guy in garage was strangely absent.
Interestingly, the shop that sold me the original battery say there is nothing wrong with it but are sending it back to supplier to check.
I probably would let this pass but the guy at The garage who took my money really rubbed it in.

I put this here to warn other, (it's not about car maintenance.( It's a warning about how a garage in my local area is operating). I thank anyone who left me advice and the boards for the opportunity to tell others.

GreeBo

"Side order of chill-pill?, anyone?" :eek:

For the record jor_el is the one who had the AA guy testing the drain on the battery, not the OP.

jor_el can you clarify if in your case Mr. AA asked if it had been off the road for any length of time (and indeed had it been?)


oh and a multi-meter is hardly something out of Star Trek :rolleyes:

Emerald Lass

The Minute Men wrote: »

I put this here to warn other, (it's not about car maintenance.( It's a warning about how a garage in my local area is operating). I thank anyone who left me advice and the boards for the opportunity to tell others.

Hi Minute Men, give a clue to who this garage was. I'm in your area so would be interested to hear, as my car needs a service and would rather avoid this lot! regardless of whether or not you authorised the additional work, I hate dealing with rude people with no concept of customer service, and as a woman I find that mechanics in garages are one of the worst perpetrators of this - they treat me like a twit, which I am not. So if they were rude and unreasonable to you, and did not return your calls etc, then this would stop me going there.

As to the motor shop in balbriggan - I have to say I've gone there on several occasions as have others in my family, and we all find them VERY helpful, knowledgeable and obliging, so fair play to them and I hope their business continues to do well - much better service than Halfords or any of the big stores.

the_syco

The Minute Men wrote: »

Firstly, after the AA jump started me, the battery wouldn't take charge.

From experience, I know that the battery will only take charge if you drive for an hour or so. If you jump-start the engine, run it for a few minutes, turn the engine off, and try to start it, it won't start, due to the battery still being pretty much dead.

=-=

Anyhoo's, as for the charging: since you didn't ask for them to do it, I'm pretty sure you shouldn't pay. Look at citizensinformation.ie to make sure, though.

Darragh29

GreeBo wrote: »

oh and a multi-meter is hardly something out of Star Trek :rolleyes:

If you don't know what it is or what it does, then it does look like something out of Star Trek. Also I think that poster was referring to a clamp-on ammeter which is a different thing entirely.

OP, the long at the short of it is that you didn't need to be sent to a garage but you were, by someone who you probably thought was an expert, because after all, "he works for the AA". When you jump start a car with a flat battery, you have to let it run for at least half an hour to get any kind of a decent charge into the battery. Ideally you would take the car for a good drive and charge the battery back up this way. If your car is sitting there idling, then it is not being fully charged because the engine is just ticking over. To be able to make a decision with regard to whether a battery is holding a charge, you need to either take it on a long drive or else put it on a charge overnight. You can't tell if a completely flat battery is holding a charge by just letting the engine run for 10-15 minutes and then turning off the engine and trying to start the car again.

bobbbb

I got charged €900 by a garage in the ops area for 1 bearing to be replaced.

I didnt know i was ripped off til i was mentioning it to a friend who knows a bit about cars.

Reported them to SIMI before christmas. Nothing.