Help to identify this carved stone text or translate please

Belfast

Can any one identify the language or better still translate it.

Bog Butter

Don't know, but at an educated quess I would say Latin. What type of building is it on? Is it ecclesiastical?

Riamfada

Whats the context of the stone? Where is it located any images of the building it is attatched to?

Belfast

malman wrote: »

Don't know, but at an educated quess I would say Latin. What type of building is it on? Is it ecclesiastical?

The stone in Limerick city not far form king John castle. it is not in it original setting.
It is near a Benedictine abbey but has nothing to do with it. It way have come from a Franciscan abbey.

The pictures below Shows where it is now. What you see in the picture are pieces taken for different places to that have been put together.

Most of what I was told about it is not much more than hear say.

Also I do not know if it is even the right way up.

Phototoxin

Oíb súi vaibim
mise nar diliarrg bo

Does latin have accents ? Vabim seems latin but the rest doesn't. Anyway I'm not an expert that's just a quick look at something roughtly sounding irish

Bog Butter

Well if it is not Latin I don't know what it is. I don't think it could be Irish as there are no V's in the language.

Capt'n Midnight

from a quick glance it looks like old irish with sheidhbu's (SP - cba looking up)
also V is easier to carve than U so guess what they do ?

Belfast

This gives some different alphabet
http://www.nylicsocialworkeramazonas.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/script.jpg

Przemyslaw

For me it looks like Latin with ligatures. It seems to be something like "O IEI SIIT VANEI UN | HINE DEII DIIS TE??BO" It's hard to say without seeing it in reality. Remember that in old Latin there was no spaces between words and no periods after using abbreviations.

partyguinness

"If you can read this..you are too close."


Seriously I think its old irish. Is it possible that it is Latin on top and old irish on the bottom or vice versa? To me it doesnt sit naturally and I would guess that it may have come from somewhere else.

Belfast

Belfast wrote: »

The stone in Limerick city not far form king John castle. it is not in it original setting.
It is near a Benedictine abbey but has nothing to do with it. It way have come from a Franciscan abbey.

The pictures below Shows where it is now. What you see in the picture are pieces taken for different places to that have been put together.

Most of what I was told about it is not much more than hear say.

Also I do not know if it is even the right way up.

The stone came from an old chapel in Donoughmore Parish, Co. Limerick.
The stone is standing in the ground of ST. Mary's Convent (Catherine MacAuley House). It was placed at this location by the curate of St. John's Parish, Fr. James Creegan C.C later P.P. in St. Munchin's Parish who had it preserved in the year 1896.

Belfast

Modified photo of the stone might make it easier to see the text

Wallacebiy

Old Norse in latinised alphabet instead of runes ?

It looks similar alright to Old english , but did use V and various accents .

Not an expert on it now but might be that

Belfast

Wallacebiy wrote: »

Old Norse in latinised alphabet instead of runes ?

It looks similar alright to Old english , but did use V and various accents .

Not an expert on it now but might be that

something like Beowulf?


full text in original script
http://www.gutenberg.org/dirs/etext06/8bwlf10h.htm

Gnar

I thought this rubbing from a tomb in Kilcooley abbey Co.Kilkenny was similar.

Belfast

Gnar wrote: »

I thought this rubbing from a tomb in Kilcooley abbey Co.Kilkenny was similar.

Rubbing of Latin inscription from one of the tombs by Cormac Maher, 2nd Class
http://www.stjosephsns.net/kilcooley_abbey.html

I wonder who told them it was Latin ?

Wallacebiy

Belfast wrote: »

something like Beowulf?
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/08/Beowulf.firstpage.jpeg

full text in original script
http://www.gutenberg.org/dirs/etext06/8bwlf10h.htm

Well not , because that is the Old English version of the tale .

What you have there in the picture looks similar to Old English But a few of the things in it , the V and the Accents for example , throw my ( admittedly inexpert ) eye towards Old Norse.

Have a search aroun to look at Old Norse texts and you'll see what I mean , I can't really find a killer link for you at the moment though

Belfast

Electronic Text Collections in Western European Literature
This page lists Internet sources for literary texts in the western European languages other than English. Translations are mentioned only when they are included in collections of original language texts, or when they are themselves of interest. Collections are listed more or less in order of size; indivdual authors are listed alphabetically. EuroDocs lists many historical and social science texts in western European languages
http://lib.virginia.edu/wess/etexts.html

720 manascrpts spanning 5000 years
The Collection is also a means to preserve and protect for posterity a wide range of written expressions of belief, knowledge and understanding from many different cultures throughout the ages.
http://www.schoyencollection.com/

Belfast

Wallacebiy wrote: »

Well not , because that is the Old English version of the tale .

What you have there in the picture looks similar to Old English But a few of the things in it , the V and the Accents for example , throw my ( admittedly inexpert ) eye towards Old Norse.

Have a search aroun to look at Old Norse texts and you'll see what I mean , I can't really find a killer link for you at the moment though

This seems to look like it to me.
The missal of the Dominican covent of Lausanne, the oldest dominican missal currently known. Copied arouned 1240, binding of the 16th century. (Historical Museum of Lausanne).

Belfast

I just got this by email the other day.

The language of the inscription is Latin and the script is a medieval one. The opening words are 'Omnia sunt vana...', which echo the biblical saying, 'All is vanity' (Book of Ecclesiastes).

I still need a translation on the rest of the text.

Belfast

http://www.archive.org/details/journalofroyalso25royauoft

The journal of the Royal Society of Antiquaries of Ireland 1895

Ennis ABBEY AND THE O'BRIEX TOMBS.

BY THOMAS JOHNSON WESTROPP, M.A., M.R.I. A., FELLOW.



"Donchad Cairbrech O'Brien, King of Thomond, fearing the approach
of death, after a reign commenced in civil war against a brother
and stained by endless feuds, strove to ease his conscience by munificent

gifts to the Church. He restored his father's abbey of Inislaunaght for
the Cistercians ; he built a house for the Dominicans at Limerick, and
finally founded another convent for the followers of the "Angelic Father"

of Assisi, "in the midst of his subjects," near his "princely circular
palace, on the bank of the river Fergus, opposite Inis an laoigh, in a
place of swamps and streams called Clonroad." 1 There, where the

narrow streets of Ennis stand and the clear brown Fergus runs over
pebbly shallows, overhung with trees, he commenced his monastery at
the cost of three years taxes of his realm, which then claimed to include

not only Co. Clare, "from Loop Head to Bealboru," but much of
Tipperary, "from Birr to Knockaney, and south to Eoghanacht Cashel."
" He exchanged this mortal life for the felicity of angels," on March 8th,

1242, 2 leaving his work in progress, and being buried in his Dominican
convent, where the ivied north wall of the church, and heaps of carved
finials and capitals and pillars, in the pretty convent gardens, mark where

his monument and effigy were long extant, under the towers of the
Plantagenet fortress of Limerick, and where the only legible inscription
fitly reads, " omnia sunt vana."

After Sir Thomas de Clare and Prince Donchad O'Brien had perished

more than 40 years later, Torlough, their successful opponent, in the
beginning of his undisputed reign, proceeded to enlarge the work of his
predecessor (1287, 1306). The Book of his wars states that Turlough

dwelt in three houses : first, the palace of Clonroad, to which he had
added a stone tower; secondly, "in the fish streamed and beautified
fabric of the convent of Inis an laoigh, which he filled with monks, and

supplied with sweet bells, crucifixes, and a good library, embroidery,
veils, and cowls ; that blessed habitation which he built for his own
interment will last for ever after him in splendour "; his third home was

in Heaven.

Despite the fierce wars with the English (1310, 1318) Maccon caech
Macnamara found opportunity to rebuild the sacristy and refectory

1 " The Wars of Torlough," written by John Mac Grath in King Dermot's reign.

(1343-60), though wrongly dated a century later in a copy, temp. George L, ic
T.C.D.

2 Calendar of Dominican Priory, Limerick. "

Belfast

Donogh Cairbreagh O'Brien is also mentioned in the text below in the link below and the is all a picture of the stone.

http://www.limerickdioceseheritage.org/Dominicans/hyDominicans.htm

and here
Donnchad Cairprech macDomnaill Mór son of Donnell Mór macToirrdelbaig O'Brien and Urlachan MacMurchada 1210 1242 brother of Muirchertach Finn, who had abdicated

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kings_of_Thomond#O.27Brien_Clan

http://74.125.77.132/search?q=cache:Tak8ob056IEJ:my.gencircle.com/users/gren/1/data/52124+Donnchad+Cairprech+M%C3%B3ir&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=ie

Donnchad Cairprech Moir O' Brien
Birth: 1168
Death: 1242
Sex: M
Father: Donnell O' Brien b. 1137 in Connaught,Ireland
Mother: Urlachan MacDermot Of Leinster MacMurrough b. 1140


About the year 1240, Donogh Cairbreach O’Brien built a beautiful monastery for conventual Franciscan friars at Ennis. From its size, beauty, and surroundings, it was regarded as one of the principal convents of the order in Ireland.
http://www.clarelibrary.ie/eolas/coclare/history/frost/chap8_drumcliff_parish.htm

Przemyslaw

In 90% it's in Latin.

The first word can be for "omnia" (with weird ligature) - all
The second word is like "sui" - "his", "theirs".
The third word "Vanei" looks like "clean".
The fourth word would be "here" (something between latin and old anglosaxon)
Fith: God (in Detive case)
Sixth: Diis (two - more than two)
Seventh: Ire (go, to walk, to lead)
Eight: boi (cows?)

In the 7th word is a weird ligature where can be a ligature for a number/digit.
So, would it be mean that the person is "The cleanest of the all of those who leads own cows"?



I'm going to contact my friend who's literal in Latin.

Gnar

Just a thought but could cows also be herd,so in a literal sense it is describing a shepherd of people,like Jesus for instance.