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Taxis Revisited in General
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06-04-2009 8:52pm#11. The taxi industry is unique in that it is a regulated service industry supplied by self employed individuals, it cannot work like any other retail/service industry BECAUSE it is price regulated as well as quality regulated and as such all the arguments about why should the taxi industry have a temporary moratorium unlike any other industry like newsagents etc. is because it isn’t allowed to run to normal economic models.
High demand/short supply= higher price
Low demand/excess supply= lower price
If you want to treat it the same as any other industry, survival of the fittest, then let it run like any other industry
2. Taxi drivers want a temporary moratorium on plates followed by a full review of the industry because there are too many anomalous situations with regard to who is working, which area(s) they are working in, which cars will be allowed as taxis after 1.1.2012, what training / testing is going to be done for drivers, what enforcement is going to be carried out, who is going to carry out the enforcement, what guarantees do non union aligned taxi drivers have that there points of view are even listened to, who is going to take responsibility for non Dublin taxis when the Taxi Regulators office is amalgamated with Dublin 21 transport, why a one size fits all solution is seen as the only way forward when different areas of the country need different solutions
3. The meter does NOT clock up units at a different rate when on a motorway as the units are distance not speed, it may seem that the meter is incrementing at a greater rate but that is only because you are covering a measured unit in a shorter time. Also despite assertions that the cost of a taxi fare from the Airport to Ballymun is nearly double when using the M50 as against the side road of the airport €15 against €28 is totally unfounded as I measured both routes ( using the Airport Roundabout and The Days Inn as datum points ) and the costs were €11.45 via the M50 on rate B and €10.25 on rate B via the side road of the airport, this would seem to suggest either an exaggeration by the poster or the taxi that the poster used has a significant difference in the set meter rate to my own ( my own I know was calibrated and sealed within the last 60 days and the fares I normally do have shown no increase) so my thoughts would be that mine is still within calibration.
Scan of receipts from journey
4. For whatever relevance it has I didn't enter the industry until 2004 and so wouldn't classify myself as someone who has an interest in seeing plate prices increase which is why I am an advocate of removing the transferability of plates BUT with the number of plates available for re-release back onto the market (after retirements etc.) set by market conditions, so that new entrants have the ability to earn a wage AND reinvest in new quality initiatives for the industry.
5. I am also an advocate that all taxis should (eventually) be less than 5 years old, be VRT free for full time taxi drivers, which would mean that if you want to have a taxi just to drive in the bus lanes to your office job and then work a few hours when you need a new set of golf clubs then you couldn't, and that they have a unique registration plate
e.g. 09TX12345
to allow Gardai to be able to effectively police clone plates and the age of vehicles, also given that the license details are on the yellow stickers it would allow the removal of the present un-aerodynamic roof signs, I believe the TR did do a report back in 2004 that the drag caused by this style of roof sign significantly affects fuel consumption. In addition to this if the taxi was reregistered for public use then the VRT would become payable, the intended effect of this would be to stop people coming into the industry for short periods of time to earn a fast buck as they would have to pay the VRT on leaving the industry as the license wouldn't be transferable.
6. Double Jobbing, in an economic downturn people who double job, just to pay for the luxuries in life are a leech on the people who are trying to pay for the necessities. They also have a direct effect on the destabilization of the taxi industry and fail to allow it to find equilibrium. It’s like having two birthday parties with cake and dividing it up between the people at each party, then some people from the 1st party decide that they’ll go and get cake from the other party because their equal slice wasn’t enough. Not to mention the questionable effect of people working for a week and then doing a weekends work driving the public around.
7. Taxi driving should be minimum wage, an interesting concept and to be honest, if I was guaranteed to get minimum wage, with the money to pay for the upgrades, maintenance of car etc. Then I would certainly consider doing it, however, as the taxi driver is self employed and also has to budget for holiday pay, sickness, unpaid enforced time of the road etc. Then minimum wage wouldn’t cover it.
8. Taxi drivers driving abilities or lack of, taxi drivers are a cross section of the Irish population and if you removed the visible signs of a vehicle being a taxi you would be hard pressed to tell the difference from that of the general populace, there is a large majority of people in Ireland who shouldn’t even be allowed to ride a bike, never mind attempt to drive a car. I would say though that one thing the Taxi Regulators office does need to look at though is the thought train of certain drivers to get in front of other drivers at any cost, perhaps this is now more apparent due to the overall competition for fares out there.
9. Discounted Fares. Because the business model of taxiing is based on a 1st seen 1st taken methodology, it’s very difficult for a single driver to differentiate themselves from the “crowd”, you may well be able to offer discounts from a company perspective and increase the amount of business generated for a percentage of drivers on that company’s radio system but it doesn’t help with the general taxi model of someone flagging a taxi down on the street. I would wonder though at the wisdom of companies reducing fares for telephone bookings whilst not reducing the costs to their customers. (Taxi drivers are the radio company’s customers, the public are the taxi driver’s customers and the radio company are a facilitator to allow the two to meet) Having spoken to personal freinds who drive for the company the jury is still out on the matter as they haven't seen the increase in business that was forecast.
10. Ranks. I would contend that due to the inherent danger of the Taxi Regulators advice to select any vehicle at a rank that it should be immediately rescinded. I’ve seen it with my own eyes where an intending passenger has gone to get into the vehicle 3 or 4 places from the front, when the queue has moved up with the result that the passenger ended up on the floor, luckily so far no one’s gone under the wheels!, I also contend that the advice gives an opportunity to the racist elements of society to avoid using cars based on race rather than on qualityTagged:0
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my comments
5) What's the obsession here with putting an age limit on cars. I have been driven in 10 year old Mercedes that were in better nick than a 4 year old Toyota for example. The overall condition of the car should be the deciding factor not its age.
The removal of the roof signs is a bad idea. Without a roof sign you won't be able to identify a taxi until it's just passing you, to late to call. It's even worse at night.
6) Part-time taxi drivers should definitely be allowed. They are not just people who do it to pay for luxuries, but also people who do it because they need the money to survive
Part-time taxi drivers are also a good way to handle demand at peak-times. Let's assume you need 1000 taxis during off-peak hours and 2000 taxis during peak hours (assumed numbers only, don't know the real ones). You have 3 choices. A) have 2000 full-time taxi drivers half of which are not needed during most of the time, which will most likely lead to
have 1000 full-time drivers, and the public is back to the good old times, when passengers have to wait for long times to get a taxi, because there are not enough at peak times. C) have 1000 full-time and 1000 part-time drivers (who only work at peak times) and you have enough taxis during the whole day without the drivers earning too little.
7) You are self-employeed you make a profit or loss, not a wage. No other self-employeed person is asking for a minimum wage.
Besides this there is also practical reasons. Who is going to pay this and from what money? How do you determine the hours a taxi-driver worked? What conditions does the driver has? Does he has to park the car at a rank, or can he just wait in an estate out-off town where none is passing by to hail a taxi and goes home after 8 hours of no fare and collects minimum wage for this?
8) Taxi drivers are supposed to be professional drivers so the rules should be more stringent than for other drivers.
I think there should be a practical driving test for the psv license (harder than the normal driving test) and the punishment should be harder for professional drivers than for normal drivers.
10) There should be no requirement to pick the first taxi in the rank. No other business is requesting the same. You don't have to buy your newspaper at the first news agent you pass you can choose where you buy it. The same should be true for taxis.0 -
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1 In a market economy that has a price cap ( maximum earning potential ) then the onus should also be on a defined ( under constant review ) number of participents, you can't have your cake and eat it. If you want a free market then ( other than safety and insurence legislation, which is a requirement for all cars ) let it be a free market with unlimited participants but no price cap
2 The moritorium is being asked for so that it's easier to restucture the market with 25000 cabs rather than with 35000, it's like having a leak in your bathroom, you don't try to fix the problem until you've turned off the supply, otherwise it just adds to the problem
3n/a
4 Participants in the taxi industry have to be able to earn enough profits to both live on and to reinvest in their vehicles, comes back down to supply v demand, do you want the taxi industry to run as a standard economic model or do you want it to run to provide a public service?
5 The quality issue is supposed to be approached with the new 9 year old rule that's due to come in from 1/1/2012, personaly I don't think it's going to make one iota of a difference to the "QUALITY" of the cars, if a driver doesn't look after his 12/13/14 year old car what makes the Taxi Regulator think he's going to look after a 6/7/8/9 year old car. As an aside to this, it was originaly planned that all NEW entrants from 1/1/2009 would have to conform to the 9 year rule, this was subsequently amended to be all new plates i.e 45000 and up. Another year lost and another year of people buying plates 2nd hand and putting anything they like ( as long as it has a roof, 4 doors, 5 seats and a boot ) on the road.
The question of identifying a taxi is subjective but would easily be solved by having the cars painted a luminous green or by having them covered in reflective stripes or whatever color scheme suits, the main contention would be the aerodynamics of the current sign ( the only requirement to ID a taxi today), are sadly lacking in the North and in many other cities the signs are much more aerodynamic, even at present levels of 25000+ taxis the fuel and economy savings ( even if it were as low as 5%) would be substantial
6 You want a professional service then you get professional drivers, if you're on short time in your normal job and you can't make ends meet then instead of being a part time hobby taxi you become full time, if you can't hack being a taxi driver full time there is no reason I can see to be one part time
7 Doesn't cover the argument that people have to eat as well as re invest in the industry, which would you prefer a taxi driver who doesn't feed his kids because the money has gone on the taxi, a taxi driver that puts minimum investment back into the industry or a compomise solution?
8 No problem with that at all, however I would take it a step further and insist that it's a pre-requisite of taxi driving that as well as passing an advanced test, that you have held a full license for a number of years AND that the license you hold is endorsable within this country, too many taxi drivers I know have licenses from other EU countries and laugh at the speeding fines etc. because they have NO fear of losing their license.
9 As I say the juries still out, apparantly there was a radio program on today with two taxi company owners facing off about discount fares, one of them was Ebbs ( 202020 taxis ) and the other was ( I think ) Network Taxis, must see if I can find a podcast of it.
10. The Garda and HSE have no concerns because it isn't in their remit, HSE and Gardai might become more concerned when a fatality or serious injury occurs, as is often the case any action will be too late to save someone's life. As to the racial side of the ranks I emailed NRCCI and Taxi Regulator about it, results NRCCI No reply TR No complaints recieved and taxiranks are not within our remit
1. Domestic electricity and gas supply are the same as taxi's. there is a maximum price set and defined quality levels also. New entrants can enter the market if they think they can make a profit.
2. There was a problem with ordinary driving licenses. no-one suggested introducing a moratorium. The extra cost of the extra licenses can deal with applying the new standards to the extra licenses.
3.
4. But "enough profits to live on and re-invest in their taxi's" is as long as piece of string. Some people will need more to live on than thers - like someone who bought their house 20 years ago vs last year at the top of the boom - for a reasonably uncontentious difference in a person's fixed outgoings. How do you set the price of a new taxi in a falling market. How often do you re-adjust the price?
5. the age of cars is a cop out in defining the standard of a car. A 25 year old Merc could easily be of a better standard to a 8.5 year old compact saloon.
The govt just increased fuel costs by more than 5% this afternoon, OPEC did a lot more over the last few years... Black taxi's in Scotland belfast and England are distinctive enough without signs.....
6. I just disagree. I see no issue with part time drivers as long as their cars meet the objective standards and driver passes the same knowledge test. What about semi-retired drivers who only operate during profitable times and live off savings or a pension for the rest of the time for example?
7. Introducing a high barrier to entry would reduce the number of taxi drivers. I thought this is what most taxi drivers want?
8. I don't see this issue of holding a license for an amount of time solving anything. If you pass the test, the govt have decided you are a competent driver. How does passing a test, not driving for x years make you any better than some one who passed the test drove for x-1 years?
I'd say EU law would prevent any discrimination on license holders nationality. There is no requirement on any eu license holder to exchange it for the duration of the license. What about a taxi driver driving in Lifford and area, but living in Strabane? they could not get an Irish license
The govt should run the penalty points system to account for at least other EU licenses, the driver number is marked 5 on EU licenses. I presume there is a record of the address on the taxi license application, which needs to be reasonably current. It's not beyond the wit of man to deal with this problem.
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10. The HSA -Health and Safety Authority, not the HSE - The HSE can't even spell, I wouldn't rely on them to do anything.
I thought the HSA were busybodies enough to want to get involved before a serious injury. They wanted us (in a previous job) to take unreal precautions in case materiel clearly marked as safe (by the multinational manufacturer with deep pockets to sue) to use latex gloves - even thought they can cause a much worse reaction.....
There's a lot of buck passing regarding ranks, which needs to be sorted out by someone.0 -
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