Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie

The proposed "free" preschool year?

Options
2

Comments

  • Options
    #32
    sarahmum2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7 ✭sarahmum2


    ScarletO'Hara wrote: »
    I have a better idea. Mothers should stay at home at least for the first couple of years and rear their children themselves. They might actually enjoy it and the children certainly would. I know women paying 1200 plus a month for childcare. For crying out loud what's the matter with parents that they don't want to care for their own children. You would be better off financially in some cases staying at home. Any children derserve to be minded by their parents, particularly their mothers, not reared in institutions.


    I am a working mother. My child is in a creche full time. I work because I "choose" to. I am not forced to do so. I love my child very much and am annoyed that you think that just because I work, I love my children less than you or do not want to spend time with them. I love my job, I find it very fullfulling. My child is extreemely happy in creche and then in the evenings and weekends she gets loads of quality time with her parents. I don't see it as a second best option to staying at home with her, it's is just different.


  • Options
    #33
    ScarletO'Hara
    Registered Users Posts: 12 ✭ScarletO'Hara


    sarahmum2 wrote: »
    I am a working mother. My child is in a creche full time. I work because I "choose" to. I am not forced to do so. I love my child very much and am annoyed that you think that just because I work, I love my children less than you or do not want to spend time with them. I love my job, I find it very fullfulling. My child is extreemely happy in creche and then in the evenings and weekends she gets loads of quality time with her parents. I don't see it as a second best option to staying at home with her, it's is just different.

    I have not accused anyone of not loving their children more or less than anyone else. What I have said is that I do not understand how anyone can leave their very young baby/child in a creche for an entire day, five days a week. Financially it cannot be worth it in a lot of cases. Never mind the huge amount of time you are missing with your child. I wonder how many parents who are now doing this would have liked it for themselves as they were growing up, and after school going to a childminding service rather than to their own home. Being cared for in a creche from baby stage and up is at best, second best. There's a happy medium somewhere I'm sure, half the week maybe? You ha ve said you 'choose' to work and that is honest. When your child is older and her choice to to stay at home, and not go to a creche or whatever, what then?


  • Options
    #34
    MILF
    Registered Users Posts: 375 ✭✭MILF


    ScarletO'Hara wrote: »
    I have not accused anyone of not loving their children more or less than anyone else. What I have said is that I do not understand how anyone can leave their very young baby/child in a creche for an entire day, five days a week. Financially it cannot be worth it in a lot of cases. Never mind the huge amount of time you are missing with your child. I wonder how many parents who are now doing this would have liked it for themselves as they were growing up, and after school going to a childminding service rather than to their own home. Being cared for in a creche from baby stage and up is at best, second best. There's a happy medium somewhere I'm sure, half the week maybe? You ha ve said you 'choose' to work and that is honest. When your child is older and her choice to to stay at home, and not go to a creche or whatever, what then?
    I find you extremely annoying and offensive.
    Do you have children?


  • Options
    #35
    ScarletO'Hara
    Registered Users Posts: 12 ✭ScarletO'Hara


    MILF wrote: »
    I find you extremely annoying and offensive.
    Do you have children?

    Everyone is entitled to an opinion. Just because you don't agree with mine should not be reason to be annoyed or offended. Disagree maybe. Why to you feel so extremely annoyed and offended ?
    Yes I have children.


  • Options
    #36
    MILF
    Registered Users Posts: 375 ✭✭MILF


    ScarletO'Hara wrote: »
    Everyone is entitled to an opinion. Just because you don't agree with mine should not be reason to be annoyed or offended. Disagree maybe. Why to you feel so extremely annoyed and offended ?
    Yes I have children.
    Yes, everyone is entitled to their opinion and mine is that I find you annoying and offensive!
    For someone who alleges that they have children, it baffles me that you think that any working mother/father is choosing to work because they would prefer doing that then spend time with their children. Most hardworking parents go to work and leave their children with creches or childminders as they want to get as much money as they possibly can to give their children any kind of life. Yes, creches etc take up a large chunk of parents wages on a weekly or monthly basis but what little money is left for some people, that money goes on their children to give them a good life and nice things etc. The state will give you €204.30 basic dole and €26 for each child if you are a stay at home parent. Who can survive on that?? I know I can't. I was a hardworking parent of 2 who left her children at a creche 5 days a week all day. It was damn hard leaving them each day but I had to if I wanted to give them the best in life. Then I lost my job, then my partner did. Its damn hard but I never once thought to myself "Jeez, I don't feel like minding these two, I think I'll take the easier option and go back to work".
    I have immense admiration for any working parent as it is not easy as I doubt you would know, judging by your remarks. That's why I find you annoying and offensive.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #37
    Godge
    Closed Accounts Posts: 21,727 ✭✭✭✭Godge


    You have all missed the point on this measure.

    I bet you that some bright spark in Revenue took out the phone book and realised that very few of the creches/Montessori schools advertised were paying any tax. By paying them some money for the 3-4 year age group, they can look at their books for the after-school kids of 4 and older as well as the under-3s. Brilliant way of raising revenue for the State while also playing to the gallery. This measure will be self-financing because of the extra revenue and they will save all the money on the early childcare supplement.


  • Options
    #38
    ScarletO'Hara
    Registered Users Posts: 12 ✭ScarletO'Hara


    MILF wrote: »
    Yes, everyone is entitled to their opinion and mine is that I find you annoying and offensive!
    For someone who alleges that they have children, it baffles me that you think that any working mother/father is choosing to work because they would prefer doing that then spend time with their children. Most hardworking parents go to work and leave their children with creches or childminders as they want to get as much money as they possibly can to give their children any kind of life. Yes, creches etc take up a large chunk of parents wages on a weekly or monthly basis but what little money is left for some people, that money goes on their children to give them a good life and nice things etc. The state will give you €204.30 basic dole and €26 for each child if you are a stay at home parent. Who can survive on that?? I know I can't. I was a hardworking parent of 2 who left her children at a creche 5 days a week all day. It was damn hard leaving them each day but I had to if I wanted to give them the best in life. Then I lost my job, then my partner did. Its damn hard but I never once thought to myself "Jeez, I don't feel like minding these two, I think I'll take the easier option and go back to work".
    I have immense admiration for any working parent as it is not easy as I doubt you would know, judging by your remarks. That's why I find you annoying and offensive.


    Why do you think I'm making up that I have children. I have two. Both grown up. Yes I worked while they were growing up, I'm still working, thank God. It doesn't change my opinion that I don't agree with full time creche care for babies. I don't think it is the best start in life for them. It probably doesn't do them any long term harm, who knows. This is the first generation that is being reared this wayl. Did I have perfect childcare arrangements? No. Do I regret that I worked from when my chldren started school? Yes. Would I do things differently.... perhaps. If a parent works and after paying childcare and other costs related in getting to work and maybe what is left over is almost nothing, would it not be better to stay at home and enjoy it. The best things in life can not always be bought. I hope you and your partner have luck in your job seeking.


  • Options
    #39
    MILF
    Registered Users Posts: 375 ✭✭MILF


    ScarletO'Hara wrote: »
    If a parent works and after paying childcare and other costs related in getting to work and maybe what is left over is almost nothing, would it not be better to stay at home and enjoy it.
    How does the rent get paid then? Shopping, bills, clothes?...
    I just think if you are now a mother of 2 grown children then you are living in the past when, lets face it, it was easier for mothers to stay at home and look after the children while hubby went out and worked. Things are a hell of a lot different now and most families have no choice but to work and send the kids to creches and childcarers. For a lot of families, its just not an option to stay at home. Doesn't make them any less a parent.
    In your eyes, its not the best start in life but in my opinion its a great thing for a child to go and interact with other children, both of the same age and older, and for them to interact with other adults, not just you. Its character building and sets them up for school when they realise that Mammy and Daddy arent with them 24/7. When I sent my first child to creche, I noticed a huge difference in her. She gained confidence and is brilliant at interacting with people. My son is only 15 months old but I expect him to be the same.


  • Options
    #40
    ScarletO'Hara
    Registered Users Posts: 12 ✭ScarletO'Hara


    MILF wrote: »
    How does the rent get paid then? Shopping, bills, clothes?...
    I just think if you are now a mother of 2 grown children then you are living in the past when, lets face it, it was easier for mothers to stay at home and look after the children while hubby went out and worked. Things are a hell of a lot different now and most families have no choice but to work and send the kids to creches and childcarers. For a lot of families, its just not an option to stay at home. Doesn't make them any less a parent.
    In your eyes, its not the best start in life but in my opinion its a great thing for a child to go and interact with other children, both of the same age and older, and for them to interact with other adults, not just you. Its character building and sets them up for school when they realise that Mammy and Daddy arent with them 24/7. When I sent my first child to creche, I noticed a huge difference in her. She gained confidence and is brilliant at interacting with people. My son is only 15 months old but I expect him to be the same.


    I think the only thing we'll agree on is that we disagree. Best wishes anyway.


  • Options
    #41
    mcwhirter
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,432 ✭✭✭mcwhirter


    is_that_so wrote: »
    I have to admit one of the few "bright" ideas they've come up with. The question is how they will actually roll it out.

    It is not a 'fair' idea though if your children have just finished pre-school.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #42
    TheQueen
    Registered Users Posts: 88 ✭✭TheQueen


    The only way this will work is of all preschools and montisorri's apply, personally, I cant see this happening, can you?


  • Options
    #43
    TheQueen
    Registered Users Posts: 88 ✭✭TheQueen


    mcwhirter wrote: »
    It is not a 'fair' idea though if your children have just finished pre-school.

    On the plus side you have had the payment for almost three years so that must have helped pay for preschool?


  • Options
    #44
    mcwhirter
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,432 ✭✭✭mcwhirter


    TheQueen wrote: »
    On the plus side you have had the payment for almost three years so that must have helped pay for preschool?

    I was paying 190 euros a month for pre school, and that was only for 3 days a week, the supplement only helped partly not fully.


  • Options
    #45
    ntlbell
    Registered Users Posts: 16,288 ✭✭✭✭ntlbell


    mcwhirter wrote: »
    It is not a 'fair' idea though if your children have just finished pre-school.

    huh?

    The government are unfair because the budget didn't fit in with the timing of your kids?

    really?


  • Options
    #46
    mcwhirter
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,432 ✭✭✭mcwhirter


    ntlbell wrote: »
    huh?

    The government are unfair because the budget didn't fit in with the timing of your kids?

    really?

    Yes, before it was indiscriminate on when you had children,

    huh!


  • Options
    #47
    TheQueen
    Registered Users Posts: 88 ✭✭TheQueen


    mcwhirter wrote: »
    I was paying 190 euros a month for pre school, and that was only for 3 days a week, the supplement only helped partly not fully.

    Im the same in that my ECS for my two children was covering my daughters playschool. Hopefully though the free pre-school year will cover her for at least six months next year and my son should get a free full year. If this is the case it will be more beneficial to me and Im sure others. The timing isn't great in your case but my point was I am sure the amount you have received in ECS in the previous three years will come close to paying for preschool. If your child was a couple of years older you would never have gotten this payment at all.


  • Options
    #48
    mcwhirter
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,432 ✭✭✭mcwhirter


    TheQueen wrote: »
    Im the same in that my ECS for my two children was covering my daughters playschool. Hopefully though the free pre-school year will cover her for at least six months next year and my son should get a free full year. If this is the case it will be more beneficial to me and Im sure others. The timing isn't great in your case but my point was I am sure the amount you have received in ECS in the previous three years will come close to paying for preschool. If your child was a couple of years older you would never have gotten this payment at all.

    Fair enough, the ECS covered about half the pre school fees though it was better than nothing.


  • Options
    #49
    ntlbell
    Registered Users Posts: 16,288 ✭✭✭✭ntlbell


    mcwhirter wrote: »
    Yes, before it was indiscriminate on when you had children,

    huh!

    The point is it's not unfair because you missed the boat

    my mother got no child care benefit no mortgage relief why? because there was no such thing she missed the boat


  • Options
    #50
    themadchef
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,813 ✭✭✭themadchef


    The thing is we were used to the money. I have 4 kids, the oldest turns 5 next month. I will miss it, of course i will. BUT loads of people with kids older than mine never got it in the first place. Wait till they take our childrens allowance too :(

    We need a decent set up for this pre school year. I am living in a really rural area and i cant see any place within 8 miles providing the service. I will in all likelyhood miss out on the opportunity of providing my kids with this free year of pre school. Why cant they do it through the national schools? Set up is already there.

    I wonder when it comes to the depths of rural Ireland where these services may not be available are they just going to say "tough luck"


  • Options
    #51
    sarahmum2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7 ✭sarahmum2


    Godge wrote: »
    You have all missed the point on this measure.

    I bet you that some bright spark in Revenue took out the phone book and realised that very few of the creches/Montessori schools advertised were paying any tax. By paying them some money for the 3-4 year age group, they can look at their books for the after-school kids of 4 and older as well as the under-3s. Brilliant way of raising revenue for the State while also playing to the gallery. This measure will be self-financing because of the extra revenue and they will save all the money on the early childcare supplement.

    I work as an accountant - I find that creches are actually probably one of the most tax compliant business' - they must register with the local health board and have to comply with a bunch of regulations. part of this involves the constant recording of numbers of children on site, staff, etc. They will get in big trouble with health board if this is not up to date and can be inspected without warning. as a result, it would be very hard for them to hide income and avoid tax.

    It is more likely that unregistered childminders at home will suffer, because even though they can earn some of this money tax free, they may not be classed as pre-school, and so parents might move more towards registered places.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #52
    Nothingbetter2d
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,037 ✭✭✭Nothingbetter2d


    i started school when i was 4...... why cant we reintroduce that policy again?


  • Options
    #53
    is_that_so
    Registered Users Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    I believe that it is down to individual schools although many of my relatives' kids started at four or shortly after.


  • Options
    #54
    sarahmum2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7 ✭sarahmum2


    Nothingbetter2d wrote: »
    i started school when i was 4...... why cant we reintroduce that policy again?

    kids do start school at 4, but they must be 4 before the school year starts and some schools insist on them being 4 by the previous march-july(depending on school). My daughter was born in sept, so will be nearly 5 starting school.


  • Options
    #55
    Nothingbetter2d
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,037 ✭✭✭Nothingbetter2d


    my sister also started at 4 and her birthday is in september


  • Options
    #56
    sarahmum2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7 ✭sarahmum2


    Nothingbetter2d wrote: »
    my sister also started at 4 and her birthday is in september

    I think they are just a bit stricter on the rules these days. Personally, I would rather my daughter is the oldest in her class, rather than the youngest.

    My niece would have been 4 +2mths starting school and they are now looking at keeping her back a year between primary/secondary as she is not doing good, due to her being that bit younger than her classmates. I have another friend who's daughter was born in sept, but she is a particularly bright child. They originally wanted to get her in a year earlier, but eventually they decided not to after looking into it. The school said they would be happier to have her skip a year if she was too far ahead than have her start too early.


  • Options
    #57
    arlone
    Closed Accounts Posts: 25 ✭arlone


    talking about this right now in the Dail. www.oireachtas.ie oireachtas live\\dail eireann\media plyer


  • Options
    #58
    cashew
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10 ✭cashew


    Wait till they take our childrens allowance too

    Sorry to butt in this thread, but there is a protest against the means testing/taxing of child benefit as suggested for the next budget at www.childbenefit.info - please log on and sign the petition and pass it on to all your friends! We need to let them know now that we are not going to let them get away with taking even more money from our children - it is not them that should be hit!
    Thanks


  • Options
    #59
    gcgirl
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,044 ✭✭✭gcgirl


    sarahmum2 wrote: »
    kids do start school at 4, but they must be 4 before the school year starts and some schools insist on them being 4 by the previous march-july(depending on school). My daughter was born in sept, so will be nearly 5 starting school.

    5 is a good age to start, my son is starting Sept and he has just turned 5 he would not have been ready last sept he is more confident and does not have a seperation anxiety thingy! i see a few kids in his playgroup and they are not ready a kid that is clingy forget it!! wait the extra year !

    Plus on ECC if your kids finished playschool you dont pay for his primary school unless fee paying !


  • Options
    #60
    sarahmum2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7 ✭sarahmum2


    gcgirl wrote: »
    5 is a good age to start, my son is starting Sept and he has just turned 5 he would not have been ready last sept he is more confident and does not have a seperation anxiety thingy! i see a few kids in his playgroup and they are not ready a kid that is clingy forget it!! wait the extra year !

    Totall agree with you on this one. Kids who start too early just end up having problems later on. My niece was 4 and 2mths starting school (july baby) and her parents are now looking at keeping her back a year (aged 8) as she is having lots of problems - girls in class are way more mature than her.
    gcgirl wrote: »
    Plus on ECC if your kids finished playschool you dont pay for his primary school unless fee paying !

    don't understand this one - are primary schools not free anyway? (except fee paying).


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #61
    dvpower
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,183 ✭✭✭dvpower


    Thought I'd give this one a bump.

    Since this is supposed to come into play from January next, I wonder have many parents had any feedback from creches about how this is going to work. It still seems to be a bit up in the air.


Advertisement