2 male kittens wanted

Call me Socket

I'm looking for a couple of kittens on behalf of a cat loving lady in Co. Clare...

Specifically:
- around the 8 weeks old mark, but not older than 12 weeks
- must both be male
- one must be all black, the other black & white
- free of charge
- adopter willing to vaccinate, worm, flea etc

Wanted as pets for companionship, guaranteed to be very loved and spoiled!

PinkTulips

if you can wait 7 weeks and would be willing to meet in somewhere in galway for the handover i have the perfect canditates for you

they were born last friday, there are 5 altogether, 3 black, 2 b&w but i'm fairly certain there's a male of each colour (hard to be certain at this age!)

the mother is a very sweet cat and we have 2 of her older kittes ourselves who are total softies, real cuddle cats, as are her other kittens we've rehomed.

we're in ballaghaderreen but like i said, could meet halfway.

Call me Socket

Aw that's brilliant, that'd be perfect Pink Tulips, you're a star, thanks a mil!
I'm sure a 7 week wait won't be any bother for this lady, I'll check it with her to make certain....
I know the road to Gort- is that halfway for you? I can go further if needs be...

cotton

That's a very specific list.

PinkTulips, I hope that the kittens will be vet checked & the homes will be thoroughly vetted before you hand them over.

Have you thought about spaying the mum? It sounds from your post that it's not her first litter, it might be something to think about.

PinkTulips

would you be willing to drive as far as oranmore? will have a baby and possibly 2 preschoolers with me so keeping the drive a bit shorter on my end would be appreciated

if you PM me we can swap contact details, i think both b&w's are male so if the lady would like pics of them so she can pick i can email them to you in a few weeks when they're a bit bigger?

Call me Socket

It's specific alright Cotton:)
The lady in question lost her daughter recently to cancer. The daughter had 2 cats- a black boy called Sooty and a bi coloured boy called Sylvester, one killed by a car and the other died at age 13.
She wants to get 2 kittens that look like Sooty and Sylvester, and give them those names as well. She feels it will help....
I've already carried out a homecheck- Rescue Me is the name I go by when placing cats or finding homes for rescue dogs.

Thanks Cotton, it's great that there are people who have concern for the fate of cats and kittens....they're so often just handed out and passed around or treated as vermin:(

Call me Socket

PinkTulips wrote: »

would you be willing to drive as far as oranmore?

No probs at all, thanks.

PinkTulips wrote: »

if you PM me we can swap contact details, i think both b&w's are male so if the lady would like pics of them so she can pick i can email them to you in a few weeks when they're a bit bigger?

Brilliant, she'll be delighted to see pics of them!!
PMing you now....:)

PinkTulips

really cotton? hadn't occured to me :rolleyes:

fyi, she came to me as a stray last year, she had a litter of kittens in sheds near us and i was feeding her. when they were 5 weeks she turned up on my doorstep with them one morning and moved herself and them in and became a cuddly affectionate housecat overnight, we kept 2 kittens from that litter and rehomed 2 to friends of my aunts. she had already been in heat at this point and by the time she finished feeding the 2 we kept she was massively pregnant again.

she had that litter and i went to the vets and spoke to them about spaying and they told me they wouldn't do it til she was finished feeding as there was a danger of wound infection, etc. about this time one of the older kittens ran in front of a car and died and his brother was miserable without him so we decided to keep one of that litter too as a companion for him (the mother isn't aggressive to him but doesn't have any interest in him either and he's a very cuddly, affectionate, playful cat)

we rehomed the other 3 kittens to 2 excellant homes (we get regular updates and one of the houses is only 50 metres up the road and we see those 2 often and they're pampered little pets:)).

unfortunately she hadn't stopped feeding him by the time my baby was born and what with spending a week in SCBU with him, the bills that mounted up as a result and the chaos when he came home of dealing with him and 2 others under 5, by the time i was able to bring her to the vets she was hugely pregnant again.

i've since found out that there'a vet in town who will be willing to spay her within the next few weeks even if she's still lactating and will be bringing her down to him as soon as the kittnes are eating some solids and can do without her for a night.

cotton

No point trying to be a smart arse , I was just trying to help.
Having rescued, tnr'd & helped hundreds of cats, I know the gestation period & exactly what happens. They can be spayed whilst pregnant & also long before kittens are weened. They don't get "massively pregnant" from the time of weening to the time of giving birth either.

Call me Socket

Well done to you Pink Tulips, she's a lucky cat to have ended up with you.
I have 7 cats...when we moved into our new house we went in search of a kitten (to christen the place!!)...Giles is the only one we sought, the rest kind of landed here! Shortly after we got Giles, a litter of 4 were found dumped in a bush near my mother's house- poor things were only a week old. I took 2, Alaska and Simba, and my mother took the other 2, Ella and Tigger, and we hand reared them.
Then came Sparrow at 6 weeks of age- her mother's owner was going to drown her.
Then Carrie, a pregnant stray, who popped 2 days after I took her in. Had 5 kittens, I kept one, called her Blaze, and rehomed the other 3.
And only a few weeks ago we added Noodles....another stray, a neighbour brought their car to the garage for a service and when the mechanic opened the bonnet- there she was!! Neighbour came and told me and off I went to the garage to get her.

Oh the joys! My husband is fit to divorce me at this stage haha!!

PinkTulips

she's quite a small cat. i think she was dumped by her previous owners when she got pregnant as she's definitely not feral in her behaviour and wasn't really hunting for herself before i started feeding her.

possibly she got pregnant very young and it stunted her growth as both the kittens we've kept have outgrown her at about 4 months old. so yes, she does get massively pregnant by the time she finishes feeding. she feeds the kittens for 12/13 weeks if they stay with us!

i know they can be spayed whilst pregnant but i'm not comfortable with that, feel free to be rude about that too but i won't abort kittens when i wouldn't abort my own child.

callmesocket, she's not my first adopted stray so my partner is a bit fed up of cats too, lol. when she had the last lot of kittens i said to him 'no more strays, i promise' and he laughed and said 'don't be daft, you'll never keep that promise' .... <<<blush>>>

cotton

Fair play to you Socket!! Sounds like you have your hands full there! I've 10 here, all rescues with similar stories, I could go on all night.

PinkTulips, they are cats, not humans. Please don't bestow human emotions on them. It's not abortion, it's saving kittens from terrible fates.
180,000 kittens/cats die every year in this country (see www.anvilireland.com) Please have a read.

PinkTulips

cotton, i spay and neuter my own cats and know the statistics and facts.

they're not being 'saved' they're being euthanised before birth and i feel the same way about it as i do abortion, that it's a choice some can make, it's not a choice i can.

the first litter i could do nothing about and with the second i was caught unawares. i take full responsibility for the third as i should have bloody well insisted the vet spay her but didn't as his talk of 'wound infection' and 'permanent deformity of the mammary glands' flustered me into thinking he knew best (keep in mind i was heavily pregnant myself and possibly a bit hormonal)

she will be spayed within the next few weeks.

and just as an aside, you don't think a cat can get 'massively pregnant'? for the last 4 weeks of her pregnancy poor blue has been so fat around the middle she's been unable to jump, waddled when she walked and couldn't sit but sort of slumped to one side around her enormous bump. she really is a tiny thing!

i know you mean well but attacking those of us who do actually love cats and care for them as best we can is not furthering the cause. take out your anger at Blue's old owners who dumped a cat unable to care for herself in the middle of the country, at the people who dump or kill unwanted kittens, at people i know who treat pets as disposable toys to be dumped on shelters as soon as they get bored of them in favour of a new pet only for the cycle to repeat 2 months later, at the people i've come across since taking in strays who see nothing wrong with throwing them out windows, on bonfires, in rivers

cotton

With the greatest respect, if you read my post, I'm not attacking anyone.
I've seen & had here 100's of Blues & all the other cases you mentioned here.
I've lost count of the "massively pregnant" females that have passed through here. All with the exception of 2 have been spayed & their kittens were "aborted"
I use the best vets in the country, they don't have a problem with it & neither do. I rescue kittens, see what they go through on a daily basis & of I can prevent one kitten from going through the hell they go through outdoors & unwanted, then so be it.
I've also had kittens born here, the mums were much farther than massively, they all had above the level of care needed & got fantastic homes.
I'm not talking out of my ass here, I talking through experience.

PinkTulips

but cotton, i'm not dumping kittens on an overworked shelter or abandoning them.

i've freely admitted she should have been spayed and will be asap, i don't need a lecture about it. i'm doing my utmost to ensure her kittens have safe, loving homes and the cycle doesn't repeat.

when she had the first litter in the shed down the road my plan was to ring the ispca to trap her and them at about 6 weeks old as being pregnant with 2 under 4's and having a cat already i didn't feel i could take her in, but she took matters into her own hands and i've been dealing with it as best i can with an awful lot else going on in my life.

i don't think i've done everything right, and lord knows people like you think i'm the scum of the earth (this isn't the first similar conversation i've had) but 4 families have much adored pets now and she and her first litter would be dead now if i hadn't taken her in.... her kittens were in a bad way when they moved in and all are the picture of health now

irish ozie gang

Dear Cotton and Pink Tulips,
I think you have both lost sight of the fact that you have both done wonderful acts in saving kittens from dreadful fates. Never mind that you have a difference of opinion - that's what makes us human. Just know that your generous deeds have gladdened my heart - I was starting to think that the people of this country cared only for cats as mouse catchers and not domestic pets. Just agree to disagree, and get on with looking out for more unfortunates. I personally can't go anywhere near a rescue centre without bursting into tears and wanting to take all the cats home - but my husband would definitely divorce me (we were adopted by a pregnant abandoned cat)!
Thank you for restoring some of my faith in humanity.

boomerang

Cotton doesn't think you're scum of the earth, and neither does anyone else who rescues cats and kittens. I see where both of you are coming from. I think it's great that you took responsibility for this little cat when most people would not have bothered, although I agree with cotton on spaying pregnant cats.

I'm always glad when someone takes in a stray, pregnant cat. My biggest worry is the problem repeating itself... Not only the mother cat herself becoming pregnant again, but her kittens, too. And their kittens' kittens. I think the most important part of rehoming a kitten to someone is to stay in touch and ensure they neuter that kitten - be it male or female -at the earliest possible age.

I do worry when I see posts for kittens free to good home because in the majority of cases the owners do not neuter their new pet and so the horrific cycle of over-population continues. Nothing drums that misery home like working in a rescue and year after year having peoples' unwanted kittens dying in your arms from disease and neglect.

PinkTulips

thank you both, and apologies cotton. i was tired and hormonal and like i said seem to be having these conversations with people too often, have had everything from 'fgs, have her put down' to 'why did you let her in' (because she was sat on my doorstep with a half dead kitten in the pouring rain!)

i should have stepped away last night istead of getting so defensive.

boomerang, all the kittens have already been neutered or are waiting to be done within the month so the cycle hasn't repeated in this case thankfully, i'm getting regular updates on them and they're all well taken care of.

those of you with experiance of this, how soon after giving birth can she be spayed, should i wait until the kittens are having some solid food at 4/5 weeks in case she is unable or unwilling to feed them after the op?

Call me Socket

I had Carrie spayed when I was happy with 2 things; firstly- the kittens were weaned, and secondly- Carrie started to get up and walk away when they tried to feed from her. I knew then that her milk would dry up quite fast and she'd go into season again. I think the kittens were almost 5 weeks old when Carrie was done, and obviously I kept her seperated from the kittens til day 2 after the op as kittens jump and climb all over the mother as you know!

PinkTulips

Therein lies my problem with Blue, after the first litter she was in heat 3 weeks after they were born (definitely, saw her being mated with by a local tomcat although she didn't get pregnant at that time but a few weeks later), she feeds the kittens that remain with us until 12-14 weeks (although that at least isn't an issue this time as they'll all be leaving around the 8 week mark) and her milk only dries up a few weeks before she gives birth again. She doesn't seem to follow the usual rules of weaning one litter before starting on producing the next!

If she's seperated from them, not feeding and going through major surgery it's unlikely she'll still be lactating when she gets the kittens back right? So is it as well to wait til 8 weeks and just spay her at the same time the kittens leave so that they get 8 weeks of milk before being rehomed? I mean if i spay earlier and they lose out on the milk it defeats the purpose of keeping them until 8 weeks doesn't it? Or is there a good chance she'll still feed them after the op?

Sorry for all the rambling questions but the local vets haven't exactly filled me with confidance so far so i'd prefer to find out from cat experts rather than a vet more used to having his hand up a cow's bum than dealing with domestic pets

irish ozie gang

Have you asked the vet about the oral contraceptive pill for Blue? I know back in Australia some breeders will put their young queens on this until they are more mature prior to breeding. This may solve your problem until you can wean the kittens... We had our girl, Pris, spayed at about 7-8 weeks post partum. The kittens were happily weaned - though still going in for the opportunistic feed..... We kept Pris locked in the bathroom overnight to let her rest after the op, and the kittens didn't want to know her afterwards - we think she smelt odd after being at the vets. We found great homes for the kittens and kept one ourselves. I don't suppose there is any hope of keeping Blue inside until she can be spayed?

Call me Socket

PinkTulips wrote: »

If she's seperated from them, not feeding and going through major surgery it's unlikely she'll still be lactating when she gets the kittens back right?

To be honest- I don't know, sorry. Lactating is enabled by the hormone changes and production is maintained by the kittens feeding on the milk...I'd imagine that when the womb is removed it would still take a bit of time for the hormones to settle, but if the kittens aren't feeding it won't take long at all for the milk to dry up.

PinkTulips wrote: »

So is it as well to wait til 8 weeks and just spay her at the same time the kittens leave so that they get 8 weeks of milk before being rehomed? I mean if i spay earlier and they lose out on the milk it defeats the purpose of keeping them until 8 weeks doesn't it? Or is there a good chance she'll still feed them after the op?

It definitely doesn't defeat the purpose. Keeping the kittens with their mother til they're 8 weeks is more for them to learn from their mother than to feed from her. Some people will keep them together up to 10 weeks of age. They learn to interact, with humans as well as with their siblings, and they learn hunting techniques through play. The mother puts manners on them and teaches them cleanliness and toilet habits, protects them and they learn from her some of the things that should be feared, like moving cars and running dogs...

Carrie's brood also lost interest in feeding when they were reunited. They were weaned at the time, but I agree that smell may have played a part....I'm sure the antisceptic on their mother would be a proper turn off!!

cotton

Don't worry about it at all, I certainly don't think you're scum of any sort!! I was only trying to help & me being a cynical bat at times doesn't help matters either.;)

To answer your question, she's most likely pregnant again. It happens straight after.
Some people spay just before the kittens are weened, if & when they have started on solids, go for it. Her milk won't dry up & she'll be back with them the same evening.
If you want to wait until they are weened at 8 weeks, then that's fine too but try to have her done as soon as you can after that.
Please try not to think of it as abortion (they'll only be tiny eggs at this stage) but saving your beloved cat having to go through this again.

PinkTulips

irish ozie gang wrote: »

Have you asked the vet about the oral contraceptive pill for Blue? / I don't suppose there is any hope of keeping Blue inside until she can be spayed?

irish, oddly although she'll stay in for days on end of her own accord, if she asks to go out and we don't let her she gets VERY agitated and starts jumping at windows, miowing frantically, knocking things, attacking the other cats, etc (when she was in the late stages of preg i tried several times to keep her in as i was concerned for her safety, and worried she's be caught short outside. as it happened she only came home a few minutes before going into labour)

i've read about the oral contraceptive online but there seems to be alot of confusion about it's safety. not sure if it's available here.

cotton, at this point i'm just concerned about Blue, she's been incredibly lucky so far but she's been through so much in this last year it's time she had a chance to enjoy life and reap the benefits of being a pampered house cat. even if she were to get pregnant again it's unlikely she'd survive another pregnacy so it's no longer an issue of not wanting to spay while pregnant, she has to be spayed or she'll die. i'll ring the vet next week and see what my options are, alot depends on how soon he'd release her anyway. the kittens are 1 week old so it'll be 3 weeks at least til they're weaned onto solids.

thank you all, have hijacked this thread completely but tbh i'm half afraid of starting a thread to ask these questions as i know the sort of response i'll get from well meaning types who have no patience for my excuses.