This Forum..

Roper

.. I think it's alright actually...

Nice to see a bit of positivity around here. Did we all catch the Good Friday blues? Typical Ireland eh, off licences close for 24 hours and people go bonkers! :pac:

judomick

my mouth was watering in opening this thread what a let down!

Roper

Well I mean it's a forum, it's not The Times. I don't know what people expect it to be but there's lots of chances to promote Irish shows and the domestic scene and as with the internet in general, you have to put up with some morons to get to the decent info.

Fozzy

Who are the morons? I find this forum to have a lower proportion of posters who genuinely annoy me than most

Roper

Would you like me to name and shame who I think is a total bell end?

Fozzy

Roper wrote: »

Would you like me to name and shame who I think is a total bell end?

If you could give decent reasons

orestes

Roper wrote: »

Would you like me to name and shame who I think is a total bell end?

Do you really think that would be a good idea?

Roper

No, I was just illustrating how silly a request it was.

orestes

Roper wrote: »

No, I was just illustrating how silly a request it was.

Indeed

Roper

Also if I was asked to give reasons it would be just stuff like "whenever I see his posts I think of Alpen, which I hate" or "he once said something that I incorrectly attributed as a quote from Mein Kampf, and then I remembered I'd never read Mein Kampf, so he must have if he's quoting from it"

Kent Brockman

Roper wrote: »

.. I think it's alright actually...

Me too:D
You bored?

ginoginelli

Well done to Neil, Roper, Rovert and who ever else that has defended the forum..

This forum is actually pretty decent. my only gripes are id like if we had a bigger population and thus more threads and posters to entertain me and also a little less of the elitism. We have a few t*theads who have practised bjj for x many years that will perpetually and pompously point out their "great knowledge" of the sport to us mere mortals at any given opportunity (cough *clive* cough).

On second thoughts this can be quite entertaining too..:D

Clive

ginoginelli wrote: »

We have a few t*theads who have practised bjj for x many years that will perpetually and pompously point out their "great knowledge" of the sport to us mere mortals at any given opportunity (cough *clive* cough).

Awesome. No need to take a roundabout route, just call me a tithead directly if you want to.

I'm going to ask the mods not to ban ginoginelli or lock this thread, so that this notion of elitism can be thrashed out.

Kent Brockman

ginoginelli wrote: »

Well done to Neil, Roper, Rovert and who ever else that has defended the forum..

This forum is actually pretty decent. my only gripes are id like if we had a bigger population and thus more threads and posters to entertain me and also a little less of the elitism. We have a few t*theads who have practised bjj for x many years that will perpetually and pompously point out their "great knowledge" of the sport to us mere mortals at any given opportunity (cough *clive* cough).

On second thoughts this can be quite entertaining too..:D

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Clive

Firstly, I can speak only for myself.

I think that it's great that so many people follow the sport of MMA as fans. In fact probably at least 80% of the people I train with don't fight or train in MMA at all - I still talk to them about MMA, listen to and respect their opinions,just as I do here. However, that doesn't mean that if I disagree I'm being elitist, I just have my own point of view.

I don't really engage that much in many of the "event discussion" threads here, simply because there are many people on this forum that are much more clued in to the larger world of MMA than I am, and I wouldn't really know that much about many of the guys in the UFC, let alone smaller events.

Occasionally I'll chime in, for instance I remember someone said that Nog had no wrestling, and I took issue with that because I disagreed. I don't think I ever said "look I've been safariin' since before you were born", I simply stated my opinion and backed it up. I'll be the first to admit that I called the Mir vs Nog fight completely wrong, but I maintain that Nog has underrated wrestling.

Just because I'm a "meathead" who fights, doesn't mean that I can't express an opinion too.

A couple of people took umbrage when I quoted a member of the MMA community saying that coming to this forum would make you hate MMA, but I don't think that's elitist, it's just a remark on some of the people on this forum (nothing to do with thier training or otherwise activities).

There are people here who are obviously trolling and interested in one upmanship, getting the last word, and swelling their e-ego ; people who are, to use ginoginelli's term titheads.
I don't think they're titheads because they're not physically involved in MMA (in fact some of them are), it's because of the way they put themselves across.

To offer my own view, I agree with Roper, this forum is okay. Some good info, the occasional interesting (to me) topic, not too much douchebaggery.

agardiner22

Nice work kent, more than i could put up with.

agardiner22

Your giving them what they want clive IMO.

orestes

I'll leave this thread open, but I am keeping a very close eye on it.

Roper

I'm a hairy hard drinking stale sweat smelling elitist and proud of it. I've said that before and I'll say it again. I don't care how many PPVs UFC sold, or what Dana thinks of Ireland. I probably have about as much in common with the average UFC fan as I do with the average wrestling fan and probably couldn't have a conversation about the sport with them- they'd know far more about UFC/Strikeforce etc. than I would but at the same time wouldn't enhance what I do one bit.

But at the same time I have to respect that they don't want to train in what I do, they just want to watch. My only wish is that they got out from behind the computer and supported the local game a bit more. That doesn't mean they have to train, it just means that at grassroots level the same people who stay up until 6am to watch a UFC could come out to a local show and watch local talent from time to time.

Fozzy

Roper wrote: »

My only wish is that they got out from behind the computer and supported the local game a bit more. That doesn't mean they have to train, it just means that at grassroots level the same people who stay up until 6am to watch a UFC could come out to a local show and watch local talent from time to time.

The only type of local show that I've ever been to was one of the MMA league competitions in UCD. i'd love to go to more shows, but work usually gets in the way and I'm not really prepared to travel to a place like Galway or Derry on my own for a show

I often watch UFC shows with a group of friends. Most of them never knew about any Irish MMA shows before I brought them up one time. Is that their fault? I think that a lot of UFC fans would gladly go to a local show if they knew about it

Tim_Murphy

Occasionally I'll chime in, for instance I remember someone said that Nog had no wrestling

Who said that Nog has no wrestling?:mad:
They've obviously never seen him shoot and drop to half guard bottom. That's classic wrestling! :pac:

As for elitism... similar to what Clive said, most people who train MMA don't fight. In fact, most people who train 'MMA' really train sub-wrestling or BJJ and might do one night a week MMA training if any. That's fine of course, but it hardly makes them any kind of expert on the sport.

It would be great to get more casual UFC fans out to local shows but in fairness, most will never even realise they are on. Except in Galway, after Mark had finished advertising the last show there can't have been many left who didn't know about it.

Raze_them_all

Fozzy wrote: »

The only type of local show that I've ever been to was one of the MMA league competitions in UCD. i'd love to go to more shows, but work usually gets in the way and I'm not really prepared to travel to a place like Galway or Derry on my own for a show

I often watch UFC shows with a group of friends. Most of them never knew about any Irish MMA shows before I brought them up one time. Is that their fault? I think that a lot of UFC fans would gladly go to a local show if they knew about it

Sher they all get announced on here! you could let them know!

Fozzy

Raze_them_all wrote: »

Sher they all get announced on here! you could let them know!

I have, a couple of them went to the last MMA show in the Good Counsel GAA club. But that's just two people. I can't be relied on to provide free advertising! :pac:

cowzerp

Fozzy wrote: »

I can't be relied on to provide free advertising! :pac:

I know you say that half joking but your promoting a sport that you want to see grow so its in your interest too..

ShawnRaven

Now for my two cents worth here.
I like the forum, it would be ten times better though if there wasn't such a split between those who watch it on the TV, and those who train for it. Because it's BS like that which is what makes forums miserable to trawl through in the first place.

I'm not a fighter, i've no problem or shame in admitting that. I've no desire to ever become one either. That doesn't mean i don't have any respect for those who do. In fact, if only I could remember their names, but i remember talking to a couple of the local lads at UFC72 whilst queuing for a photo op with Dana White who were also promoting an upcoming fight of theirs in Dublin later that month, and found them to be really nice guys, very respectful and gracious.

Fighting is an art, but let's be realistic here, the second it gets thrown into an arena to sell tickets, and/or televised it becomes a form of entertainment (no, not THAT entertainment guys, before you jump on me) too. And that has to be acknowledged, and to a degree respected because even for local promotions, fighters either have to be paid, or else they'll fight so that their respective gym can raise funds for training equipment, etc. So in that sense, isn't it not a little unfair to be giving slack to some of the guys who are helping that funding too?

At the end of the day, the forum is called MMA, not MMA training, not MMA practice, not MMA fanatic. So I really can't see a problem with all aspects of it being talked about, from both a fighter and a fan's standpoint? And rather than take the whole "who are you to criticise, you've never fought" stance, for the sake of discussion would it not be better than to correct a fan and go as far as to educate them as to where you feel their opinion is going wrong? For every fighter that ends up making it, one thing they're going to end up being for at least one person, is a role model, regardless if they like it, not, want to or not.

Same goes for the fans of MMA to the fighters, If you don't know exactly what you're talking about other than what you read from a site or an interview (most likely written by someone who never fought), would it not be a better idea to bring the point up with some of the guys who do train, who do fight and get their spin on it first.

To me, that makes sense. But hey, what do I know? I'm just a pro wrestling fan who watches MMA too.
That said, from watching several series of TUF and watching the guys actually train, it did give me a lot of motivation to cut my weight from 13 and a half stone to just under 11 stone, because i felt i was way too big for my height (5'10).

Nothingcompares

I think the best analogy is Soccer. I have never seen a thread on the soccer forum about technique. I have never seen a thread on the soccer forum about where to buy football boots. All the threads are generally about the FA Premiership, the Champions League and Irish internationals. There are occasionally threads about the shenanigans professional footballers get up to. If you look at the typical Liverpool or Manchester United fan they're probably more interested in Steven Gerrads girl friend or Wayne Rooneys granny fetish then they are Shamrock Rovers or bohemians. Again, they're probably more interested in the war of words between Ferguson and Benitez then in their local AUL team.

However, the difference is MMA does have a culture of discussion about the sport from a competitors point of view. Discussion about technique, psychology, equipment by actual participants is actually common.

It would be an e-tragedy if all the MMA fighters abandoned this forum because it bored them.

As a disclaimer I'm not a MMArtist. I probably do MMA sparring less than once a month. But I am mad into grappling and train in that quite regularly (but not much lately ). I watch every UFC live or the day after it airs. I look up every fighter on sherdog before an event and try and find info about their back story. I used to lke making predictions about who wins etc. but I don't do that anymore. I watch the other big promotions too but I usually just look out for the fights I'm interested in or the fights of the night.

I have attended a few Irish shows usually when I have a friend/training partner/fella out of the gym on the card. I have been at John Kavanghs, Andy Ryans, Barry Oglesby's , Dave Pattersons and Mark Leonard's events. I've enjoyed them all it's got to the stage now where MMA shows are on every month almost. Sometimes there are 2 shows on the same night. So I obviously don't make it to every show but I do try to go to them. Firstly, because they're enjoyable from a social/few pints point of view. Secondly, I just like watching MMA at every level, from E to UFC. Thirdly, I appreciate my 30 euro and my 5 friends 30 euros that we pay for tickets makes a small contribution to MMA in Ireland which like everyone else, I want to see to continue to progress.

My gripe with this forum, and it's not just this forum is with life in general. Shaq's comments sum it up:

“I heard Mr. Walton’s comments, and I think Mr. Walton has broken the Big Man Pecking Order Code, Ordinance 225.7, which means his resume isn’t quite good enough to speak on what I’ve done....I look at what Mr. Walton has done, I look at what Mr. Walton has said, and one thing I hate is a hypocrite. So, if I’m faking an injury, his whole injury-playing career is a fake. Here’s a guy who only played one or two seasons injury-free, and now he’s talking about me being injured....Like I said, Mr. Walton has broken the Big Man Ordinance Code, 225.27. No big man under should talk about a big man above. It’s just not right, and that’s just disrespectful. And I earn my respect.” --Shaq’s response to Bill Walton

I don't write on message forums saying MMA fighters are crap. I'm not entitled too. When I see a guy on the UFC make a mistake that I wouldn't make myself maybe I will. I don't like when people, whether they're mma experts or not, come on a forum and talk thrash about a guy doing something that they can't do themselves.

I've been at real life mma shows and I've seen guys who have never been in a cage or ring in their life tutting and rolling their eyes when a guy gets choked out saying "I can't believe he made that mistake". They guys are eejits and annoy me and this forum has its fair share.

I'm the first to admit I talk too much nonsense on this forum and I appreciate not everyone cares what I think about Dana White or where I can get a Tapout t-shirt but I still like to do it. So I'm probably not going to stop until someone specifically asks me not to.

Drunkmonkey79

I like this forum but have found that alot of people get shot down for saying things, giving there opinion or mentioning there event and i don't think its purely an elitist attitude that causes it, i think there is a serious issue with people just being clanish, if they don't know you they don't think you have a right to mention anything!
As a result of this i rarely say anything on here, not that much of what i say should be taken to seriously as its usually just general observations or random comments. I have found over the years even back when it was MA/MMA forum that the responce to a post is solely based on who the OP was, which i don't think is fair.
Thats just my lil' rant for the day, have a nice easter and don't eat to much chocolate!:)

dunkamania

I have no home internet access, so am only catching up with 4 days of "emotional" posting now. Overall I think the forum is doing reasonably well. Given the sheer volume of posts, there was clearly a need for a split from the SDMA forum.

Dyr

from good old wiki:

"Elitism is the belief or attitude that those individuals who are considered members of the elite—a select group of people with outstanding personal abilities, intellect, wealth, specialized training or experience, or other distinctive attributes—are those whose views on a matter are to be taken the most seriously or carry the most weight"

In this context elitism is a thoroughly good thing for a forum, the opinion of a professional footballer and some spectator who roars "WOULDJA CLEAR IT FFS" at a telly do not hold the same value, no matter how long or often said spectator has been roaring at tellies.

Apparently pointing this out is unfair in some way.

cowzerp

Bambi wrote: »

from good old wiki:

"Elitism is the belief or attitude that those individuals who are considered members of the elite—a select group of people with outstanding personal abilities, intellect, wealth, specialized training or experience, or other distinctive attributes—are those whose views on a matter are to be taken the most seriously or carry the most weight"

In this context elitism is a thoroughly good thing for a forum, the opinion of a professional footballer and some spectator who roars "WOULDJA CLEAR IT FFS" at a telly do not hold the same value, no matter how long or often said spectator has been roaring at tellies.

Apparently pointing this out is unfair in some way.

I agree with this, thats why i listen to those more experienced than me because they have knowledge that i can gain from them so that i can improve, i watch more MMA than most but the best experience is definetly hands on.

thats not to say people who dont fight or train should not have an opinion, for example 1 of the best knowledgable posters on the boxing forum never boxed but just loves boxing, but there will always be things he can never know due to not been able to experince it, like what its like to get punched in the head for 3 mins and have to keep going!