Wish I had Carol O'Byrnes troubles?

ceret

AlekSmart wrote: »

And with each passing day it becomes clearer the the €90 Billion Toxic pile was amassed by as few as 50 (well connected) individuals,a fact which according to the Sunday Tribune was described as "bizzarre" by Dept of Finance officials...I`ll bet it was !!!

Hmm, do we know who these 50 developers are?

Rod & Reel

This report came from a conversation with Brian Leninhan on the Pat Kenny Radio show 1 day last week. i was listening. She did sound very upset but as u listened to her u got to understand where she was coming from.

she was well peed with the new levies and then the new hikes fair enuff i think we all are. but then she went on to say that 4 yrs ago she, her words "she stupidly remortgaged her home to buy an apt in crotia" and if she had not done so she would not be complaining near as much now.

was it greed i dont know, was she thinking well iv worked for the past 30/35yrs and im not getting any younger so maybe a nice spot in the sun is something i deserve for my yrs of service. Was she foolish, obivously in hindsight yes, is she to blame probably. after all no forced her to sign the dotted line but maybe she thought after yrs of service to the state teaching kids who some of would have went on to contribute a wealth in experince to this ecomony she deserved a SPOT IN THE SUN.

maybe after reading another post or maybe this 1 the avearge age of a board user is 20 sumtin so they would not have the forsite to see what this person was thinking.

btw im 32.

ntlbell

Rod & Reel wrote: »

she deserved a SPOT IN THE SUN.

She did indeed and she now deserves to take on the personal accountability that goes along with assuming you're entitled to a nice home in your own country paid off and another one in Croatia

sure she worked all her life...

There should be a head of wall smiley

ixoy

Rod & Reel wrote: »

maybe after reading another post or maybe this 1 the avearge age of a board user is 20 sumtin so they would not have the forsite to see what this person was thinking.

Umm you could argue forsight is exactly what she was lacking. Nobody has a "right" to an apartment in the sum and people need to take responsibility for buying beyond their means by anticipating the fact that their current means may change.

btw im 32.

By the by, I'm 30. Age doesn't really play a factor here, it only reflects the fact that the greed and short-term approach by some spanned across the generations.

Rod & Reel

ntlbell wrote: »

She did indeed and she now deserves to take on the personal accountability that goes along with assuming you're entitled to a nice home in your own country paid off and another one in Croatia

sure she worked all her life...

There should be a head of wall smiley

fruitless cheap shot at my post.u could have taken the whole aritical and replied to that. instead u took the line that would be sure to get a rise out of a lot of people.

also i never said she wasnt accountable again if u read u would have seen that.

Rod & Reel

ixoy wrote: »

Umm you could argue forsight is exactly what she was lacking. Nobody has a "right" to an apartment in the sum and people need to take responsibility for buying beyond their means by anticipating the fact that their current means may change.


By the by, I'm 30. Age doesn't really play a factor here, it only reflects the fact that the greed and short-term approach by some spanned across the generations.

ioxy i dont assume with what she did was rite and as i have stated she was foolish and she is to blame. lots of people have second homes for thier retierment lots more have pensions which the pay into in hope of having a nice future when thier old, are the also foolish for paying X amount for the past 35/40 yrs to find out its not near quater the value they had hoped for.

no age shouldnt matter but when ur 20 sumtin u dont look to the future as much as when ur 30 40 or in her case 50 sumtin.

ntlbell

Rod & Reel wrote: »

fruitless cheap shot at my post.u could have taken the whole aritical and replied to that. instead u took the line that would be sure to get a rise out of a lot of people.

also i never said she wasnt accountable again if u read u would have seen that.

i'm highlighting a mentality that a lot of people have and is part of the reason her and many like her are in the situation she's in.

owning a home is not a right, owning a home and a fecking holiday pad in croatia is far far from a right she's a school teacher for god sake.

gurramok

Just because she educated kids does not merit an entitlement to anything. She was paid huge wages for that.

No-one is entitled to anything in life, even a spot in the sun for retirement, you work for that pad instead.

ntlbell

Rod & Reel wrote: »

ioxy i dont assume with what she did was rite and as i have stated she was foolish and she is to blame. lots of people have second homes for thier retierment lots more have pensions which the pay into in hope of having a nice future when thier old, are the also foolish for paying X amount for the past 35/40 yrs to find out its not near quater the value they had hoped for.

no age shouldnt matter but when ur 20 sumtin u dont look to the future as much as when ur 30 40 or in her case 50 sumtin.

lots of people do stupid things it's not a get out clause

"oh but everyone was doing it"

their pensions wouldn't be worth a quarter they are now if they kept an eye on what was going on.

a simple move into cash would of stopped any rot.

people wanted MORE and MORE and paying little or not attention to what was going on.

jimmycrackcorm

At least she isn't as bad as the Aer Corp pilot who ended up with €8million worth of mortgages and who lost his won home in the process.

If a man goes out on the town, gets drunk, falls over and breaks his leg - who's fault is it:

a) His own?
b) The pub selling the alcohol?
c) The government for not regulating alcohol enough?

ntlbell

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

At least she isn't as bad as the Aer Corp pilot who ended up with €8million worth of mortgages and who lost his won home in the process.

If a man goes out on the town, gets drunk, falls over and breaks his leg - who's fault is it:

a) His own?
b) The pub selling the alcohol?
c) The government for not regulating alcohol enough?

he didn't complain tho IIRC

dodgyme

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

At least she isn't as bad as the Aer Corp pilot who ended up with €8million worth of mortgages and who lost his won home in the process.

If a man goes out on the town, gets drunk, falls over and breaks his leg - who's fault is it:

a) His own?
b) The pub selling the alcohol?
c) The government for not regulating alcohol enough?

Its his legs fault

Rod & Reel

dodgyme wrote: »

Its his legs fault

Dodgy doesnt do drunks but if he did theres always D

Sponge Bob

Friend of mine just back from one of the teachers conferences reckoned that the feeling about was that Carol cost them all the good publicity and sympathy they may have managed to wring out of the event ....and more.

http://www.rte.ie/podcasts/2009/pc/pod-v-080409-44m56s-todaypk.mp3

She is about 10 mins in .

oh well

I've just listened to that Podcast - because of her own stupidity which she admits to, she feels hard done by. When we bought our first house interest rates jumped up to 15% - no one predicted it and we were all in shock but we had to put up and pay them. She is complaining about her investment causing her to be in financial anxiety - tough luck. She took a gamble on investment property and lost. I've put extra money into my pension as my investment for future pension (which won't be a patch on a public sector teacher's pension) and I've seen it go belly up. I'm gutted but in all fairness, thats the luck of the draw. I don't get to whinge to ministers about it - she's on a good salary guaranteed job and guaranteed pension yet she moans and whinges like a 6 yr old in class at getting extra homework.

by the way, i must be like an OAP on boards if everyone is in mid 20s, I'm in mid 40s. agggggggggggghhhhhhhhhhhh

P. Breathnach

oh well wrote: »

... by the way, i must be like an OAP on boards if everyone is in mid 20s, I'm in mid 40s. agggggggggggghhhhhhhhhhhh

From where I am, that seems young.

sneakyST

ntlbell wrote: »

owning a home is not a right,

you may want to tell that to a lot of people on here and other forums who are jumping up and down wanting to buy houses in d4 for thrupence hapenny...

ntlbell wrote: »

a simple move into cash would of stopped any rot.

Some or a lot of pensions cant be put into cash after 2 years of contributions. Believe me I tried.
I think you are harsh but ultimately correct. I can understand if someone reached 51 and had no pension - do you try and save or take a punt on something. However on 63k and a state pension, no mortgage I bet she could have saved more money than she bought the property for........

bringitdown

I listened to this on air, and honestly once she said

I stupidly, through an investor friend of mine, bought a property abroad

I lost any and all sympathy I had for her. She is responsible for stretching herself to the limit based on her current salary and not including contingency for a time when things might not be so rosy. Its not nice, its not enviable but its not the governments responsibility.

(Of course wish they could extend that to the macro investors that have made a feck of the banking system)

jimmycrackcorm

Same story, if another angle, about the young teacher who tackled Batman at one of the conferences. She wasn't old enough to have bought her "croatian investment property" but was pissed off at having overpaid for her residence becasue of economic stupidity.

MG

Sponge Bob wrote: »

Friend of mine just back from one of the teachers conferences reckoned that the feeling about was that Carol cost them all the good publicity and sympathy they may have managed to wring out of the event ....and more.

Not sure they would have had any sympathy anyway regardless of this woman. Both public and private sector are long sick of the teaching union's whinging.

ceret

According to RTÉ, the average teacher salary is €56,000. This is shockingly high.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2009/0416/teachers.html

mac_iomhair

bet she thought she was warren buffet when she went for that investment. your gonna have to get some cream for them burnt fingers love, thats not brian lenihans fault.

i think were all learning some valuable lessons this last few months about living within our means. I certainly have.

jimmmy

ceret wrote: »

According to RTÉ, the average teacher salary is €56,000. This is shockingly high.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2009/0416/teachers.html

I believe the true figure , inc everything, is closer to 60,000. Either way,
I agree this is shockingly high. Bear in mind the president of some countries abroad eg New Zealand ( a country comparable to Ireland in terms of population size etc ) only earns 80 k in office....there are currently over 300 civil servants here who get higher pensions than that when they retire....plus a 250k lump sum.

BroomBurner

jimmmy wrote: »

I believe the true figure , inc everything, is closer to 60,000. Either way,
I agree this is shockingly high. Bear in mind the president of some countries abroad eg New Zealand ( a country comparable to Ireland in terms of population size etc ) only earns 80 k in office....there are currently over 300 civil servants here who get higher pensions than that when they retire....plus a 250k lump sum.

Do I even need to say it at this stage - Jimmmy, where is your evidence?!

At least the poster that claimed what the average wage was posted a link to their data.

hellboy99

Is this correct ?







Links:

http://www.payscale.com/research/IE/Job=Secondary_School_Teacher/Salary

http://www.payscale.com/research/IE/Job=Primary_School_Teacher/Salary

gurramok

No hellboy99, you need to use the official stats for it. Payscale is just a survey.
http://www.education.ie/servlet/blobservlet/teacher_scales.htm

And then throw in the generous allowances and thats how they get an average of €60k.

Firetrap

Surely someone who starts teaching comes in at the bottom of the scale. I don't fully understand the tables but I assume the top line of the first table is what a new teacher starting their job in 2008 would have been on - e.g. €31,804. That's a fair salary for someone who's gone to university and has a degree and a HDip. OK, so being a qualified teacher mightn't be as sexy as a quantum physicist but it's a skill.

dresden8

I wish I had Michael Fingleton's troubles.

The poor chap forced out with only a 28 million pension pot.

I wish I had Brian Goggins troubles.

Earnings slashed by 50% from 2 million.

Now that's hardship.

doolox

Teachers at the start of their careers are probably paid fairly but I think it goes wrong when they are paid approx 1.5 time as much after 20 years of service in the same job.
Is there any limit to the increase in productivity one can expect from a teacher in a class of 30 pupils?
Does the more experienced teacher teach in classes of 35, leaving the new teachers in smaller classes (25 or lower) in order to hone their skills in teaching?
I think not.
As far as I know both teach the same number of kids for the same hours and get them through the school year in the same time frame.
Do the pupils of the more experienced teachers learn more and get better results? Is there more supervision and coaching required of the younger teachers? Can parents look for and get the more experienced teachers to teach their kids?
I do not see the economic benefit or justification for such a huge difference in starting pay and finishing pay. Most jobs would require a quantifiable and tangible benefit in performance, productivity or reduction in training,surpervisory, or other costs to justify such a huge increase in pay for the same job. For example one would expect an expereinced teacher to learn more subjects, teach more and different years etc to be more versatile than the starter. Does this happen?
We don't even get basic performance managment and monitoring from teachers, its hard to get rid of the bad ones and most parents end up paying private grind schools to get their kid through subjects delivered by badly performing teachers.
Most of the TD's in the Dail are ex-teachers and one would think this would at least give the profession a sympathetic ear in government. How many factory workers are in the Dail??
I know workers let go at no notice with the bosses still owing the last months wages which they will probably never get. They are anxious.
Anyone on 60k a year in a guaranteed job from which very few have been fired should not be anxious.