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Ireland 1989 v Ireland 2009
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well I wanted to show negatives of both era's
or else someone might accuse me of being bias.0 -
2009 shall do.In saying how bad the 80s was at least there was a sense of community,
there's **** all of that in Ireland these days.0 -
i cant remember 1989Busses to Ulster Final replays.
Holidays before that were on caravans. The joys of caravans.
That was posh then, now it means something else.BlitzKrieg wrote: »comparison (sort of)
Coolock 1984:
(thank you monkeyfudge)
Coolock 2008
A sum up of the problems from both sides0 -
In saying how bad the 80s was at least there was a sense of community,
there's **** all of that in Ireland these days.
There is plenty of it, if you want to see it and PARTICIPATE.Mad Men's Don Draper : What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.
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i cant remember 1989Upward Spiral wrote: »In 1989 the times were tough but our expectations and lifestyles were on par with it.
Now, times are tough again and we have alot more expectation and far more lavish lifestyles to support, so now is probably worse than '89
WTF is good about having low expectations?0 -
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i cant remember 1989Disease Ridden wrote: »Wasnt around for '89 myself, but my brother says the 80's were a brilliant time to be a child, despite the fact that things were tight; apparently it was really sunny during the summers back then, but maybe thats his selective memory?! I'd say it wasn't too bad; at least then if you had wealth, the wealth was solid and you could buy one of those old classy fuel-inefficient E class mercedes!Heh heh
... (I don't get it
)
BlitzKrieg wrote: »comparison (sort of)
Coolock 1984:
(thank you monkeyfudge)
Coolock 2008
A sum up of the problems from both sidesIn saying how bad the 80s was at least there was a sense of community,
there's **** all of that in Ireland these days.
You will always get areas where people don't give a ****.
I'm just lucky enough to live in a place where people do care.0 -
84, 88 and 89 were great Summers. 84 in particular.
Ah right, I'm sure he would have scattered memories of the summers of '88 and '89 as he was six in '88. He has fond memories of playing football on the street with the other kids in the area and going inside for kia ora and biscuits afterwards!
Another thing. Everyone says that they never went abroad in the 80's? My older siblings and parents went to Spain 2 or 3 times over the course of the 80's and my dad wasn't making a killing or anything! They say it was cheap enough with a bit of saving, no?0 -
2009 shall do.Well, that being a good thing is subjective surely? I don't feel in any way as if it's a bad thing for people not to be religious - in fact I think it's more desirable that people face up to realities rather than convincing themselves it will be all right if they pray...
Fair enough. I know people must accept and face up to the reality of situations but I also believe that prayer can be a great comfort to people in troubling times. For example, there was a fantastic local priest who provided great comfort and support to my Mam the time she had breast cancer. My Mam's faith and strength certainly helped her during this period and I believe it played a big part in her getting through it.
Also, I don't believe that being non-religious is a bad thing and I never have done so. I know quite a few really decent people who have no time for religion.Sorry, no. Young people harbour great anger towards the catholic church because of what it stands for... not to be trendy. That misconception is very patronising and implies young people can't think for themselves. I dislike when people make out they're "rebels" for being atheist/anti catholic church, but to take up the position is not an attempt to be "cool" - unless you're a pre-pubescent.
Sorry if you believe I was being patronising. I can certainly understand why someone would detest the Church for the complete abuse of it's position in this country over the years but I also believe that you shouldn't paint all us Catholics with the same brush. There are so many good Catholics out there who also abhor what certain elements in our church have done over the years and we make no excuses for it. These evil, hypocritical b@stards had totally abused their positions and destroyed many lives in the process. The fact that it all came out in the open was a fantastic thing as it helped expose the festering cancer that had being eating away at the core of the Church for so long. All I ask for is that decent, good Catholics and Christians who try to make a positive contribution to their societies are treated with some respect and not tarred with the same brush as those who have brought our church into disrepute and who have irreparably damaged it. There seems to be no respect whatsoever given to Christianity nowadays, especially on this forum where Christianity is often subjected to quite offensive mockery and pi$$-taking, hence why I came to the conclusion that some people find it "trendy" to mock Christianity. There's a difference between reasonable criticism and downright sneering/abuse. Would you mock Muslims and treat them all as lunatic terrorists because of the actions of a certain few? That would be seen as Islamophobic. Mock and ridicule Judaism and you are called anti-Semitic. Here's a Wiki link on Christophobia if you want to check it out.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ChristophobiaA lot of people consider those good enough reasons to despise the institution that is the catholic church.I don't think anyone would deny there are decent individuals who represent the catholic church but that doesn't make the institution any less reprehensible.
As I had mentioned, the institution has been irreparably damaged by the actions of the evil and corrupt within it and more should have been done much sooner to eradicate these evils. They practically destroyed themselves in this country by not doing so. I still choose to keep my Catholic faith because I have experienced so much positive work being done by good, decent Catholics in my community and elsewhere. I have faith in these people and in the work they do and I also believe that my life is better for being a member of the church. The whole institution isn't bad. All I ask for is that we are treated with some level of respect and that we are not put on the same pedestal as those individuals in the Church who have destroyed, and continue to destroy our reputation.
I have a feeling someone is going to criticise me on the position of the Church regarding condoms in Africa so here's my reply.
I believe the Church have done themselves no favours regarding this issue, especially the report that states that condoms actually have micro-holes in which the sperm cells can pass thru. I also believe that condoms are not the entire solution to the AIDS problem in Africa. There are a lot of superstitious beliefs and ignorance among certain African tribes. For example, some tribes believe that having sex with infants may be able to cure them of AIDS. More should be done to fully educate these people so as to scrap these superstitions and more should be done to make treatments more widely available to them. Education is what the people need in order to turn the AIDS epidemic around in the long-term.0 -
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I was 14 years old in 1989. We lived in a smallish village. My dad drove a rusty Hiace van. It had three seats in the front and in the back he had welded two airplane seats to the floor which is where my older brother and myself sat. I have no recollection of seat belts.
There was no money. My dad was unemployed most of the time. Every week when you passed the local police station there was a long line going down the road of the men signing on. The line would quickly move towards the pub.
I was getting ready for the inter cert. There were no luxuries.By that I mean things like going out for dinner apart from the odd bag of chips from the chipper. We didn't own a TV, we rented one. We didn't have a VCR or a phone. My English teacher was also my career guidance person. We had one session together where she helped me fill out forms for apprenticeships. She asked if I had family in England, which I did, she advised me to leave and move to England. That was the total sum of career guidance provided. Every night the 6 o'clock new consisted of, number on the live register, number who left the country that month, the latest shooting or punishment beating in the north.
I had a job on a farm that I had first started at when I was 12. I made 1 pound an hour. In the summer time I would work 50+ hours a week. There was no protection for child workers, at least nothing that was enforced.
All in all I have no love of the 80's and my guess is anyone who experienced the 80's and unemployment would have no love to return to it either.0 -
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and you ended up in Maine? Your geography teacher must have been ace.
Yup and very happy here. It's a long time since 1989 and sometimes life will take you where it wants to take you. Now I am a senior vice president of a technology company, it's a little different to when I used to pick stones in the pissing rain.0 -
1 Packie Bonner 2 DF Chris Morris 3 DF Steve Staunton 4 DF Mick McCarthy 5 DF Kevin Moran 6 MD Ronnie Whelan 7 DF Paul McGrath 8 MD Ray Houghton 9 FW John Aldridge 10 FW Tony Cascarino 11 MD Kevin Sheedy 12 DF David O'Leary 13 MD Andy Townsend 14 DF Chris Hughton 15 FW Bernie Slaven 16 MD John Sheridan 17 FW Niall Quinn 18 FW Frank Stapleton 19 FW David Kelly 20 MD John Byrne 21 MD Alan McLoughlin 22 GK Gerry Peyton
Versus...
Shay Given
Nick Colgan
Richard Dunne
Andy O'Brien
John O'Shea
Paul McShane
Glenn Whelan
Kevin Kilbane
Steven Reid
Darron Gibson
Keith Andrews
Damien Duff
Robbie Keane
Aiden McGeady0 -
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2009 shall do.In '89, people weren't coming off 10 years of self-indulgence & debt accumulation.
Young people in '09 have a lot further to fall when it all goes tits-up.
Unrealistic expectations of what a normal factory or office job should afford you have given way to a realisation that the big house was a house of cards, a 4 by 4 was 16 but we happily paid 64 if we could have it today, the 3 trips a year to the states would have paid a good chunk off the mortgage.
Where the 80's family got a sympathetic, knowing look from the neighbours, many of todays' young adults don't know the neighbours. My neighbours in the 80's thought nothing of borrowing a pint of milk, or keeping an eye on my house when I was away. I couldn't imagine either scenario now. With loss of community spirit, it's tougher to cope with hardship. I think the tough times of the 80's were coped with better, because people coped together.0 -
Now I am a senior vice president of a technology company
Your story is one of considerable enough hardship for a western country (ok, it could be WAY worse, but it's still pretty tough-going). It just seems bizarre for, in the greater scheme of things, a relatively recent time. At 34 you're probably ancient to a lot of posters here, but realistically you're quite young, and that just seems like a life for a person a lot older than you.
Did you end up going to college?0 -
Auvers wrote:Any chance of a jobHoly flurking shnit! Well done!
Your story is one of considerable enough hardship for a western country (ok, it could be WAY worse, but it's still pretty tough-going). It just seems bizarre for, in the greater scheme of things, a relatively recent time. At 34 you're probably ancient to a lot of posters here, but realistically you're quite young, and that just seems like a life for a person a lot older than you.
Did you end up going to college?
Ireland jumped 30 years in the space of 10 during the 90's. A lot of people don't seem to realize that. Ireland of the 1970's and 1980's was not unlike America of the 1950's. I have never considered myself to have experienced hardship as such as I don't know if we can even fathom what true hardship is. But growing up it did take me a while to understand that not everyones life is like my families. Other families had cars, they had VCR's and they go out and do things.
I did go to a local regional technical college and lasted a year before I dropped out. I was on a vocational grant which put 15 quid into my pocket every week which wasn't enough to even cover the bus fare to get there. Because I lived in the country I had to work farm jobs which paid very little and I became the stereo typical angry young man because my life consisted of college, thumbing lifts everywhere and working to pay for my room at home. I dropped out to take a job driving a forklift in a warehouse.
I did go back and spend 2 years getting a certificate by doing night courses while working full time. I eventually landed a job in the field I love by banging on doors and offering to work for less money that I made driving a forklift. That job required me to have to travel 15 miles to work and I had no way to get there so I offered to travel with a lorry driver I knew and load his lorry for him at the warehouse in exchange for dropping me to my office. This obviously meant some very long days. I would have been 19 then and making 9k a year. I remember a lot of this like it was yesterday, but inbetween then and now not so much.0 -
89 was great, it was less complicated back in the 80's. People who complain about it being bad now obviously didn't experience the 80's. Going out for a meal was unheard of, the closet you would get would be a bag of chips and that didn't happen too often. Houses were like freezers, no central heating, no double glazing, old wooden doors with the wind coming through. We would have to stick towels along the bottom to keep the wind out. Getting out of bed in the morning was awful and there was no such thing as a warm shower. If you had a landline you were rich. All the vegetables grew in the garden and milk came directly from the cow, no cartons or bottles! Cars also had chokes and you were lucky if the damn thing would start, especially in the winter. Most of your family lived in New York, New Jersey, Boston, Birmingham and London. But everyone seemed to have time for everyone. Neighbours would call around and if you needed help with something they would be there for you. It will never be like that again.0
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Sgt Hartman wrote: »Fair enough. I know people must accept and face up to the reality of situations but I also believe that prayer can be a great comfort to people in troubling times. For example, there was a fantastic local priest who provided great comfort and support to my Mam the time she had breast cancer. My Mam's faith and strength certainly helped her during this period and I believe it played a big part in her getting through it.Sorry if you believe I was being patronising. I can certainly understand why someone would detest the Church for the complete abuse of it's position in this country over the years but I also believe that you shouldn't paint all us Catholics with the same brush. There are so many good Catholics out there who also abhor what certain elements in our church have done over the years and we make no excuses for it. These evil, hypocritical b@stards had totally abused their positions and destroyed many lives in the process. The fact that it all came out in the open was a fantastic thing as it helped expose the festering cancer that had being eating away at the core of the Church for so long. All I ask for is that decent, good Catholics and Christians who try to make a positive contribution to their societies are treated with some respect and not tarred with the same brush as those who have brought our church into disrepute and who have irreparably damaged it. There seems to be no respect whatsoever given to Christianity nowadays, especially on this forum where Christianity is often subjected to quite offensive mockery and pi$$-taking, hence why I came to the conclusion that some people find it "trendy" to mock Christianity. There's a difference between reasonable criticism and downright sneering/abuse. Would you mock Muslims and treat them all as lunatic terrorists because of the actions of a certain few? That would be seen as Islamophobic. Mock and ridicule Judaism and you are called anti-Semitic. Here's a Wiki link on Christophobia if you want to check it out.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christophobia
As I had mentioned, the institution has been irreparably damaged by the actions of the evil and corrupt within it and more should have been done much sooner to eradicate these evils. They practically destroyed themselves in this country by not doing so. I still choose to keep my Catholic faith because I have experienced so much positive work being done by good, decent Catholics in my community and elsewhere. I have faith in these people and in the work they do and I also believe that my life is better for being a member of the church. The whole institution isn't bad. All I ask for is that we are treated with some level of respect and that we are not put on the same pedestal as those individuals in the Church who have destroyed, and continue to destroy our reputation.
And it's as if you're unaware of the abuse muslims and Jews get - they get plenty of it.
Also, some people object to catholics continuing to support the institution of the church after all that has happened, suggesting they convert to another christian denomination. I'm inclined to agree with that - I don't see why it has to be catholicism that Irish christians embrace. I see nothing wrong with a person being a christian.I also believe that condoms are not the entire solution to the AIDS problem in Africa. There are a lot of superstitious beliefs and ignorance among certain African tribes. For example, some tribes believe that having sex with infants may be able to cure them of AIDS. More should be done to fully educate these people so as to scrap these superstitions and more should be done to make treatments more widely available to them. Education is what the people need in order to turn the AIDS epidemic around in the long-term.Ireland jumped 30 years in the space of 10 during the 90's. A lot of people don't seem to realize that. Ireland of the 1970's and 1980's was not unlike America of the 1950's. I have never considered myself to have experienced hardship as such as I don't know if we can even fathom what true hardship is. But growing up it did take me a while to understand that not everyones life is like my families. Other families had cars, they had VCR's and they go out and do things.
I did go to a local regional technical college and lasted a year before I dropped out. I was on a vocational grant which put 15 quid into my pocket every week which wasn't enough to even cover the bus fare to get there. Because I lived in the country I had to work farm jobs which paid very little and I became the stereo typical angry young man because my life consisted of college, thumbing lifts everywhere and working to pay for my room at home. I dropped out to take a job driving a forklift in a warehouse.
I did go back and spend 2 years getting a certificate by doing night courses while working full time. I eventually landed a job in the field I love by banging on doors and offering to work for less money that I made driving a forklift. That job required me to have to travel 15 miles to work and I had no way to get there so I offered to travel with a lorry driver I knew and load his lorry for him at the warehouse in exchange for dropping me to my office. This obviously meant some very long days. I would have been 19 then and making 9k a year. I remember a lot of this like it was yesterday, but inbetween then and now not so much.89 was great, it was less complicated back in the 80's.
I'm a similar age and loved the 80s too - it was great being a kid then.
But I'm so grateful I wasn't the age I am now.Going out for a meal was unheard of, the closet you would get would be a bag of chips and that didn't happen too often.Houses were like freezers, no central heating, no double glazing, old wooden doors with the wind coming through. We would have to stick towels along the bottom to keep the wind out. Getting out of bed in the morning was awful and there was no such thing as a warm shower.
Oh yeah, towels as draft excluders! Yeah, getting out of bed could be awful all right but in fairness, there WAS such thing as a hot shower.If you had a landline you were rich.All the vegetables grew in the garden and milk came directly from the cow, no cartons or bottles!There were of course cartons and bottles.
Cars also had chokes and you were lucky if the damn thing would start, especially in the winter.But everyone seemed to have time for everyone. Neighbours would call around and if you needed help with something they would be there for you. It will never be like that again.0 -
2009 shall do.Where the 80's family got a sympathetic, knowing look from the neighbours, many of todays' young adults don't know the neighbours. My neighbours in the 80's thought nothing of borrowing a pint of milk, or keeping an eye on my house when I was away. I couldn't imagine either scenario now. With loss of community spirit, it's tougher to cope with hardship. I think the tough times of the 80's were coped with better, because people coped together.
I live in a Cork city suburb and most of my neighbours are still like that.0 -
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i cant remember 1989It would be easy to look at 1989 through rose tinted glassess as I was 16 at the time and yeah I had some great times but I do remember a very definite hopelessness. We were in the **** and we couldn't see any way out. We had f'all confidence as a nation whatever about individually.
Every second man in our estate was without work. A huge number of older brothers and sisters had emigrated. Things were generally ****.
I am still optimistic that we will come out of the current mess. It is a world wide mess and we certainly have the collective ability to rise again when conditions improve.0
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