Brian Cowen in legal dispute over property...

tomcosgrave

As if Ireland wasn't damaged enough already -

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/ireland/article6088204.ece?token=null&offset=0&page=1

Brian Cowen, the Irish prime minister, is facing legal action in the English courts over his ownership of a buy-to-let flat which his landlords say he is illegally sub-letting to Leeds University.

…

The purchase of the student apartment block, which cost around £12.5 million, was financed through mortgages taken out by the investors with Allied Irish Bank, whose share value plunged 98 per cent in the last year because of bad property loans.

Last September, amid fears that a bank was about to go bust, the Taoiseach and his finance minister Brian Lenihan stepped in to extend a 440 billion euros government guarantee to six mainly-Irish owned financial institutions, including Allied Irish with whom Mr Cowen secured his mortgage for the Leeds apartment.


At the time no cabinet minister declared, nor was asked to declare, an interest in any of the guaranteed banks.

hobochris

the plot thickens!

silverharp

I dont think the bailout should be linked to this , for all we know his personal bank accounts are with AIB , shock horror.
Good to know though he was as dumb in his personal investments. I'd be more worried if it came out that he had invested in a hedge fund that was shorting the banks or property.

EastWallGirl

Fourteen of the investors, including Mr Cowen and his wife Mary, recorded their addresses in the Land Registry as 60 Merrion Square, Dublin

Who are they?

Where are the Irish investigative journalists.

Someone need to be ont he bakc of FF, the builders adn the bankers to get to the bottom of it.

gandalf

Oh dear, this is not good but was to be expected with Fianna Fail.

Fr0g

EastWallGirl wrote: »

Fourteen of the investors, including Mr Cowen and his wife Mary, recorded their addresses in the Land Registry as 60 Merrion Square, Dublin

Who are they?

Where are the Irish investigative journalists.

Someone need to be ont he bakc of FF, the builders adn the bankers to get to the bottom of it.

The most recent claim for management fees sent to Mr Cowen’s address as recorded in the Land Registry was returned, with a note attached saying “Not known at this address”.

There is another thread debating whether FF need a change of leadership. As if that would make any difference.

leitrim lad

yes thats my thread, and its starting to get serious now ( the thread)

however brian has done no wrong here, it is just the media blowing it up in the air, nothing wrong with getting a morgage to buy a house in england, and if you have 14 others willing to chip in on the repayments, thats even better,

because if brian doesnt have it this month surely one of the other 14 will,

come on we dont need to step this low to start bad mouthing our taoiseach , this could bankrupt the country if ye keep it up ,and what ever journalist wrote these infactuated lies needs a spell in the joy

Fr0g

leitrim lad wrote: »

yes thats my thread, and its starting to get serious now ( the thread)

Serious?

If there was a "Funniest Thread of the Month" I would nominate it as a candidate.

Dr Galen

i agree for once that taken on it's own, there is nothing wrong with Cowan getting a mortgage from AIB and buying property with it. The man has to deal with a bank on a personal level we all do. The report makes a bit much of that angle alright.

My concern is that it appears he/they are unable to keep their house in order. If he can't be trusted to keep up payments etc due on a block of 14 apartments, then how can he be trusted with our tax dollars?

Dr Galen

leitrim lad wrote: »

,and what ever journalist wrote these infactuated lies needs a spell in the joy

so now we start locking up journalists for writing things we don't want to or like to hear? fascism here we come........

thebigcheese22

Mystik Monkey wrote: »

so now we start locking up journalists for writing things we don't want to or like to hear? fascism here we come........

Dude maybe if we don't respond to trolls they'll just go away. I live in hope!

gandalf

Mystik Monkey wrote: »

so now we start locking up journalists for writing things we don't want to or like to hear? fascism here we come........

It's the FF way. Look at the fuss over that poor old artist. If handled properly and laughed off it wouldn't have registered on the radar at all. Handled in the normal heavy handed FF manner it became international news.

I am glad someone has published this story. It makes you wonder who the other investors are and how many other investments of this type there are? Did the banks vet these the same way as they would for Joe Q Public and were there any favours garnered because it was the then Minister for Finance?

I don't expect to see RTE running with this because they have been neutered quite effectively by FF since daring to broadcast the offending pictures of our esteemed leader and property investor.

professore

leitrim lad wrote: »

yes thats my thread, and its starting to get serious now ( the thread)

however brian has done no wrong here, it is just the media blowing it up in the air, nothing wrong with getting a morgage to buy a house in england, and if you have 14 others willing to chip in on the repayments, thats even better,

because if brian doesnt have it this month surely one of the other 14 will,

come on we dont need to step this low to start bad mouthing our taoiseach , this could bankrupt the country if ye keep it up ,and what ever journalist wrote these infactuated lies needs a spell in the joy

Yes he has done wrong, or the syndicate he is legally part of has:

The freeholder has written to Mr Cowen, who earns 257,000 euros a year as Taoiseach, and the other lease holders informing them:”Contrary to the terms of your leases you have sub-let without authority to the University of Leeds”.

The freeholder describes that action as “an irredeemable breach of covenant”.


Bills sent out to the individual lease-holders for ground rent and management fees have not been paid. The most recent claim for management fees sent to Mr Cowen’s address as recorded in the Land Registry was returned, with a note attached saying “Not known at this address” . :eek:

60 Merrion Square, in the heart of Georgian Dublin and a stone’s throw from Leinster House, the Irish Parliament buildings, and the Offices of the Taoiseach, is a four-storey town house with two residential apartments on the upper floors and offices, which are vacant and available for rent.

What a f**king crook. And to think I was defending him in other posts blaming it all on Bertie. The next tax bill I get I'll give a false address - we'll soon see if Revenue takes such a soft tone with me.

Hagar

Tighten your belts he says.

How does he do this, and God knows what else, on the money we pay him? Is it even possible?

There's little hope left for Ireland with leadership like that.

leitrim lad

and what would you say if it was a venture by 14 ministers to say by this block as a joint venture, and now hard times they may only be able to repay the interest, its not the end of the world.

why not name and shame the banker who organised the deal instead of bringing the country down because the taoiseach has a mortgage, well guess what 2 million more people have morgages aswell. its not against the law for the man to borrow from a bank ,atleast he didnt use the money to buy shares in the bank did he ,

and if you want something to write about , how many hundred million was borrowed to buy the d4 hotels ,and guess what the repayments are not being met by the borrower, nope

the insurance is covering that loan ,why isnt in the paper, o i forgot, the taoiseach has a morgage lets write about that instead that will have a better chance of bankrupting the country wont it

for shame

Dr Galen

the point of the article isn't that he has a mortgage. I'd fully exect him to have one and have absolutely no issue with him having one. At the end of the day he has to deal with banks in a normal manner just like the rest of us.

The issue appears to be the fact that he and his partnership were breaking the terms of the freehold, by sub-letting the apartments to a university.

The freeholder describes that action as “an irredeemable breach of covenant”

also

Bills sent out to the individual lease-holders for ground rent and management fees have not been paid. The most recent claim for management fees sent to Mr Cowen’s address as recorded in the Land Registry was returned, with a note attached saying “Not known at this address”.

they haven't paid their management fee's or ground rent. Bills were sent to the landlords (i.e Cowan and the other partners) and his was returned? Sounds a bit fishy don't it?

gandalf

What is pathetic is that some here do not seem to get the idea of good governance is leading by example. If that is the case then the developers are just following the wonderful example of FF.

If this country does go bankrupt then it is because this current government and the previous one mismanaged the country’s finances in the most cavalier manner possible to the benefit of their sponsors. Not because one of the so called Taoiseach previous mistakes has come back to bite him in the ass.

At the moment with the current government we are morally bankrupt, we might as well add fiscally bankrupt to that as well.

leitrim lad

fair enough tell the media its not against the law to have a morgage,

im sure the problem is in the process of being sorted, ground rent isnt the end of the world

maybe they genuinily couldnt afford it, that could be a nest egg for him and his wife on their retirement,

and who knows maybe he used the office in dublin, as an address and moved offices, and the new office was never registered

it could be as simple as that , i know every time i moved house/office i still found letters going to my previous address for months and even years in some cases.

i predict a genuine mishap, blown out of proportion by the media again

another example of media corruption was that doherty boll1x going on the late late show to run down the senate, the pr1ck couldnt name one member of the senate, let alone what they do

so this is the same in one way, but who cares 1/10 of the irish population is in arrears and biffo is no different,he is still human at the end of the day

Dr Galen

he's the Taoiseach, he has to uphold higher standards than the rest of us

sparklepants

I find the insight into Cowen's personal finances interesting. I think this helps explain why so many cabinet ministers believe that we all benefited greatly from the celtic tiger. It also shows that Cowen's abolishing of the tent at the Galway races was a vain effort to capture the Zeitgeist, and was designed primarily to give an untruthful impression that there was a distance between property developers and himself.

That said, it is disingenuous of the reporter to imply that Cowen had an "interest" in AIB just because his private accounts are there, and the attempt in the article to draw an association with someone from Tipperary with a criminal conviction was clumsy, to say the least.

leitrim lad

sparklepants wrote: »

I find the insight into Cowen's personal finances interesting. I think this helps explain why so many cabinet ministers believe that we all benefited greatly from the celtic tiger. It also shows that Cowen's abolishing of the tent at the Galway races was a vain effort to capture the Zeitgeist, and was designed primarily to give an untruthful impression that there was a distance between property developers and himself.

wrong, the tent was leaking and they couldnt afford a new one



That said, it is disingenuous of the reporter to imply that Cowen had an "interest" in AIB just because his private accounts are there, and the attempt in the article to draw an association with someone from Tipperary with a criminal conviction was clumsy, to say the least.

agree with you on this paragraph, clumsy and inadequet , media should be regulated,along with auctioneers,and solicitors/barristers.

maybe then they might focus on the criminals not our leader,

what do they aim to acheive from this ,the fall of ireland or something wonkers the whole lot of them

Dr Galen

you suggest we should regulate the media? How strongly LL?

gandalf

So the fact that the leader of the country is in breach of a contract and is in arrears with his fees is not of interest to the people at large?

This is the man charged with getting us out of the mess his government led us into to.

If he cannot manage his own public finances and legal commitments properly how can he possibly manage the countries?

leitrim lad

regulate the media and get rid of wafflers like ian o doherty , i never heard of him as did the majority population until he trew his little tantrum on the late late, and it back fired on him in a bad way.

its the media who have made the bigger picture worse with all of their doom and more doom

and its none of my or your business if the taoiseach has fallen on hard times ,at the end of the day the man has a wife and a young family too you know, he not a mutant just because he missed a payment,

give the poor man a break

gandalf

Of course it’s our business that the Taoiseach is unable to take care of his personal finances and commitments. That means he is compromised and could be influenced unduly.

That is a concern especially given the behaviour of other FF members who held the office of Taoiseach.

Dr Galen

he didn't miss a payment. they simply didn't pay their fee's or ground rent.

how could he fallen on hard times, you do know how much he's getting paid don't you?

leitrim lad

yes i do know what he gats paid , but he probably has other debts aswell ,you know

like would it be such a big deal if beverly cooper flynn fell into arrears paying back the bank loan she had to take out to pay rte for slandering her.

Dr Galen

you completely dodging the main point again. It's to be expected though going on your history of posting on this forum.

The fact that the man who is charged with running the countries finances can't sort his own out is a concern. Why can't you at least acknowledge that?

With the Bev Cooper Flynn comment, my suspicions about your motives get stronger and stronger though

BroomBurner

So, LL, we should:

• regulate the media so as not to say nasty anti-government stuff, even if it's true
• sack 2/3 of the public sector without a pay-off or the dole
• let the government away with anything they want to do because they're our "leaders"

I can't wait to hear more!

I think you're living in the wrong country though, you should get in friendly with the leaders of one of those three countries you alluded to in another thread. I'll give you clue, the country you said doesn't actually exist, however, there are is a North and a South.

leitrim lad

we have a north and south 2 you know they are called
munster and ulster

and for the point about his personal finances, i know several people who run the contries biggest operations and employ thousands and there finances personal as in a mess

deadhead13

I am no fan of Cowen, but to even tenuously link this to the banks bailout is really stretching it.