Let the people of Tramore elect Mayor!

Enigm_a

Friday, April 10th, 2009

A pre-election proposal, which would give the people of Tramore a say in electing their Mayor, has been tabled by a local Town Councillor.

The idea, put forward by Independent Council member James McCartan, is that the top five vote-catchers, in order, would get the Mayoralty for the five year Council term, with the other four (there are only nine altogether) and the poll-topper automatically becoming Deputy Mayor for one year each.


Cllr McCartan argues: “That would seem a fair way of selecting the town’s first citizen, instead of the current system involving a pact under which five members retain the post between them”. The five are Fine Gael’s Lola O’Sullivan, Ann Marie Power and current incumbent Raymond Hayden, Labour’s Pat O’Callaghan and Independent Joe Conway.

“My proposal would lead to the Mayor, in effect, being elected democratically by the people, instead of a cosy arrangement which could deprive of the honour the person with most public support”, stated the County Down native, co-opted to the Council four years ago in place of Betty Twomey, who resigned at the time.

Cllr McCartan was putting his proposal to Tuesday night’s monthly meeting of the Town Council, but was not optimistic regarding its chances of adoption. “I know I’ll get a measure of support but some of my colleagues will argue against on the basis that the Council’s current membership shouldn’t make a decision on behalf of the new Council, to be elected on June 5″.

“But in answer to that”, he said, “it’s only before an election that such a decision should be made, so that the electorate know the full significance of their vote casting”.


by Tom Young, Munster Express

I have to say I agree with Cllr. McCartan. Pact`s are unquestionably undemocratic and in my opinion resresent what could only be called a `cosy cartell`. We have seen the fruits of `cosy cartels` at national level (Banks, Developers etc) so are we supposed to automatically accept them
at local level?

Your views please!

scout353

Might be a good proposal but Mr McCartan still won't get the mayoralty which is what he seems to want!

Psychedelic

I don't think it would make any difference one way or the other.

Sully

Psychedelic wrote: »

I don't think it would make any difference one way or the other.

A nice idea but I cant see how it would work. Smacks of desperation also, which I doubt he wants to show (or mean). We have had some excellent majors including Indo. Joe Conway, so its fair(sh) as is.

Stan Nangle

I think it's an excellent idea.

I thought so back in 2004 as well and I wrote to the Candidates suggesting it as an option. It didn't get any traction.

I see two options:

1) First past the post is Mayor for the five years, and effectively becomes an executive Mayor. The deputy Mayor goes in order to the people who came 2nd through 6th in that order, or in reverse order.

2) The Mayoralty goes in order to 1,2,3,4,5, and the Deputy Mayor goes in order to 5,6,7,8,9 (or these orders could be reversed).

The current Pact system is not ideal, especially in Waterford City. It pays very little heed to the democratic wished of the people.

Sully

Do you honestly think it would make a difference Stan? Hasnt nearly everybody been a major at some stage over the last few years?

qork

I don't think Stan has been mayor yet!
Q

Sully

From reading todays Munster Express, it looks like this may not be going ahead as planned. Two candidates are undecided; Lola O'Sullivan and Pat O'Challaghan. The three other candidates who were part of the old council said they still support the idea (Joe Conway, Ann Marie Power, and Blaise Hannigan). Blaise has said he will walk out of the meeting on Monday night if the decession is changed.

scout353

Sully wrote:

From reading todays Munster Express, it looks like this may not be going ahead as planned. Two candidates are undecided; Lola O'Sullivan and Pat O'Challaghan. The three other candidates who were part of the old council said they still support the idea (Joe Conway, Ann Marie Power, and Blaise Hannigan). Blaise has said he will walk out of the meeting on Monday night if the decession is changed.

Blaise does a lot of threatening!!!!

You will see the FG pact in operation - they will probably try and bring in Joe Conway or Paddy O Callaghan to get the numbers!

Gulamugas

I'd say Mr Deasy will tell them what to do. He will want the other 2 FG members to be brought into it and yes I'd say O'Callaghan or Conway, neither of whom really worry about where they get their mayorality once they get one! Or may Cllr"well pet" might get a chance!

Gulamugas

Well it looks like Paddy snaps at the dangling carrot, according to WLR news

Jim_Are_Great

WLR wrote:

The election of Labour Councillor Paddy O'Callagahan as Mayor of Tramore led to two Independent councillors walking out of last nights meeting.

The previous council adopted a motion only last April for the councillors with the biggest first preference vote to be made Mayor.

I am very disappointed, not even slightly surprised, by this. Power, O'Sullivan, O'Callaghan, Raine and Keown should be ashamed.

Anne Marie Power, Lola O'Sullivan and Paddy O'Callaghan all voted in favour of the McCartan system of mayoral selection just a few weeks ago. In fact, that reccommendation was passed without objection. Despite this, they are now perfectly happy to blatantly go back on their word and instate themselves as the powerful. It was fine to increase the democratic legitimacy of the mayoral position last April, but now that there's extra cash, coverage and committee jobs up for grabs, that's of not important.

Not only that, but these people are bafflingly ready to give the two fingers to our town's democratic mandate. The McCartan system is unquestionably fair in ensuring that only those who are most popular become mayor, effectively instating a direct election. By rights, Joe Conway should have been appointed mayor yesterday. Instead, despite the fact that he blew every other candidate out of the water with his poll-topping performance, he will almost certainly not be mayor, or even deputy mayor. Instead, we will have a selection of rag-tag hacks, who really appointed themselves by way of a shady back-room party cartel without any form of mandate, as our first citizens. Included among these is a guy who was eleventh out of fifteen candidates in terms of first preferences.

Also, we just saw Maxine Keown, who was livid in her criticism of Labour as a sellout party in the papers last week, vote for a labour mayor (the very same labour mayor as refused her a nomination). How principled:rolleyes:

Sure, you can say that the appointment of mayor doesn't really make a huge amount of difference to us, and that the position is merely ceremonial. But that's missing the point. Last night my worst suspicions were confirmed - that most of our elected representatives are craven, self-serving hacks, who care more about their own statuses, wallets and jobs-for-the-boys than about what the people of Tramore want. I, personally, am sickened.

Sully

This was the latest article on the matter in the Munster

Just days after the local elections and in a climate rife with political cynicism among the public, two members of Tramore Town Council may be about to renege on a decision taken only in April relating to election of the town’s Mayor.

The Council meets next Monday night to pick a Mayor and poll-topper Joe Conway (Ind) will be elected provided the new Council abides by a recommendation from the outgoing membership.

That recommendation, made unanimously two months ago, is that the people, in effect, would elect the Mayor, with the top five vote-getters serving a year each during the Council’s five-year term. The next four would each be Deputy Mayor for a year, as would the person receiving most first preference votes.

As five of the nine-member Council who made that decision were returned at the weekend, that recommendation will stand, provided all five stick by it.

But there are doubts on the basis of a check made by this newspaper with the five concerned. Joe Conway, Blaize Hannigan and Ann Marie Power said they would do so, but the other two, Lola O’Sullivan and Pat O’Callaghan, are undecided.

The Council’s four Fine Gael members and party activists were meeting on Tuesday night to consider the issue and no doubt Cllr O’Sullivan will have a contribution to make to that debate. But as of Tuesday morning she said she did not know which way she would jump - she hadn’t given it any thought, she maintained.

As for Labour’s Cllr O’Callaghan, he said he had an open mind. He could be “forced” to vote a certain way, depending on the options. Asked if he felt obliged to vote in accordance with the April recommendation, given that he was a party to it, he said no.

Cllr Hannigan went so far as to say that while he would recognise the Mayor irrespective of who was elected, he would walk out of Monday night’s meeting in protest if any of the returned five councillors reneged on the decision taken. “The people’s wishes are paramount and this is the fairest way of electing a Mayor”, he commented.

Cynicism

In fairness to former Independent councillor James McCartan, who failed to get re-elected, he was the one who proposed the new system of electing a Mayor - it was seconded by Cllr Power.

Pacts applied in the past and clearly Cllrs O’Callaghan and O’Sullivan are open to continuing with that method if it suits them.

But some would say that going back on a decision taken only two months ago would serve to feed the cynicism currently rampant among an electorate disillusioned by the behaviour of so many in politics over recent decades.

Source: http://www.munster-express.ie/local-news/tramore-councillors-may-renege-on-mayoral-election-decision/

Jim_Are_Great

Sully wrote: »

Joe Conway, Blaize Hannigan and Ann Marie Power said they would do so...

Cllr O’Sullivan ... hadn’t given it any thought, she maintained.

As for Labour’s Cllr O’Callaghan, he said he had an open mind. He could be “forced” to vote a certain way, depending on the options. Asked if he felt obliged to vote in accordance with the April recommendation, given that he was a party to it, he said no...

In fairness to former Independent councillor James McCartan, who failed to get re-elected, he was the one who proposed the new system of electing a Mayor - it was seconded by Cllr Power.

FFS! I genuinely cannot believe the cheek of these people. I hope the text of what was said in the meeting by way of justification is made available.

Sully

Jim_Are_Great wrote: »

FFS! I genuinely cannot believe the cheek of these people. I hope the text of what was said in the meeting by way of justification is made available.

There usually up on the Council website but iv noticed aspects of meetings iv been at not recorded. Something like this I would assume is.

Also, I was told Blaise and Pat both walked out as a result of this. Man of his word and fair play to the lads for doing so imo.

Gulamugas

Jim_Are_Great wrote: »

FFS! I genuinely cannot believe the cheek of these people. I hope the text of what was said in the meeting by way of justification is made available.

Just read Anne Maries speech in the Munster Express (page 13). Wow....it is probably the worst effort at defending a decision I have ever come across. Does she take us all for fools. You have to read it.

In it she says she is not going back on anything previously agreed and that what she agreed to was to let Mc Cartans Principle be put before the copuncil for discussion, but the 2001 local Government Act which " supercedes any resolution to alter or move against the decree of the Act" does not allow for such a " directly elected mayor" scenario and therefore she and the FineGael party are not going to " foist a non statutory sentiment on anyone here present"

" In other words, we most certainly cannot introduce a law which is putative and we would believe that it would be fallacious of this council to predicate our deliberations on a presumption"

It goes on and on and is real Oh My God stuff!

I am still stuck for words

James Mccartan

Waterford city had an agreement within the pack who ever topped the poll would be elected Mayor.
All that was required from Tramore Town Council was that the person that topped the poll be elected Mayor and that would be legal under the local Government act 2001.
Any thing else said is only an effort to get all out power for one party and to hell with the people.AND BEFORE ANY ONE JUMPS ON MY BACK I KNOW I WAS REJECTED ON JUNE 5th.

Jim_Are_Great

It's a shame, James. I thought your proposal really was a good one, and I'm furious that some of the councillors have reneged on it.

I saw Ann Marie's speech in the Munster too. It was horrific. It doesn't even make any sense. When you boil off all the jargon, it basically says "Yeah, we promised to do it this way, but you can't make us, so HAH!" The nerve. These people should lose their jobs as councillors. If there was some way to call for a re-election of a town council, I would be the first to sign.

Gulamugas

Jim_Are_Great wrote: »

It's a shame, James. I thought your proposal really was a good one, and I'm furious that some of the councillors have reneged on it.

I saw Ann Marie's speech in the Munster too. It was horrific. It doesn't even make any sense. When you boil off all the jargon, it basically says "Yeah, we promised to do it this way, but you can't make us, so HAH!" The nerve. These people should lose their jobs as councillors. If there was some way to call for a re-election of a town council, I would be the first to sign.

Have to agree. Horrific is the word. If it was me who dleivered such speech i'd go into hiding for a week to avoid any embarrassing moments. Do you think Mr Deasy's finger prints were all over it?

Jim_Are_Great

Gulamugas wrote: »

Do you think Mr Deasy's finger prints were all over it?

Ah, without question. Don't know if any of the councillors in the pact would have the wit/articulacy to put together that dross. Nasty bit of work by Deasy, I must say. I wonder what's behind it? He's smart enough to know that this will make those Fine Gael concillors unpopular, so what's the reasoning behind it?

Gulamugas

Jim_Are_Great wrote: »

Ah, without question. Don't know if any of the councillors in the pact would have the wit/articulacy to put together that dross. Nasty bit of work by Deasy, I must say. I wonder what's behind it? He's smart enough to know that this will make those Fine Gael concillors unpopular, so what's the reasoning behind it?

When did he ever have any reasoning for anything he has done. This is about POWER and you can bet your bottom dollar that a deal was'nt done with Conway cause Deasy wouldn't like him to be getting any higher a profile than he already has. Dail seat and all that!!

Jim_Are_Great

You maight be right about Conway there, Gulamugas. What I want to know is can something be done about this? Some way of people officially registering their displeasure? Everyone I talk to is p1ssed off about this, and I don't think we should be expected to lie down and take a blatant hoodwinking like this. I'm thinking an open letter would be a good one. Something. Anything to show these people that we are not the eejits they seem to take us for.

James Mccartan

Jim_Are_Great wrote: »

You maight be right about Conway there, Gulamugas. What I want to know is can something be done about this? Some way of people officially registering their displeasure? Everyone I talk to is p1ssed off about this, and I don't think we should be expected to lie down and take a blatant hoodwinking like this. I'm thinking an open letter would be a good one. Something. Anything to show these people that we are not the eejits they seem to take us for.

We could take to the streets then you would find out who is pissed off bet it would be like election day all would go into hiding.
Every one is backing you onto you try to do some thing and then there is no one to be found.
I found this out the hard way.

Gulamugas

Well legally there is nothing can be done. Open letter yeah, an email campaign, debate on deise am but it would probably be like water off a duck!
That response was an insult and 2 fingers to every citizen in Tramore

Gulamugas

Just re reading the speech, what about this
" we cannot now retrospectively change the mandate bestowed on us by the people. That would be a very dangerous thing to do. We cannot change the will of the people because we would be tampering with the democratic process and that would have been unthinkable and illegal. To attempt to impose a non binding motion on the members of this council demonstrates complicity with egotistical prevarications hostile to the will of the people. "

Now that should go up there with Robert emmets " let no man dare when I am dead........"

Jim_Are_Great

Just for anyone who might be interested - I found out this morning that there's a petition doing the rounds in a few local businesses, just registering disapproval of the whole thing. I just signed it myself in that Red Lane on Main Street.

Gulamugas

Did you check it for fingerprints? bet ya might fine 2 ex FF ers prints on it, anyway its a good idea might raise the thing again in the media

Jim_Are_Great

I'd say that's the idea alright. There are a fair few signatures there already, but I'd still urge everyone to get out and sign it, or at least spread the word around. There's one in Colm Morrisey's also. If anything is obvious from the past week, it's that our local politicians need a big kick up the arse. A huge number of signatures on this might just do the trick.

shabouwcaw

ive made an online petition that i am waiting to be activated. I think its easier than finding the loose slips of paper that are floating about the hairdressers of tramore atm.


ill post the link once the application comes through.

Sully

‘Breach of faith’ as pact elects Mayor Pat
Friday, June 19th, 2009

by Tom Young
Pat OCallaghan

Pat OCallaghan

The election by Tramore Town Council on Monday night of Pat O’Callaghan (Labour) as Mayor was facilitated by three members backtracking on a decision of the Council made only two months ago.

Two councillors walked out of the annual meeting in protest as the new Mayor himself, along with Fine Gael’s Ann Marie Power and Lola O’Sullivan, set aside an April decision favouring election of the First Citizen by the people, as reflected in local election voting. That meeting decided unanimously to recommend to the incoming Council a system whereby, through its five year term, the top five vote-getters would each be honoured with the Mayoralty.

But after poll-topper Joe Conway, in accordance with that recommendation, was proposed and seconded by fellow Independents Blaise Hannigan and Pat Finnerty, Fine Gael’s Ann Marie Power and Lola O’Sullivan proposed and seconded Cllr O’Callaghan. And a pact between Cllr O’Callaghan and Fine Gael’s four members ensured that he got the post by five votes to four, with Joe O’Shea (FF) supporting Cllr Conway.

Furthermore, it can now be safely assumed that the Fine Gael councillors - Power, O’Sullivan, Maxine Keoghan and 19-year-old Tom Raine - will share the Mayoralty between them through the next four years. They will also no doubt dominate the position of Deputy Mayor, starting with Cllr O’Sullivan who was elected on the proposition of Cllr Power, seconded by Cllr Raine.

Cllr Hannigan left the meeting, as he said beforehand he would do if the April recommendation wasn’t implemented. “To my mind this is undemocratic and a total joke”, he said of the about-turn by Cllrs O’Callaghan, Power and O’Sullivan. “You have let Tramore and its people down by ignoring their wishes”, he accused. Standing up to go, he assured the new Mayor however that he would “recognise” him at future meetings.

Later on, Cllr Finnerty also left the room, protesting that those involved in the pact were flying in the face of the electorate who, he maintained, were fully aware of the McCartan Principles when they cast their votes on June 5 (it was ousted Independent councillor James McCartan who made the April proposal, which was seconded by Ann Marie Power).

He challenged the Mayor, who has twice previously held the position, and Cllrs Power and O’Sullivan, who are also County Council members, as to whether they were about to involve themselves in a pact within that body too “and leave East Waterford with a lesser share of resources” (compared to the West).

Cllr Conway said he was more disappointed by the breach of faith on the part of some councillors with the people of the town than by any personal considerations. He wished the Mayor well for the coming year.

Regarding the controversy over the method of electing the Mayor he remarked that given a choice between being the darling of a political party and reviled by the people, or vice versa, he knew which would be his preference.

Before proposing Cllr O’Callaghan, Cllr Power said she and her Fine Gael colleagues had considered the April recommendation but having fleshed out “the statutory variables germane to the election of the new Mayor” it was decided, as that was simply a recommendation and not legally binding, to proceed as they were doing. While the April decision was made in good faith, she considered it would be unfair to tie the hands of the new Council, with all its first-time members.

She said she had no doubt the resort would benefit from Cllr O’Callaghan’s term as Mayor. He was a perfect gentleman who had the wisdom of experience which he would utilise for Tramore’s betterment.

The new Mayor spoke of the need to push the town forward, particularly in terms of tourism and job-creating business generally. But he felt it was indicative of neglect on the part of the County Council that at a time when that body was advocating water conservation, four major leaks in the town’s supply system had not been repaired long after they were first reported. He also called for footpath improvements along the route of one of his pet projects, Sli na Slainte.

Other appointments





The Mayor, a regular Town Council representative on the Association of Municipal Authorities of Ireland, was elected again to that post along with Maxine Keoghan. That was after Cllr Conway, who announced that he would attend the association’s meetings at his own expense, pinpointed the need to select people who would report back from what was a vital organ of local democracy, particularly as the Council’s participation would cost about €20,000 in expenses over its five-year term. Cllr Raine is to attend some of the association’s meetings also, as a learning experience.

The Mayor and Cllr Raine are to represent the Town Council on the County Council’s Area Committee, while Cllr Raine is also to be the Council’s representative on the County Development Board.

Cllrs Raine, Keoghan, Hannigan and O’Shea were appointed to the County Council’s four SPCs - Culture and Heritage, Environment and Planning, Housing, Corporate Affairs and Emergency Services and Tranpsport and Infrastructure, respectively.

Source: http://www.munster-express.ie/local-news/%E2%80%98breach-of-faith-as-pact-elects-mayor-pat/

Also getting reports that one of the independent candidates is trying to form a pact with Finna Fail and Sinn Fein today. Sketchy report mind. Joe has an article talking about pacts in the Munster Weekender from what I spotted in the shop today.

James Mccartan

Dont forget to sign the petition that is in many shops around the town, hundreds of signatures already collected.