Xbox 360 and Tesco customer service

Flaccus

Mate bought a 360 over a year ago from Tesco in Limerick. After 6 months, it got the RROD. Tescos advised mate to send off to MS for repair as they said it would be quicker than them handling it, which he did. Interestingly he saw these customer interaction sheets they use when you bring a console back. For example, on the 360 it was 1. tell customer MS is responsible. 2. tell customer MS will repair quicker. 3. tell customer no stock in shop etc.. Basically anything to get out of sorting it themselves. Same for DS,Wii,PS3 etc.. Anyway, he got it repaired by MS, and the other day it went again..same RROD, same exact fault.

It's now over a year old and Tescos want him to send it off for repair again which he doesn't want to do. He brought all the relevant information with him..original receipt, printout of trouble tickets with MS, printouts from National Consumer Agency, pointing out the 1st repair wasn't permanent and he want's a replacement or money back which he is entitled to by law, printouts of Sale of Goods Act and Statute of Limitations, to which he pointed out the goods were not fit for purposes intended, and should last a reasonable period of time which just over a year isn't reasonable.

Tesco fobbed him off saying they had to ring their supplier 1st to organise a replacement. Never happened. Then they said they had to ring MS for a repair even though his contract is with Tesco them and not MS, and again he pointed out he doesn't want a repair as the 1st repair was not permanent. They even lied about replacement stock being available. Basically they shut him down at every turn and got pure ignorant with him. In the end they told him he has to send it off for repair. Now he is contacting the NCA to investigate and thinks he will probably take tTesco to the Small Claims Court.

Anyone have similar experience with Tesco's ? It sounds to me like they are fobbing off any responsibility they have and are simply breaking the law, assuming the fault on my mates 360 is the exact same one which was repaired last year (which I have no reason to doubt).

Nody

First of all it is very unlikely he got a repair from MS; most likely he got a replacement (refurb).

Secondly Tesco would never replace it directly with a new one; they would send it to MS and get a refurb back. Same result if your mate dealt directly with MS.

Third and final, it is repair, refund OR replacement at the sellers discretion; hence they can replace it with a refurb and meet the criteria. Your mate can hand it in to Tesco but he will have to wait for the replacement to return from MS to Tesco before he gets it back; Tesco is not under obligation to hand over a new unit on the spot.

Flaccus

Sorry mate, it was a repair. Not a refurb he got back. That's the crux of the problem.

1. He doesn't want another repair, as the last one was not permanent. He wants a replacement now, whether it's a refurb or a brand new 360 he doesn't care. As the 1st repair was not permanent he is now entitled to a replacment (whether it be refurb or new) or refund.

2. Tescos are refusing to deal with him. It doesn't matter if sending it off to MS is quicker. His contract is with Tesco's not with MS. So legally Tescos are obliged to deal with him and organise a replacement or refund. However, as I said they won't deal with him. As of this morning they claim it's not their policy to return 360's to MS. He also spoke to MS this morning and they could not guarantee they would not just repair it again, which he doesn't want.
http://www.consumerconnect.ie/eng/Hot_Topics/FAQs/Faulty-goods/

3. He was just off the phone with the NCA who concur, and advise he write a letter of complaint to the Tesco branch in question advising them that they have 4 to 6 working days to organise a replacment or refund or small claims court action will be taken.

The bottom line is, if Tesco took responsibility and didn't have such a cheeky attitude, they could have returned it to MS requesting a replacment/refurb. They didn't. Instead they were ignorant.

Cabaal

Flaccus wrote: »

Sorry mate, it was a repair. Not a refurb he got back. That's the crux of the problem.

1. He doesn't want another repair, as the last one was not permanent. He wants a replacement now, whether it's a refurb or a brand new 360 he doesn't care. As the 1st repair was not permanent he is now entitled to a replacment (whether it be refurb or new) or refund.

Does not matter what he wants, its not upto him...the law states repair, replace or refund

cotwold

Flaccus wrote: »

Sorry mate, it was a repair. Not a refurb he got back. That's the crux of the problem.

1. He doesn't want another repair, as the last one was not permanent. He wants a replacement now, whether it's a refurb or a brand new 360 he doesn't care. As the 1st repair was not permanent he is now entitled to a replacment (whether it be refurb or new) or refund.

They cant repair a rrod hard drive, they replaced it repairing the problem, refurbing the console. Regardless of the terminology they're both the same thing. You're friend cant demand a new one, i recomend he just sends it off to MS again if he wants it fixed quicked, its sh*t what Tesco are doing but if you want it fixed quick i wouldnt bother fighting them. If you really want to pursue Tesco get your friend to send a letter to your local newspaper detailing his experience with their bad customer service ect, its the only way you'll get theyre attention

mickoneill30

Firstly, the original repair did fix the console. For over 6 months.
Microsoft extended THEIR warranty and said THEY'LL repair / replace any console up to 3 years from the RROD.
Warranty and stutory rights are different. Under statutory rights I'm pretty sure you can demand that Tesco replace / repair / refund the console (they decide which of those three to do). What they would do is take back the console, contact Microsoft and go through the procedure with them. It'd add about a week to the console getting fixed and it's a pain in the ass for Tesco.

So it is your mates right to give Tesco a pain in the ass but in the end he's only going to get a replacment or repair and a delay but if I'm wrong here let me know what the NCA say.

Flaccus

Cabaal wrote: »

Does not matter what he wants, its not upto him...the law states repair, replace or refund

WRONG!! the law says if the repair isn't permanent, then he is entitled to a replacement or refund. His original 360 was repaired.

http://www.consumerconnect.ie/eng/Hot_Topics/FAQs/Faulty-goods/
"However, if a repair is offered and accepted, then it should be permanent. If not, and the same fault occurs again, then the buyer is entitled to seek another form of redress from the list."

Flaccus

mickoneill30 wrote: »

Firstly, the original repair did fix the console. For over 6 months.
Microsoft extended THEIR warranty and said THEY'LL repair / replace any console up to 3 years from the RROD.
Warranty and stutory rights are different. Under statutory rights I'm pretty sure you can demand that Tesco replace / repair / refund the console (they decide which of those three to do). What they would do is take back the console, contact Microsoft and go through the procedure with them. It'd add about a week to the console getting fixed and it's a pain in the ass for Tesco.

So it is your mates right to give Tesco a pain in the ass but in the end he's only going to get a replacment or repair and a delay but if I'm wrong here let me know what the NCA say.

The NCA took his side. The repair wasn't permanent. Doesn't matter it was fixed for over 6 months. The same fault has reoccured. So he is entitled to another form of redress. The NCA agree.

mickoneill30

Flaccus wrote: »

WRONG!! the law says if the repair isn't permanent, then he is entitled to a replacement or refund. His original 360 was repaired.

So permanent means forever in that context does it? Great. I'll be on to various shops in 10 years when my items eventually clap out. I'm pretty sure after 6 months they'd assume the repair did it's job.

Edit: Just saw the post above. Bleedin hell, that's great. I've had stuff repaired under warranty before. That seems to mean I now have an infinite warranty if the same problems ever occur again. Grand.

penexpers

Flaccus wrote: »

WRONG!! the law says if the repair isn't permanent, then he is entitled to a replacement or refund. His original 360 was repaired.

http://www.consumerconnect.ie/eng/Hot_Topics/FAQs/Faulty-goods/
"However, if a repair is offered and accepted, then it should be permanent. If not, and the same fault occurs again, then the buyer is entitled to seek another form of redress from the list."

Highlighted the important word for you there.

In any case, I wouldn't trust any advice from the NCA.

Elessar

Flaccus you are correct in that the repair must be permanent, if it occurs again within a reasonable time you are entitled to seek an alternative (replacement or refund).

Write a letter to Tesco management stating the case and quote what you did to the store, tell them to get back to you ASAP or you are going to the small claims court. If you don't get a reply, go straight to court. It is the only thing these clown retailers will listen to.

Kensington

Flaccus wrote: »

Sorry mate, it was a repair. Not a refurb he got back. That's the crux of the problem.

1. He doesn't want another repair, as the last one was not permanent. He wants a replacement now, whether it's a refurb or a brand new 360 he doesn't care. As the 1st repair was not permanent he is now entitled to a replacment (whether it be refurb or new) or refund.

2. Tescos are refusing to deal with him. It doesn't matter if sending it off to MS is quicker. His contract is with Tesco's not with MS. So legally Tescos are obliged to deal with him and organise a replacement or refund. However, as I said they won't deal with him. As of this morning they claim it's not their policy to return 360's to MS. He also spoke to MS this morning and they could not guarantee they would not just repair it again, which he doesn't want.
http://www.consumerconnect.ie/eng/Hot_Topics/FAQs/Faulty-goods/

3. He was just off the phone with the NCA who concur, and advise he write a letter of complaint to the Tesco branch in question advising them that they have 4 to 6 working days to organise a replacment or refund or small claims court action will be taken.

The bottom line is, if Tesco took responsibility and didn't have such a cheeky attitude, they could have returned it to MS requesting a replacment/refurb. They didn't. Instead they were ignorant.

How can you be sure that it wasn't a replacement MS sent back out to him? They may well have replaced it with a refurb, in fact, I'd nearly put money on it that they did since this is generally the standard procedure with cases of RROD.

1. He may want a replacement, but it's quite likely he's already had a replacement unit from the last dealings with MS. Anyway, at the end of the day, it's going to involve going through Microsoft, be that dealing directly with MS yourselves, or insisting Tesco do it (longer). You are not going to get an instant replacement.

2. LEGALLY Tesco may be required to deal with it, but it's generally far quicker if you just deal direct with MS. How long has the console been out of action for now? Before Easter I assume? Do you know that if you go the SCC route, it can take up to 30 days?

3. You can go on what the NCC are telling you, but it's going to take far longer - and what's to say another 6 months down the line the console won't RROD again?

Finally, the attitude of a retailer usually reflects that of the customer they are dealing with...

Flaccus

Elessar wrote: »

Flaccus you are correct in that the repair must be permanent, if it occurs again within a reasonable time you are entitled to seek an alternative (replacement or refund).

Write a letter to Tesco management stating the case and quote what you did to the store, tell them to get back to you ASAP or you are going to the small claims court. If you don't get a reply, go straight to court. It is the only thing these clown retailers will listen to.

That's exactly what my mate did. Just back from post office with him. Sent a registered letter. Thanks.

Flaccus

Kensington wrote: »

How can you be sure that it wasn't a replacement MS sent back out to him? They may well have replaced it with a refurb, in fact, I'd nearly put money on it that they did since this is generally the standard procedure with cases of RROD.

1. He may want a replacement, but it's quite likely he's already had a replacement unit from the last dealings with MS. Anyway, at the end of the day, it's going to involve going through Microsoft, be that dealing directly with MS yourselves, or insisting Tesco do it (longer). You are not going to get an instant replacement.

2. LEGALLY Tesco may be required to deal with it, but it's generally far quicker if you just deal direct with MS. How long has the console been out of action for now? Before Easter I assume? Do you know that if you go the SCC route, it can take up to 30 days?

3. You can go on what the NCC are telling you, but it's going to take far longer - and what's to say another 6 months down the line the console won't RROD again?

Finally, the attitude of a retailer usually reflects that of the customer they are dealing with...

MS told him they repaired it not replaced it. The console is out of action less than a week. The repair they made isn't permanent, so he is entitled to a replacement or refund. Tescos offered neither. NCA agree. Letter of complaint sent to Tescos hardware manager.

As for your comment about the attitude of the retailer reflects that of the customer. Where did you gleam this bit of knowledge from ? I already explained Tesco said it's their store policy not to send 360's back to MS. This is in clear violation of the law. They also gave him various other excuses - 1. have to speak to their supplier first. 2. have to ring MS. 3. no replacement 360's in stock. All my mate wants is a replacement 360 - whether new or a refurb. He doesn't want another repair and have to deal with the situation again in 6 months. Tescos were rude and outright refused to send it back for him. My friend was polite the whole time. As for it taking longer for the shop to do it. That's besides the point. He has already gone out and bought a new 360 arcade. He still wants the original 360 replaced, and want's Tesco to honour the law and not hind behind their store policy. It's now a matter of principle. I do realise the SCC takes longer. Have been 3 times myself.

Flaccus

penexpers wrote: »

Highlighted the important word for you there.

In any case, I wouldn't trust any advice from the NCA.

Mate...that is just paraphrasing the sale of goods act. Generally you are entitled to a replacement or refund in the event the repair is not permanent. I don't know why there is so much negativity about this. Do you work for Tesco or have something against the NCA ?

Flaccus

mickoneill30 wrote: »

So permanent means forever in that context does it? Great. I'll be on to various shops in 10 years when my items eventually clap out. I'm pretty sure after 6 months they'd assume the repair did it's job.

Edit: Just saw the post above. Bleedin hell, that's great. I've had stuff repaired under warranty before. That seems to mean I now have an infinite warranty if the same problems ever occur again. Grand.

The statute of limitations runs out after 6 years usually, and within that time period a judge will decide on what a reasonable period of time the goods should last. So while a mobile phone might be a year, a console is most likely longer. There are also other factors to consider, such as whether the goods develop a fault within the 1st 3 months, during which time the contract is deemed to have not been concluded so refund is possible in some circumstances, if the goods are in non conformance after 3 months and within the 1st year in which case they are deemed to be in non conformance from day 1 and must be repaired or replaced, or after the 1st year if there is a defect and if you can prove it, or after 2 years, where there is no defect but you can proove the goods should have lasted longer than they did etc.. So no, you don't have an infinite warranty. Each case is treated on it's own merits and sale of goods act is just a general guideline.


In general - The problem in my friends situation is Tescos did not acknowledge their obligation to return the 360 to MS in either instance. And now that his repaired 360 is no longer working, he requires a replacement (refurb or otherwise) as the repair was not permanent. For that to happen he could of course return it to MS himself and hope they send him a refurb. But he wanted Tescos to do it, as they should have in the 1st instance. If they had agreed to that then fair enough. But the sheer audacity and ignorance of the Tesco staff saying it has nothing to do with them in the end, has forced him to push the point home to them. The point of this thread was to ask people if they had similar experiences with Tesco's customer service. Not to engage in the finer points of the sale of goods act and whether my friend is in the right or wrong.

Elessar

What else did you go to the SCC for? How was the experience, and what were the results?

Flaccus

Washing machine - pump went just after 1 year. Shop's reaction was to try and sell me a new washing machine, and while they were at it, not take the old one back as they said it wasn't covered by the recycling fund (machine was bought by builder for new house/prefitted kitchen). Manufacturer would repair but wanted to charge labour. Took about 6 weeks to get to SCC. Noone showed up except me. Decided in my favour. Washing machine repaired for free.

LCD TV - broke down within warranty. shop sent back for repair. 2 months later and still no repair. then told repair centre had it and told to deal with them. repair centre couldn't find it. blamed shop. Took SCC proceedings. Shop settled before going to court. Got new TV.

Laptop - logic board went 6 months out of warranty. shop would not deal with it. manufacturer wanted 460 euro for new board. took shop to SCC. ruled in my favour as judge deemed a 2k euro laptop should last more than 1.5 years. Laptop replaced. 8 weeks wait for SCC. Shop had legal representation who did not challenge. Basically just showed up.

Fridge - ice maker / taps broke after 6 months. 3 months waiting for repair. Shop refused to deal with me. Repair done by manufacturer's repair agent. same problem occured 6 months later. Shop would not deal with me. Took shop to SCC, as consumer still has recourse to seller even if manufacturer made attempt at repair. And last repair took an unreaasonable period of time. Fridge was replaced as repair was not permanent and shop misrepresented the facts during court proceedings. Was also able to show evidence of known fault with that particular model.

Blazer

Nice to see someone winning over those fcukers.
Too many times people aren't bothered and just buy a new one.
Those days are gone now.

EKRIUQ

Flaccus wrote: »

That's exactly what my mate did. Just back from post office with him. Sent a registered letter. Thanks.

I don't think it's your mate, I think it's you.

You seem to be awful unlucky with electrical items:rolleyes:

Flaccus

considering the amount of items I buy, I think 4 in the last couple of years is a small percentage. and no, it's not my 360 that the problem is with.

you can think whatever you want though :rolleyes:

wmpdd3

This problem has been happening with 360s for ages surely some one has gone to the small claims court with one.

What was the out come?

Would the fact the store is in effect offering a 3 year warranty for the items go against the OP? ( OK so you have to deal with MS direct)

If every person who bought 1 is looking for th atore to replace their unit after a year, nobody would be left selling them. Always found MS easy to deal with.

If the store does replace this with one from stock it's pure loss as they will not be able to return it for credit, this means you would probably have to go straight to Customer service with the complaint.

In reference to the customer interaction notes the OP saw they must be something somebody in that store made up in relation to customers with a unit more than 1 year old as they are not the current instructions.

Flaccus

wmpdd3 wrote: »

If every person who bought 1 is looking for the store to replace their unit after a year, nobody would be left selling them. Always found MS easy to deal with.

If every person who bought 1 is looking for th atore to replace their unit after a year, nobody would be left selling them. Always found MS easy to deal with.

If the store does replace this with one from stock it's pure loss as they will not be able to return it for credit, this means you would probably have to go straight to Customer service with the complaint.

In reference to the customer interaction notes the OP saw they must be something somebody in that store made up in relation to customers with a unit more than 1 year old as they are not the current instructions.

Not the point. And irrelevant and not the consumers problem. And I never said he wanted a brand new unit. He would have settled for a refurb/replacement from MS if Tesco had returned it to MS as they are legally obliged to. And the reason my friend wanted them to replace the unit was because dealing directly last time (over pressure from Tesco) got him a repair from MS which failed. MS have acknowledged it was a repair. After this repair failed only a week ago, he wanted to make sure he got some sort of replacement and felt that the way to go about it was to go back to the original seller which he is legally entitled to do (depsite dealing with MS the 1st time the unit went faulty he legally still reserves this right).

But how many times do I have to make the point that the store was offering NOTHING and the staff were ignorant. They kept repeating the mantra that it's not their policy and he has to contact MS. As regards the notes, that is what they were reading off, current policy or not. His contract is with Tesco not MS. His 360's 1st repair should have been permanent and was not. The 360 should be expected to last more than a year and a bit, and did not. This was all pointed out as mannerly as possible. If they had shown the slightest bit of interest this issue would not have escalated as it has. Instead they spouted their mantra, their excuses, various stall tactics and downright lies. Now, a registered letter asking for a resolution to this issue or else SCC proceedings will take place, has been sent to them on the advice of the NCA.

Incidentally, the original 360 he bought a year or so ago had a manufacuring date of late 06 or 07 I believe. So was pretty old stock to begin with.

Kensington

Flaccus wrote: »

Incidentally, the original 360 he bought a year or so ago had a manufacuring date of late 06 or 07 I believe. So was pretty old stock to begin with.

Stock can sit in shops for a number of months before someone buys it. A lot of the time they're bought in bulk so do end up sitting in a warehouse for some time.

Which makes it all the more odd they chose to repair your friends console. There's reports on the net that from late 2007, the internal design of the Xbox system was slightly changed (more heatsinks, better cooling, board layout changed to seperate components that run hot) to prevent the issues that cause RROD so if your console is replaced with a post-07 batch unit, hopefully you won't get RROD again.

BTW. A refurb console isn't really any different to a repair. A refurb is another unit which was returned to MS as faulty - MS then repair it to "as new" condition and dispatch this as a refurbished unit. If they choose to replace your friends console, then in all likelihood, that'll end up back in MS as a refurb'd unit which they'll send out to someone else...

And the guys in Tesco whom you were dealing with are only going on instructions over which they've no say. No matter where you buy the XBox console, you'd run into the same situation, as MS insist warranty repairs are dealt with directly with them (despite the law saying you're entitled to otherwise).

foggy_lad

And the guys in Tesco whom you were dealing with are only going on instructions over which they've no say. No matter where you buy the XBox console, you'd run into the same situation, as MS insist warranty repairs are dealt with directly with them (despite the law saying you're entitled to otherwise).

so who is more right then microsoft or the law? the law is very clear on consumers having the right to deal exclusively with the seller so what microsoft or any other manufacturer says in their policies holds no weight. and well done to the op's mate on taking a stance against this kind of watering down of our consumer rights.

Flaccus

I agree foggy. Too many people accepting a stores policy.

Kensington - there was still no reason for the 2 people in the store my friend dealt with, to act pure ignorant and thick, no matter what guidelines they were going by. And MS can insist till the cows come home that MS deal with the consumer and not the store. They are perfectly in their rights to make policy on how their repairs are handled but they don't make the law as Foggy Lad pointed out are not within their rights to insist you don't deal with the seller. It was clear on Tescos printout that employees are asked to encourage the consumer to go to MS with their console (as they obviously don't want to have anything to do with it going by their attitude). Some other stores do the same, but will take care of sending it back to MS if the customer chooses. In fact some stores like Smyths in my experience will hand out a new 360 on the spot if under a year old (even though there is no legal requirment for them to do so). Some Gamestops are the same. And some will just send it back for you. Tescos was the 1st store that said it wasn't their policy to deal with warranty on 360's. I say balls to that. So your statement "No matter where you buy the XBox console, you'd run into the same situation" is not true 100% of the time.

The crux of the matter is Tesco didn't give him the option of returning it through them. And I agree, it can take longer and usually does if you go through the seller. But as my friend was so put off by their nonchalant attitude he decided to do something about it. In light of the number of successful claims I have made and other mates of mine have made and won, I fully support him and believe him to be 100% right in this matter. I also do appreciate what people are saying about refurbs just being a repaired console, so he will end up with a repair anyway. It's just my mate didn't want the same console repaired for the 2nd time (MS said it was a repair not a refurb the 1st time) as he was worried about the issue repeating. He wants a replacement, even if it's a refurb, it's still a replacment and not a repair of the same console. And he will take his chances from there. Surely this isn't so hard to appreciate.

We will now wait and see if Tescos play ball and offer to have it sent back to MS or not. Or if they decide to do nothing, we will then let the SCC make a decision.

wmpdd3

In a years time if this replacement fails will you go back to the retailer?

jahalpin

I don't know why you and your friend are so against dealing directly with Microsoft to get the unit repaired again.

As other posters have pointed out it would be far quicker to deal with Microsoft directly (Tesco probably didn't buy directly from Microsoft, so they would have to send the faulty console to their supplier who would then send it to Microsoft for repair).

With all the time that you have wasted talking to Tesco, you could probably have gotten your console repaired by Microsoft.

One of the major reasons the XBOX etc are cheaper in Tesco is that they don't provide after-sales support, instead relying on the manufacturer to provide this. If they were to provide full after-sales support they would have to increase the prices to cover the increased costs.

If there was no free repair service avaliable to the OP I would understand them causing hastle for Tesco, however, Microsoft support services are excellent and are avaliable to the OP.

It is the attitude of people like the OP that are the reason why shops have to charge more here than in the UK

Flaccus

God damn it jahajpin...will you read my flaming posts :mad: I already explained it's a matter of principle which is why he is taking the action he is. I already explained he did deal with MS the 1st time at Tesco's insistance and got back a repaired console which failed. I already explained he is now legally entitled to a replacement (be it a refurb) and wanted Tesco to take care of it which they are legally obliged to do. I already explained they washed their hands of it, quite ignorantly. And I already explained time/speed of repair is not the issue for him, as he bought a new console anyway. Tesco are breaking the law. Simple as that. Incidentally he only spent 2 days talking to Tesco so wouldn't have had a console repaired by MS during that time.

"One of the major reasons the XBOX etc are cheaper in Tesco is that they don't provide after-sales support, instead relying on the manufacturer to provide this. If they were to provide full after-sales support they would have to increase the prices to cover the increased costs.
It is the attitude of people like the OP that are the reason why shops have to charge more here than in the UK"

What a load of crap. I don't give a damn about why 360's are cheaper than Tesco or where Tesco bought them from. They cannot legally not provide after sales support. And I already explained above my reasons why he wanted them to send it back. You obviously work for Tesco or have no clue how the law works. And don't get personal about attitudes. My friend was completely polite with them at all stages. They were thick and ignorant at all stages. And it's because of these attitudes, why sometimes Irish people don't follow up on their rights as they feel intimidated by so called "store policy". This has nothing to do with why prices are dearer in the UK as you seem to suggest. What nonsense. Now stop spouting sh*te. :mad:

foggy_lad

One of the major reasons the XBOX etc are cheaper in Tesco is that they don't provide after-sales support, instead relying on the manufacturer to provide this.

this is rubbish!

tesco are legally obliged to provide after sales care for every product they sell!

Quint

Good man Flaccus, Tesco are only interested in selling and aren't interested in after sales support.
Every time I see or hear a tesco ad with their slogan "Every little helps" I'll think of their store policy and laugh!