Dolan's comments on the Bundesliga

Neil3030

I didn't watch the Barcelona Bayern Munich game last night but flicking onto Setanta during half-time I heard Dolan commenting on how the future looks extremely bright for the German League. Does anyone agree with this? I can't say I watch all that much from the Bundesliga, but Dolan cited Germany's relative economic stability and young football enthused population as support, which seems to make sense. The prices English clubs are valued at are surely going to send investors elsewhere eventually. Anyone reckon there'll be a German CL winner in the next 5-10 years though even?

Aidric

Who values Dolan's opinions?

Mitch Connor

Financially, the German clubs are a lot stronger than most sides around Europe, as there are strict financial controls on the entire league structure, so teams can't put themselves in debt pushing for success, as we have seen in england, and there is no chance (i think) of a Glazer style take-over which heaps massive debt on to a club.

If the economic downturn hits european football hard, I would say the german clubs are best placed to deal with it.

joe123

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Financially, the German clubs are a lot stronger than most sides around Europe, as there are strict financial controls on the entire league structure, so teams can't put themselves in debt pushing for success, as we have seen in england, and there is no chance (i think) of a Glazer style take-over which heaps massive debt on to a club.

If the economic downturn hits european football hard, I would say the german clubs are best placed to deal with it.

Werent Borrusia Dortmund facing closure only a few years back or something?

That_Guy

Aidric wrote: »

Who values Dolan's opinions?

Enough said.

Mr. Presentable

Aidric wrote: »

Who values Dolan's opinions?

Well, he does get paid for it... Do you?

If you look at the top German clubs you will see they are financially robust - Bayern debt free, for example -which compares well with English or Italian clubs. So, yes, they are in a good situation.

m@cc@

nipplenuts wrote: »

Well, he does get paid for it... Do you?

What's that a measure of? McDonald's get paid for producing food, does it mean the quality is good?

monkey9

m@cc@ wrote: »

What's that a measure of? McDonald's get paid for producing food, does it mean the quality is good?

Well i'd rather eat McDonald's that eat dogsh!t from a bin!

anonymous_joe

joe123 wrote: »

Werent Borrusia Dortmund facing closure only a few years back or something?

Leading to regulation and very clever fiscal policy.

Long story short, when United, Liverpool and co go bankrupt, the stars'll be off to Germany to be paid in hard cash. :pac:

DSB

What about when they never actually do go bankrupt?

x in the city

Neil3030 wrote: »

I didn't watch the Barcelona Bayern Munich game last night but flicking onto Setanta during half-time I heard Dolan commenting on how the future looks extremely bright for the German League. Does anyone agree with this? I can't say I watch all that much from the Bundesliga, but Dolan cited Germany's relative economic stability and young football enthused population as support, which seems to make sense. The prices English clubs are valued at are surely going to send investors elsewhere eventually. Anyone reckon there'll be a German CL winner in the next 5-10 years though even?

Having been in Germany alot I can say he right on a lot of points, also its extremely cheap to watch games compared to england which is a joke, I mean CHELSKI, LOL

The average age of alot of the teams is quite young, Bremen are almost certainly odds on favourties for the UEFA cup this year also.

Hoffenhein [:mad:]had a fine season until they imploded when Ibisevich got injured.

Also Germany doesn't have a 'sky 4' monolopy as such, and clubs are not dependent on arab gadzillionaires to screw things up.

x in the city

nipplenuts wrote: »

Well, he does get paid for it... Do you?

If you look at the top German clubs you will see they are financially robust - Bayern debt free, for example -which compares well with English or Italian clubs. So, yes, they are in a good situation.

Bayern have managed to convince every German soul that they the the uber team to support, they sell more apparel than any other to some stupid people.

m@cc@

monkey9 wrote: »

Well i'd rather eat McDonald's that eat dogsh!t from a bin!

You've lost me.

Mr. Presentable

x in the city wrote: »

Bayern have managed to convince every German soul that they the the uber team to support, they sell more apparel than any other to some stupid people.

So, a German Man U, then. But without .5billion of debt

Mr. Presentable

m@cc@ wrote: »

What's that a measure of? McDonald's get paid for producing food, does it mean the quality is good?

*Zooom*

BolBill

They get bigger gates than the premiership.

Ronan|Raven

The atmosphere is great in the majority of the Stadiums. Fans are actually priced fairly, you can get into the Bundesliga matches for a decent price. The standard of football is very good, there are different teams always challenging for the title, the last few years have been great.

To hell with the champions league in my opinion. A good stable league that isnt going to go whallop with a good fanbase who are treated as fans and not consumers is a good thing.

zAbbo

anonymous_joe wrote: »

Leading to regulation and very clever fiscal policy.

Long story short, when United, Liverpool and co go bankrupt, the stars'll be off to Germany to be paid in hard cash. :pac:

Highly taxable hard cash, which makes it unlikely!

But here's an interesting idea, German households pay an extra E24 per year on their tv licence and get bundesliga for free on terrestrial television. It would double the TV income to German clubs to 900m per year and would allow them to invest in youth and supplement with imports.

gucci

zAbbo wrote: »

Highly taxable hard cash, which makes it unlikely!

But here's an interesting idea, German households pay an extra E24 per year on their tv licence and get bundesliga for free on terrestrial television. It would double the TV income to German clubs to 900m per year and would allow them to invest in youth and supplement with imports.

Interesting idea, but I dont know if it would be a goer....I can imagine the uproar in Ireland if the GAA proposed something similar!!

_blank_

I'm going over to Germany for a match in a few weeks.

Royale with Cheese

Plus you can drink and stand in the stadiums.

Yes they're not really competitve in Europe anymore, but the German league is perfect how it is now. The last big league in Europe without the same teams finishing in the top positions every year (Bayern aside, even then they've had a dodgy season every now and then). Best crowds in Europe, great prices, great football.

I'm not sure the best and most highly paid players in the world coming to German football would be a good thing at all.

Sútalún

I think the Bundesliga is without the best structured league in Europe.
It's been very competitive over the last few years. No monopoly like in the English league. Prices are very low. Crowds are thus very high. Although it's often hard to attract players this seems to be changing with players like Ribery going to Deutschland. You can also DRINK BEER in the stadium. Saying this I never watch Bundesliga and I've only been to one game.:o

Ronan|Raven

Des wrote: »

I'm going over to Germany for a match in a few weeks.

Where you going to Des?

_blank_

Ronan|Raven wrote: »

Where you going to Des?

Berlin, I think.

Rekop dog

At least the league gives home grown talent the chance to florish unlike the premiership. This might be at the expense of having 3 teams in the champions league semi-final but come the next world cup you just know Germany will be there or there abouts as they always seem to be and invariably make it further than England do. I realise i'm slightly derailing from the original point here but it really irritates me when English news channels gloat about how fantastic there league is and then the national side don't even qualify for a europen championship.

Hank Scorpio

has anyone read his articles in the star? I just skip them now.
He makes me cringe.

_blank_

Ronan|Raven wrote: »

Where you going to Des?

Ah.

Looks like I'll be at the

Hertha Berlin (4) -v- VfL Bochum (14) match on 9th May in the Olympiastadion, it looks like a super stadium.

applehunter

Des wrote: »

Berlin, I think.

I was there recently.

Went to the Olympic Stadium for Hertha vs Dortmund.

Very impressive stadium, very reasonable, beer and hotdogs, sehr gut.

Ronan|Raven

Great city as well for a night out.

Necronomicon

Des wrote: »

Ah.

Looks like I'll be at the

Hertha Berlin (4) -v- VfL Bochum (14) match on 9th May in the Olympiastadion, it looks like a super stadium.

Lucky. When I was there the season was finished, but I was still in awe of the place. It's an amazing stadium.

x in the city

Ronan|Raven wrote: »

The atmosphere is great in the majority of the Stadiums. Fans are actually priced fairly, you can get into the Bundesliga matches for a decent price. The standard of football is very good, there are different teams always challenging for the title, the last few years have been great.

To hell with the champions league in my opinion. A good stable league that isnt going to go whallop with a good fanbase who are treated as fans and not consumers is a good thing.

+1

robert murdoch has ruined football here, arsenal, man u, liverpool, chelski.. yawnnnnnnnnnnn

zzzzzzzzzzzzzz

who will win next years prem, man u huh.. oh wait, the bookies have spurs favs to break into the sky 4

x in the city

Sútalún wrote: »

I think the Bundesliga is without the best structured league in Europe.
It's been very competitive over the last few years. No monopoly like in the English league. Prices are very low. Crowds are thus very high. Although it's often hard to attract players this seems to be changing with players like Ribery going to Deutschland. You can also DRINK BEER in the stadium. Saying this I never watch Bundesliga and I've only been to one game.:o

Dortmund and Bremen bring in uber huge crowds!

Ronan|Raven

Im hoping to get over to Dortmund next year and get to go to "the wall" http://www.unitech-alumni.org/images/photoalbum/35/Dortmund_2008_2.JPG The old fella who is German reckons it is the best football stadium in Germany, says the fans there are nuts!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gYsNuiS0jNI

Not a plastic flag in sight

Although all that said, Alles Fur Fortuna Koln!

Quint

Ronan|Raven wrote: »

The atmosphere is great in the majority of the Stadiums. Fans are actually priced fairly, you can get into the Bundesliga matches for a decent price. The standard of football is very good, there are different teams always challenging for the title, the last few years have been great.

To hell with the champions league in my opinion. A good stable league that isnt going to go whallop with a good fanbase who are treated as fans and not consumers is a good thing.

Agree with that and most of the points in this thread. Germany is a great place to be if you're a football fan.

Highest attendences by a mile
Terraces!
Cheap tickets, season tickets are dirt cheap
Good value nice beer in the stadiums
Quality stadiums, I was in Bochums 30k starium, it was a really tidy stadium, full to the rafters, great atmosphere too.
You get free public transport on matchdays if you have a match ticket.
Quality food around the grounds from the stalls, not the usual burger or hotdog for €5.
Plenty of mental fans to laugh at!
National team is always competive.
Lets sing: Deutschland, Deutschland über alles....

Quint

Ronan|Raven wrote: »

Im hoping to get over to Dortmund next year and get to go to "the wall"!

Try and get there for a Schalke match

Ronan|Raven

Quint wrote: »

Try and get there for a Schalke match

Hehe indeed, to say they dislike each other would be understating it

I have family outside Koln so its a great base to get to lots of different stadiums, you have Dortmund, Leverkusen, Schalke, Monchengladbach, Mainz, Koln which hosts Fortuna Koln and FC Koln *hiss!* plenty more all within two hours.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iUDoJ8uYoSA

Sadly more at a division three Regional League North match that at most LOI Games

Boskowski

Professional football in Germany happens on a smaller financial scale than in England. That's mostly due to the fact that tickets for games and also PayTV subscriptions are a lot cheaper.

At the same time Bundesliga players get paid a lot. They would be on between a few hundred k to half a million or more. Big stars would be on more again. But except for a very, very few players (Ribery, that kinda stuff) there is no one on 50, 75, 100 or more k a week.

The depth of German football is amazing. In any given region you would have a total of 7 to 12 FA league tiers all beginning with the 3 professional leagues and then funneling down to regional leagues. And thats not counting senior leagues (age 32+), junior leagues (-18), factory leagues, college leagues and so on and so on. Most of the teams in those leagues would have a reserve team too and some even a 3rd or a 4th who would compete in parallel reserve leagues.

All teams that qualify to participate in professional football need to be licensed with the DFB in order to actually join the professional ranks. It happened before that a team that got promoted proper was denied the license for the upper pro league because it was found that their success was built on unsound financials. This measure is mostly about guaranteeing uninterrupted league schedules. No one wants a team dropping out in the middle of the season due to bankruptcy. To obtain such a license you must effectively open your balance sheet to the DFB (FA) explaining your entire business model & budget for the next season(s).
That's why a debt of - say - 10 or 20 million Euro would be considered huge in the Bundesliga.

Long story short. The Bundesliga is pretty healthy. The fans love it and they don't give a **** whether they're considered one of the best leagues in the world or not. As a matter of fact the typical Bundesliga supporter wouldn't rate the Premier League or any British football at all and thinks that all the big clubs in Europe that are better than the German clubs are better because they are up to their nostrils in debt. And there is some truth in that I suppose.

But whether the Bundesliga will take over after a financial footie crash that I'm not sure about. For starters I doubt this big crash will ever happen. People are just too footie mad, they will keep spending money on it. But secondly Bundesliga supporters wouldn't accept Premier League style salaries. Even at the levels the salaries are at right now people express discontent with the pampered soccer millionaires and their attitudes and people call for regulation.

Smegball

The league is very... ermm... efficient

chopperbyrne

Or could his Setanta bosses just have asked him to talk up the Bundeliga to boost their highlights show ratings?

Boskowski

chopperbyrne wrote: »

Or could his Setanta bosses just have asked him to talk up the Bundeliga to boost their highlights show ratings?

Could well be. I mean they're all guilty of that. Sky does it, RTE does. Of course they're all showing only 'the best' stuff.

But if you watched the Bundesliga on a regular basis and not just some 10 minutes highlights show - like full matches, extended highlights at least - then you would find that the Bundesliga isn't much behind the Premier League. Actually I don't think it is behind at all. The Bundesliga has more depth I think. Ok, the top Bundesliga teams aren't as good as the top four (maybe Bayern being the exception) but the middle of the road teams are certainly as good as the likes of City, Everton, Westham etc. And I think that the bottom teams are probably better than the bottom teams in England. Furthermore I believe that the 2.Bundesliga is better than the Coca-Cola league (or whatever it's called these days).

Thats one reason why nobody can break into the top four while in Germany there is no top four. There is only Bayern and the others and while Bayern certainly dominate the rankings over the years they're far from being a guaranteed league winner.

delta_bravo

I had a great laugh at the last german game i went to. Went to see FSV Frankfurt v Freiburg. Got a tram to take me from my hotel to the train station and another tram that stops immediately outside the Commerzbank Arena (60,000 seater- fantastic). €9 in for the terrace with all the hardcore fans. Id say there was only about 8,000 there in the whole stadium but it was a good atmosphere and very well run.

The one problem that does seem to exist in German football is the geographic distribution. As far as i know Cottbus are the only East German side in the Bundesliga. The only East German side in the 2.Bundesliga are the once major side Hansa Rostock. Both sides have a strong chance of relegation this season.

everdead.ie

x in the city wrote: »

+1
who will win next years prem, man u huh.. oh wait, the bookies have spurs favs to break into the sky 4

Neil3030 wrote: »

Anyone reckon there'll be a German CL winner in the next 5-10 years though even?

I'd almost bet spurs be more likely to win the cl then A german club in the next ten years almost
While the league is set up well they can't keep match winners like ribbery for long enough to win a cl title the big money of the epl and la liga takes them.

GLaDOS

delta_bravo wrote: »

As far as i know Cottbus are the only East German side in the Bundesliga.

Hertha Berlin?

MementoMori

everdead.ie wrote: »

I'd almost bet spurs be more likely to win the cl then A german club in the next ten years almost
While the league is set up well they can't keep match winners like ribbery for long enough to win a cl title the big money of the epl and la liga takes them.

Given Spurs current squad cost somewhere in the region of £180m, I don't really think this is the strongest of points.

Boskowski

Now Uli Hoeness predicted that eventually the big clubs with hundreds of millions of debt are going to collapse. That would be the vast majority of Premiership clubs, that would be Real Madrid and a lot of the Italian clubs also.
While I don't like him and I know he talks a lot of sh1t - especially if it suits to talk his beloved Bayern up - he does know a lot about European football and especially the financial side of it.

Boskowski

Neil3030 wrote: »

Anyone reckon there'll be a German CL winner in the next 5-10 years though even?

Never picked up on this one really.

Germany had Dortmund in 97 and Bayern in - what was it? - 2001? Of course there will be another German champions league winner. These things tend to be cyclical.

Quint

everdead.ie wrote: »

I'd almost bet spurs be more likely to win the cl then A german club in the next ten years almost
While the league is set up well they can't keep match winners like ribbery for long enough to win a cl title the big money of the epl and la liga takes them.

Spurs! I doubt they'll even break into the top 4, especially with Man-City on the scene now. Funny that the closest spurs managed to get was under Jol, who they sacked, and his team knocked City out of the UEFA cup yesterday.