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Ireland's contribution to the EU

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    #32
    ynotdu
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,817 ✭✭✭ynotdu


    WooPeeA wrote: »
    It's really weird that Ireland with really big GDP per capita is still asking EU for extra money..

    There's lots of countries with lower GDP per capita than Ireland and they are are funding that extra money every year. Where's the sense?

    The sense lies in where we are situated on the globe,a great landing rock for military purposes,ultimitly why would usa or europe bother about such a tiny market?

    like its not as if we have not proved that as a nation we will whore ourselves for money.

    Shannon airport was just an example,sure if was needed Dublin Cork airports would be available for a price also...........


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    #33
    Scofflaw
    Registered Users Posts: 23,283 ✭✭✭✭Scofflaw


    ynotdu wrote: »
    The sense lies in where we are situated on the globe,a great landing rock for military purposes,ultimitly why would usa or europe bother about such a tiny market?

    like its not as if we have not proved that as a nation we will whore ourselves for money.

    Shannon airport was just an example,sure if was needed Dublin Cork airports would be available for a price also...........

    Except that the people it's of use to are the US and the Russians (up the 90s), and that's been the case since 1945. Neither the US nor the Russians are in the EU, virtually none of the EU nations need it (to do what? fly military aircraft to America?), and the EU has no control over it. Finally, it should be obvious that nobody needs to give us lots of money to have Shannon available for their military aircraft, because it's available to the US, NATO, most of South America, and they don't.

    We're still receiving money because we cunningly got the poorer areas of Ireland redesignated separately, so that they're still receiving EU structural funds (which saves the Dublin taxpayer). As to how we managed it, we managed it because our governments are, apparently, far better negotiators at the European level than they seem to be at home. Whatever one thinks of the EU Constitution, it was the Irish who finally managed to get it negotiated (and managed to keep most of it into Lisbon).

    cordially,
    Scofflaw


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    #34
    ynotdu
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,817 ✭✭✭ynotdu


    Scofflaw wrote: »
    Except that the people it's of use to are the US and the Russians (up the 90s), and that's been the case since 1945. Neither the US nor the Russians are in the EU, virtually none of the EU nations need it (to do what? fly military aircraft to America?), and the EU has no control over it. Finally, it should be obvious that nobody needs to give us lots of money to have Shannon available for their military aircraft, because it's available to the US, NATO, most of South America, and they don't.

    We're still receiving money because we cunningly got the poorer areas of Ireland redesignated separately, so that they're still receiving EU structural funds (which saves the Dublin taxpayer). As to how we managed it, we managed it because our governments are, apparently, far better negotiators at the European level than they seem to be at home. Whatever one thinks of the EU Constitution, it was the Irish who finally managed to get it negotiated (and managed to keep most of it into Lisbon).

    cordially,
    Scofflaw

    True the structural funds were manipulated.

    The US and many other countries spend billions on worst case scenarios leading to possible military attacks.

    Hitler did rise to power.
    Pearl harbour did happen.
    9/11 did happen.
    North Korea IS happening.
    Iran?

    We are kindda on a retainor,just in case..................................


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    #35
    WooPeeA
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,136 ✭✭✭WooPeeA


    Scofflaw wrote: »
    We're still receiving money because we cunningly got the poorer areas of Ireland redesignated separately, so that they're still receiving EU structural funds (which saves the Dublin taxpayer). As to how we managed it, we managed it because our governments are, apparently, far better negotiators at the European level than they seem to be at home. Whatever one thinks of the EU Constitution, it was the Irish who finally managed to get it negotiated (and managed to keep most of it into Lisbon).
    Indeed Ireland contributed a lot into the constitution and the Lisbon Treaty. It was one of the strongest negotiators, and it took lots of efforts for everyone to finally accept that document.

    I don't really think Ireland needs extra money that much today. Of course it's always better to have some extra money, but I think it would be better for Irish reputation to say that we really don't need that money anymore. It would put Ireland on the elite list of EU funders.

    I think making the Irish market more liberal, removing most of the restrictions and unneeded laws would bring that extra money back very quickly, without any help from outside. Conservatives have one in common, and it's putting their ideology into the politics, law, economy and education. It worked well during the Celtic Tiger, but that period was more or less a historical accident and it was well known that those things will change one day.

    Now the economy suffers from laws made by conservatives. Low education level with strong religious influences or the last idea to completely cancel free studies will make the economical situation even worst. Simply, soon after foreign investors will leave the country, 10 years from now, Ireland won't have much to offer to the outside world. Uneducated young people with overpriced expectations.. that's what will remain after conservative governments. Welcome back potatoes.

    As you mentioned Scofflaw, Irish government is much better negotiator on EU level than at home, but I think they should concentrate more on what's going on inside of the country than they do today. I believe Ireland as a country and economy can do better.


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    #36
    Scofflaw
    Registered Users Posts: 23,283 ✭✭✭✭Scofflaw


    ynotdu wrote: »
    True the structural funds were manipulated.

    The US and many other countries spend billions on worst case scenarios leading to possible military attacks.

    Hitler did rise to power.
    Pearl harbour did happen.
    9/11 did happen.
    North Korea IS happening.
    Iran?

    We are kindda on a retainor,just in case..................................

    Well, you're starting to move off in the direction of Conspiracy Theory stuff there, the more so because we're not on a retainer from the US. We subsidise Shannon.

    cordially,
    Scofflaw


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    #37
    SWL
    Registered Users Posts: 574 ✭✭✭SWL


    PHB wrote: »
    What about the access to markets which is basically the core of our economy? People who use the catch argument really are just grasping at straws.


    Which is a two wat street, evey notice the amount of German cars on Irish roads, other nations have benfited from the progress in the irish economy also.


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    #38
    r14
    Closed Accounts Posts: 205 ✭✭r14


    SWL wrote: »
    Which is a two wat street, evey notice the amount of German cars on Irish roads, other nations have benfited from the progress in the irish economy also.

    I'm sure the Irish car sales more than make up for the c 22 billion euro Germany contributes to the EU. Oh and don't forget the 102 billion euro Germany has spent bailing out the Hypo Real Estate Group. If they hadn't done this for us the Irish economy would have collapsed. We simply don't have 100 billion euro.
    Since last autumn, Berlin has given Munich-based Hypo Real Estate (HRE) property group €102 billion loans and guarantees because of severe liquidity problems attributed to its Dublin-based subsidiary.

    The loans have annoyed cash-strapped German politicians and infuriated the financial regulator BaFin.

    In their analysis, Germany did Ireland a €102 billion favour by bailing out what they see as an Irish-based bank and responsibility of the Irish regulator.

    BaFin energetically rejects suggestions from Dublin that, as a subsidiary of a German company, the German is responsible for bail-outs.

    “I’d like to see what regulation or law the Irish think proves that,” exclaimed one BaFin official recently. “This was an Irish bank needing an Irish rescue.”

    Yesterday, a parliamentary committee met for the first time to investigate the circumstances of the near-collapse of HRE/Depfa.

    Don't fall into the trap of thinking our problems are big. Saving 4 billion from the budget is just kids play for some of these big countries. It makes very little difference to them whether Ireland are in the EU or out of it, while for us it's the difference between Ireland and Iceland.


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