Irishman Killed During Bolivian President Assassination Attempt

mick.fr

prinz wrote: »

I'd put more money on being ex- French Foreign Legion.

In which case we might never find out who it is.

If he was an ex-French legionnaire he would be way more fit that those fat ass guys I have seen here.

Evilsbane

prinz wrote: »

Plus they seem to have witnesses to back it all up too.Strange that.

Source?

My name is URL

mick.fr wrote: »

If he was an ex-French legionnaire he would be way more fit that those fat ass guys I have seen here.

Booooo!

We have the best hitmen in the world..!

Prove me wrong :pac:

Rew

pyroger101 wrote: »

The idiots at the timesonline had a few things to say about his bebo page,
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/europe/article6115458.ece

What you say here could be tomorrows headline, your likely to be contacted by the press they use fourms like this as lazy ways to pick up quotes for stories.

Rew

mick.fr wrote: »

If he was an ex-French legionnaire he would be way more fit that those fat ass guys I have seen here.

Jaysus what rubbish :rolleyes: Just because you were a Legionaire/SAS/ARW/Mareine/Conan the Barbarian does not mean that yor are or have to be uber fit and likt till your 102....

I know at least 2 FAT ex SF guys.

prinz

Evilsbane wrote: »

Source?

eh every news article I've read about it so far.

pyroger101

Rew wrote: »

What you say here could be tomorrows headline, your likely to be contacted by the press they use fourms like this as lazy ways to pick up quotes for stories.

Point taken . Just been a pretty sh*t day. After today ill never believe what i read in the news papers again tho.

pyroger101

prinz wrote: »

eh every news article I've read about it so far.

I didnt read anything about witnesses? any links?

prinz

mick.fr wrote: »

If he was an ex-French legionnaire he would be way more fit that those fat ass guys I have seen here.

I hadn't seen the pictures at that stage. Just pointing out that a suspected mercenary from these parts would more like than not be FFL than our own Defence Forces, or British Army, as someone else was supposing. Either way ex- is ex- so weight/conditioning could have deteriorated.

A bigger contra is if he was ex-FFL he'd still be alive

Terry

Rew wrote: »

What you say here could be tomorrows headline, your likely to be contacted by the press they use fourms like this as lazy ways to pick up quotes for stories.

I've sent him a PM.
See here for details.

prinz

pyroger101 wrote: »

I didnt read anything about witnesses? any links?

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/breaking/2009/0417/breaking30.html?via=mr

men fled into hotel and shoot-out ensued, witnesses and police say.

ahara

I'm no expert when it comes to transnational assassination plots but common sense would tend to suggest that the people involved in such things probably wouldn't have a Bebo page.

mick.fr

Rew wrote: »

Jaysus what rubbish :rolleyes: Just because you were a Legionaire/SAS/ARW/Mareine/Conan the Barbarian does not mean that yor are or have to be uber fit and likt till your 102....

I know at least 2 FAT ex SF guys.

I am not talking about those **** of SAS etc, I am talking legionaire here.
You do get fat over age for sure, especially when you leave active status.
Legionaire's on going physical training will leave you some marks for sure. Many years later.

Those guys are muppets with weapons. This is totally different. Whichever way, somebody put weapons in their hands, or they decided to put them themselves.

Rew

pyroger101 wrote: »

Point taken . Just been a pretty sh*t day. After today ill never believe what i read in the news papers again tho.

Its only just begun im afraid and anyone who as ever been involved in anything that makes the papers knows what you mean it really makes you wonder.

Just remember you in a privileged position and right now there are people who would take advantage of that.

prinz

Evilsbane wrote: »

Every article I've read has neglected to mention witnesses, so a source to an article with this information would make me better informed.

See link above, Irish Times article.

Rew

mick.fr wrote: »

I am not talking about those **** of SAS etc, I am talking legionaire here.
You do get fat over age for sure, especially when you leave active status.
Legionaire's on going physical training will leave you some marks for sure. Many years later.

Those guys are muppets with weapons. This is totally different. Whichever way, somebody put weapons in their hands, or they decided to put them themselves.

There's a Walter Mitty forum over in the military board you should check it out.

prinz

Rew wrote: »

There's a Walter Mitty forum over in the military board you should check it out.

It's a pity that advice wasn't given to the deceased a while back.

mick.fr

Rew wrote: »

There's a Walter Mitty forum over in the military board you should check it out.

Well no need for that you can ask me directly when it comes to french army and legionaire.
I don't need to ask people sitting on their arse in Israel and shouting two bullets a year in the conerama.

Evilsbane

prinz wrote: »

See link above, unless The Irish Times is now part of the conspiracy.

No need for that. So far I've just pointed out inconsistencies that will need to be addressed before this case can be considered closed.

Rew

prinz wrote: »

See link above, unless The Irish Times is now part of the conspiracy.

There cutting and pasting from anywhere they can get info like half the people in this thread.

prinz

Evilsbane wrote: »

No need for that. So far I've just pointed out inconsistencies that will need to be addressed before this case can be considered closed.

You're quite right, apologies and edit done.

Evilsbane

prinz wrote: »

You're quite right, apologies and edit done.

Fair enough. I noticed this in that article too. It's by no means conclusive that the men were innocent (Costas could be trying to cover his ass) but it does make the whole thing a lot messier and difficult to figure (Morales could be trying to cover HIS ass):

Governor of Santa Cruz Ruben Costas, an opponent of Mr Morales, told reporters that local police were not involved in the arrests and suggested the alleged assassination plot was staged to discredit his administration.

juvenal

Article in tomorrow's (Saturday) Irish Times about it:

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/frontpage/2009/0418/1224244976665.html

GARDAÍ AND Department of Foreign Affairs officials are due to confirm to the Bolivian authorities that a man shot dead in a clash between police and alleged anti-government mercenaries was a 25-year-old from Co Tipperary.

The Bolivian police have named him as Michael Martin Dwyer.

They have said the deceased’s Irish passport was found among his personal items after he and two of his associates were fatally wounded in what they said was a shoot-out with police in a hotel in the city of Santa Cruz on Thursday morning.

Two other suspects – accused of being part of a group of mercenaries hired to kill president Evo Morales – were arrested and taken in for questioning.

A member of the family of Michael Dwyer (25), from Ballinderry, near Borrisokane, Co Tipperary, confirmed last night that he had died in unexplained circumstances while travelling in Bolivia.

The Department of Foreign Affairs last night confirmed that an Irishman had been involved in a “violent incident” in Bolivia.

A spokesman for the Department said an official from the Irish Embassy in Buenos Aires, Argentina was travelling to Bolivia to investigate the matter.

Garda sources said the Interpol office in the Bolivian capital La Paz had sent a formal request to the agency’s office in Dublin asking for the Garda’s assistance in confirming the identity of the deceased as that on the passport recovered.

Sources said initial checks on Garda databases had thrown up no information on Mr Dwyer.

Gardaí will now liaise with the people who they believe to be Mr Dwyer’s family in Co Tipperary.

Alvaro Garcia Linera, Bolivia’s vice-president, claimed at a press conference on Thursday that “a band of terrorist mercenaries, Croatians, Irish and Bolivians” had tried to kill President Evo Morales, and intended to destabilise the country’s left-wing government.

Police say that along with a large cache of weapons, they recovered a list of targets that included Mr Morales, Bolivia’s first indigenous president.

In a press conference in Venezuela where he is attending a regional summit, Mr Morales said Bolivia’s police had the group under surveillance since April 3rd and he gave the order to arrest them.

It is understood some of the group had been working in private security in the US. The two other men killed in the shoot-out were a Hungarian man and a Bolivian man with Croatian citizenship who had fought in the Balkan wars.

A page on a social networking site created by Mr Dwyer was taken down last night. It contained a number of pictures of him with friends in Bolivia which were posted earlier this year.

Some of the photographs also showed Mr Dwyer, a university graduate recently living in Galway, dressed in combat fatigues and carrying imitation weapons with friends at what appeared to be a mock war game at an adventure sports facility.

Capt'n Midnight

mick.fr wrote: »

Just get up to speed on history and you will learn the US governement has financed and/or leaded an incredible number of assassinations and political destabilisations in many Southern American countries since the last 20 years.
I am not making anything up. This is history.

Only 20 ? Closer to 120
9/11 means 1973 if you are talking about Chile


http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/world/2009/0418/1224244976525.html

THERE WAS shock and disbelief among residents of the small village of Ballinderry in Co Tipperary, last night as they absorbed the news reports from Bolivia.

Some of the customers in the only pub, the Tavern Bar, said they knew Michael Dwyer and were very upset by the news.

JP D’Arcy (23) a friend of Mr Dwyer described him as “a lovely guy and a very decent and reasonable character”.

He said: “I heard he was shot dead in South America and hoped it was not true”.

Mr Dwyer was a university graduate who lived in Galway after he left the family home. He is understood to have played for Shannon Rovers GAA club near Borrisokane when he was younger.

Mr Dwyer’s parents are both still alive and he also has two sisters.

Mr D’Arcy said: “As far as I know, Michael was on holiday in Bolivia with a friend. He was staying in a hostel there and I heard it was raided and he was shot.” He came from “a very respectable family, was a hard worker and a nice guy. I had a lot of time for him and he had a lot of time for me”, he continued.

“He was into travelling and the last time I was talking to him was a few months ago when he was working with his father who is an electrician. I know his family well and Michael and I used to travel on the same school bus together.”

Ronan Donoghue (20) from the nearby village of Coolbawn, who was working behind the bar in the tavern last night, said everyone in the area was very upset about the news. Mr Donoghue, who also knows the Dwyer family, said he was shocked by news reports.

A young man in Ballinderry who did not wish to be named said “reports that Mr Dwyer might be a mercenary were simply unbelievable.

“They are saying he was planning an assassination, but, far from planning an assassination he wouldn’t plan his own birthday.”

A member of Mr Dwyer’s family confirmed the 25-year-old had died in unexplained circumstances while travelling in Bolivia, and requested that the media not visit the family home.

prinz

The only ways the stories correspond is if this guy was caught in the crossfire, which at this stage is looking unlikely, as the Bolivians are saying they were under surveillance, they knew who was and wasn't a member of this group. This case just gets odder and more bizarre all the time.

You can be sure the rest of the boyos were up to no good, all war vets and guns for hire for years. Question is why would he be with them? He's the odd one out, yet everything I've seen about this guy points to a fascination with war games, military matters etc, hardly that big of a coincidence that he just happened to be there.

My name is URL

It really is a weird story. I mean how did a seemingly normal bloke from Tipp end up being a henchman for Croatian/Hungarian extremists?
Who payed them to do this?

The mind boggles tbh.

I expect this to escalate in the coming days..

I bet you it was for Adare!;)

K-9

Che isn't that cool after all.

prinz

no self-respecting gang of mercenaries is going to be complete without someone with a bit of electrical know how :rolleyes:

Evilsbane

Well, the Irish government is sending someone over to investigate - let's hope he or she asks hard questions instead of attempting to have it go away as quickly as possible.

gandalf

Having just watched a local news report video that showed the men where they fell I would expect the DFA to ask some very serious questions. Michael Dwyers body is shown in the report. He is in boxers, his body is relatively clean for someone supposedly caught up in a 30 minute intense gunfight and most telling of all has a neat double tap bullet wounds in his chest. This looks like an execution and no matter why he was originally there why was he executed and not captured.

prinz

gandalf wrote: »

Having just watched a local news report video that showed the men where they fell I would expect the DFA to ask some very serious questions. Michael Dwyers body is shown in the report. He is in boxers, his body is relatively clean for someone supposedly caught up in a 30 minute intense gunfight and most telling of all has a neat double tap bullet wounds in his chest. This looks like an execution and no matter why he was originally there why was he executed and not captured.

Try reading up on counter terrorism and HRT's will you?

Caoimhín

Fair play to him i say.

If your going to go out, might as well as go out with a big one.

Dieing in a hail of bullets while trying to assassinate a south American president, it beats dieing from a dickey heart while running for the bus.

I have been in a few odd scrapes in my time, but this man has raised the bar for all of us.

Frankie Lee

Well in fairness the two veterans of the Croatian war of independence were likely to have connections with the CIA, how a relatively normal chap from tipp got involved with them is a big mystery.
Maybe Libertas sent him?

prinz

Frankie Lee wrote: »

Well in fairness the two veterans of the Croatian war of independence were likely to have connections with the CIA,

people just itching to pin this on the Americans. Given that they were actually of Bolivian origin, were far right fascists, and el presidente morales is a lefty, i fail to see the CIA link as yet.

Frankie Lee wrote: »

how a relatively normal chap from tipp got involved with them is a big mystery.
Maybe Libertas sent him?

He thought he could play soldier. Turned out he couldn't. Seems he wanted to get into private security etc as a contractor, basically a hired goon gun. Pretty straightforward from there.

Frankie Lee

prinz wrote: »

people just itching to pin this on the Americans. Given that they were actually of Bolivian origin, were far right fascists, and el presidente morales is a lefty, i fail to see the CIA link as yet.

Well I don't know of any left wing leader in Latin America in the last 100 years that the CIA has not tried to get rid of, what makes Morales different.

prinz

Frankie Lee wrote: »

Well I don't know of any left wing leader in Latin America in the last 100 years that the CIA has not tried to get rid of, what makes Morales different.

They've got bigger fish to fry down there with Chavez. That, and the fact that there's no link between this gang and America

Frankie Lee

Of course it cannot be proven that Eduardo Rozsa Flores and Arpad Magyarosi had any link with the CIA but it is possible and likely given their experience in the Balkans and the CIA's history in trying to get rid of left wing governments that do not serve the American "interests".

However maybe they were just hired by the racist whites in Bolivia that don't like Morales because he's indigenous.:rolleyes:

FlutterinBantam

Caoimhín wrote: »

Fair play to him i say.

If your going to go out, might as well as go out with a big one.

Dieing in a hail of bullets while trying to assassinate a south American president, it beats dieing from a dickey heart while running for the bus.

I have been in a few odd scrapes in my time, but this man has raised the bar for all of us.

heh heh, Dying in a hail of bullets ain't no good way to go out buddy.

You been playin too much paintball horse;);)

Cuddlesworth

prinz wrote: »

Try reading up on counter terrorism and HRT's will you?

Amazing that a 30 minute fire fight is finished up with a perfect take down.

FlutterinBantam

:eek: Were you there.??


Did you see it??

Grow up man

arybvtcw0eolkf

Rew wrote: »

There's a Walter Mitty forum over in the military board you should check it out.

Maybe all threads relating to this dead lunatic should be moved there!...

/NO - WAIT I was messing - about the moving thread, not about the lunatic.

Having read up on this lad I've come to the conclusion that he was off the wall mad, living in a fantasy world of airsoft 'make believe', dressing up in DPM's and running around like a little soldier, Krav Maga and then travelling to South America to chase the cloud he was living on.

I feel sorry for the family the guy left behind.

FlutterinBantam

Absolutely spot on Mairt.

Death in these situations is a lot messier that these paintballers imagine.

My name is URL

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

Absolutely spot on Mairt.

Death in these situations is a lot messier that these paintballers imagine.

True

But you have to admire his determination to be something he wanted to be. Better than filling your head with **** and shooting up a school!

FlutterinBantam

Upward Spiral wrote: »

True

But you have to admire his determination to be something he wanted to be. Better than filling your head with **** and shooting up a school!

Are you for real buddy.

"better than shooting up a school":eek::eek:

Think before you post pal.

pyroger101

Ok guys. As a group of very good friends of mike we would like to make a few things clear. The media have stated some lies and twisted a few tales about our friend Mike to make him look worse.

We cannot deny that the circumstances that he was found in were very suspicious however if you knew mike like we did you would understand where we are coming from

We can say for certain that:

• Mike never had any military training of any sort WHAT SO EVER!
• Mike was never politically oppinnionaited
• The pictures in the newspapers of mike in "his military gear" are pictures that are taken from a local nigthclub on halloween.Click here for proof
• Other photos with him holding weapons in camo gear in the forest are him participating in airsoft games which he had recently started as a hobby.
• He never branded himself as "the jackel" or "a sniper" these titles were given to him by online quiz's that were set up for fun.
• Mike was a very easy going, friendly out going guy.
• Mike had no affiliation with the IRA
• Mike was not involved in the drugs industry
• Mike was 24 not 25

We are very concerned as to the circumstances around his death.

This quote was taken from the Sky News web site:
Quote:
"Officers attempted to arrest the armed men in the city of Santa Cruz, whose governor is a prominent critic of the president.

But they fled to a hotel where a 30-minute gun battle followed, police chief Hugo Escobar said."

This can hardly be the truth! There are images of the bodies of the deceased from this attack! The men are in their boxers in their hotel rooms, no guns, bullet casings on or around them. The rooms that they were in certainly did not look like there was a gun fight of any sort, certainly not one that lasted 30 minutes and involved grenades. We're sure that these men were not chased from the city in their boxers. These men look like they were just woken and brutally murdered.

Also from this website, http://www.budapesttimes.hu/content/view/11706/219/ [NSFW] if you scroll down and view the video of the bodies, you can see that all men were in their underwear, two of the men have their arms clearly visible. From the images in the morgue, you can see that one of the men with the black underwear has their arms tied. If you look at the same man from the photos at the scene of the gun fight, you can see that Mike and one of the other man's hands are not tied, whereas the man with his body facing the ground appears to have his hands in his front, which could suggest that he was tied up when killed maybe? As the body bags are being brought into the morgue, it is clear that one of them has his arms tied together.

Also there are reports of weapons being found in a seperate location and not the hotel they were staying in. There are also no reports as to what weapons were held on them at the time.


I know that this may all sound like crazy conspiracy theory jargin, however if you knew Mike like we do you would understand that there is definatly something suspicious surrounding the death of our friend.

We would request that people be considerate to what they say about this man online. He has a lovely respectable family and lots of mourning friends. We would ask that people keep an open mind to this subject and if they have any other information that may help paint a clearer picture for us or that can show any contraditions or suspicious information to please Private message us at any time.

Thanks for your time

Ger and friends

pyroger101

Another photo of mike in this "military uniform" in "training" !!???
Click here for photo, more to come

arybvtcw0eolkf

pyroger101 wrote: »

We would request that people be considerate to what they say about this man online. He has a lovely respectable family and lots of mourning friends.
Thanks for your time

Ger and friends

Thats a nice thing to say about your friend, and I withdraw my earlier comments.

However because I'll lose a few 'thank you' counts I won't delete 'em, sry - ya know how it is.

.

FlutterinBantam

Nice post,but let's wait for the inquiry.

Sincere condolences to the lad's family.

arybvtcw0eolkf

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

Nice post,but let's wait for the inquiry.

Sincere condolences to the lad's family.

+1 and I'd include his friends in that too.

.