People on the dole working for free...can it work???

beachlife

easyeason3 wrote: »

Ah no it's not a confidence thing at all, it's called pride.
That nice boss has since closed down his business, not by choice.
I have sent out the best part of 800 hundred applications, at least, & have been interviewed four times.
I don't need a rant from you when it's very clear what the post was intended for.
Exactly what have you contributed except your own self pitying moan?
You're not the only one out there looking for work at the moment so instead of telling everyone how hard you're looking for a job, how about thinking of ways to ease the burden of social welfare on the taxpayer.

Because the taxpayer will have little or no sympathy for someone like you or me at the moment.

what moaning you twat,your the one moaning ,did you even care about the unemployed before you became one of them? and there plenty of aids to get a job and /or training if you want it,for instance if you are out of work 6 months or so, you can go to fas and they will pat up to 1200 for retraining etc,I'm not the one saying lets overhaul the system, but let's just look at your idea.....If you take the 350,000 people who are out of work and then CREATE work for them(like the workhouses of old???) what are you really doing? if the work really needs doing and is of a commercial nature then you will be putting otherwise employed people out of work!!So lets say we stick to work of a non commercial nature,now the government will not only have to pay your dole but employ managers ,inspectors etc to oversee the "projects" I think everybody remembers the fas courses run in the 80's just to take numbers of the live register.Bottom line is yes it cost money to pay people to do nothing....but it cost's more to make them do something for their dole and who will pay for that?? the already strapped taxpayer that's who...........

dr.bollocko

beachlife wrote: »

what moaning you twat,your the one moaning ,did you even care about the unemployed before you became one of them? and there plenty of aids to get a job and /or training if you want it,for instance if you are out of work 6 months or so, you can go to fas and they will pat up to 1200 for retraining etc,I'm not the one saying lets overhaul the system, but let's just look at your idea.....If you take the 350,000 people who are out of work and then CREATE work for them(like the workhouses of old???) what are you really doing? if the work really needs doing and is of a commercial nature then you will be putting otherwise employed people out of work!!So lets say we stick to work of a non commercial nature,now the government will not only have to pay your dole but employ managers ,inspectors etc to oversee the "projects" I think everybody remembers the fas courses run in the 80's just to take numbers of the live register.Bottom line is yes it cost money to pay people to do nothing....but it cost's more to make them do something for their dole and who will pay for that?? the already strapped taxpayer that's who...........

BANNED.

easyeason3

beachlife wrote: »

what moaning you twat,your the one moaning ,did you even care about the unemployed before you became one of them? and there plenty of aids to get a job and /or training if you want it,for instance if you are out of work 6 months or so, you can go to fas and they will pat up to 1200 for retraining etc,I'm not the one saying lets overhaul the system, but let's just look at your idea.....If you take the 350,000 people who are out of work and then CREATE work for them(like the workhouses of old???) what are you really doing? if the work really needs doing and is of a commercial nature then you will be putting otherwise employed people out of work!!So lets say we stick to work of a non commercial nature,now the government will not only have to pay your dole but employ managers ,inspectors etc to oversee the "projects" I think everybody remembers the fas courses run in the 80's just to take numbers of the live register.Bottom line is yes it cost money to pay people to do nothing....but it cost's more to make them do something for their dole and who will pay for that?? the already strapped taxpayer that's who...........

Beachlife I can see your point but I don't appreciate being called an idiot/ twat or whatever other names you can think of.
The title to the thread is 'People on the dole working for free...can it work???', it doesn't say lets make them work nor does it say anything about creating jobs for everyone.
I was asking IF it would be viable & if so what could be suggested. Thankfully some of the other posters managed to grasp that much.
As regards managers, inspectors etc, apparently our public service is overstaffed at the moment so I think it would be fair to assume that a few of them would be willing to part take in such a scheme if it was introduced. The government or should I say taxpayer, as it stands, is already paying these people as well as social welfare.

easyeason3

dr.bollocko wrote: »

BANNED.

Thank you

Dexterm99

OP, I'm a tax payer but like some people, I'm worried that I won't have a job this time next year so I don't think many people would begrudge you your dole and if they did, so what?

The idea of people on the dole working probably gets discussed every morning over coffee. We think it's great that all these workers could get their dignity back while the M50 is finished ahead of schedule. But as a few posters have highlighted, it is open to abuse from employers. The real losers are the workers.
If you got 200 in your pay packet for one week when you were working, what would you have done? I doubt that you would have been happy. My point is that 200 is not an awful lot. If I did a couple of interviews a week, I would have eaten into my weekly budget having to pay for travel, parking etc. If you were working 3 days a week, how much do you think you'd have left after travel, meals etc?

Apart from the potential knock on affect of replacing a paid person, your time would be much better spent looking for and creating jobs. It's difficult to do now, how difficult will it be if you've got 3 days less to do it in?

My heart goes out to you but you owe the country nothing.

diverdriver

dexterm is right, working three days a week would cost you money unless you could walk to the job and are on a diet. Really it's not a practical or sensible idea. It would be abused by employers. Why hire someone when you can get them for nothing off the dole? A really cynical employer would lay off someone one week and bring them back the next week in the same job for nothing. Even if no deliberate attempt was made to avoid hiring paid staff. It would become very comfortable for employers to have unpaid workers. Too comfortable for them to give it up.

The only practical idea would be to help charities but even then many charities are employers too. Again people would lose jobs.

Even though the idea of attending classes or doing courses, while it has merit again costs money the government doesn't have. On top of that most unemployed people with skills really don't need training or self development. They actually need a job that pays their bills.

You sound like a hard worker but I'm afraid you'll have to sit back and accept the reality you face.

Incidentally you mention refusing money for work you did as a favour for a previous employer. Now I understand why you did it. But please don't ever do that again. I work in an industry where people offer to work for nothing in order to get experience and where some employers expect it. It's also common for an employers to expect a new entrant to pay serious money for his or her own training, not to mention almost everything else surrounding the job, including uniforms etc and to top it all they remained unpaid until finally signed off. Worse people have paid to work in the business.

But not all, I know one boss, who angrily threw out a prospect who offered to work for nothing telling him to 'Never denigrate your profession or skills by offering to work for free'. He was right. At the very least take a token payment. It's a slippery slope and it's not good for either side on the arrangement. In my current job. I replaced a couple of part timers who were unpaid. Frankly I am better than them and I wasn't prepared to work for nothing or for peanuts. The boss hasn't looked back since and neither have I.

Good luck and keep thinking up ideas.

CU-Cme

The problem could be that when someone (like the original poster) is so used to working nearly every hour they have so that they can be with people, being on the dole is a lonely and frustrating time.

Volunteering is not an option (officially) as according to the Dole, you are not 'available for work' if you are volunteering - this was said to me after I had enquired about joining the Garda Reserve, thinking that I should give something to my country as they are giving me this money.

The Social Welfare expects us to be spending the time we have looking for work - which is fine if there are jobs out there - but in this current climate and with restrictive traditional limitation relating to age, sex, orientation etc - not everyone who may be qualified will get the position.

We should have schemes to cater for people who want to get out and do something rather than go mental sitting at home looking at depressing lack of employment ads - but not to replace jobs that are being done by paid employees. So that leaves - cleaning up the country, removing grafitti or assisting in areas of care where there is insufficient funding to provide a level of service.

Catari Jaguar

OP, I think it would be an excellent idea, especially for community links.

Here are some things that require volunteers:

Reading to children at the library

• Visiting the elderly in nursing homes or helping with Meals on Wheels

• Working in the second hand shops sorting clothes/ items for sale

• Volunteering in inner city schools

• Working in youth centres as a leader

• Working at a homeless shelter

• Answering calls for ISPCC or Samaritans

• Helping in animal shelters

• Playing with the sick children in Temple Street hospital

easyeason3

CU-Cme wrote: »

The problem could be that when someone (like the original poster) is so used to working nearly every hour they have so that they can be with people, being on the dole is a lonely and frustrating time.

Volunteering is not an option (officially) as according to the Dole, you are not 'available for work' if you are volunteering - this was said to me after I had enquired about joining the Garda Reserve, thinking that I should give something to my country as they are giving me this money.

The Social Welfare expects us to be spending the time we have looking for work - which is fine if there are jobs out there - but in this current climate and with restrictive traditional limitation relating to age, sex, orientation etc - not everyone who may be qualified will get the position.

We should have schemes to cater for people who want to get out and do something rather than go mental sitting at home looking at depressing lack of employment ads - but not to replace jobs that are being done by paid employees. So that leaves - cleaning up the country, removing grafitti or assisting in areas of care where there is insufficient funding to provide a level of service.

THANK YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!

There are more people out there thinking along these lines & while I'm not suggesting for one minute that we take jobs from existing employees, I am looking for a solution to a problem that is growing by the day.
As it is there are approximately 400,000 people signing on. I know there a people who can't work due to disability or illness but there are people who CAN & WANT to work. Even if it is for the same amount of money.
So many people have been left frustrated by the lack of having something to do that it makes sense to have something in place to help & improve the community they live in.
However people have come up with very valid points as to why it would not work but surely there has to be a way around it that would keep everyone happy?
I know if I was still working I'd be supporting something like this because I would want to feel as though my tax money is going to achieving something, somewhere.

ahara

OP, I'm in my 30s and signed on for the first time ever 3 weeks ago.

I intend spending my time on the dole by staying in bed until after midday in order to avoid having my day ruined yet again by inadvertantly overhearing Gerry ****in Ryan. This will be followed by afternoons and evenings spent doing the things I like doing but was too tired to do at the weekends when I was working.

I'm not at all lazy but theres no way on Earth I'd volunteer to work for free picking up rubbish or such like.

Sounds like you need to get yourself a hobby. Grab some cheap cans and join me and my new chums down at the bookies

easyeason3

• Answering calls for ISPCC or Samaritans

Would you not need some form of qualification in counselling or social studies to be suitable for this? If not how does someone go about volunteering for this?

Banm

I was talking about this with a few friends the other day. we reckon it would be a great time to gert started on the long promised western rail corridor. As many may not even think about this situation on a daily basis they may be unaware that we in the west of Ireland do not have any rail service from donegal -sligo- mayo right down to galway. If people in the local areas that were on the dole worked on the line to set it up etc each area would be done quickly and a great service would be up and running in no time.

easyeason3

ahara wrote: »

OP, I'm in my 30s and signed on for the first time ever 3 weeks ago.

I intend spending my time on the dole by staying in bed until after midday in order to avoid having my day ruined yet again by inadvertantly overhearing Gerry ****in Ryan. This will be followed by afternoons and evenings spent doing the things I like doing but was too tired to do at the weekends when I was working.

I'm not at all lazy but theres no way on Earth I'd volunteer to work for free picking up rubbish or such like.

Sounds like you need to get yourself a hobby. Grab some cheap cans and join me and my new chums down at the bookies

If this is a p!ss take then take it somewhere else.
If you are serious then I feel very sorry for you.

CAPSLOCK365

easyeason3 wrote: »

Ok there is something similar going on in another thread but not everyone is going to read it & there's so many replies on it that it's become a bit long winded. It also has a lot of debate going on about various opinions & I want this thread to at least try to achieve something.

Anyway I'm signing on for the last few months. I have been working for the last ten years, sometimes double & treble jobbing. I have always been in full time employment but because I was always good at my job I often got asked to give a dig out from previous employers during busy times or if someone got unexpectedly sick.

As it stands I get €204 a week for doing nothing. Now believe me when I say that I don't like getting this money for nothing. I have always been used to working & getting €204 a week means I can manage, just, but that's not my problem. I want to work & I also feel incredibly guilty getting this money when the rest of the country are being taxed to the hilt.

So I propose that, anyone who is willing, offers to work for the same amount of money for maybe three days a week. Three days a week isn't going to kill anyone & it will also allow time to actively seek work & attend interviews.

Now here lies the question. What would people on social welfare do for three days a week that will benefit the economy?

Repair roads? Improve conditions at schools? Work in social welfare? Aid care givers? Become a cleaner in a local hospital?

I'd really like people to give an opinion on this as to what anyone who is willing & able can do.

I really want constructive thoughts & advice on what can be done & how it can be achieved.

Thank you.

Couldn't agree more. We should get them to tar the roads, cut ditches and so on. We could chain them all together as well.

ahara

No its not a piss take, I have no intention of working without pay. Simple as that.

I don't have a clue why you feel sorry for me. If your life is really empty without having to endure the soul destroying drudgery of working then I should probably feel sorry for you.

P.S. My offer of cans at the bookies is hereby withdrawn!

Catari Jaguar

easyeason3 wrote: »

• Answering calls for ISPCC or Samaritans

Would you not need some form of qualification in counselling or social studies to be suitable for this? If not how does someone go about volunteering for this?

PM sent. Not sure about posting this stuff on boards.

Disease Ridden

ahara wrote: »

No its not a piss take, I have no intention of working without pay. Simple as that.

I don't have a clue why you feel sorry for me. If your life is really empty without having to endure the soul destroying drudgery of working then I should probably feel sorry for you.

P.S. My offer of cans at the bookies is hereby withdrawn!

Haha, fair play! People who dont take things too seriously tend to have happier lives and more friends OP. What, should we all work so you dont feel bad!?

Mrs_Doyle

easyeason3 wrote: »

I
As regards working double & treble jobs, yes i did get offered money for it but I didn't accept it because it was mostly a favour for my previous employers who i happened to maintain a friendly relationship with after I left them.

Your worked for previous employers for free, and yet still no one, not even one of these previous employers, is willing to give you a job?

easyeason3

ahara wrote: »

No its not a piss take, I have no intention of working without pay. Simple as that.

I don't have a clue why you feel sorry for me. If your life is really empty without having to endure the soul destroying drudgery of working then I should probably feel sorry for you.

P.S. My offer of cans at the bookies is hereby withdrawn!

After reading that I honestly don't know what is going to be become of this country.
My lifestyle isn't empty, but I have never felt that work is soul destroying either even in the worst place I worked, which was fcuked up to be honest.
Anyway that's your opinion on it & that's fine, but I have always had structure to my day, something to do, something to get up for, something to take pride in.
Instead of hanging around watching Jeremy Kyle & the likes I would personally prefer to be doing something even if it is for nothing.
I know not everyone will agree with this, but as I said already the thread was not created as a rant for people to make unhelpful/ nasty comments. It was posted to try & find a solution, if there is one.

So considering the posts on this thread I'd like a moderator to close it down if possible. While I appreciate the comments & suggestions from some posters, be it good or bad, I think this thread has started to go around in circles & has gone off the topic more than it has been on topic.

Thank you to anyone who has given advice, good or bad.

ahara

I was only giving my honest opinion. I've been working for years and paying in the state kitty and now I'm gonna sit on my arse until something crops up. no need for you to descend in to despair because i didn't want to join your Hitler Youth scheme.

easyeason3

ahara wrote: »

I was only giving my honest opinion. I've been working for years and paying in the state kitty and now I'm gonna sit on my arse until something crops up. no need for you to descend in to despair because i didn't want to join your Hitler Youth scheme.

I'm not descending into despair because you disagree with me. I'm not foolish enough to think everyone wants to do this so but the thread clearly states that I am looking for a solution to a growing problem.
You have your opinion & I have mine, it is as simple as that.
But the thread is looking for ideas or advice. It was not created for you or anyone else to vent against what I am suggesting.
There is plenty of other threads out there dealing with similar opinions but this was set up for a solution, or at least an attempted solution, not a debate on who should do what/ who is right/ who is wrong etc.
As I said you are completely entitled to your opinion but it seems to be in the wrong post that's all.

easyeason3

Mrs_Doyle wrote: »

Your worked for previous employers for free, and yet still no one, not even one of these previous employers, is willing to give you a job?

Read the previous posts. One business has closed down, & the other has staff but it was only an emergency when I filled in. As it is those people I covered are now fighting for hours.

ahara

Maybe you could use your free time go on a course that could teach you to be a little bit less condescending.

Highsider

Was on the dole a couple of years back and went out of my mind doing nothing after a month. Did some volunteer work to pass the time until something came up that paid a decent wage.

AckwelFoley

Forced to work? I dont need the government to force me to work ive got a fiance at home that would kick the life out of me if i stayed at home massaging my cornhole.

red-demon

If you feel like working for your "free money" then why not do some volunteer work?

easyeason3

Ok well first of all thank you to people who suggested solutions & problems to what I was suggesting.
I'm finished posting on this thread as it is obviously pointless, so as I have said already if a mod can shut it down then please do, there's enough debate going on in other threads regarding social welfare so there doesn't need to be another one despite the fact that it was created for solutions to people on social welfare who want to work or help in their community to ease a growing burden on taxpayers.

Disease Ridden

As far as I'm aware its illegal to be engaged in any form of work including voluntary while you're on the dole; so if you want to legally do any sort of work you'l have to give up your dole money for the privellage!

sunnyside

OP you should be thanking people for pointing out the problems with your plan. That way you can address these problems before presenting your ideas officially somewhere. Bit like the Dragon's Den:)

easyeason3 wrote: »

• Answering calls for ISPCC or Samaritans

Would you not need some form of qualification in counselling or social studies to be suitable for this? If not how does someone go about volunteering for this?

EastWallGirl wrote: »

I think it's an excellent idea. Volunteering for example will

1) Give structure to your day.

2) Allow you to get experience if you have a skills gap

3) Help you get an additional reference (you may not be on good terms with a previous employer).
.

Some charities are getting a bit annoyed with this new breed of volunteer who is only there to pass the day/avail of free training/meet people/put it on the CV. In the past volunteers have been people with the sole objective of helping. They worked hard and never expected recognition. Organisations like Childline/Cura/Samaritans have to invest money in training volunteers. This money comes from fundraising and it's unfair on the charity to invest in someone who will probably disappear when the economy improves.

easyeason3 wrote: »

The government wouldn't be employing them as such so there would be no contract, verbal or written, to be honoured.
Existing employess would still have a job but there would be someone there to ease the workload.

Someone would have to pay for insurance for the volunteer staff.

ahara wrote: »

OP, I'm in my 30s and signed on for the first time ever 3 weeks ago.

I intend spending my time on the dole by staying in bed until after midday in order to avoid having my day ruined yet again by inadvertantly overhearing Gerry ****in Ryan. This will be followed by afternoons and evenings spent doing the things I like doing but was too tired to do at the weekends when I was working.

I'm not at all lazy but theres no way on Earth I'd volunteer to work for free picking up rubbish or such like.

Sounds like you need to get yourself a hobby. Grab some cheap cans and join me and my new chums down at the bookies

easyeason3 wrote: »

If this is a p!ss take then take it somewhere else.
If you are serious then I feel very sorry for you.

I feel more jealous than sorry, I have the equivalent of dole left to spend after mortgage. Being unemployed isn't the end of the world, enjoy the positives like staying in bed on a wet morning. Relax a bit like this guy.

Lil Kitten wrote: »

OP, I think it would be an excellent idea, especially for community links.

Here are some things that require volunteers:

Reading to children at the library

• Visiting the elderly in nursing homes or helping with Meals on Wheels

• Working in the second hand shops sorting clothes/ items for sale

• Volunteering in inner city schools

• Working in youth centres as a leader

• Working at a homeless shelter

• Answering calls for ISPCC or Samaritans

• Helping in animal shelters

• Playing with the sick children in Temple Street hospital

Loads of those involve working with children so would need Garda checks, again more expense to taxpayer.

OP you do sound very proactive and I commend that. You have to accept that plenty of people are happy to do nothing or fill their time with things of personal benefit to them, study, gym. Lots of others are like you. Maybe you should try politics, stand in the local elections and use all your ideas and enthusiasm to represent the unemployed.

Good luck.

red-demon

Disease Ridden wrote: »

As far as I'm aware its illegal to be engaged in any form of work including voluntary while you're on the dole; so if you want to legally do any sort of work you'l have to give up your dole money for the privellage!

Its illegal to do voluntary work? so is it illegal to cut the grass? pick up litter etc.?

Rowley Birkin QC

I looked into this as I've been offered an unpaid work placement in the profession I'm qualifying in this year and the Social Welfare consider it as being unavailable for work.:mad::mad:

sunnyside

red-demon wrote: »

Its illegal to do voluntary work? so is it illegal to cut the grass? pick up litter etc.?

I don't understand that either. Or the thing about calling to someone's aunt for tea earlier in the thread. You're still available for work and could drop any of these activities at short notice to go to a job that became available

What about all the unemployed in the coffee shops and gyms and bookies during the day. Using these facilities and spending money doing so boosts the economy so they are helping other people keep their jobs. My local coffee shop seems to be full of newly unemployed every day. They aren't spending much but a constant flow of people spending €3 on a coffee is keeping that place in business. I don't go to gym's or bookies but I expect the same is happening there.

Pete P Peterson

CAPSLOCK365 wrote: »

Couldn't agree more. We should get them to tar the roads, cut ditches and so on. We could chain them all together as well.

And blindfold them.... Of course.

Spudmonkey

Just wanted to say fair play to you EasyEason, I knew that there were some people out there not willing to sit on their ar*es and do nothing. I posted on a thread a number of weeks ago about something similar but was shot down. We need more people with a get up and go attitude rather than the "I'm entitled to it so why should I bother attitude"

It really does make me wonder how we are going to get out of this recession. We need more people who are willing to work and are willing to make a difference. Problem is that those is power don't have the balls to introduce such a scheme as it would effect their ratings at the poles!

Also to those who sleep in late in the mornings and grab a few cans before heading to "da" bookies, doesn't sound like ye are spening all yer time looking for jobs!

EastWallGirl

I start my voluntary work this week. Four hours. How anyone can think that I do not have time to job hunt between these 4 hours is a mystery.

I need the experience to get the job I want, and I think Social Welfare are being very stupid.

I have told the organisation that I may have to drop the sessions if I get a job at short notice and they are fine with it, just want one-two days notice.

I think volunteering helps with your self esteem and gives you a routine and if you are changing career (me) is very valauble for experience.

EastWallGirl

bigkev49 wrote: »

I looked into this as I've been offered an unpaid work placement in the profession I'm qualifying in this year and the Social Welfare consider it as being unavailable for work.:mad::mad:

Big Kev

Try and work something out with your company, keep applying for other jobs, may be do the job volunteering for 2-3 days a week, leaving two for resumes and job interviews, and do not bring it up with Social Welfare again.

Good Luck

Noopti

It is a good idea, but it would need to be very well organised and tracked.
If you have been working full time for a while and are suddenly made redundant the money you get (Job Seekers Benefit) is basically paid for with the money you have been paying out on PRSI while you were working. (As far as I understand it anyway)

So you aren't being paid for nothing. You are getting back money you paid to cover for such an eventuality. These people should not have to work for that money, as they already have. They should be given this money and be allowed to work full time on trying to find a job.

The proposal from the OP should be applied to people on Job Seekers Allowance, which is given to people who have too little or no PRSI built up. So they are given an allowance by the government which is means tested.

Good idea, but I wonder would it also be hard to implement.

Spudmonkey

bigkev49 wrote: »

I looked into this as I've been offered an unpaid work placement in the profession I'm qualifying in this year and the Social Welfare consider it as being unavailable for work.:mad::mad:

How ridiculous is this, some-one who wants to work but told they can't? Try and work something out with the company you are dealing with, it will benefit you in the long run as it will look like you are eager.. Who knows, they might even take you on full time!

Fighting Irish

in theory its a great idea, but in practice....


i love to see people filling potholes etc

these days most of the CC workers I see are fixing up flower beds and ****