Are Nigerians really that bad

maninasia

I see, you just don't like what I am saying, you have nothing of substance to add to the debate. I'm not getting side-tracked into what are the conditions for asylum, suffice to say that it is blood well obvious they should be prioritised to people from Somalia, Iraq, Congo and Sudan...and a whole host of other countries.

djpbarry

maninasia wrote: »

…I went to the passport office and I had two Nigerian ladies standing in front of me screaming at the staff to 'give them their passports' (pre 2004) with their babies in the buggy beside them.

And that proves what exactly?

maninasia wrote: »

The system is flawed because it allowed Nigerians and others to migrate under 'asylum rules'…

I don’t know what you mean by this? Are you saying that there are Nigerians in Ireland who have been granted refugee status who were not entitled to it?

maninasia wrote: »

…while asylum should be given to war-torn country refugees, of which there are MILLIONS worldwide who live in desperate conditions.

A country does not have to be “war-torn” for it to produce genuine asylum seekers and/or refugees, e.g. Iran, Pakistan, Serbia.

maninasia wrote: »

It has tightened up now of course.

What has “tightened up”? Are you saying that asylum law has recently been changed in this country?

Papad

djpbarry wrote: »

And that proves what exactly?
I don’t know what you mean by this? Are you saying that there are Nigerians in Ireland who have been granted refugee status who were not entitled to it?

I would say that. And so would the people working the department working their cases. It is a matter of public record what the head of the agency who deals with asylum seekers said regarding Nigerian applicants. (You can go look it up).

djpbarry wrote: »

What has “tightened up”? Are you saying that asylum law has recently been changed in this country?

I can't see where maninasia said this, so why are you saying it?
It is obvious that they have 'tightened up' because they have caught on to most but not all of the scams used by Nigerians to claim asylum.

djpbarry

Papad wrote: »

djpbarry wrote: »

Are you saying that there are Nigerians in Ireland who have been granted refugee status who were not entitled to it?

I would say that. And so would the people working the department working their cases.

I’m guessing you have absolutely no evidence to support this claim?

Papad wrote: »

djpbarry wrote: »

Are you saying that asylum law has recently been changed in this country?

I can't see where maninasia said this, so why are you saying it?

Eh, I was asking a question.

Papad wrote: »

It is obvious that they have 'tightened up' because they have caught on to most but not all of the scams used by Nigerians to claim asylum.

What does this mean exactly? What has “tightened up”? What are these “scams” that you are referring to?

irishjohn25

i have worked and lived all over the world

and everywhere u go the same 3 names pop up

nigerian, turks and morrochans

i wonder why

15 years ago there were virtually no refugee's in ireland

but now its bloody full of them

i wonder why -

because ireland made itself wealthy -

and thats why we have so manny refugees here. rich country = free stuff

here's a few facts.

we didnt ask any of ye here - ye chose to come here
we didnt cause your problems - its not our fault


but yet here we are listening to all your problems - to hell with ye

refugees going around with all their 'sad sad' storys.

its like this

if you come to ireland and want to work, be part of our country, pay tax - most irish will welcome you

but if you want to come here, live off the system, OUR TAX MONEY - then to hell with you - the sooner you are deported the better

i am not a raceist based on the color of skin - I HATE ANY BASTA$% WHO COMES TO OUR COUNTRY TO LIVE OF THE STATE

So add to this country or get out

thats it

Bubs101

irishjohn25 wrote: »

i have worked and lived all over the world

and everywhere u go the same 3 names pop up

nigerian, turks and morrochans

i wonder why

15 years ago there were virtually no refugee's in ireland

but now its bloody full of them

i wonder why -

because ireland made itself wealthy -

and thats why we have so manny refugees here. rich country = free stuff

here's a few facts.

we didnt ask any of ye here - ye chose to come here
we didnt cause your problems - its not our fault


but yet here we are listening to all your problems - to hell with ye

refugees going around with all their 'sad sad' storys.

its like this

if you come to ireland and want to work, be part of our country, pay tax - most irish will welcome you

but if you want to come here, live off the system, OUR TAX MONEY - then to hell with you - the sooner you are deported the better

i am not a raceist based on the color of skin - I HATE ANY BASTA$% WHO COMES TO OUR COUNTRY TO LIVE OF THE STATE

So add to this country or get out

thats it

I love the way so many Irish have absolutely no sympathy with people moving from countries that are in the ****ter to purer pastures considering our history

irishjohn25

yeh - well how many times have u ever heard irish complain about
the chinese who came to ireland

never

why - they work - they do their bit

they came here - and worked, bettered themselves and added to the irish
country with their resturants

and no irish complain

and the chinese have been here longer than the 'poor refugees'

oh its about culture alright

some want to work - some dont

lmtduffy

irishjohn25 wrote: »

yeh - well how many times have u ever heard irish complain about
the chinese who came to ireland

never

why - they work - they do their bit

they came here - and worked, bettered themselves and added to the irish
country with their resturants

and no irish complain

and the chinese have been here longer than the 'poor refugees'

oh its about culture alright

some want to work - some dont

you do know people who are having their application processed )this can take many years) are not allowed work so are forced on to state benefits,oh and Ireland first official refugees were Vietnamese,

lmtduffy

maninasia wrote: »

I see, you just don't like what I am saying, you have nothing of substance to add to the debate. I'm not getting side-tracked into what are the conditions for asylum, suffice to say that it is blood well obvious they should be prioritised to people from Somalia, Iraq, Congo and Sudan...and a whole host of other countries.

all I asked was for you to explain what you meant by the "asylum rules" that allow Nigerians to migrate,

so before you jump down my throat, relax and if you have anything of "substance to add" please explain the term?

djpbarry

irishjohn25 wrote: »

15 years ago there were virtually no refugee's in ireland

but now its bloody full of them

Full of them? Hardly. At year-end 2007, Ireland had 9,333 refugees – about 2.1 for every thousand people in the country.

irishjohn25 wrote: »

and thats why we have so manny refugees here. rich country = free stuff

Ooooh, free stuff. I like free stuff. If my application for asylum in Ireland is successful, what “free stuff” am I entitled to?

irishjohn25 wrote: »

yeh - well how many times have u ever heard irish complain about
the chinese who came to Ireland

Quite a few times, actually.

irishjohn25 wrote: »

why - they work - they do their bit

All of them? No Chinese slackers whatsoever? No Chinese criminals? Every single one of them is a model citizen, eh?

You don’t generalise much, do you?

irishjohn25 wrote: »

they came here - and worked, bettered themselves and added to the irish
country with their restaurants

:rolleyes: Yeah, the “Chinese” food in Ireland is fan-****ing-tastic - I’d love to see how long Charlie’s would last in New York.

irishjohn25 wrote: »

and the chinese have been here longer than the 'poor refugees'

Are there no Chinese refugees?

alegrabaroque

Who is a Nigerian? I just noticed today, while thinking about this thread, a nigerian girl in the library in college who was heavily pregnant. She has been here since she was young. So I would consider her Irish at this stage ....and her child will be second generation Irish?

So I reckon we`ve arrived at this arguement far to late have commited ourselves and will have to embrace our ethnic diversity as is.

Maybe lock the doors now thou?

Papad

djpbarry wrote: »

I’m guessing you have absolutely no evidence to support this claim?
Eh, I was asking a question.
What does this mean exactly? What has “tightened up”? What are these “scams” that you are referring to?

You ask a lot of questions, but then again that's what the people you represent do too.

If you want to know more about these scams, you should ask the OP (who is Nigerian) because I do not think you would believe me (because I am Irish).

I have been working part time as an interpreter for various law firms and refugee services for about 6 months now and the emotions I have felt are ones of bewilderment,shock,and anxiety after listening to a lot of unscrupulous claims by people who would say anything just to stay in Ireland.Professionally I am not allowed to make comments or make any judgements relating to their stories but I literarily refrain myself from laughing out loud during the interviews because I know that almost 99.99999% ( do the maths) of the claims are absolutely false and mostly laughable.

Bubs101

alegrabaroque wrote: »

Maybe lock the doors now thou?

if we lock the doors how in the **** will I leave

alegrabaroque

Bubs101 wrote: »

if we lock the doors how in the **** will I leave

Lol!lol! don`t leave the future is bright moving forward don`t ye know?!

djpbarry

Papad wrote: »

You ask a lot of questions, but then again that's what the people you represent do too.

What? The people I represent? I don’t represent anyone other than myself.

Papad wrote: »

If you want to know more about these scams, you should ask the OP (who is Nigerian) because I do not think you would believe me (because I am Irish).

I might believe you if you can produce some evidence? I’m guessing you can’t? All you’ve got to go on is anecdotes, eh?

irishjohn25

djpbarry

where u from

read this

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=59953540#post59953540

this is based on personal expeirence - greedy selfish people

hotels - completely free -

hey im irish - id love if the government paid for my car,heating , medical ,education etc. etc. etc.

but they wont - because i have to work for my keep


and i have never heard of any chinese people in trouble in ireland

any way idiots like you can scream all the bull you want -

fact is - ireland is broke now - so we will see just how long refugees want to stay in ireland.

numbers per room in the free hotels is to double within 4 months - government cant pay for ye anymore -

we will see what happens - caus its time up for the free living


irish people dont want useless lazy people here - living out of their pockets

Nodin

irishjohn25 wrote: »

djpbarry

where u from

Somewhere where english is either a primary language or well taught would be my guess. You're rather more problematic.

irishjohn25 wrote: »

hey im irish - id love if the government paid for my car,

Theres no such thing as 'de Free kar for de Asyelum seekurs'. However you may prove me wrong by linking to where I can download an application form, or some official information on the subject.

alegrabaroque

I think you might find its b and b or hostel emergency accomodation which they also pay for homeless people or people on the counsel waiting list.

Why are you being so begrudging you do realise that you were just born here by the grace of god? If you lived in a country like that what would you do?

satcie101

irishjohn25 wrote: »

hey im irish - id love if the government paid for my car


numbers per room in the free hotels is to double within 4 months - government cant pay for ye anymore -

we will see what happens - caus its time up for the free living

I just want to know who spread this rumour about the free cars about? So many people believe this is true. I think I should start a thread about this... For everyone's information this is completely false and is one of the biggest misconceptions about asylum seekers and refugees.

The number of Asylum claims have dropped in the last two years so where is the numbers to double in 4 months coming from. If your going to slag these people off have the facts to back it up.

In Ireland we follow the Geneva convention, if someone claims to be persecuted in their country they have the right to claim asylum. They stay in a hotel (yes) but the problem is the department of justice take years to process most claims which is not cost effective and in this time the asylum seeker is not allowed to work. Some of them stay five years in these centres and by the time they come out they do not know how to partake in society they are so institutionalised.

Nigeria is considered safe, for the most part that is true, but if someone comes to Ireland claiming persecution we have to process their application we not barbarics.

djpbarry

irishjohn25 wrote: »

read this

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=59953540#post59953540

Would I be right in saying that you don't know the difference between refugees and asylum seekers?

irishjohn25 wrote: »

hey im irish - id love if the government paid for my car,heating , medical ,education etc. etc. etc.

Ah, the free car fiasco - I was wondering when that would surface.

So where do they get the free cars from?

irishjohn25 wrote: »

and i have never heard of any chinese people in trouble in ireland

Oh well if you have never heard of something then it obviously doesn't exist.

irishjohn25 wrote: »

numbers per room in the free hotels is to double within 4 months...

I find this very hard to believe considering that the number of asylum applications made in this country has been declining for several years.

Ye know, if the life of the asylum seeker in this country is so wonderful, I’m quite surprised that we don’t receive far more applications. Aren’t you?

Anyways, this is all off-topic.

Papad

djpbarry wrote: »

What? The people I represent? I don’t represent anyone other than myself.
I might believe you if you can produce some evidence? I’m guessing you can’t? All you’ve got to go on is anecdotes, eh?

And of course you did not address the quote from the person (who happens to be Nigerian) who worked in the system:

I have been working part time as an interpreter for various law firms and refugee services for about 6 months now and the emotions I have felt are ones of bewilderment,shock,and anxiety after listening to a lot of unscrupulous claims by people who would say anything just to stay in Ireland.Professionally I am not allowed to make comments or make any judgements relating to their stories but I literarily refrain myself from laughing out loud during the interviews because I know that almost 99.99999% ( do the maths) of the claims are absolutely false and mostly laughable.

And then use the old 'anecdote is not sufficient' excuse, knowing well that empirical evidence is almost impossible to obtain unless they admit they lied in their asylum applications.

djpbarry

Papad wrote: »

And of course you did not address the quote from the person (who happens to be Nigerian) who worked in the system...

Actually, that’s a quote from a practically anonymous poster on a discussion forum – it’s virtually meaningless.

Papad wrote: »

And then use the old 'anecdote is not sufficient' excuse, knowing well that empirical evidence is almost impossible to obtain unless they admit they lied in their asylum applications.

I’m have enough confidence in the asylum system in this country to believe that the vast majority of recognised refugees in this country are genuine – I have no evidence that suggests otherwise. Do you?

Papad

djpbarry wrote: »

I’m have enough confidence in the asylum system in this country to believe that the vast majority of recognised refugees in this country are genuine – I have no evidence that suggests otherwise. Do you?

Irrespective of the amount of evidence I produce, it will be insufficient for you and others with similar sentiments. But for the benefit of other posters:

FOUR out of five asylum seekers have been caught making false claims. More at http://www.independent.ie/national-news/four-in-every-five-asylum-seekers-caught-out-by-language-police-1582891.html/

Also from the Independent:
Fingerprint checks on a European-wide system have revealed that more than one in 10 asylum seekers in Ireland has already claimed refugee status elsewhere in the EU. Staff from the Office of the Refugee Applications Commissioner (Orac) have tightened their scrutiny of asylum claims and are looking for tell-tale signs from application forms that the would-be refugees have already tried elsewhere.

A NIGERIAN lawyer based in Dublin has described the majority of applications for asylum status in Ireland as bogus: http://74.125.95.132/search?q=cache:yknhab0g_XQJ:https://www.tribune.ie/article/2006/jun/18/nigerian-lawyer-says-most-asylum-claims-are-false/+nigerian+asylum+ireland+false+claims&cd=10&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us&lr=lang_en

An overview of the asylum seeker situation estimated that 90 per cent of claims are bogus:
http://www.independent.ie/national-news/false-claims-help-bill-for-asylum-seekers-to-hit-8364300m-1366632.html

It is mind-boggling the amount of information out there about the abuse of the Irish asylum system. Of course, it may be a media conspiracy.

Anyone who says that they "have enough confidence in the asylum system in this country" loses all credibility in this argument.

Now back on topic. No, not all Nigerians are bad.

bug

I think anyone who knows the public service in the current financial climate would understand that it wouldnt take a law change to be more stringent in actually properly reviewing asylum cases.

Pressures of the current financial situation are making departments actually implement the policies they profess to have.

I have a number of anecdotes about the costs including doctors bills, security etc, of sending people back
to their point of entry once refused asylum, involving huge costs to the the state where carrier's refused to take individuals due to previous outbursts and safety concerns.

But, thats just what they are, anecdotes, and the money is spent, and its done.

It wouldnt take a stretch of the imagination considering the complete waste of money our government has spent in general and the mismanagement revelations recently coming to light, to realise that our business and boom orientated government had no interest in the social implications of integration and support of same.

In our effort to woo European Governances we left ourselves wide open on immigration/ asylum policies and the implementation of them.
No ones fault except our own really.
No integration or social policy for same, and a disaster socially. Racism claims all over the shop when really people just need to be introduced, understood, and integrated.

It takes a Nigerian OP to shed a small bit of light on the insights of the situaton and culture, when really our government should have
done this.

The whole situation was managed ridiculously. 51M would have done well in local community centres to introduce integration projects.

djpbarry

Papad wrote: »

djpbarry wrote: »

I’m have enough confidence in the asylum system in this country to believe that the vast majority of recognised refugees in this country are genuine – I have no evidence that suggests otherwise. Do you?

Irrespective of the amount of evidence I produce, it will be insufficient for you and others with similar sentiments. But for the benefit of other posters:

FOUR out of five asylum seekers have been caught making false claims.

So you don’t know the difference between a refugee and an asylum seeker either, eh?

biko

The terms "refugees" and "asylum seekers" are often used interchangeably but they have quite distinct meanings.

Refugees
As outlined above, refugees are victims of persecution who have been recognised as fitting the definition of a refugee contained in the 1951 Convention relating to the Status of Refugees.

Asylum Seekers
For some of the world's refugee population it is either impractical or impossible to go first to a neighbouring country and then to seek resettlement from there. This could be because the neighbouring countries are not signatories to the international laws that would ensure their protection in these countries (few countries in this region, for instance, are signatories to the Refugee Convention). It could also be because they would not be safe in a neighbouring country, in particular if that country was sympathetic to the persecutory regime. In these cases, individuals may choose to try to go directly to a country, such as Australia, where they can seek protection.

Such people are called asylum seekers.

Is this correct?

http://www.refugeecouncil.org.au/arp/faqs.html#dif-ra

Permabear

This post has been deleted.

Papad

djpbarry wrote: »

So you don’t know the difference between a refugee and an asylum seeker either, eh?

Another question with a poor retort. Deflection will not make the issues go away.

You said you have "enough confidence in the asylum system in this country", which is an indication of your inability to grasp the enormous problems in Ireland's asylum process. If the Green Party has the same views then they will never make progress as a mainstream political party. This is a major issue that needs to be addressed. Putting your heads in the sand and saying that the status quo is fine is not the solution.

djpbarry

Papad wrote: »

You said you have "enough confidence in the asylum system in this country"...

Nice selective quoting.

Are you of the opinion that there are a large number of (Nigerian) refugees in this country whose applications for asylum should have been rejected? If so, why?

Papad wrote: »

...which is an indication of your inability to grasp the enormous problems in Ireland's asylum process.

Such as? The biggest problem with our asylum process, from my perspective, is the inordinate length of time required to process applications.

What problems are you referring to? Too many successful applications for your liking?

Papad wrote: »

If the Green Party has the same views then they will never make progress as a mainstream political party. This is a major issue that needs to be addressed. Putting your heads in the sand and saying that the status quo is fine is not the solution.

What are you talking about now? What has the Green Party got to do with anything?

Permabear

This post has been deleted.