Is Fagan running Dublin or not?!

Peckham

I'm very confused. The story of his participation keeps changing all the time. When he was interviewed after Great Ireland Run he gave the impression he wasn't running Dublin, but according to the Dublin Marathon website:

Mullingar’s Martin Fagan, who yesterday came in third place in the Great Ireland run in Phoenix Park, has vowed to make up for the disappointment of losing out in the final push by not just participating in the Lifestyle Sports-adidas Dublin Marathon this October, but taking the 30th anniversary title.

Running Bing

Peckham wrote: »

I'm very confused. The story of his participation keeps changing all the time. When he was interviewed after Great Ireland Run he gave the impression he wasn't running Dublin, but according to the Dublin Marathon website:

Good question Peckham.

The story on the Dublin website seems very wishy washy to me. It doesnt seem like an official confirmation and from any interviews I have seen with Fagan he seems undecided on what he is doing.

Wouldnt be surprised if he does run but I think the website is being a bit premature tbh.

TheRoadRunner

I heard that at this moment he is not running regardless of what the DCM website says. I suppose that could change though

Frank3142

when listing his goals for 2009 on an interview in flotrack he said that he would like to qualify for Berlin and hopefully run the dublin marathon too(or something along those lines) . he sounded like he wanted to run there.

thirtyfoot

At the Q&A at Santry with athletes before the Great Run he said he hopes to run an autumn marathon (didn't specifiy where) and then Euro Cross in Dublin in December.

Full interview in Fanzone on AI website.

thirstywork

:eek:This will not happen for a number of reasons.
1.2007 and Thomas Abyu runs the time to make the Olympics but later its found out that the Dublin marathon hasn't been measured by the correct people.
The lads dreams are shattered of running int he Olympics for GB.

2.money talks and i can't see Dublin forking out ?00000euros.....

3.Fagan's goal is to break the Irish record and Dublin just aint a fast course.

4.Fagan carrying abit of a groin problem so October might not be the right time.

Rineanna

thirstywork wrote: »

3.Fagan's goal is to break the Irish record and Dublin just aint a fast course.

Eh? Sokolov ran 2.09.07 two years ago on it, and the women's race has been won in sub 2.30 times for the past three years, not to mention the 2.27.22 Kutol ran in 2003. It's no Berlin or Rotterdam but it's certainly no slouch of a course either.

2.money talks and i can't see Dublin forking out ?00000euros.....

True, but while I'm sure Fagan could do with every cent he can get to support himself full-time, he doesn't strike me as the type of guy who's obsessed with winning big prize money. In fact, I'm sure the honour of winning his home country's flagship marathon would mean quite a lot to him. Anyway, Naumov got €15,000 for winning AFAIK last October, which isn't bad. Granted Merga collected ten times that for winning Boston today, but I don't think he'd turn his nose up at what Dublin's to offer.

Hard Worker

We'll probably know the answer to the question by the end of June when Martin decides himself.
As for Dublin not being a fast course: Naumov, Sokolov, Osadchy, Abyu and Kimutai, to name but a few, have all run P.B.'s on it. So have a lot of the British girls who have come over.
Regarding prizemoney: there is also a seperate prize fund for Irish athletes, including time bonuses. If Martin Fagan was to win in a good time, he could make himself a sizeable few bob.

TheRoadRunner

Hard Worker wrote: »

As for Dublin not being a fast course: Naumov, Sokolov, Osadchy, Abyu and Kimutai, to name but a few, have all run P.B.'s on it. So have a lot of the British girls who have come over.

Isn't there still an outstanding problem with the course not being properly accredited/measured though ? so any times run on it don't count as qualifying times. Abyu missed out on the Olympics because of this and to the best of my knowledge the course is still yet to be properly measured by the appropriate authorities. I could be wrong on this.

thirstywork

spot on roadrunner.Im not saying Dublin isn't a fast course but there are alot faster.also its not the actuall prize money but the fee for actually running the race won't be enough.
You got to remember Martin really is limited to racing one marathon year.
I know he isn't the type who is greedy but he goya pay for them tattoos;)

donothoponpop

TheRoadRunner wrote: »

Isn't there still an outstanding problem with the course not being properly accredited/measured though ? so any times run on it don't count as qualifying times. Abyu missed out on the Olympics because of this and to the best of my knowledge the course is still yet to be properly measured by the appropriate authorities. I could be wrong on this.

From last year they made a big issue of the measurement to get official accreditation, think there was some posters here who saw the official measuring taking place early on a Sunday morning.

RoyMcC

TheRoadRunner wrote: »

Isn't there still an outstanding problem with the course not being properly accredited/measured though ? so any times run on it don't count as qualifying times. Abyu missed out on the Olympics because of this and to the best of my knowledge the course is still yet to be properly measured by the appropriate authorities. I could be wrong on this.

I think that's now sorted RR. Certainly the race is a member of the Association of International Marathons and Distance Races (AIMS) which has a prerequisite of course measurement by their accredited measurers - of which it appears Ireland have six.

Out of curiosity (and off-topic, sorry) does Ireland have accreditation of measurement for domestic road races generally?

shels4ever

RoyMcC wrote: »

I think that's now sorted RR. Certainly the race is a member of the Association of International Marathons and Distance Races (AIMS) which has a prerequisite of course measurement by their accredited measurers - of which it appears Ireland have six.

Out of curiosity (and off-topic, sorry) does Ireland have accreditation of measurement for domestic road races generally?

As far as I know if a race has a licence from the AAI it should have been measured, I think there are only a few people in the country who can actually do it. I maybe wrong.

TheRoadRunner

RoyMcC wrote: »

I think that's now sorted RR. Certainly the race is a member of the Association of International Marathons and Distance Races (AIMS) which has a prerequisite of course measurement by their accredited measurers - of which it appears Ireland have six.

If that's the case then great. It was mad that the course wasn't properly accredited.

I agree with thirstywork prize money alone won't be enough to entice Fagan, he probably wants an appearance fee which may be the stumbling block.

Personally I hope he doesn't run it. As much as I would love to see an Irish man win Dublin, the European cross country is only six weeks later. He has a realistic chance of medaling and I would rather see him anchor the team home.

Stupid_Private

Isn't the Abyu thing more to do with the fact that Dublin isn't on some list of marathons that you can set a qualifying time on? The list is published 2 years before the Olympics/Europeans/whatever else. If someone runs and sets a time on a course that isn't on a list is just plain stupid in my opinion. Their fault and not the course. Also wouldn't UKA be like AAI and require that an athlete informs them 2 days before making a qualification attempt? If Abyu had done that then surely someone somewhere would have told him that Dublin wasn't on the damn list!

TheRoadRunner

Stupid_Private wrote: »

Isn't the Abyu thing more to do with the fact that Dublin isn't on some list of marathons that you can set a qualifying time on? The list is published 2 years before the Olympics/Europeans/whatever else. If someone runs and sets a time on a course that isn't on a list is just plain stupid in my opinion. Their fault and not the course. Also wouldn't UKA be like AAI and require that an athlete informs them 2 days before making a qualification attempt? If Abyu had done that then surely someone somewhere would have told him that Dublin wasn't on the damn list!

Yeah I think you are right. But maybe the reason it wasn't on the list was because it wasn't properly accredited ??? I agree with you about Abyu though, he was plain stupid. In fairness to him he didn't make a big deal out of it though. He realised it was his own fault

thirstywork

"Not many people seem to know this but the Dublin course was actually short in 2007- it was officialy re-measured and as a result Thomas Abdu of GB was not allowed to run in the Olympics because his time of 2-10 could not be ratified. HughJones the International Measurement Administrator was sent to measure the Dublin course this July so it is certain to be accurate now as he had previously measured the Olympic Marathon route in Beijing. Interestingly the Dublin crowd kept very quiet about their course being short and I only heard of it over in England. At least Cork runners can be proud of the fact that all the courses they run on are completely accurate thanks to the sterling work done by Cork BHAA and John Walshe in particular........
from cork blog
http://corkrunning.blogspot.com/2008/10/marathons.html
intersting graph regaring the hilsl in Dublin also.

thirtyfoot

TheRoadRunner wrote: »

Personally I hope he doesn't run it. As much as I would love to see an Irish man win Dublin, the European cross country is only six weeks later. He has a realistic chance of medaling and I would rather see him anchor the team home.

Yep, would have to agree with that. If he is going for a glorious home soil victory, a win whether individual or team on home soil in a Championship race will live longer in the memory than a win in the DCM. He'll get diddly squat cash for Euro Cross but you would like to think that will mean more than a payday. Its a great opportunity for our distance athletes in December. I hope he is aware he may never get a chance like this again.

shels4ever

Tingle wrote: »

Yep, would have to agree with that. If he is going for a glorious home soil victory, a win whether individual or team on home soil in a Championship race will live longer in the memory than a win in the DCM. He'll get diddly squat cash for Euro Cross but you would like to think that will mean more than a payday. Its a great opportunity for our distance athletes in December. I hope he is aware he may never get a chance like this again.

+1 There will always be another DCM to run and win. When will the next time you can take a major title on home soil . Maybe even a team win too

TheRoadRunner

thirstywork wrote: »

At least Cork runners can be proud of the fact that all the courses they run on are completely accurate thanks to the sterling work done by Cork BHAA and John Walshe in particular........

Ah my old rebel friends. Any chance to get a jab at the Dubs is taken with glee

RoyMcC

TheRoadRunner wrote: »

Ah my old rebel friends. Any chance to get a jab at the Dubs is taken with glee

Up the Peoples' Republic! I trotted around the Bandon 5 in December and the starting point seemed to be a matter of mutual consent Great craic afterwards though.

Rineanna

TheRoadRunner wrote: »

I agree with thirstywork prize money alone won't be enough to entice Fagan, he probably wants an appearance fee which may be the stumbling block.

Fair enough, but I disagree. I doubt he'd turn up his nose at €15k, plus the added bonus of a win on home ground. Just my opinion, though.

thirtyfoot

TheRoadRunner wrote: »

Ah my old rebel friends. Any chance to get a jab at the Dubs is taken with glee

A chip on the shoulder will help you go a long way! Maybe they are all out measuring road races courses instead of training these days;)

TheRoadRunner

Rineanna wrote: »

Fair enough, but I disagree. I doubt he'd turn up his nose at €15k, plus the added bonus of a win on home ground. Just my opinion, though.

I don't know the guy at all but I think if I were him as was going to run Dublin I'd want a guaranteed 15k (appearance fee) and then an opportunity to increase that with a win etc. There is no guarantee he will win Dublin, it has been very competitive in recent years.

shels4ever

Just going on interview that i've seen I think his main focus is on the record and not the winning. Going on his times compared to the likes of Hall he should be capable of a sub 2:09 ?

mrak

There have been several threads on here before about people doing their best 10k 4-6 weeks after a marathon - does this work for elites as well..? Maybe he can do both.

Hard Worker

Just to clarify things regarding the comment that the Dublin course was short in 2007: it wasn't. The course was measured by two qualified course measurers and was accurate. As was pointed out by another poster, Dublin wasn't on the list of events for qualifying times and therefore, the time posted by Tomas Abyu was not accepted by UK athletics for Olympic acceptance.
The course is now on the list. It was measured last year by Hugh Jones and the two Dublin course measurers have now got the highest qualifications required ( even higher than anyone in Cork ).
Just to reiterate - the Dublin course was perfectly accurate in 2007.

TheRoadRunner

Hard Worker wrote: »

Just to reiterate - the Dublin course was perfectly accurate in 2007.

Cheers. That Cork blog smugness was annoying me

TFBubendorfer

Tingle wrote: »

Yep, would have to agree with that. If he is going for a glorious home soil victory, a win whether individual or team on home soil in a Championship race will live longer in the memory than a win in the DCM.

It probably shows my obsession with marathons, but for me it would be the other way round. A win in Dublin would stay in memory much longer than medaling at the cross country.

shels4ever

TFBubendorfer wrote: »

It probably shows my obsession with marathons, but for me it would be the other way round. A win in Dublin would stay in memory much longer than medaling at the cross country.

Ok a test
who won the world XC in limerick in 1979 ?
Who won the dublin marathon in 1980?

jlang

Hard Worker wrote: »

Just to clarify things regarding the comment that the Dublin course was short in 2007: it wasn't.
...
Just to reiterate - the Dublin course was perfectly accurate in 2007.

Phew! Really didn't want to have to admit it took me nearly 4 hours to run a Dublin mini-marathon.

TheRoadRunner

shels4ever wrote: »

Ok a test
who won the world XC in limerick in 1979 ?
Who won the dublin marathon in 1980?

Great point Shels.

thirstywork

Rineanna wrote: »

Fair enough, but I disagree. I doubt he'd turn up his nose at €15k, plus the added bonus of a win on home ground. Just my opinion, though.

Thats if he wins,anything can happen in a marathon.

thirstywork

Hard Worker wrote: »

Just to clarify things regarding the comment that the Dublin course was short in 2007: it wasn't. The course was measured by two qualified course measurers and was accurate. As was pointed out by another poster, Dublin wasn't on the list of events for qualifying times and therefore, the time posted by Tomas Abyu was not accepted by UK athletics for Olympic acceptance.
The course is now on the list. It was measured last year by Hugh Jones and the two Dublin course measurers have now got the highest qualifications required ( even higher than anyone in Cork ).
Just to reiterate - the Dublin course was perfectly accurate in 2007.

http://www.uka.org.uk/media/news/october-2007/article-26/