Ferguson vs Benitez thread

5starpool

Headshot wrote: »

im also hoping moyes does the job against chelsea, really deserves a trophy for a team on limited budget unlike the other half they've really done well

not so bad for a small club :rolleyes::rolleyes:

Rafa never called Everton a small club. He called them a smaller club, which although unfortunate in it's phrasing, is indisputible. If certain people want to twist that around and use it in press conferences years later when it is totally irrelevant to the issue at hand, then that is more a statement on their childish, idiotic way of behaving tbh.

thegen

Funny I thought this thread was about Ferguson v Benitez. It was funny at the start,but has descended into a utd v pool thread. Maybe its because Benitez had the sense this time to keep his mouth shut. So really nothing else for th utd fans to do but defend Ferguson.

Maybe Benitez wil say something today;)

spockety

Headshot wrote: »

yawn

I presume that's what Berbatov was doing when he took his dire penalty yesterday, the state of it! 32 million quid for that peno?!

Robbie keane ........................................

SOLD!

citytillidie

thegen wrote: »

Funny I thought this thread was about Ferguson v Benitez. It was funny at the start,but has descended into a utd v pool thread. Maybe its because Benitez had the sense this time to keep his mouth shut. So really nothing else for th utd fans to do but defend Ferguson.

Maybe Benitez wil say something today;)

It would be great if he did not say anything and talk only of the Arsenal game and just irgnore everything that was said by Fergie.

But then he could bring more fire to it by say Fergie should have been paying attention to the Cup semi final and not worry what big Sam has to say about me.

monkey9

Headshot wrote: »

yes ill agree with that

but what I dont like is liverpool fans question someones mentality

its very low blow

Headshot wrote: »

there stick and calling into question a mans mental health

maybe i shouldve said somthing about those gifs tbh
I think i put up the keegans body one but how can you say that has anything to do with mental health

In fairness, Headshot. What goes around, come around!

Headshot wrote: »

not as good as your other sig

rafa in a straight jacket

that was priceless

Boggles wrote: »

Or highlight them further as a reason Mad Rafa went into the rant

redout wrote: »

Jesus I just watched the Rafa rant and all I can say is the guy has lost the plot

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

I had to laugh upon hearing Rafa's comments. The guy is clearly rattled and cracking under the pressure. I bet it brought a smile to the legend's face when he heard the remarks.

ntlbell wrote: »

lol he was like a spanish bertie ahern

how embarassing..

ntlbell wrote: »

what does he do for the rest of the week?

wirte scripts on fergie?

maybe he should try learning them so he doesn't look like a dribbling bafoon on tv

ntlbell wrote: »

it's not about if he was right or wrong he looked and sounded like a 12yr old mumbling child...

ntlbell wrote: »

by fumbling around with a bit of paper couldn't even remeber what he was upset about and generally looking like a 12yr old dribbling child

very very embarassing imo

And God forbid that someone at Utd would question someone's mental health





Sir Alex Ferguson described Liverpool manager Rafa Benitez as "angry"
and "disturbed" as he responded to his title rival's attack.

Fergie saw his side move two points closer to the title leaders over the weekend, as the Reds' draw with Stoke was followed by United's victory over Chelsea this afternoon.

And speaking to Sky Sports, the United manager hit back at Benitez.

He said: "I think you've got to be careful of the venom of it. Hopefully he will reflect and understand what he said was ridiculous.

"I think he's an angry man - he's disturbed for some reason or another

Mr Alan

Boggles wrote: »

Good job so Rafa will never be in the position to challenge on all fronts

Boggles wrote: »

No, you can't say that all, unless your mystic megs son?

you, i presume are then in actual fact Mystic Megs son?

although, you were wrong about your prediction that Rafa would never challenge for the league in England. so maybe not. maybe you're just a Utd fan, who can't say anything positive about Liverpool and will kick em at every opportunity. yea, thats more likely i think.

Good work Monkey in regards to the quotes from utd fans, Headshot, now i presume you will accept how laughable your moral outrage was yesterday?

This thread is the reason i don't post in this forum at all. More sense out of a kindergarten scrap.

Ironically, it's also the reason why i lurk here nearly all the fcuking time.

purple_hatstand

SAF – “what I didn't want was to go into extra time with my strongest squad."

If SAF had put out a stronger team (ie: Rooney & Tevez in front of a decent midfield), United would have been more likely to put the game beyond Everton within an hour. Then make changes in order to rest certain players for other games.

While I am well aware that games of football are not played on bits of paper, it would appear to me that Portsmouth in the League would be a significantly more straightforward encounter than an FA Cup Semi against anybody.

His team selection yesterday was disrespectful to Everton and to the FA Cup (regardless of how well the players actually played) and just 2 days after he accuses Benitez of the same. His post-match comments blaming the pitch etc…are an insult to his own players, other teams and managers and all fans with an interest in the FA Cup/football in general. The one-eyed arrogance of this man is really quite astonishing and his comeuppance is long, long overdue.

herbieflowers

purple_hatstand wrote: »

His team selection yesterday was disrespectful to Everton and to the FA Cup (regardless of how well the players actually played) and just 2 days after he accuses Benitez of the same. His post-match comments blaming the pitch etc…are an insult to his own players, other teams and managers and all fans with an interest in the FA Cup/football in general. The one-eyed arrogance of this man is really quite astonishing and his comeuppance is long, long overdue.

I'm sorry, but how was his team selection disrespectful? Judging by the fact that they should've won the game, and matched Everton, and only lost by the lottery that is penalties, I can't see how it was disrespectful. He put a team out there which he thought could win the game, and they very nearly did.

Karmafaerie

Great post monkey.

Karmafaerie

herbieflowers wrote: »

I'm sorry, but how was his team selection disrespectful? Judging by the fact that they should've won the game, and matched Everton, and only lost by the lottery that is penalties, I can't see how it was disrespectful. He put a team out there which he thought could win the game, and they very nearly did.

So what you're saying is it was Fergies rotation policy that failed him.

When will he learn.

herbieflowers

Karmafaerie wrote: »

So what you're saying is it was Fergies rotation policy that failed him.

When will he learn.

They lost on penalties. That can happen to any team on any given day. It's a lottery (well, except for the Germans ).

Karmafaerie

monkey9 wrote: »

Sir Alex Ferguson described Liverpool manager Rafa Benitez as "angry"
and "disturbed" as he responded to his title rival's attack.

Fergie saw his side move two points closer to the title leaders over the weekend, as the Reds' draw with Stoke was followed by United's victory over Chelsea this afternoon.

And speaking to Sky Sports, the United manager hit back at Benitez.

He said: "I think you've got to be careful of the venom of it. Hopefully he will reflect and understand what he said was ridiculous.

"I think he's an angry man - he's disturbed for some reason or another

Beyond the pale.

Karmafaerie

herbieflowers wrote: »

They lost on penalties. That can happen to any team on any given day. It's a lottery (well, except for the Germans ).

But if it was Rafa, then it would be blamed on his rotation policy.

UTD were unlucky to loose yesterday.
But if they had fielded a stronger team, they would have had more a chance of winning.
Ferguson made the choice to field a weaker side.
Now he has to accept the responsibility.

The only reason that people are saying it wsa showing disrespect to Everton, is that alex chose to dig up a misquote from 3 years ago, for no other reason than to take a dig at Rafa.
If he hadn't done this, nobody would mention the idea of disrespect.
Again, Ferguson's choice.
Again he has to accept the responsibility.

Boggles

Karmafaerie wrote: »

Ferguson made the choice to field a weaker side.

It was a weaker side but not a weak team, 7 established internationals and some of the best youth players I have seen in a decade.

Dave!

FYI Moyes was also critical of the pitch
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/8006546.stm

Speaking to BBC Radio 5 Live, Moyes added: "I thought it looked very spongy and a poor playing surface - not in a way that it was all bobbles and divots but it just looked as if it was very soft, spongy and quite slow at times."

JPA

FFS lads, this is going absolutely nowhere.

purple_hatstand

herbieflowers wrote: »

I'm sorry, but how was his team selection disrespectful? Judging by the fact that they should've won the game, and matched Everton, and only lost by the lottery that is penalties, I can't see how it was disrespectful. He put a team out there which he thought could win the game, and they very nearly did.

You've taken less than half of what I posted and quoted it in isolation. The point I was making (and quite well, I thought) was based on SAF's post-match quote which I stuck at the top of my post. I also put certain key words of my reply in bold to avoid confusion. Please reread.

herbieflowers

purple_hatstand wrote: »

You've taken less than half of what I posted and quoted it in isolation. The point I was making (and quite well, I thought) was based on SAF's post-match quote which I stuck at the top of my post. I also put certain key words of my reply in bold to avoid confusion. Please reread.

you mentioned that you thought his selection was "disrespectful". I replied to that statement.

Karmafaerie

Boggles wrote: »

It was a weaker side but not a weak team, 7 established internationals and some of the best youth players I have seen in a decade.

You do see in the quote of mine that you made there that I did say "weaker" right.
Cause it's quite obvious that I did.

If I'd meant to say weak, then I would have, but I didn't I said weaker, cause, as you said, it was by no means a weak side.

It was simply not the strongest he could have fielded.
He made the choice.
He has to accept it.

Boggles

Karmafaerie wrote: »

It was simply not the strongest he could have fielded.
He made the choice.
He has to accept it.

Why? Has he not accepted it, does Ferguson think United are in the Fa cup final?

Priority is the League and Champions League, he played the best team he could under the circumstances.

Can you understand that? Because I will explain it in full detail for you if you don't.

CoachBoone

I think we should keep this thread and treat it like a creche.

It seems to be keeping the arguments about United and Liverpool out of the other threads. Im all for it.

Karmafaerie

Boggles wrote: »

Why? Has he not accepted it, does Ferguson think United are in the Fa cup final?

Priority is the League and Champions League, he played the best team he could under the circumstances.

Can you understand that? Because I will explain it in full detail for you if you don't.

:rolleyes:

Karmafaerie wrote: »

But if it was Rafa, then it would be blamed on his rotation policy.

UTD were unlucky to loose yesterday.
But if they had fielded a stronger team, they would have had more a chance of winning.
Ferguson made the choice to field a weaker side.
Now he has to accept the responsibility.

The only reason that people are saying it wsa showing disrespect to Everton, is that alex chose to dig up a misquote from 3 years ago, for no other reason than to take a dig at Rafa.
If he hadn't done this, nobody would mention the idea of disrespect.
Again, Ferguson's choice.
Again he has to accept the responsibility.

purple_hatstand

herbieflowers wrote: »

you mentioned that you thought his selection was "disrespectful". I replied to that statement.

I think an FA Cup Semi-Final is a show-piece deserving the talents of the best players from the four teams involved, all showing a genuine desire to win a trophy for their club.

I believe the FA Cup is devalued if a manager decides to leave most of his best players at home for a Semi-Final.

I believe the FA Cup is devalued if a manager decides to take his team to a different competition in a foreign country (as he did a few years ago) instead of competing in it at all.

I also think that if SAF had played his strongest side yesterday, and yesterday's team against Portsmouth this Wednesday, he would have had a better chance of winning both matches.

Highsider

Boggles wrote: »

Why? Has he not accepted it, does Ferguson think United are in the Fa cup final?

Priority is the League and Champions League, he played the best team he could under the circumstances.

Can you understand that? Because I will explain it in full detail for you if you don't.

But Chelsea are going for everything also and they did'nt disrespect the FA cup like ferguson did yesterday. His best team under the circumstances was his best players and he did'nt play them.

jesus_thats_gre

http://www.football365.com/story/0,17033,8652_5214252,00.html

Sir Alex Ferguson has no concerns about the team Arsene Wenger will pick for Arsenal's key Premier League clash with Liverpool at Anfield on Tuesday.

A point for Rafael Benitez's men will be enough to send them top once more, even though they will have played two games more than Manchester United.

However, Arsenal's chances of avoiding defeat could be adversely affected if Wenger decides to make a significant number of changes to the team defeated by Chelsea in the FA Cup semi-final on Saturday.

Having fielded a virtual second team himself against Everton at Wembley, Ferguson is hardly in a position to complain.

In any case, he does not believe any team Wenger sends into battle will lack hunger, which is why he is confident Arsenal will give Liverpool a stern test.

"I don't know what Arsene will be thinking about tomorrow but no matter what, Arsenal always try," said Ferguson.

"That is the mantra of Arsene himself. He is a winner.

"Providing they try, it is all I can ask for."

However, Ferguson recognises the most important task for his team this week is to beat Portsmouth at Old Trafford on Wednesday.

After winning their last two games to end a two-match losing streak, the Red Devils are in the happy position of knowing they can afford to slip up once on their seven game run-in and still complete a Premier League title hat-trick.

"I am not concerned about Tuesday's game," he said, referring to Arsenal's visit to Anfield.

"I will concern myself with my own team. That is enough for me to think about."

He seems to be trying to take Wenger under his wing now

Boggles

Highsider wrote: »

But Chelsea are going for everything also and they did'nt disrespect the FA cup like ferguson did yesterday. His best team under the circumstances was his best players and he did'nt play them.

Dear God. :rolleyes:

How many games more have United played than Chelsea, they also have 7 left in the league opposed to nearly everyone else having 6.

NabyLadistheman

Boggles wrote: »

Dear God. :rolleyes:

How many games more have United played than Chelsea, they also have 7 left in the league opposed to nearly everyone else having 6.

Pity about them. Ya talk of winning everything & been untouchable then deal with it

Boggles

torresistheman wrote: »

Pity about them. Ya talk of winning everything & been untouchable then deal with it

Jaysus, did people spend too much time out in the sun at the weekend?

Mr Alan

Martin Samuel wrote:

It's a joke to pick on Rafa The League Managers Association would gain considerably more credibility if they did not appear to exist as the fiefdom of Mr. Ferguson, the Manchester United manager, and friends. The sight of Ferguson and Sam Allardyce, of Blackburn Rovers, ganging up on Rafael Benitez, the Liverpool manager, last week was laughable, the idea that Benitez's gestures at Anfield during Liverpool's win over Blackburn were disrespectful even more so. Indeed, watching this alleged slight, Benitez (above) appears to be laughing at himself for advising against a move that led to a goal or telling his players now to go steady and close the game down. If he was saying the match was over at 2-0, as Allardyce and Ferguson suggested, though, he is no bad judge: it ended 4-0. Ferguson says previous Liverpool managers would not have acted like that and he is right. Previous Liverpool managers would never have been 2-0 up after 30 minutes against an awkward side like Blackburn. This may be what Ferguson liked most about them.

Oliver Kay wrote:

In his remarkably candid diary of the 1996-97 season, Will to Win, a pre-knighted Alex Ferguson wrote of his shock upon hearing, en route to the funeral of an eminent Scottish sportswriter, of Kevin Keegan’s resignation as Newcastle United manager. He turned on the radio and, after hearing confirmation, grew frustrated at the crass discussion that ensued, leaving him to wonder what had happened to the art of sports journalism.

Ferguson likes to regard himself as a crusader against the twin evils of sensationalism and knee-jerk reactions, even writing to media outlets to demand that we all get back to talking about football, rather than whipping up storms where none exists. Then he goes and spoils it all by saying something stupid like his bizarre and, frankly, embarrassing latest tirade against Rafael Benítez, the Liverpool manager.

It was only a week earlier that Ferguson was snorting at Benítez’s apparent obsession with him — “he’s got a European tie against Chelsea and he’s talking about Alex Ferguson! Fantastic!” Journalists laughed along with the Manchester United manager, as we often do, but seven days later, he embarked, unprompted, on yet another rant against Benítez.


First, Ferguson dredged up a comment that Benítez had made about Everton in February 2007, “which points to his arrogance”. Then, more hilarious still, he talked of the “absolute contempt” that Benítez showed to Sam Allardyce with a gesture during his team’s 4-0 victory over Blackburn Rovers, saying: “I don’t think any other Liverpool manager would ever have done that.”

Journalists sprinted to their laptops, going straight to YouTube in search of the despicable act that took Benítez “beyond the pale”. What they found was not even trivial, never mind offensive.

Ferguson is a genius, a manager whose achievements with United and, before that, Aberdeen demand the greatest reverence, but he is also capable of the most breathtaking hypocrisy. If he wishes to cast Benítez in an unflattering light he should ask himself whether the late Sir Matt Busby, for example, would have resorted to such low and misguided blows against a fellow manager or indeed against referees or the game’s authorities or just about anyone who ever dares to cross him.

It is a different game these days. The constant media pressure makes life difficult for managers and at times whips up unedifying spats. But never let Ferguson tell anyone that he is somehow above this mudslinging. When it suits him, he is as guilty as anyone of creating the kind of sensationalism that he claims to despise.

James Lawton wrote:

As a student of American politics, and an interviewee of David Frost, Mr. Ferguson will be aware of the killer line in the recent Frost/Nixon movie. Pressed on his role in Watergate, Richard Nixon utters his self-serving justification that reveals his megalomania: "When the President does it, that means it's not illegal."

Let's take that theory and apply it to modern English football. How do we know when a Premier League manager is acting with arrogance and contempt? When Ferguson says he is, of course. Or, when Ferguson spots an innocuous gesture from Rafael Benitez, whom he happens to despise, towards Sam Allardyce, who has proved his unwavering acolyte. That is Ferguson's Nixon principle: it is because I say it is. And how could we be so stupid as to argue with him?

In applying the Ferguson/Nixon principle on arrogant behaviour between managers, suddenly things become a lot clearer. For instance, there was no arrogance involved when Ferguson picked Paul Scholes for a Premier League game against Middlesbrough in September 2002, having first withdrawn him from Sven Goran Eriksson's England squad. It was by no means humiliating for Eriksson to be sat in the Old Trafford stand when this took place.

Anyway, Ferguson was never contemptuous of Eriksson, especially not when he mimicked his Swedish accent and stock answers in a magazine interview in 2003. "He sails along, nobody falls out with him," Ferguson said of Eriksson at the time. "He comes out and he says: 'The first half we were good, second half we were not so good. I am very pleased with the result.'"

Arrogant and contemptuous attitudes were right off the menu when Ferguson's players and staff were aggressive, hostile, abusive and provocative in a confrontation with Chelsea's groundsmen last April. That was not my description but that of the Football Association independent commission that found overwhelmingly in Chelsea's favour in December over that incident. Presumably the QC in question, Nicholas Stewart, had not applied the Ferguson/Nixon principle. What the hell was he thinking?

It is a talent peculiar to men like Ferguson, to see things exclusively their own way. When Ferguson described Benitez's "game over" gesture against Blackburn Rovers on Friday, he said it was "beyond the pale", as if the Liverpool manager had sneakily executed a Nazi salute in Sam Allardyce's direction. At most, Benitez just looked like a harassed supply teacher trying to restore order.

Remarkably, Ferguson claims that he spotted Benitez's gesture towards Allardyce himself, which must have taken a lot of rewinding and pausing of his Sky+ as he scrutinised Benitez's conduct for something that could be considered controversial. Not since Mary Whitehouse has the television age known someone so easily offended.

The more obvious explanation is that Allardyce told Ferguson about it, largely because Allardyce is a very enthusiastic disciple. Other managers such as Mark Hughes, Steve Bruce, Roy Keane – even yesterday's opponent, David Moyes – have sought to put some distance between themselves and Ferguson. They are well aware that however chummy, if Ferguson wants something – your best player for instance – then it will be business as usual.

Perhaps the most laughable aspect of Ferguson's justification for his attack on Benitez: that Allardyce was undeserving of it because of his sound work for the League Managers' Association, as if that organisation was – at that very moment – endeavouring to solve Africa's poverty and bring peace to the Middle East. Perhaps with Big Sam in the vanguard, uniting warring factions through lectures on ProZone stats and the necessity of having a club nutritionist.

The LMA doubtless does much good work, but membership of it does not alone necessarily confer righteousness. It has, like any professional organisation, its own self-interest. The great irony is that the serving England manager is given the honorary title of LMA president and when all the backslapping is done, that same LMA president has to fight against the LMA's leading members withdrawing their players for international friendlies.

It is not impossible to discern why a foreign manager such as Benitez feels an element of distrust towards the LMA, especially when it is used against him by Ferguson in arguments such as the one the United manager ignited on Friday. Ferguson may have a polite tradition of writing to every new young manager who joins the profession, but that avuncular style is not exclusive to him. In the only interview he has given since leaving Sunderland, Keane singled out Benitez as a manager who had been generous with his time.

Contempt, arrogance – these are every manager's stock in trade when the moment requires it. When Ferguson refused to shake the hand of Claude Puel after United's defeat to Lille in the Champions League in 2005, the French manager might well have regarded that as arrogant. Ferguson's dismissal of Manchester City this season – "still lingering in mid-table" – was not dissimilar to Benitez's "small club" jibe at Everton.

What Ferguson is attempting to do is to isolate Benitez because he clearly senses a hardening of feeling towards the Spaniard among his managerial cronies. It also suits him to do so as the season reaches its conclusion with Liverpool still very much in the running.

It is all the familiar mind games, the usual nonsense. But let's be clear about one thing: giving Big Sam a bit of stick does not make Benitez arrogant. Even if Ferguson proclaims it so.

few articles on the subject.

BaZmO*

If Liverpool win the PL this year Rafa will be hailed as a mindgames master and likewise, if Utd. win the PL this year Fergie will once again be hailed as the mindgames master.

The funniest part is watching both sets of fans getting so roiled up with their comments.

SlickRic

torresistheman wrote: »

Pity about them. Ya talk of winning everything & been untouchable then deal with it

Boggles is arguing that they needed to rest players because they're in everything.

decide what you're slating utd for, rather than just blanket bombing and hoping something sticks.

for the record, i don't think fergie needed to rest that many players; a couple maybe, but not that many. but they nearly did it so whose arguing? Yes, Fergie would have had a better chance of winning with his better players on the pitch but he took a calculated risk because of what he's prioritising.

I'd have expected Rafa to do the exact same thing. Fans hate it, because they want to see the best players every game so that they can win every game in all competitions.

Karmafaerie

jesus_thats_gre wrote: »

http://www.football365.com/story/0,17033,8652_5214252,00.html



He seems to be trying to take Wenger under his wing now

He also seems to completely contradict himself.

I don't know what Arsene will be thinking about tomorrow but no matter what, Arsenal always try," said Ferguson.

"That is the mantra of Arsene himself. He is a winner.

"Providing they try, it is all I can ask for


Followed by


"I am not concerned about Tuesday's game," he said, referring to Arsenal's visit to Anfield.

"I will concern myself with my own team. That is enough for me to think about."

monkey9

Independent.ie


By Sam Wallace


Monday April 20 2009

As a student of American politics, and an interviewee of David Frost, Sir Alex Ferguson will be aware of the killer line in the recent Frost/Nixon movie. Pressed on his role in Watergate, Richard Nixon utters his self-serving justification that reveals his megalomania: "When the President does it, that means it's not illegal."

Let's take that theory and apply it to modern English football. How do we know when a Premier League manager is acting with arrogance and contempt? When Ferguson says he is, of course. Or, when Ferguson spots an innocuous gesture from Rafael Benitez, whom he happens to despise, towards Sam Allardyce, who has proved his unwavering acolyte. That is Ferguson's Nixon principle: it is because I say it is. And how could we be so stupid as to argue with him?


In applying the Ferguson/Nixon principle on arrogant behaviour between managers, suddenly things become a lot clearer. For instance, there was no arrogance involved when Ferguson picked Paul Scholes for a Premier League game against Middlesbrough in September 2002, having first withdrawn him from Sven Goran Eriksson's England squad. It was by no means humiliating for Eriksson to be sat in the Old Trafford stand when this took place.


Anyway, Ferguson was never contemptuous of Eriksson, especially not when he mimicked his Swedish accent and stock answers in a magazine interview in 2003. "He sails along, nobody falls out with him," Ferguson said of Eriksson at the time. "He comes out and he says: 'The first half we were good, second half we were not so good. I am very pleased with the result.'"


Arrogant and contemptuous attitudes were right off the menu when Ferguson's players and staff were aggressive, hostile, abusive and provocative in a confrontation with Chelsea's groundsmen last April. That was not my description but that of the Football Association independent commission that found overwhelmingly in Chelsea's favour in December over that incident. Presumably the QC in question, Nicholas Stewart, had not applied the Ferguson/Nixon principle. What the hell was he thinking?


It is a talent peculiar to men like Ferguson, to see things exclusively their own way. When Ferguson described Benitez's "game over" gesture against Blackburn Rovers on Friday, he said it was "beyond the pale", as if the Liverpool manager had sneakily executed a Nazi salute in Sam Allardyce's direction. At most, Benitez just looked like a harassed supply teacher trying to restore order.


Remarkably, Ferguson claims that he spotted Benitez's gesture towards Allardyce himself, which must have taken a lot of rewinding and pausing of his Sky+ as he scrutinised Benitez's conduct for something that could be considered controversial. Not since Mary Whitehouse has the television age known someone so easily offended.


The more obvious explanation is that Allardyce told Ferguson about it, largely because Allardyce is a very enthusiastic disciple. Other managers such as Mark Hughes, Steve Bruce, Roy Keane – even yesterday's opponent, David Moyes – have sought to put some distance between themselves and Ferguson. They are well aware that however chummy, if Ferguson wants something – your best player for instance – then it will be business as usual.


Perhaps the most laughable aspect of Ferguson's justification for his attack on Benitez: that Allardyce was undeserving of it because of his sound work for the League Managers' Association, as if that organisation was – at that very moment – endeavouring to solve Africa's poverty and bring peace to the Middle East. Perhaps with Big Sam in the vanguard, uniting warring factions through lectures on ProZone stats and the necessity of having a club nutritionist.


The LMA doubtless does much good work, but membership of it does not alone necessarily confer righteousness. It has, like any professional organisation, its own self-interest. The great irony is that the serving England manager is given the honorary title of LMA president and when all the backslapping is done, that same LMA president has to fight against the LMA's leading members withdrawing their players for international friendlies.


It is not impossible to discern why a foreign manager such as Benitez feels an element of distrust towards the LMA, especially when it is used against him by Ferguson in arguments such as the one the United manager ignited on Friday. Ferguson may have a polite tradition of writing to every new young manager who joins the profession, but that avuncular style is not exclusive to him. In the only interview he has given since leaving Sunderland, Keane singled out Benitez as a manager who had been generous with his time.


Contempt, arrogance – these are every manager's stock in trade when the moment requires it. When Ferguson refused to shake the hand of Claude Puel after United's defeat to Lille in the Champions League in 2005, the French manager might well have regarded that as arrogant. Ferguson's dismissal of Manchester City this season – "still lingering in mid-table" – was not dissimilar to Benitez's "small club" jibe at Everton.


What Ferguson is attempting to do is to isolate Benitez because he clearly senses a hardening of feeling towards the Spaniard among his managerial cronies. It also suits him to do so as the season reaches its conclusion with Liverpool still very much in the running.


It is all the familiar mind games, the usual nonsense. But let's be clear about one thing: giving Big Sam a bit of stick does not make Benitez arrogant. Even if Ferguson proclaims it so.

Boggles

monkey9 wrote: »

What Ferguson is attempting to do is to isolate Benitez because he clearly senses a hardening of feeling towards the Spaniard among his managerial cronies. It also suits him to do so as the season reaches its conclusion with Liverpool still very much in the running.

What utter twaddle.

Hate to break it to ye Scouse fans, but Liverpool arn't anywhere near Uniteds main rivals this season.

We have to play Arsenal 3 times, including the semi finals of the biggest competition of them all, Chelsea for me are still the danger in the league, they are looking the real deal under Hiddinck, and could potentially be up against United again in the final of the CL.

Liverpool had their chance this year, out of all cup competitions early, fair play to the merseysiders, 5 points ahead in the league now coming into the last few games potentially 4 points behind.

It was only 6 weeks ago that fans were calling for Rafas head - I agreed with them, the prospect is another failure of a season, 3rd in a row, as someone mentioned he would not survive at any other top club, but for some reason the Scouse celebrate mediocroty and give the Spaniard a 25 million pound contract.

Heads in the F'ing sand, sad really.

Houlier officially becomes more successful than the Spaniard when Liverpool fail in the league.

Mr Alan

lol boggles. lol is all i can say to that.

Davei141

Mr Alan wrote: »

lol boggles. lol is all i can say to that.

Boggles cracking up!

Boggles

Mr Alan wrote: »

lol boggles. lol is all i can say to that.

Was it the prospect of 3 years in a row with nothing to show for it or the fact that ye gave the man responsible for that a 25 million contract that made you laugh? I did chuckle myself when it was announced.

monkey9

Boggles wrote: »

What utter twaddle.

Hate to break it to ye Scouse fans, but Liverpool arn't anywhere near Uniteds main rivals this season.

We have to play Arsenal 3 times, including the semi finals of the biggest competition of them all, Chelsea for me are still the danger in the league, they are looking the real deal under Hiddinck, and could potentially be up against United again in the final of the CL.

Liverpool had their chance this year, out of all cup competitions early, fair play to the merseysiders, 5 points ahead in the league now coming into the last few games potentially 4 points behind.

It was only 6 weeks ago that fans were calling for Rafas head - I agreed with them, the prospect is another failure of a season, 3rd in a row, as someone mentioned he would not survive at any other top club, but for some reason the Scouse celebrate mediocroty and give the Spaniard a 25 million pound contract.

Heads in the F'ing sand, sad really.

Houlier officially becomes more successful than the Spaniard when Liverpool fail in the league.

You can be sure Fergie is cracking up over Rafa for a reason

x in the city

how is this not locked yet..

houllier even got a mention..:P

monkey9

Boggles wrote: »

Was it the prospect of 3 years in a row with nothing to show for it or the fact that ye gave the man responsible for that a 25 million contract that made you laugh? I did chuckle myself when it was announced.

It's called progression! It's being made.

Karmafaerie

Boogles.

You are a legend.
Not in the way you think.
But you are.

x in the city

BaZmO* wrote: »

If Liverpool win the PL this year Rafa will be hailed as a mindgames master and likewise, if Utd. win the PL this year Fergie will once again be hailed as the mindgames master.

The funniest part is watching both sets of fans getting so roiled up with their comments.

I dont think pool will win the league, they have left themselves with too much to do, but it would be amazing if they did

a community shield in the autumn as god intended 20 years on from the 96.

shur Alex ferguson is always harping on with someone, its either Wegner or keegan or Mourinho or Benitez

its all in a days work for him

Boggles

monkey9 wrote: »

It's called progression! It's being made.

Karmafaerie

x in the city wrote: »

I dont think pool will win the league, they have left themselves with too much to do, but it would be amazing if they did

a community shield in the autumn as god intended 20 years on from the 96.

shur Alex ferguson is always harping on with someone, its either Wegner or keegan or Mourinho or Benitez

its all in a days work for him

Yes, but now UTD fans are cracking up because they're getting a taste of their own medicine.

It's hilarious!:D

BaZmO*

x in the city wrote: »

I dont think pool will win the league

I don't think they will either, but my point still stands.

x in the city wrote: »

shur Alex ferguson is always harping on with someone, its either Wegner or keegan or Mourinho or Benitez

its all in a days work for him

Really? Don't think they ever really had a go at each other?

monkey9

x in the city wrote: »

Ishur Alex ferguson is always harping on with someone, its either Wegner or keegan or Mourinho or Benitez

its all in a days work for him

Yep, but only when he feels they're a threat.

So Boggles may not feel Liverpool are a threat, but Boggles isn't the Man Utd manager (although i'd love it if he was)

Mr Alan

agreed X.

I don't think we'll win it this year personally....as SAF said when he was at Utd 7 years before winning the league, its hard to knock a team off the top when they have had a couple of decades with continuity and added excellent player after excellent to already title winning teams, but we are undoubtadly closer every year & this year are right on their tails.

With our recent form, Utds recent poor form since the schooling dished out at OT, Fergusons recent peculiar behaviour, the pressure is obviously starting to show....so there's one point in it, and we have the easier run in....its very possible, and all Liverpool fans wanted was to be involved in the title race.

Whatever happens Liverpool fans view it as a good season, Boggles doesn't, but thats ok :rolleyes:

Boggles

Mr Alan wrote: »

Whatever happens Liverpool fans view it as a good season, Boggles doesn't, but thats ok :rolleyes:

Liverpool will get what they deserve a champions league place, personally I don't think that is good enough but we ovbiously have different levels of what we think success is.

Karmafaerie

Boggles wrote: »

Liverpool will get what they deserve a champions league place, personally I don't think that is good enough but we ovbiously have different levels of what we think success is.

Boogles, I think it's safe to say that you and the rest of us have different levels of what we think everything is.

We think success is something different than you.
We think dignity is something different.
We think that left and right are something different.