All TV channels missing, but radio is fine - any ideas?

Aepos

Hi all,

Email sent this morning, so we'll see if anything happens.

"Good Morning,


I am the owner of a TX32LZD81 TV and I refer to your LCD Freesat Tv’s particularly the operation of same in the Irish Republic and the RTE DVB-T service.


As you have recently been made aware by many Republic of Ireland owners of these TV’s, both LCD and Plasma, who until recently were able to decode the RTE DVB-T Mpeg4 transmission that due to a firmware limitation the ability to store the Channel data as set out in the DVB-T specifications has been lost.

“It appears that the reason that the TV no longer works is because it does not recognise the service type which has been changed from 0x01 to 0x16 ,22(0x16) = Advanced Codec SD Digital Television Service, which does not appear to be defined in the firmware ..”

In a recent reply to a complaint made by another ROI Panasonic customer the following statement was made:-

“It is purely down to good luck that DVB-T channels prior to changes RTE made that now prevents DVB-T reception on the new MPEG 4 system.

We would recommend you purchase a set top box designed for Ireland’s MPEG 4 broadcast system and use that with the TV for the new channels in Ireland.”

Such a response is totally unacceptable from what is a after all a “Premium” brand when a “fix” should be possible with a little effort from your engineering department especially as there are a considerable number of Panasonic customers in the ROI who have been affected by this problem.

The refusal of Panasonic so far to even attempt to provide a solution will undoubtedly affect future purchasing decisions of ROI customers.

May I also suggest that the following link is investigated by your Engineering support division;

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055542668

I must refer also to an email sent to you by another unhappy customer Ticket Number PHAD-7RLFXL who sets out the problem in great detail.

Please ensure that this email is forwarded to the relevent engineering department.

I would very much appreciate you following up this issue for me and I look forward to your response,

Regards"

Charlie-Bravo

I uploaded the TX-32LZD81 channel file data to my 37" LZD81. It uploaded no problem however, the stations in these data files are on Channel 54. I'm receiving from Greystones, and the stations are broadcast on Channel 52.

FYI, I attempted an upload of the Version 2 file for the PZ81's...but incorrect model came up and an error....so only use LZD81 file for LZD81's and PZ81 file for PZ81's.

Anyone here receiving from Greystones and has an LZD channel data file still active to send onto us?

Thanks, Astro.

Hissing Sideban

Firstly, has anyone PZ81 channel list for Mt Leinster?

Regarding the reasons for this happening, I can confirm that RTE have done this for compatability issues in the border counties, and are unlikely to go back to the previous settings. It is a strict application of the protocol, to the 'Noirdic standard'. Panasonic habeve not implemented the standard correctly

As far as I know multiplex generator is up at Montrose, not on TX sites, so changes will affect all sites. I could see nothing in the racks or DTV TX's that would indicate local data modulation on site last time I was there, but I could be wrong.

Rgarding Panasonic's reluctance to do anything, peaking to someone with legal knowledge indicated that there are several possible ways to pursue Panasonic over this.

'Not fit for purpose' is one, especially since many sets were sold in the Republic, not Grey imported. However, you woudl have to pursue the retailer, not the manufacturer.

Perhaps Panasonic may act if ther was more widespread bad publicity over their sets, and worries about future compatability and upgrade issues.

In the USA Panasonic offers firmware downloads for it's sets on it's website, probably because the larger market demands it, and there is more competition

Ninjakettle

This is probably ≥ a dumb question

I'm not in Eire at the moment to try this, but given that the panasonics have a CAM slot, could there be any way of putting a NEOTION cam in there and tuning the DTT channels and then saving those (to favourites?)

not even sure the Neotion cams would work in a Tv that already decodes MPEG4, but just thought i'd ask the question. Also, i've had no reply from panasonic yet since my email.

I wonder (as Hissing has implied) if playing the not fit for purpose card might be worth a shot as the TV is under a 5 year warranty!?

maxg

The problem is not mpeg decoding. The new service type is not defined in the firmware and the channel scan therefore see such channels as none valid and ignore them. Thats the problem.
The value 0x16 for the service type has to be added to 1 or 2 selection tables at the dvb-t part of the firmware. That would be the whole fix.

SRB

Hissing Sideban wrote: »

Regarding the reasons for this happening, I can confirm that RTE have done this for compatability issues in the border counties, and are unlikely to go back to the previous settings.

Given the impending switchover in NI and the slow take up of DTT, this seems an odd route to take, as newer boxes will be bought as the switchover approaches and these will be capable of showing the Irish DTT channels, as mentioned before and on other forums, BT Vision boxes already do so.

stephene

Satfinder wrote: »

The attached data was taken from a 50PZ81 and applied successfully (phew!) to restore the TV channels on a 46PZ81.

I used this data to successfully update my 46PZ81 yesterday. Should keep me going for a while anyway.

Many thanks Satfinder


Stephen.

pipkato

From the above reports, do the experts in this thread think it's safe to apply the data from Satfinder (PZ81_data_Three_Rock_V2.zip) to update a 42PZ81 receiving DTT from Three Rock?

Has anyone successfully updated this model?

steveq

I also sent an email to Panasonic Support as a disappointed LZD81 owner. No response from them yet though.

Satfinder

pipkato wrote: »

From the above reports, do the experts in this thread think it's safe to apply the data from Satfinder (PZ81_data_Three_Rock_V2.zip) to update a 42PZ81 receiving DTT from Three Rock?

I'm claiming no expertise, but here is the evidence:

1. V1 of the data I posted was unedited data from a 50PZ81, which I successfully applied to a 46PZ81;
2. V2 was an edited version of V1, edited on a 46PZ81 to get the non-channel settings closer to the factory defaults. Stephene has just confirmed that this worked on another 46PZ81;
3. Astrofluff reported an error message (and not anything more alarming) when trying the PZ81 data on a TX-37LZD81.

As the person who started this thread, if anyone can confirm that the "PZ81" data works on a 42PZ81, pipkato deserves to know.

Peter

Another email sent here.

bob11

I received another reply from Panasonic, See below :
I get the feeling that they are not even reading my emails ..

I think this response is crap ... Are RTE broadcasting DVB-T2 coding ??
If the TV can't decode it, why can I receive the channels when I copy someone else's old channel list via SD card ?

Maybe someone smarter that me can draft another response for me ...

Ticket number: PHAD-7S7DGR

ISSUE RESOLUTION: Dear Mr

Thank you for your further e-mail

Accordingly I have taken the opportunity to consult our Technical Support Team. They have confirmed that the PZ81 and LZD81 sets were designed for the UK market and as such conform to the DVB-T MPEG 2 specification. The recent test signals from RTE you were able to receive were broadcast on this system.

It has emerged that the more recent test signals from RTE use MPEG 4 DVB-T2 coding. As such, the television is unable to decode these broadcasts. Regrettably, there are no planned firmware upgrades for these models, as they were never designed for use outside of the UK.

I trust this clarifies the company’s position on this matter.

Kind Regards
Anthony Clarke
Dealer Support / Correspondence Team
Panasonic UK Ltd

SRB

No, they aren't, they are using DVB-T, MPEG4, and the TV is very obviously able to display this as it did so before. The problem is the service descriptor RTE NL are now using, the TV doesn't "know" what to do with the channels. The service is now flagged as "advanced codec SD digital television service". That the TV doesn't know what to do with a service flagged as such is Panasonic's problem.
Has anyone e-mailed RTE NL about this ? They may ignore the e-mail or give the "it's a test, not a live service" line, but it may be worth trying.
Might also be worth sending a sample Transport Stream to Panasonic - let them see for themselves.....

bob11

Thanks STB ...

I will email Panasonic back, but I don't fancy my chances ...

I did email RTE NL a few weeks ago, but no response:

to rtenl@rte.ie

date Tue, Apr 28, 2009 at 2:20 PM
subject Digital TV Engineering Trial


Hi There,

I have a query relating to the current DTT engineering trial that is ongoing. Can you please forward this email on to the appropriate department please ?

I realise that the current Engineering trial is not a guaranteed service, but I just want some clarificaction around a particular issue that I have noticed ..

I have recently purchase a TX-37LZX81 Panasonic TV that I am using in Dublin.

I purchased this TV as I was informed that it was compatible with the new Digital TV broadcast format (MPEG-4).

My TV had been working fine picking up the 4 TV and 4 Radio channels available from ThreeRock, but recently I was prompted to do a rescan for new channels which has now disabled my TV from receiving the 4 TV channels. The Radio Channels are still available.

It appears that the reason that the TV no longer works is because it does not recognise the service type which has been changed from 0x01 to 0x16 ,22(0x16) = Advanced Codec SD Digital Television Service.

There is a detailed discussion on this issue on boards.ie http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055542668&page=3

Would it be possible for RTE NL experts to look into this issue and advise if this is something that may be changed back, or if this Service Type change is here to stay.

I realise that this may be a problem in the way that the Panasonic TV has interpreted the standards, but I'm sure this issue will have an impact on quite a lot of users who have purchased these particular models because of the MPEG4 tuners.

Thanks in advance for help with this matter and I do understand that during these Engineering tests, parameters and service may change significantly from time to time.

I just wanted to know if I will need to look at an alternative means to receive the DTT service,

Thanks again,

maxg

bob11 wrote: »

Ticket number: PHAD-7S7DGR

ISSUE RESOLUTION: Dear Mr

Thank you for your further e-mail

Accordingly I have taken the opportunity to consult our Technical Support Team. They have confirmed that the PZ81 and LZD81 sets were designed for the UK market and as such conform to the DVB-T MPEG 2 specification. The recent test signals from RTE you were able to receive were broadcast on this system.

It has emerged that the more recent test signals from RTE use MPEG 4 DVB-T2 coding. As such, the television is unable to decode these broadcasts. Regrettably, there are no planned firmware upgrades for these models, as they were never designed for use outside of the UK.

It looks like the technical team from Panasonic mixed up the planed UK freeview HD in DVB-T2 with the irish DTT project.
Nobody in Ireland is planing to introduce DVB-T2 as modulation method. Mpeg compression and modulation are two pairs of shoes.
RTE is using MPEG4 with bog standard DVB-T as modulation method since july 2008.
Beside that the Panasonic team didn't understand that only a simple value is missing in 1 or 2 selection tables to make the new service type valid for the dvb-t part of the TV.
The service type 0x16 which is now in use is definded in the DVB specs and Panasonic promised to follow the DVB specs at the last page of the owners manual but the value 0x16 for the service type is missing in the firmware.

Aepos

Hi all,

Got a silly reply from Customer support, the usual old rubbish so I sent a very stiff reply and copied it to one of the Directors. (Mr. Turu Kihara)

It will be interesting to see what that will do....If anything.

If anyone wants that email contact I'll pm it to them.

Cheers


Aepos

Ninjakettle

Hi Guys,

I got the a very similar response from Panasonic today - some excerpts as follows...

"MPEG 4 decoding only works via the Freesat (satellite) section of the TV"

"We would advise that you may pick up the required signals by purchase of a set top box that RTE would be marketing for their MPEG 4 based DVB-T system when it is finalised. It is purely down to the original RTE test signals being broadcast on the MPEG2 system prior to changes RTE made that now prevents DVB-T reception on the new MPEG 4 system."

I'll reply of course - thanks for the specific info STB\maxg on this.
will knock off a mail to RTENL too.

J

Apogee

I think a few people on here have mentioned that they bought their Panasonics in shops in the Republic? If these were official sales, rather than grey imports, then those buyers are the ones with the strongest case against Panasonic. If you get nowhere, then try sending some emails to Conor Pope at the Irish Times - all these companies hate bad publicity.
http://www.irishtimes.com/blogs/pricewatch/


As an aside, the latest line-up of Irish Panasonics specifically mentions H264 (mpeg 4) in the specs e.g. TX-P50G10L.
http://www.panasonic.co.uk/html/en_GB/Products/VIERA+Plasma+and+LCD+TVs/Irish+Viera+Plasma/TX-P50G10L/Specification/2356286/index.html?trackInfo=true

It would be very interesting to see if these TVs still have the same problem not recognising the "advanced codec flag" - perhaps someone could drop into a friendly local Pansonic dealer to check? The model code suggests that it's a stripped down version of the Freesat TX-P50G10 sold in the UK, and the firmware is probably quite similar in both.
http://www.panasonic.co.uk/html/en_GB/Products/VIERA+Plasma+and+LCD+TVs/VIERA+Plasma+TV/TX-P50G10/Specification/2121404/index.html?trackInfo=true

SRB

@bob11, Leaving Panasonic aside, it's pretty poor of RTE NL to ignore that e-mail. Perhaps a personal e-mail to RTENL's individual directors, (cc'd to local TD's) might bring a better response.....

Charlie-Bravo

So the list of people to email so far are:

Panasonic.co.uk CustomerCare.Advisor@eu.panasonic.com

RTENL rtenl@rte.ie

Should there be someone here which has bought any Panasonic TV in the Republic with this problem could also chase up these guys too?!

Eamonn Ryan, Minister for Communications customer.Service@dcenr.gov.ie

RTÉ Authority (http://www.rte.ie/about/authority.html)

Broadcasting Commission of Ireland (http://www.bci.ie/contact/staff_contacts.html) Declan McLoughlin (Broadcasting Standards)

National Consumer Agency (http://www.consumerconnect.ie/eng/Working_With_You/Submit_a_Consumer_Complaint/) but only if you haven't had any luck with the TV shop!!!!

Slicklink

Thats complete nonsense regarding them working at mpeg2 tests only as are most of the so called customer care responses.

My 37LZD81 worked during the MPEG4 tests up until a few weeks ago before RTE changed the service type from "digital terrestrial service" to "Advanced codec SD Terrestrial service" as pointed out earlier in this thread. The TVs were not even on the market when RTE stopped the MPEG2 trial in July 2008.

Surely, the UK do not have a special opt out from following DVB standards ? If panasonic refuse to admit the problem or explain techical detail why it cant be fixed, persist with the its only for the UK approach, and dont roll out a firmware fix for little old Ireland, I will personally post it back to them in small pieces and vow to tell as many people how crap the backup from panasonic is. I mean its not brain surgery. They would had to have defined the firmware for the "E" version of this series of TV for France.

The French wouldnt put up with this sh*te.

maxg

Maybe the owners of the pz81/lzd81 series should complain again and describe exactly the problem. It looks like the panasonic team is not able to fully understand the problem.
RTE changed the service type from 0x01 to 0x16 for tv channels in the service description data.
The exact problem is the channel scan.
If a automatic setup in dvb mode delete the channel list the following channel scan is not willing to store tv channels which are marked with service type 0x16 in the service description data.
If someone don't do a new channel scan the irish channels are still fully working.
If someone upload a backup channel list via the hotel.pwd method the irish tv channels are also fully working.
The problem is the channel scan which is not able to store tv channel with service type 0x16 because the value 0x16 is not defined in 1 or 2 selection table(s).

Aepos

maxg...

You are perfectly correct they don't have a clue what is wrong. From what I have read in this forum the majority of complainants including myself have directed the support people to this site.

They either are non technical support staff, can't read English, don't give a hoot or possibly all three!!

I suggest that all future email complaints are copied to Panasonic UK Directors which is my present modus operandi.

Interestingly enough my last email was responded to this morning with no comment from the sender......

Cheers Ae

bob11

I have followed Aepos's lead and I have copied the directors on my latest email ... I have also questioned their ability to read what I have told them numerous times ..
Let's see if we get anywhere ...

netwhizkid

Panasonic have lost over €1,000 from me over this as I was on the verge of buying a 46" PZ81B with Freesat etc. I now don't know what to do as I want the TV I buy to have an integrated tuner that works! If something like this happened in the UK the BBC's Watchdog would tear Panasonic to shreds over it.

steveq

This is the reply I got this morning. By the way Aepos, the reply was at the bottom of the emails after 2 confidentiality notices and before the last one -- it is hard to find.

[FONT=&quot]ISSUE RESOLUTION: Dear Mr XXXXX,

Thank you for your e-mail enquiry.

In response, I would explain that these sets are fully compliant with the UK Standard DVB-T system.

There are no plans to upgrade these models to receive DVB-T broadcasts not compliant with the UK system.

I trust this clarifies the company’s position on this matter.


[/FONT]

maxg

From the owners manual page 68:

DVB TX-32lzd81 Declaration of Conformity No. 5755, 23 June 2008
.......TX-37lzd81 Declaration of Conformity No. 5756, 23 June 2008

Either Panasonic is lying in that declarations or they are not lying.
Its up to Panasonic now to clarify that point.

Aepos

Thanks steveq, I found it buried in the email... It would appear to be an F off we don't give a toss reply. So much for customer support / satisfaction. Still I will persist in sending on the stuff up the chain of command.....

Ae

Aepos

Latest Rant to Panasonic Higher echelons:


Good evening gentlemen,

I attach a series of emails concerning difficulties involving certain freesat lcd tv models sold in Ireland both North and South.

It would appear from the negative response contained in replies to these communications that Panasonic does not wish to assist the many customers who own these sets in any way to resolve the problem.

It is also understood by the many highly qualified technical persons involved in discussions relating to this problem that a simple firmware fix would overcome this issue.


The following discussion forum may be of interest to you:-

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055542668

All the users who have encountered this difficulty are astounded at the poor response from your company.

Panasonic is in Ireland considered to be a premium brand and as such purchasers of expensive equipment do expect a more enlightened response to such requests.
It must also be realised that by attempting a fix for this problem Panasonic will retrieve the goodwill from disappointed customers with a consequent boost to sales and reputation, which I am sure in these austere times would be good for Panasonic.

I trust the above may be of interest to you, if not then I apologise for wasting your time.

Regards,

Down Exile

I have just uploaded the data from the 32LZD81 onto my 37LZD81 and it has worked! The only downside is that there is no EPG, but I suppose having DTT is better than nothing. The digital teletext works OK.

The only difference is that the download of my original settings puts the hotel.pwd in the root directory of the SD card and the other files are put in a sub directory.

Aepos

Dear Mr.....

Mr Cowmeadow our head of Panasonic European logistics has forwarded your e-mail to me for answering.
I have read your correspondence and the discussion forums you have referred too, I would make the following
comments related to this issue:

Panasonic have not marketed the Freesat model's in Southern Ireland and only supply this product into the
North of Ireland market for two reason one being the Freesat product is focused on the UK market and the other due to the
Freeview digital tuner is design for the UK digital broadcast network, it is not compliant with the planned RTE transmission
format they have selected to adopt.

Whilst conducting their transmission tests RTE have use the format which can be received by equipment which can receive
the UK digital broadcast signal, this however would not be the long term format to be used by RTE. I understand from the forums
that a number of people have purchase this unit on the understand that it can receive the RTE digital signal.

Since the changes they have applied in there test transmission single the effect you have described is the complaint we
are receiving from Panasonic Customer who purchased the PZ81 models from the North of Ireland and are then using
in the South of Ireland. The changes required to make this model receive the signal are more significant than just a software
change and unfortunately we have no modification available to customer who find themselves in this position.

I would agree with you entirely that we would have a responsibility to ensure continued functionality if we had produced and
marketed the product for the Southern Irish market, but we have not. The hardware and software have been design for operation
in the Northern Irish, and mainland UK markets. We therefore are not in a position where we are able to support our customers
in the South of Ireland who have purchased these products from the north.

If the users have purchase these units only for this functionality and it was marketed to them by the retail from whom they
purchased the unit on this basis alone, I would suggest they contact these retailers to address their issues. We have notified the dealers
in the north of Ireland about our opinion on this issue and the fact that product can not be sold to customers in southern
Ireland for Free to area digital TV transmission use, as RTE do not support the format required.

I am sorry I can not provide a complete resolution to your problem, and apologise for any confusion our original response may have caused.


Regards



Stuart Mckay
Head of Service Group
Panasonic UK Ltd.


Any comments???

Ae

SRB

"it is not compliant with the planned RTE transmission", given this is an agreed international DVB DTT format, why not ? I'd send him an e-mail explaining the SD Card solution and then ask why, if customers can solve the problem themselves, they can't. I'd also point out the TV's weren't bought in "the North".

Ninjakettle

The changes required to make this model receive the signal are more significant than just a software
change and unfortunately we have no modification available to customer who find themselves in this position.

But given the info expounded on this thread - this statement is surely wrong? It is precisely just a tiny software change that is required.

maxg

Mr. Stuart Mckay didn't understand the problem.
There is 1 (in words one) additional byte in the firmware needed to let the channel scan accept the irish tv channels.
The rest of the firmware is following the dvb standards and following the dvb standards also means the firmware is able to handle mpeg4.
The problem is not mpeg2 against mpeg4. The problem is the channel scan is not willing to accept irish TV channels with service type 0x16 in the service description data.

Ninjakettle

Stuart Mckay: I have read your correspondence and the discussion forums you have referred too

For the attention of Stuart Mckay,

On the off chance that you will be following up on your recent correspondence and revisiting this thread; i'd like to firstly thank you for taking the time to reply to your Irish customers regarding this issue.

Secondly i would like to say that although these TVs were not marketed in the Republic of Ireland, there are nonetheless many customers who bought the TVs here and indeed more living in the border areas that purchased their sets in the North but use them in the South.

I'd like to state that the TVs we own will work with the Irish DVB-T standard without any hardware modifications. This much we know for certain. We also know precisely what is preventing the sets from receiving the signal at this time. To paraphrase some of our learned members here:

RTE changed the TV channel service type from 0x01 to 0x16 in the service description data. The problem arises when performing a channel scan after this change. Owners have found that the TV is not willing to store the tv channels which are now marked with service type 0x16 in the service description data.

If an owner chooses not to perform a new channel scan, their channels remain unaffected and fully working. Furthermore, if affected owners upload a backup channel list via the hotel.pwd method, the irish tv channels can be restored.

The problem in short, is that the channel scan is unable to store tv channels marked with service type 0x16 because the value 0x16 is not defined in 1 or 2 selection table(s).

I respectfully ask that you raise the matter with your firmware/technical team and given that the precise problem is known already, it should surely be a simple matter of releasing an updated version of the firmware which we can apply ourselves?

Thank you.

Aepos

Yet another email sent to Panasonic,


"Good Morning Mr McKay,

Thank you for your prompt reply the content of which is noted.

However I posted your reply on the boards.ie forum and the following comment was made by a member:-


“Mr. Stuart Mckay didn't understand the problem.

There is 1 (in words one) additional byte in the firmware needed to let the channel scan accept the irish tv channels.
The rest of the firmware is following the dvb standards and following the dvb standards also means the firmware is able to handle mpeg4.
The problem is not mpeg2 against mpeg4. The problem is the channel scan is not willing to accept irish TV channels with service type 0x16 in the service description data.”


I must also point out that the following course of action has been taken by some owners of this series of TV’s (including myself) to restore the reception of RTE’s DVB transmissions:-

“Got my TV channels back!
________________________________________
Thanks to all your advice ( particularly maxg an Apogee) I got my TV channels back. I have two Panasonic TX32LZD81 TVs. I used the Auto Setup on one of them and lost the TV channels but used the DVB manual tuning option on the other thereby not overwriting the TV channels. So, here's how I transferred the channel data between sets. DO THIS AT YOUR OWN RISK!!!

1. Format an SD card on a PC.

Insert SD card into PC. Right-click on SD card in MyComputer, then select FORMAT and press OK.

2. Set up hotel.pwd file on SD card.

Open MyComputer and double click on SD card (Removeable Disk). Go to Tools, Folder Options and select the VIEW tab. Then unclick the "Hide extensions for known file types" option and apply the change. Right click and select New and Text Document to create an empty text file. Name it "hotel.pwd" ( Note that there is no .txt file extension added because of option selected above). Remove SD card.

3. Copy all channels from TV1 to SD card.

Turn on TV. Insert SD card. The process starts automatically. Enter the code 4850 when requested. The copy is made to the SD card. Remove the SD card.

4. Copy channels from SD card to TV2.

Turn on TV. Insert SD card. The process starts automatically. Enter the code 4851 when requested. The copy is made to the TV.
Turn off the TV and then turn it on again. The channels are copied! There's no EPG info for the TV channels.

I tried unsuccessfully to attach a compressed copy of the "hotel.pwd" file that was created on my SD card. It's for the Dublin Three Rock Mountain area channels. I'll try again if I can figure out how to do it.

EDIT: Only copy between identical models! “


While not a very elegant or permanent solution it works for the moment and it proves beyond any doubt the capability of these sets to function with RTE’s DVB transmission type.

Surely if a few of your customers can isolate the problem and provide a temporary fix, then it is not beyond the capabilities of Panasonic to engineer a more elegant and permanent solution to the problem thus expanding the use and functionality of what is after all a really good range of TV’s to a larger user base.


Your comments would be appreciated,


Regards"

We will see what happens now,


Ae

Aepos

Just in case anyone wants to follow up with an email of their own the email address for Stuart McKay is:-

FAO Stuart Mckay customer.care@panasonic.co.uk

It might be a good idea to keep the pot boiling!!

Ae

Ninjakettle

Thanks for the address, I've mailed Mr Mckay also with what I posted above.

Say Panasonic release a new version of the firmware with the Selection Tables fixed. Is this something that we could then apply via the SD card slot ourselves?

MPEG4

Got a PZ800 a week or so ago and have the same problem, but wanted to know if anyone else had actually seen them working? i.e. if they know they have the MPEG4 decoders.
Thanks

maxg

Ninjakettle wrote: »

Thanks for the address, I've mailed Mr Mckay also with what I posted above.

Say Panasonic release a new version of the firmware with the Selection Tables fixed. Is this something that we could then apply via the SD card slot ourselves?

The panasonic freesat range has an upgrade path via satellite and got already 1 or 2 updates.
A sd card is a second alternative.

maxg

MPEG4 wrote: »

Got a PZ800 a week or so ago and have the same problem, but wanted to know if anyone else had actually seen them working? i.e. if they know they have the MPEG4 decoders.
Thanks

The european model PZ800E got an mpeg4 decoder.
The situation about the uk model PZ800B is not so clear. 1 or 2 reported last year irish dtt is not working.

maxg

@Aepos

Maybe Mr. McKay need a few additional hints:.

- the pz81B/lzd81B TV's have an mpeg2/mpeg4 decoder on board
- the mpeg decoder doesn't care about if the sat (freesat) tuner or the dvb-t (freeview) tuner is sending mpeg data for decoding.
- the tuner has no affiliation to mpeg decoding
- there is bog standard DVB-T in use in ROI and not DVB-T2
- due to the dvb standard a receiving device which has an mpeg4 decoder on board has to accept service type 0x16
- Panasonic promised in the declaration of conformity to fully following the DVB standards.

Barryo

Hi Anthony

Thanks for your reply which is essentially a copy and paste of e-mail response I've already read - sent to someone querying the same issue in ROI.

I think that you are missing the point of my e-mail. You're advising that this tv was only ever intended for use in the UK and to quote "The UK does not use such a system. So these TVs were never sold as capable of working with MPEG 4 DVB-T transmissions"

Northern Ireland is part of the UK and we are using MPEG4 for RTE transmissions. I don't feel it's unreasonable for a UK customer (in region where this product is aimed at) should expect an upgrade to receive transmissions on TV he/she was previously recieving.

Again i don't think that the resonse of "only intended for use in the UK market" is helpful especially for those who bought this tv in good faith. I AM IN THE UK and this tv has stopped receving transmissions that I am entitled to receive and which the TV was happy to receive until recently.

Can you please look at this issue again as I see from Panasonic websites in the USA etc that online upgrades for TVs are possible. If as you are saying that the TVs are intended for UK only then an OTA upgrade from transmitters in Northern Ireland would ensure then that the upgrade is only received there.

Kind Regards

Barry O'Brien

yel

Hi Lads,
Has anyone got the SD Cards channels for Kippure?

SRB

Barryo wrote: »

Northern Ireland is part of the UK and we are using MPEG4 for RTE transmissions.......

I AM IN THE UK and this tv has stopped receving transmissions that I am entitled to receive and which the TV was happy to receive until recently.

Can you please look at this issue again as I see from Panasonic websites in the USA etc that online upgrades for TVs are possible. If as you are saying that the TVs are intended for UK only then an OTA upgrade from transmitters in Northern Ireland would ensure then that the upgrade is only received there.

Barry, Northern Ireland isn't using MPEG4 for RTE.
Kippure, Three Rock, Holywell Hill and Clermont Carn will, in all probability, be heavily nulled towards the North NW England/Wales. Kippure for example, has dropped drastically in signal strength after almost a month of perfect reception - from Easter Sunday until about a week ago it was actually stronger than some of the MUXES from Divis in and around Portaferry, Co Down.
Someone posted to say the service descriptor change was a move by RTE to stop Freeview boxes storing the RTE TV channels, which they couldn't display anyway - if that is the case, then it's unlikely Panasonic will do anything to help viewers in NI.
On the other hand, these are still tests and as RTE NL have said, settings being tested may not be the settings the service "goes live" with. It's quite possible once the tests are over, the TX's will all go off anyway, as no one is footing the bill other than RTE NL.

bob11

Interesting article here on RTE's desire to continue it's broadcast services in Northern Ireland:

http://www.ofcom.org.uk/consult/condocs/dttfuture/responses/rte.pdf

http://www.ofcom.org.uk/consult/condocs/psb2_phase2/responses/rte.pdf

Found the highlighted portion interesting ...

Based on this view RTÉ believes that there would be significant public value in creating the framework whereby reciprocity of free-to-air terrestrial broadcasting services could be achieved on both sides of the border. The initiation of DTT in the Republic of Ireland now offers this as a real possibility, notwithstanding the political, legal and regulatory issues to be addressed in order to enable this to come into being.
There are issues of frequency planning to be addressed, as well as the discussion regarding optimal technical standards to be adopted in both jurisdictions. In addition, the regulatory regime would also have to work very closely with the manufacturers in order to ensure a smooth deployment of suitable equipment throughout the island of Ireland.
RTÉ would welcome the opportunity to engage with Ofcom and the other relevant UK authorities in order to explore the potential of such a reciprocal agreement.

Free-to-air Digital Terrestrial Television
The advent of the DTT platform in Britain and Northern Ireland, and soon in the Republic of Ireland, provides a unique opportunity for broadcasters to contribute to the further establishment of peace and reconciliation and play a part in supporting the normalisation of Northern Irish, and indeed Irish, society by allowing for the full expression of ‘all traditions and identities on the island’ free-to-air in both jurisdictions.
A final point, with regard to digital switchover, concerns the probable loss of RTÉ services in Northern Ireland to many viewers there who will be affected when the switchover happens in 2012. This will have a significant impact on the cultural diversity of the television landscape in Northern Ireland. For this reason RTÉ asks if some way of legitimately providing free-to-air RTÉ services in Northern Ireland could be considered?
RTÉ looks forward to engaging with Ofcom and all the other stakeholders and interested agencies in Northern Ireland as preparations for the digital future progress.

bob11

Found some further stats on RTE viewers in NI here also, Do a search on the page for RTE ...
http://www.ofcom.org.uk/research/cm/cmrnr08/tv/

Barryo

SRB wrote: »

Barry, Northern Ireland isn't using MPEG4 for RTE.
Kippure, Three Rock, Holywell Hill and Clermont Carn will, in all probability, be heavily nulled towards the North NW England/Wales. Kippure for example, has dropped drastically in signal strength after almost a month of perfect reception - from Easter Sunday until about a week ago it was actually stronger than some of the MUXES from Divis in and around Portaferry, Co Down.
Someone posted to say the service descriptor change was a move by RTE to stop Freeview boxes storing the RTE TV channels, which they couldn't display anyway - if that is the case, then it's unlikely Panasonic will do anything to help viewers in NI.
On the other hand, these are still tests and as RTE NL have said, settings being tested may not be the settings the service "goes live" with. It's quite possible once the tests are over, the TX's will all go off anyway, as no one is footing the bill other than RTE NL.

I'm in Fermanagh with perfect reception of both Cairn AND Clermont, I'm just trying to counter the "not aimed at markets outside UK" line Panasonic are touting

Hissing Sideban

Barryo wrote: »

I'm in Fermanagh with perfect reception of both Cairn AND Clermont, I'm just trying to counter the "not aimed at markets outside UK" line Panasonic are touting

Good point Barryo. I will add my contribution to the emails to Panasonic when I get home next week. It may be better to write a traditional letter to the higher management echelons of Panasonic, rather than an email. It is possible that an email might get caught in an anti-spam filter and never even be read.

However, as a 'plan B', it might be possible to work out some sort of channel editor, If at least two, (but preferably three or more) different 'hotel' files, each from a set which was tuned successfully to a different different transmitter were compared in a hex editor.
It should be possble to work out the RF tuning information, edit it and thereby get other sets working for Transmitters for which there were no saved 'hotel' mode files. How many different transmitter profiles have been saved?

keithoh

Hissing Sideban wrote: »

Firstly, has anyone PZ81 channel list for Mt Leinster?

The data attached is for the Mt. Leinster transmissions from a TH46PZ81B

Unzip the file and copy the contents onto a SD card and insert into a PZ81B TV

Use password 4851 when prompted