Criminal Justice (Miscellaneous Provisions) Bill 2009

Sparks

Principal casulties of this bill will be us (target shooters). Fundamental rethink and revision is required. Minister is sitting there grinning. Little personal spat.

They're reading out a letter now from a pistol shooter.

Sparks

Practical shooting gets a last mention there before Pat stopped reading. Decent letter actually. Didn't recognise the text though.

Sparks

Back to the point that there's no evidenciary link between our stuff and gun crime.

Minister protesting that he's trying to stop the creation of a handgun culture.
Pat saying that there are no EU countries more rigorous than us in our firearms laws; the sport doesn't interest him, but crushing the sport for no reason isn't something he'll support.

Sparks

...criticising the 'piecemeal' approach to firearms legislation not being addressed by this bill.

Sparks

...farmers getting a bit of criticism for having their shotguns stolen, but it being emphasised that drug gangs source their firearms outside of the country.

Sparks

FCP now being mentioned, and it's been stated they were never shown the aspects of the bill we have problems with, so the 'extensive consultation' the Minister mentioned can't have happened.

bigred

Must send Pat a thank you letter - he's doing a great job here!! Pity there's nobody there to listen

Sparks

Charleton's judgement mentioned, and the opposing judgements mentioned as well. Firearms ownership shouldn't be a right, but undue weight shouldn't be given to Charleton. His (Charleton's) comments on concerns over gun crime aren't incorrect; but Pat has yet to be shown a jurisdiction where clamping down on licenced firearms owners clamps down on gun crime.

Challanges the Minister to show evidence for such a connection.

Sparks

This morning's debates are up on the web now by the way:
http://debates.oireachtas.ie/DDebate.aspx?F=DAL20090520.xml&Node=H9#H9

Sparks

Last minute of Pat's statement. Sticking with the lack of evidence for a link between target shooting and gun crime.
...and he's down.

And Deputy Dooley now speaking.

G17

Sparks wrote: »

Last minute of Pat's statement. Sticking with the lack of evidence for a link between target shooting and gun crime.
...and he's down.

Thanks a million for the updates, I couldn't 'tune in' this avo, phone stuck to my frickin' ear.

Sparks

Mention being made of meeting with pistol owners, and a visit to a firing range, and lots of sympathetic noises, but not much as concrete as with Pat Rabbitte.

Sparks

bigred wrote: »

Must send Pat a thank you letter - he's doing a great job here!! Pity there's nobody there to listen

True that. Between Howlin's efforts in the CJB2004, and this stuff from Rabbitte now, we seem to get the best vocal support from Labour.

The low numbers isn't much of a surprise, it was that way with the CJB2004 as well - three to five people in the chamber during the debates, then everyone piled in and voted on party lines for the votes, then evacuated again for the post-vote stuff.

Sparks

Most of Dooley's talk here is about the other stuff in the Bill rather than the firearms stuff.

Sparks

Dooley's sat down, I don't recognise the TD now standing - James something?
Straight onto handguns. comparison between us an New Zealand and the UK, and here comes the Dunblane mention...

Sparks

Replica firearms mentioned, but not airsoft ones. Discussion of "Gray firearms" and "Black firearms" (the latter which are imported for criminal purposes).

Yes, this is as painful to listen to as you'd imagine....

tonysopprano

Bannon, FG Westmeath

Sparks

Lots of stuff on how gun crime is out of control, most of it a gift to the Minister to beat us with; and now back to a partial mention that we're not linked to gun crime. And straight into a party political broadcast for Fine Gael, the party for law and order...

tonysopprano

Actually met Eamon Gilmore about 1hour ago. I commented on lack of deputies and he told me that all the work will be done in committee stage.

Bannon bullsh*tting about gun ownership and US. Wants more security to be put in place.Very hard to listen to. All over the place. Now on about the increase in FAC's since 2004. Now coming back to support ownership of pistol and firearms for sports (mentioned Derek Burnett proudly) but wants clubs to have more say about issuig of FAC's.

Sparks

Making lots of noise about rises in pistol and rifle licences.
Asking for stricter guidelines on clubs instead of legislation.
Derek Bernett mentioned.


(that's James Bannon, btw, and frankly, I'd rather not see him speak on our behalf again, he's having trouble sticking to the topic between the start and end of his sentences ffs)

edit: cheers Tony

Sparks

On about small local garda stations now...
Seriously, I don't think he can see the point from where he's meandering.

tonysopprano

Big rigmarole about Garda numbers in rural areas. What has this got to do with this Bill?

Sparks

You know, I get that not everyone's a good public speaker, or even highly literate, but if this is the best Longford can find to put forward to speak for them (or even to read off a sheet like he's doing)....

Sparks

This is just a bloody election poster of a speech, read out badly. :mad:

Sparks

Bebo and Facebook don't solve knife crime....

Sparks

Less than a minute of this dross left, thank feck.

Sparks

He's delighted that the Minister's decided to ban 'those swords' which are a terrible threat to life....

And he's down. Brendan Kenally (FF, chair of the justice committee) is now talking. I'd guess this won't be good

Sparks

Here goes the fear - we can't walk down the street without fear of dying in a crossfire from armed gangs...

Sparks

European arrest warrent stuff being discussed now, firearms stuff to come.

Sparks

Mention now being made of the shooting of armed raiders the other day in Lucan.